Calling the Autoshite Youth: 90's rep-mobiles, close to classicdom?

[Partridge]

OK, here's my thought process in a nut shell. Escort MK1 and 2 are now considered proper "classics" and are hit with OMFGSCENETAX mostly because of the rallying connection. (and maybe, just maybe the PE1 white room if you're a cynic)

 

I wasn't around to see that when they were new, therefore I don't care about them that much. I've noticed at car shows the blokes and blokettes and driving Fords them are mostly 40-something "Daves" so I assume they grew up watching rallying and standing in mud watching this:

And if their parents let them stay up late, they watched this:

They were probably driven around in this:

 

However, in the 70's I was one of these:

 

So I grew up watching this:

And playing this:

And I was driven in one of these:

 

So to me, 90's stuff (mostly saloons) are cool.

Are they due to have their time very soon? Discuss.

 

 

[RedSparrow]

I dunno. I was born early 80s and to me most motors from the 90s are so dull I don't think I'd ever consider any of them classics.

[scruff]

Same here RedSparrow. Most of the 90s motors I like have their roots in the 80s. As for what you grow up with - we didn't have moderns or repmobiles in the family and those at school whose parents did, were usually shitheads, so not many fond memories. Newest motor we had up to my late teens was a J reg ex BT Transit.

[Guest bangerfan101]

the mondeo's will be a rare thing in the future the rate there been bangered an have been the last 5-6 years

[Spiny Norman]

Personally I like cars from the 80s and 90s but I think of them them as viable daily transport, not classics.
As is often pointed out on these very pages, cars from this period probably represent the pinnacle of the shiteness-vs-dependability graph, so I think there's a way to go before the bread & butter stuff is seen as 'classic', but I don't doubt it'll happen one day.

[RedSparrow]

the mondeo's will be a rare thing in the future the rate there been bangered an have been the last 5-6 years

 

See, that's what I mean: I love cars but I really wouldn't care if every single Mondeo was raced.

[twosmoke300]

I dunno . I think the mk1 mondeo is just starting to come through the worthless banger state. Most of the ones left that I see are quite tidy and looked after

[Pillock]

Totally. I really can't see why it won't just keep going round the cycle.... How many Mk2 Escorts were crushed or dumped in the 80s because they were just an unfashionable old wreck. All the classic folk were concentrating on the older stuff, Anglias and whatever. Before that, tired Anglias were forgotten in favour of pre-war cars.

 

We're getting to the point where a Mk4 Escort is looking like a sensible classic buy, and Maestros and Cavaliers.

 

In ten years time, we'll be fluffing ourselves over a low mileage Vectra, and moaning that the Mk4 Insignia is too hard to mend.

[gordonbennet]

I wonder how many of us are buying those 90's designs, and making them as rustproof as possible.

 

I suspect lots of late 80's and 90 designs will see classic age if not status, maybe far more than earlier stuff because we've seen that car time stopped for many of us at the turn of the century and we're keeping hold of them and pouring lots of TLC into them lasting as long as possible.

 

You could probably elongate the lifespan of cars made now, but eventually several of the umpteen bloody mind boggling electronic on board nightmares will fail and render the car uneconomical to repair, and thats if any bugger can diagnose the crap anyway.

 

Obvious example to me is the SBC braking system on MB E and higher classes, W211 from years 03 to 06 or slightly later for bigger models, this unbelievably stupid system uses pumped hydraulic pressure in the brake lines, the pump 'counts down' every time its used, so after X number of applications its used its 'life' up and is a £1500ish job to renew...apart from that you have to be bloody careful if you want to work on the system, it never really switches off and there is a specific sequence to doing so,  your fingers could be in line with the piston when the fuckin thing decides to take the play up as the pads are out, goodbye fingers.

To be fair Benz dropped that when they facelifted the model around 06, but no doubt theres dozens of other bloody things equally costly, such as the 7G gearbox for one when it needs fluid renewal it has to be pumped in and out (from underneath) via STAR system at eye watering cost...WHY?

And don't get me started on cars without a dipstick.

 

The recently bought 52 plate Outback H6, so 90's design, is proving to be a good buy, so that undergoing treatment to make it last as long as possible, will probably be LPG'd, no i doubt a Japanese 4WD estate will ever be called a classic however long it lasts, but thats not the point for the likes of us.

 

Talking of dipsticks, the Outback has 3 under the bonnet,  engine auto box and front diff, cool.

[Junkman]

A car has become a classic in that moment, when you consider it worth preserving and buy it for this reason.

It doesn't matter how many people do this with the same make/model, and how old the car is at that time.

 

So go ahead, buy the 90s chod you consider worthwhile, and enjoy your classic.

[robinmasters]

A resounding yes from me.

 

Shite.

 

 

Shite.

 

 

Shite.

 

 

Shite.

 

[Angrydicky]

I was born in 1991, and my current everyday motor is 60 years old. Cars made after about 1990 (with a few exceptions) don't interest me at all.

[forddeliveryboy]

406 Coupe? Rover 75? Volvo T5? Enjoy now before the global warming taxers obliterate them for good - electric cars will probably be selling in huge numbers by 2020, running on nuclear and coal power, but concentrating do-gooders minds to the filthiness of exhaust pipes.

[Hendry]

Stuff that was "cool" when new and owned by people in their 20s will become classics with scene tax when those cars become older and the folk who owned one when they were newish also get older and want to own the car of their youth again.

 

Mk1/2 Escorts are a prime example, they were the in car when new and the folk who owned them then are the ones paying top whack for them now. Don't think rep mobiles will end up like this, look at sporty mk3/4 Escorts starting to get hit with it, Orions aren't doing it to the same extent.

 

90s cars I think will become scene taxed classics are: mk3 Golf GTi/VR6, Fiesta XR2i/RS Turbo/RS1800, mk3 Astra GSis, mk5/6 Escort XR3i/RS 2000, Corsa B SRi/GSi, Fiat Uno Turbos, sporty Civics (fuck knows the sporty name of early 90s ones) 306 XSi/GTi, Clio 172s, etc. ie stuff owned by boy racers when modern, only "repmobile" I can see going that way is the mk3 Cavalier GSi2000/Turbo and possibly some others like the redtop SRis and Cesaro v6s

[Cavcraft]

They'll never have big values like M1/2 Escorts because they're just too ordinary. Just have a look at stuff like Farinas and what not, although they're class motors they're not really worth that much now.

 

Get something like a Sierra XR4, Cavalier GSi or whatever and they will do some coin, but boggo models will take a very, very long time to be worth investing in.

[rml2345]

Get something like a Sierra XR4, Cavalier GSi or whatever and they will do some coin, but boggo models will take a very, very long time to be worth investing in.

Is that not what usually happens? The posh/sporty models start to climb in price and the bog basic ones sort of follow on afterwards. I think some cars (Sierras particularly) are starting to creep up now so Mondeos might follow on in a couple of years. Unfortunately it means quite a few more will be lost yet.

[Negative Creep]

I was born in 82 but don't tihnk I can ever see a Mondeo in the same way as the Sierra. Perhaps that was due to the dull styling or lack of proper performance version. 90's cars seem to be on the cusp of moving from backstreet banger to retro but I don't tihnk it's happened quite yet. That said, at the moment they do offer something different with more toys and rustproofing than their 80's equivalents

[Lacquer Peel]

What's extraordinary about a RWD Escort?

 

I like all the cars from the 90s.... Kia Shuma... all the 90s cars... Toyota Picnic.... all the cars from the 90s....... Proton Persona Diesel.

[Bren]

What's extraordinary about a RWD Escort?

I like all the cars from the 90s.... Kia Shuma... all the 90s cars... Toyota Picnic.... all the cars from the 90s....... Proton Persona Diesel.

Absolutely nothing - and that's indicative of good modern cars are - they are so competent as to be soul destroying.

[Pillock]

A Mk1 / 2 Escort, when new, was wholly unremarkable. One of the most popular cars, seen everywhere. Quite what happened to give stella-swilling thugs a stiffy when they get within 600 yards of one is a mystery.

 

My mum's friend had one. Wedgewood blue, Mk2, estate. I seem to remember it was an R reg. Today, that would be worth a fortune but at the time (mid 80s) it was considered old, a bit of a wreck, and by some of the parents at school slightly embarassing. I suppose the equivalent of having an R-prefix Vectra on the school run when everyone else has three-year-old swanky diesels with satnav and front and rear parking sensors. 

 

My grandfather's mint Cortina, when he traded it in for a Mk3 Cav in 1988, was 6 years old. It took was considered old technology, being the last of the run so was already a dated design. It seemed to last for another 6 years, but even halfway through it's life when it went to the Vauxhall dealer, they considered it just a rubbish part-ex and it got shipped straight off to the auctions. That was in so good condition that now, it would be worth a damn sight more than the Cavalier.

[mercrocker]

I am not so sure  we should discount the povo stuff....Everybody's wheels from the kids pushchair to the geriatric's Asda bulldozer has more bells and whistles than the average 1990s beigemobile.   Therefore I think the appeal in the future will be in the stuff with windy miller  windows, no stereo and struggle steering.   Subtle upgrades can be done cheaply for driveability but the miserable-ness of basic spec will be far more of a talking point than something that  was loaded when new but barely makes  the minimal level of what constitutes a "car" today.....

[Mr Lobster]

Everything comes of age eventually I suppose and I'd happily give to space to a mk1 Laguna. 2.0 RTi or 3.0 with 200bhp please

[Hendry]

A Mk1 / 2 Escort, when new, was wholly unremarkable. One of the most popular cars, seen everywhere. Quite what happened to give stella-swilling thugs a stiffy when they get within 600 yards of one is a mystery.

 

My mum's friend had one. Wedgewood blue, Mk2, estate. I seem to remember it was an R reg. Today, that would be worth a fortune but at the time (mid 80s) it was considered old, a bit of a wreck, and by some of the parents at school slightly embarassing. I suppose the equivalent of having an R-prefix Vectra on the school run when everyone else has three-year-old swanky diesels with satnav and front and rear parking sensors. 

 

My grandfather's mint Cortina, when he traded it in for a Mk3 Cav in 1988, was 6 years old. It took was considered old technology, being the last of the run so was already a dated design. It seemed to last for another 6 years, but even halfway through it's life when it went to the Vauxhall dealer, they considered it just a rubbish part-ex and it got shipped straight off to the auctions. That was in so good condition that now, it would be worth a damn sight more than the Cavalier.

When I started high school R reg Vectras themselves were the swanky 3 year old cars, with the then equivalent of sat nav and parking sensors in air conditioning, remote operated central locking, and on board fuel computer and trafficmaster, but I know what you mean.

 

I think another factor is how much appeal cars have to kids when they were growing up, I was born in 87 so it was 92 when I was 5 I started getting to know cars and at that time it was still XR2s, RS Turbos, Sierra Cossies, Astra GTEs and Nova SRs that were the in thing then and captured my imagination so I'd be much more inclined to spend on one of these than something newer but someone born in 92 would've started noticing cars when XR2is, Corsa SRi/GSi, mk5 XR3is etc were about so they'd be willing to pay top whack for these in years to come. That's my theory anyway.

[eddyramrod]

We started to have this conversation, sort of, at my second interview for the Classic Car Buyer job.  I mentioned my 1996 Volvo, and that I didn't regard it as a classic, which took us off into generalisations.  Of course now I have something older, with more of a car-show following to it, although still a 90s car.  I was born in 1959, so I still struggle with the idea of even 1980s cars as classics, but many show organisers and insurers are happy enough to accept a threshold of 20 years.  I'll take that, it gets my MR2 in.

 

I understand that the Escort love has been driven by the rally history, but really... the Escort was a characterless blob that replaced one of the prettiest small cars ever, the Anglia.  I remember it happening.  I remember Escorts new, how asthmatic and poorly-equipped they were.  People forget that sort of thing, especially the young who only know the sporty models because all the povos have gone.  Classic status will always be led by the sporty and/or luxury models, that's life, but I will always champion the right of the ordinary car to survive.  Despite my well-known preference for luxury!

[Jim Bergerac]

I think some of the 90s rep mobiles will get a bit more collectable but nothing like as much as the Escorts have done. I think early or high spec Mondeos will draw in a bit of a scene tax but non-blue oval stuff will get less of a following. A MK2 Cavalier isn't particularly valuable these days and I expect that ten years down the line MK3 Cavaliers and early Vectras will be in that boat (insert any other non-Ford repmobile and its eighties equivalent here).

[HH-R]

It feels like just last week that "All That She Wants" by Ace of Base was number 1 and I was listening to it on a Bush walkman from Poundstretcher, so it's hard to recognise 90s stuff as classics...

 

... til you realise it was 20 years ago

[Pete-M]

As someone who's owned his current Mk2 Escort for five years, and who's owned 20 or 30 of them over the years I feel I should act in the defence of the Mk2.

 

They're not brilliant, but they are fun in the right spec. 1.1 pop? Fucking miserable shell donor. Same for any of the base spec ones - in basic specs they weren't great. They only really start to be fun when you get to the 1600 Sport or Harrier level because they're much more sorted. Forget 4 door ones as the shell is too wibbly. Same for estates. Vans can be fun when fitted with a 2.0.

 

Also, Mk2s like to rust. They always did. Most surviving examples have been painstakingly restored at least once by now. That takes a long time and a lot of effort. It's not rocket science but it can be a whole lot of work to get an Escort to the standards of the average £10k RS2000. One that isn't absolutely immaculate or correct will struggle to get over £7k. So there's no point in doing half a job. Lots of Mk2 Escorts have had full on restoration jobs that would cost £80k on an e type Jag.

 

I bought my first mk1 Escort in 1988. It was 12 years old and needed the floors, a posts and boot floor welding when I bought it. Even then a Mk1 or 2 was more fun than anything else I could vaguely afford to buy so it got welded up. It was also very very easy to make faster. £50 on a twin choke DGAV Weber and a service could often yeald 10-15 bhp. If it was a 1300 then the next trick was to fit a 1.6, another 10-15 bhp. If that wasn't enough then it was time to take a hammer to the bulkhead and fit a 2.0 Pinto. You could just keep on going and nothing was difficult. For a few hundred quid you could take a 55 bhp 1.3 base and it could have 150 bhp of DCOE Weber equipped Pinto lobbed in, and there were still more things you could do to make it fun. Which is why I love the things. The temptation to bolt the 170 bhp Duratec ST engine from my Focus into my Mk2 is huge - and it ain't hard to do.

 

Nothing else around at the time was so easy to tweak. Not much has ever been so simple to tweak. Not many cars are so easy to get sideways either.

 

The Classic Rallying scene knew how good the RWD Escorts were, they mysteriously kept the homologation date to just before the Escort was introduced in 68 for years. Because they knew that nothing else would win one the Escort was legal to enter classic rallies. It has proved right. You need at least £100k of sorted 911 to have a hope against £25k of Escort.

 

I've gone off old cars lately. Stuff like the Mk3 Cavalier or Mk4 Escort does nothing for me. Lagunas etc are cars that were good when they were new but I have zero desire to drive many of the common cars of the early 90s again. I'd have another XR4x4 or Sapphire Cosworth but that's about it when it comes to reasonably run of the mill stuff.

 

What will be a classic? Cavalier GSi and the Turbo. Sierra Cosworth. Any S or RS Audi. It's always the same, quick ones first then the lower models take 20 years longer before anyone wants them.

 

Saxo VTS / 106 GTi will be worth good money in mint condition, as will early unmolested Subaru Impreza / Legacy Turbos.

 

Base model stuff is never worth keeping in the hope it'll go up in value - if it doesn't have a shell that can be used to repair faster ones.

[philsford]

10 years ago all the boy racers had Citroen Saxos in VTR or VTS flavour. If you have space buy a mint one and leave it for 10 years. I am tempted to get one for my son who is now 4 as an investment, if he doesn't like it when he gets to 17/18 or carn't insure it he can cash it in and buy what he sees fit at the time. Once these boy racers have had there kids and have a bit of life back and disposable income they will be queing up to pay top dollar for tidy ones.

[Pete-M]

I can see folk shelling out half decent money for an immaculate Saxo VTS in the near future. The VTR won't be as sought after because the VTR was the common one, and everyone who had a VTR really wanted the VTS. Another 5 years and there'll be more VTS than VTR jobs anyway.

 

It's like 205 GTis. The 1.6 is the better daily drive but everyone with a 1.6 sometimes wishes they had the 1.9.

[Lacquer Peel]

All the 90s cars I like..... Citroen Xantia 1.9D LX automatic..... 90s cars, cars from the 90s, Renault Laguna 2.2D multivalve....the 90s, do you remember the Mazda 626 Supercharged Diesel?