Project Rusty Triumphs in Scotland - To gas or not to gas(less MIG) - 09/11/24

[Yoss]

Another one for mallard here. I had a mk2 2000 in it. It's a lot darker than yours but lovely when it's shiny. There's almost some blue in it. I also had two green mk1s, one Olive and one Conifer. They were quite similar but if you put the two together the Olive was a bit more brown. 

Or Russet brown. I had a Russet 1850. It's a similar tone to Brooklands but in brown. It looked fabulous under streetlights, it turns almost orange. But Mallard  is the classiest by far. 

[captain_70s]

Right. Weekend summary.

Day -1 : Yes, minus 1. Work was due to start on Sat but @GingerNuttz couldn't resist prodding at the wobbed up rear door and found it was rotten as fuck at the bottom and filled higher up, probably a dent repair. So roughed in a repair on Fri before I'd even arrived. It'll need loads of hammer and dolly action to look the part but is solid and 100% metal. Once finished everything is going to be drowned in vactan, zinc primer and waxoil so I'll never need to come back to it again!

 

Day 1 - The first actual day of work with me present. I arrived at 10:30am for assessment of front panels and chassis legs. White pen had been used liberally across the car to highlight repairs required.

Mr Nutzz had also taken off the bonnet and remaining engine bay clutter and started undoing the gearbox/engine bolts ready for removal. We pushed the car into the garage behind the Triumph Herald chassis as there was a van blocking the gate so we couldn't swap them over. The the strip down of the front end commenced. I started pulling trim and lights off while the Nutzz man made a start on repairing the N/S chassis leg.

Removing the front bumper required some angle grinder usage...

It was quite grotty behind the lights and grille. As in at least half of the metalwork was entirely absent and the rest was utterly fucked.

The corners of the wings and edge of the front valance were entirely filler and up on cutting the rot out we found...

Seems the rear arches weren't the only part to get the double skin treatment. At some point a new valance has been glued over the remnants of the old. Although they did at least cut most of the old one away this time...

I think it was around this time we decided to pull the engine. This was done properly with a crane and some chains and definitely wasn't* three blokes lifting it out by hand while being really confused as to why the gearbox was also coming despite being detached (because the gearbox mount was totally and utterly fucked).

With the engine out we pulled the sump off to admire the condition.

This is the big end bearing for No.3...

The hardened surface on the crank is entirely gone...

This end cap had gotten so hot the metal had blued... The adjacent oil pump was heat seized solid, we couldn't even get it apart...

My next video release will show the sheer amount of play in the crank/conrods and the fore-aft movement caused by shagged thrust bearings. I ran a magnet across the bottom of the sump and gained 2mm of metal... We were going to take out the crank but the pulley nut may as well have been welded on and we lacked the right adaptor to get the huge socket on the impact gun...

Diagnosis of failure: Catastrophic destruction of big end bearings, potentially accelerated by wear in the thrust bearings but as the engine was all sludged up when I got it it was probably neglected badly at some point in the past anyway.

If I'd done a full rebuild when I first got the car it would have been savable, but 12,000 odd miles of use down the line? Nope.  Salvageable parts? Nothing. It's entirely knackered, the crank is beyond regrinding, the bores are scored, the area around the main bearings will be compromised from the heat given off by No.3 going supernova so the block is toast, the cam will have 140k of wear and the original head is fucked from long term oil starvation. RIP  engine... 

No evidence of any prior rebuild and plenty of evidence the car had done 138,000 miles... A long life for a Triumph SC engine, but it's now finished.

We poked around with the front valance and wings a bit more trying to find solid metal until we decided it was home time at 16:00. The car was pushed back into the driveway for the night.,

Day 2 - I turned up at around 10:45. Now the gate was clear and we could swap the Dolly and Herald around. We towed the Dolly out with the Acclaim and pushed the Herald clear.

The Dolly was then rolled into the garage and the Herald sat on the driveway and well covered with tarps.

The front of the car was then bashed/cut to fuck in a hunt for good metal...

The "eyebrow" panels that live under the front panel and above the headlights hold the front panels and the wings together and a notorious rot spot due to the location and the number of overlapping panels/seams. Mine were completely and utterly fucked.

The remains of the O/S example was removed more or less intact via use of a plasma cutter to use as a template but the section that runs down the side of the wing beside the headlight was entirely missing on both sides. This had us pretty stumped because without knowing how it all went together and what purpose the panel served we couldn't really replicate it or replace it in an effective manner. So we finished a bit early and I hit the internet to find pictures. Thankfully a guy on the TDC forum had documented his concourse resto of a Sprint and there were loads of pictures of the whole area repaired as per it left the factory, so now we have something to work from.

A rough up of the O/S "eyebrow" panel has been knocked up and a few test fits attempted but it'll need a fair bit more work to be finalised.

Another thing we did do was make up a large chunk of the N/S front valance and indicator mount. Sadly @GingerNuttz doesn't like posting WIP shots (preferring before/after) despite the fact that about 25% into him making a panel is the point where 95% percent of people would say "yup, that'll do" and weld it to the car. so you'll just have to make do with this teaser shot...

It took a while to get the indicator area correct as the indicator mount remains vertical while the panel curves both downwards and inwards.

A full GRP panel is avaliable from the TDC for £160 + £25 for joining the club, and then a 10 hour drive and £100+ in petrol to collect it from the Midlands. The "eyebrow" panels are avaliable in GRP for £45 each, headlight mounting panels are £52 each. Just to get the panels for the front end would be the best part of £500 and would leave the wings still to be repaired. That's a lot of money/time that can be spent actually working on the car/ buying suspension bushes, etc + time waiting for parts to arrive which would probably need fettled to fit anyway so the decision was made to fabricate the lot...

Anyway, work was a bit slower overall on Day 2 but overall still utterly blistering due to the speed Mr Nutzz works at. He's threatened to have the entire front of the car finished by my next visit a week on Sunday which I can easily see being the case...

 

[sdkrc]

This is absolutely fucking amazing. At what point is this going to be entirely new parts and metal i.e. none of the original car? I reckon you're 30% of the way there already.

[Tickman]

Brilliant work

[GingerNuttz]

2 minutes ago, sdkrc said:

This is absolutely fucking amazing. At what point is this going to be entirely new parts and metal e.g. none of the original car? I reckon you're 30% of the way there already.

Front wheels forward it's going to be all new metal as there's fuck all to weld to. We've got all the repair panels made for the chassis and main structure of the front end, then it's just the fronts of the wings and the other side of the valance to knock up.

 

 

[big_al_granvia]

great work lads, a good fabricator is a godsend.... good 1st weekend

[320touring]

Huzzah! Great work:)

[greengartside]

Well done guys, there’s some serious talent on these forum pages right now.

Id personally leave it Brooklands Green, it’s such a cool 70’s colour in my eyes. It is Brooklands, right?

[Tamworthbay]

Good to see it getting some love!

[PhilA]

Bearings aren't wrecked, they're just a proper Scots "money's worth".

As stated previously, nice to see it getting a bit of TLC. Trigger's Broom is unimportant. Structural integrity counts at this point. Gotta give BL a little credit that so much air could hold a car together.

 

Phil

[somewhatfoolish]

9 hours ago, captain_70s said:

This is the big end bearing for No.3...

The hardened surface on the crank is entirely gone...

Where's the Ladybird book of it's fucking fucked M9 when you need it.

[eddyramrod]

Indoor workspace!  I'm so envious...  This is looking brilliant already, it's going to make my work on Huggy look so rubbish.

Have you sourced a replacement engine yet?

[Tadhg Tiogar]

6 hours ago, PhilA said:

.... Gotta give BL a little credit that so much air could hold a car together.

The alternative was gaffer tape and hope.

[dollywobbler]

Blimey. This truly is great to see.

[blackboilersuit]

Absolutely loving this. Amazing car, and amazing work going on. I vote for keeping the colour the same purely for selfish reasons. It's how I remember not just this Dolomite but all Dolomites on the roads during my childhood and the colour also reminds me of the HB Viva my mate sprayed on his driveway using half a gallon of tractor enamel about 25 years ago.

As a man very much in tune with the style and fashion of that era I know we can trust you to pick a colour that'll look amazing on the car ?

[phil_lihp]

Amazing progress and great to see this car finally getting the work it's needed for so long.   Props for not giving up on it!

[Jenson Velcro]

Well, it seems that neither Gingernuttz or Mr_Bo11ox are afraid to go balls deep into repairs of galloping rot. Must be something in the names, perhaps I should change mine and grow a big pair myself.

Great to see the work being put into the Dolomite, it should be good to see it live on for a long while yet.

[LightBulbFun]

Awesome to see the serious work being put into the Dolomite makes me very happy to see it get some serious TLC!

I look forward to its return to the road in time  

[davehedgehog31]

Absolutely tremendous work both of you.

[somewhatfoolish]

9 hours ago, eddyramrod said:

Have you sourced a replacement engine yet?

It's in the boot, already prettified by a generous shiter whose identity escapes me.

[davidfowler2000]

I may come round one day when yous are doing work and make it a council job by standing observing

[GingerNuttz]

13 minutes ago, davidfowler2000 said:

I may come round one day when yous are doing work and make it a council job by standing observing

You're welcome anytime! I'll even make you one of them posh lattes in the delicate cups ? 

[captain_70s]

To answer a few above questions:

An engine has already been sourced and rebuilt by @Jikovron, still a 1296cc unit but a "pre-rationalisation" example with smaller crank journals from the mid 1960s. In the early 1970s the engine was redesigned to share it's big end bearings with the TR6 which made it less rev happy. Early spec 1300 engines are generally accepted to be the best of the Triumph SC units so when Ron said there was one for sale locally to him for cheaps I jumped on it!
@GingerNuttz is trying to convince me to install a hot cam and at least twin carbs but I'm a fucking miser and the performance (possibly up to 65bhp-ish!) will already be mind blowing. It can't have had more than 45bhp before, a well sorted Morris Minor would out-drag it...

A whole lotta' metal* is getting replaced, these cars rot from the inside out due to the construction of the front end. Dirt and water get's flung up behind the lights be the front wheel, there is no splash guard, and collects at the wing tips and down the leading edge of the wings. Once rot takes hold it spreads inwards, more holes, more dirt and water gets trapped behind the nose panel and by the time that is blistering from the inside out everything behind it'll be properly rough...

*Mostly paint, rust and filler currently...

Originally the whole car was made of 1.2mm steel, so a decent thickness, probably a large reason as to why the front of the car is still straight despite losing so much structure! For the repairs the chassis structure is getting 2mm, the structural components (inner front panel etc) that have to support stuff are 1.2mm and the cosmetic panels (wing tips, valances etc) will be 0.8mm. This is simply because 0.8 is so much easier to manipulate, it shaves hours off the fabrication time. It's essentially the standard for modern motor's panel skins, the Japanese were using it in the 1970s - As evidenced by the Acclaim which is mostly 0.8!

The only downside is that I won't be able to do dumb shit like stand on the wings to take photographs, and it might not win the Pebble Beach concours d'elegance if they whip out the calipers... ?

Have another fuzz shot...

(Wonkness of the driver's side panel is because two tacks on one side does not a panel support!)

I've ordered some gaskets and other misc engine shit so that should be largely assembled on Sunday... I also need to order pretty much every rubber component on the car as it is all utterly fucked from sitting...

[Supernaut]

On 7/13/2020 at 5:19 AM, somewhatfoolish said:

Where's the Ladybird book of it's fucking fucked M9 when you need it.

[captain_70s]

I cut that out as a PNG template ages ago and I've fucking lost it...

[Supernaut]

1 hour ago, captain_70s said:

I cut that out as a PNG template ages ago and I've fucking lost it...

What, so you can put it over a photo of one of your cars? I suppose it would work on other cars too...

[Yoss]

I have a fast road cam in the loft. I've had it many years but decided not to use it as reading up on these things (pre Internet days) it was decided the mk3 Spitfire cam 212164 was the best all rounder. Which is what mine came with being a 1300TC. I also have twin carb inlet manifolds and a box of SU's though they would need rebuilding. But if you have a good single carb I would start with that, so much easier to set up. If you want to go TC at a later date it's very easy to swap but as you say a good 1300 will be a revalation compared with what you've been used to. 

[GingerNuttz]

I'm not one for posting pictures of things half done but the fuzzy pictures are doing my head in ? 

It's still a work in progress and I've only got 4 hours on it since the weekend and I'm working from pictures to make these panels so quite slow progress I'm afraid. It's all just tacked atm so i can make sure all the body lines meet and lights fit etc 

d 

 

 

[Jikovron]

Great work on the repairs, loads of patience clearly on display here with the fiddly work!

 

[CreepingJesus]

One of those jobs where 'just' comes with a permanent asterisk. "We just* need to..." etc. Cap well and truly doffed, and as the forum seems to lack a 'teeth drying' emoji, you'll have to take it as read that I dried my teeth a few times, reading this.