invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[Sheefag]

Invacar Races From The Past

Quote

One of my funniest memories as a kid, if you are old enough, the little blue car in the picture was called a Invacar shortened from "invalid carriage" which even the name would not be allowed.

This little blue fibreglass call was powered by a Villiers 197 two stroke motorcycle engine.

As teenagers, we knew a man who owned one of these vehicles, he was called Ted and he was the most miserablest man on the planetTed owned a riding stables, his riding school was probably a mile and a half up a farm track, this farm track like many was not Teds land, he only had access across the track to his own land.

The land was owned by a Farmer and I was friends with his boy, the Farmer and his wife were just the nicest people and we would help out during harvest and around the farm.

Then we got a bike a bit like the one in the photo, it came to us as a road bike but we pulled it apart and put knobbly tyres on it, I honestly cannot remember the name of the bike but the bike was fitted with the same Villiers 197 engine as Teds Invacar, lol

We would then take the bike into my mates Dads field next to the track and wait for Ted,

Ted already hated us for various activities on my mates land next door to his over the years and here were sat waiting to fucking race him, lol

Ted only went out once a day so we would only get one race a day but still,

I would be going first, yeah, course I was, I was the youngest and always the test pilot for most shit we did and I was a regular at the local hospital for stitches etc.

My first attempt to race Ted failed miserably, I made the novice mistake of coming from wet grass to gravel so when I dropped the clutch, the tyre dug in and I flipped it and ended up in the gravel.

Ted was probably pissing himself looking in his mirror, fair play Ted, 1-0

The following day was different, I had been practicing on the gravel and I could drop the clutch if I was hanging over the bars and controlling the slide, when Ted turned he was shaking his fist and shouting abuse at us from his little window, in response I just revved the bike up to drowned him out, lol.

The first race, I don't think Ted tried tbh, I was past him in seconds and it was all a bit of a anti climax, myself and the bike were obviously a lot lighter than Teds blue racer, combine that with the fact he never tried but he would given time and enough races.

Over the school holidays the racing would become relentless with a race everyday, Ted became so wild he would try his best but cannot be easy trying to rally a Three wheeled car, ffs

Has it became boring we would do all kinds of daft shit to even up the odds, lol three of us on the bike to even the weight up, thanks for the good memories Ted you miserable Bastard,
much Luvviness,
Paul

 

Obviously not the original pictures but the best match I could find

 

 

[LightBulbFun]

had an all day run out in the VDP  my first out of town trip with the Ol Girl

To East Grinstead and back to pick up the 1940's Fluorescent light fixture @Christine and @500tops very kindly pointed my way to that was being sold on RetroRides by User Datman, I also took my brother along with me and used the opportunity to see my Sister and Nephew who happened to be staying in the area for half term

rather fittingly joined the M25 behind/with this Datsun 280Z  

and the driver of this LHD 106 looked very baffled to see us for some reason (kind of a shame I was not in REV in this particular shot as in Bright yellow it very much gave me Ali-G Renault 5 vibes LOL)

eventually was time to head home by which point it had gotten quite wet

stopped for fuel which allowed me to do  my first MPG calculation for it, sadly I have not quite as good with my milage recording as I have with REV so so I dont have an exact figure but depending on which figure I do base my calculation on somewhere between 16.6 and 22.8 Mpg, the joys of slushing around London at single digit average speeds!

battled our way through a very wet M25,

which the ol Pirincess handled without complaint despite at times getting a very serious soaking from Lorries and the such like, (hopefully its given her underside a good clean too, I had to traverse a bit of a farm lane earlier in the day which made me feel bad.)

spotted this nice Rover P6 also  felt rather fitting to be papping it from a Vanden Plas! 

obligatory bakery stop for mum

and then finally home (yes I did forget to park the windscreen wipers)

overall Ye Olde Vanden Plas 1300 Princess did very well! I am pleased to report that the the stumbling issue I had on the run back from Bristol has cleared itself and at one point when I was seeing what the ol girl could do (to see if the issue was still about or not), as I had my foot to the floor clearing a line of traffic via the outside lane I briefly achieved 80 on the GPS  (before bringing things back down a notch for fear of speed cameras and things exploding LOL) and as mentioned the run back home was very wet but that did pose any problems at all thankfully (besides highlighting the fact I really need to clean all the glass)

exactly 111.1 miles covered in this outing according to the trip/Demeter too  

also for the fellow computer nerds I nabbed a couple old computers from Mr Datman as well, had to get the Grey one because of how delightfully 2003 it is, look its got a Handle and everything! would of been real handy for LAN parties I imagine...

[D.E]

An Albrecht for sale! What's interesting about this invalid carriage is that it has a dickey seat:

Albrecht

[MT606]

Probably the only country that thing would get a chance to top out.....

[Weird Car]

Acedes or petite ?

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Weird Car said:

Acedes of petite ?

a quite early AC Acedes Model 57  

it has a an IMCDB entry

https://www.imcdb.org/vehicle_1078714-AC-Invacar-Type-57-1959.html

[davocano]

FB algorithm threw this at me

[davocano]

Also, I spotted your Princess in Walton-on-Thames back in September 2020.

[Sheefag]

Dodgy or not?
https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=1583758583198193&set=pb.100046921999165.-2207520000

Quote

Well…..our radar for dodgy stuff is usually pretty good, but when we posted this car for sale on FB Marketplace this morning, following a share from a member, we didn’t immediately spot the issues with the picture that some of our eagle eyed page followers did!
Like the roof rail going all the way round and the odd blurring effect on the badging, both suggesting some input from AI.

Does this mean the sale is dodgy? Who knows!
It’s been posted by someone who has clearly been on FB for quite a long time and has quite a few other listings for antiques, but the description is certainly brief and the photos are odd.
Why would a photo of a car for sale need any input from AI?
Anyway, thank you to those of you who commented and drew this to our attention.

Remember folks, when any car is advertised, we would advise not parting with any cash until you have viewed it in person and met the owner so that at least you are satisfied that the car exists and is actually in the advertiser’s possession.
If the owner is an 1100 Club member (and you can always check that with us if you are a member as well) then that hopefully helps a bit too. 

[LightBulbFun]

5 hours ago, davocano said:

Also, I spotted your Princess in Walton-on-Thames back in September 2020.

very cool! I had seen these on Flicker previously, but its great to hear from the Spotter (Spotee?) themselves  a few weeks back I did do a bit of digging and found some other history for it also, its still listed as a hireable vehicle on one of those "hire a vehicle for an occasion" website!

On 20/01/2026 at 14:14, LightBulbFun said:

along those notes I was ogling its keeper change history

and decided to do a bit of digging into its history and rather interestingly/amusingly turns out it was available for hire at some point in time!

owned by someone called Hazel

https://www.bookaclassic.co.uk/vanden-plas-princess-london/

who called it Margaret! (Princess Margaret!)

(Speed 60 Mph? thats selling it short I had it up to 77 on the M4 on the way back from Bristol, until I remembered its the M4 theres speed cameras everywhere and brought it back a touch, if I ever get done for exceeding the NSL on a motorway I want it to be in REV  )

Photos tally with these 

On 29/01/2024 at 07:39, HMC said:

Here a a few pic the previous owner sent me (they lived in central london) which further tap into that vibe…

and on the forum Its been owned by @HMC (Twice) @Sigmund Fraud, @Andyrew, @SiC and currently Me   

 

if any of the previous owners have any details about any history of the vehicle im all ears, ill certainly be doing a bit of digging in time  in particular @HMC did you get any details from the person you got it from/how did you find it?  

google is also showing a thumbnail of an uncensored version of one of the pictures from the car hire website

but every you click on the image in google images it just takes you to some non relevant facebook post instead...

[666jjp]

just watched an episode of the big match revisited (s06e17) and there is a shot of LNO983P at about 40.52 minutes in.

 

[LightBulbFun]

Random Lightbulb interlude  for those who remember this post in this thread

On 24/04/2020 at 22:01, LightBulbFun said:

also while talking to stuart about all this the subject drifted onto lightbulbs, and it turns out he only happens to have 2 Bayonet capped fluorescent tubes hidden away in his shed! one was stashed away and one was/is built into the shed itself with its 1940s control box still, removing that one without bringing down half the shed is going to be fun!

so that was very exciting! he has very kindly offered them to me when I can either collect them or get them collected!

I was planning on visiting Stuart once I had REV on the road anyway, and how many fluorescent tubes Can you fit in a Model 70 is a fun game iv been wanting to play  so that works out nicely I guess LOL

(can you imagine being some traffic copper sitting on an overpass and you see an Invacar fly down the Motorway with a load of fluorescent tubes sticking out of the side windows like some sort mad exhaust stack LOL)

 

for those who dont know, while we (Osram GEC) did technically invent the fluorescent tube first it was GE in the US with its massive clout who managed to properly bring it to market properly first in 1938

but by the time the "tech" had come back to the UK WW2 was underway so the "standard" US 4ft 40W Tube had to be redesigned around components already in manufacture in the UK so companies did not have to make new tooling etc

and such was the 5ft 80W bayonet capped flourcent tube born, stretched to 5ft and 80W so it could run off an existing 80W mercury vapour lamp choke (ballast), and then used normal bayonet capped end caps from normal lightbulbs

early bayonet capped tubes really did have normal lightbulb end caps http://www.lamptech.co.uk/Spec Sheets/D FL Silicate Ar Mazda F80T12-WW BC.htm

but these are quite rare (Osram GEC was the last manufacture to make BC tubes in this style making them until the mid 1980s I think) if anyone does have any please do let me know im quite eiger to add one to the collection  

 

such tho was the popularity of the BC tube and its fixtures throughout the war and just after the war, that replacement BC capped tubes did remain in production until 1992!

however despite this, any and all types of Bayonet capped tubes are sadly still very rare today including the later skirted cap types (which used a type of widened bayonet end cap which meant they could use a normal type tube without having to have special ends for the narrower incandescent lamp end caps) 

and this later skirted type is the 2 that Stuart has stashed away

the first is this Philips MCFA one, sadly going by the large splotches of missing phosphor i fear this one may have gone to air a long time ago, but im hoping im wrong (sadly I don't think Stuart has any sort of Plasma ball or such to try and make it glow to test if its still under "vacuum" or not)

this one is however unusual because it says Cool White /33 now Colour 33 was known as Daylight in the UK until the late 1970's where it was finally labeled up as cool white to match the rest of the world, but this tubes date code is 49, so that indicates its from January 1962! so that's a bit of a mistary! 

another rare feature is the fact its an MCFA tube and would have had an earthing stripe running down the length of the tube of which you can see the remains of in the second picture http://www.lamptech.co.uk/Spec Sheets/D FL Mazda MCFA20.htm

the second is this Omega branded (BLI made) one  I sadly dont know when this one was made (I know what the date code is, its the dots you see scattered around the etch, but I sadly dont know how to decipher them) but I can say this one is also likely from the 1960s going by its etch style etc

this one looks to be in much better condition and im hopeful it still works as well

 

well when I went to the National Microcar rally last year, I did finally manage to get these, (well the Omega BC tube, the Philips BC tube was completely cactus as I thought!) and most recently I finally got around to giving it a good look over  

and sure the Omega tube and its gearbox that was still abandoned in situ , fired up without a hesitation after who knows how long  the control gear unit is quite interesting its a starterless type of the Quickstart type but it appears have an Open circuit voltage above that of mains voltage, so its topology is something I am quite keen to figure out! as the boosting of mains voltage like this is quite unusual for a Quickstart setup

 

I also got around to checking over and firing up the old fluorescent light fixture I picked up off of Retro rides 

shown here in its disassembled state as I checked things over, the fixture itself is made by Thorlux 

only a small remnant of the sticker on my unit remains, but what does remain and its outline where crucial to ID'ing it, but here is an example of the sticker from another very similar unit

pictures of the control gear, of note is a date of 1951 on the Power Factor correction capacitor, (the MRJ104 choke was also only produced after 1950 but discontinued by 1955)

after giving a things a good check over, I popped in one of the NOS, GLS capped BC tubes from my collection 

and 75 years later, still fires up and runs without an issue  I also changed the Thorn Glow bottle starter for a more era appropriate (but very rare) Osram-GEC thermal starter, also because they start the tube much nicer then a glow bottle starter does and I want to look after my Rare GLS Capped BC tube! (this may well be the first video on the internet of a fluorescent tube thermal starter in action...)

 

and heres a bonus view that you get with the old GLS Capped BC tubes, the gap in the phosphor where the tube tapers down to the bayonet caps gives you a neat view of the cathodes in operation  

overall I am quite pleased with this aquestion, its nice to have a BC fluorescent tube fixture in my own collection  especially being one the archetypical designs/styles you see in all the old factory/works photographs!

 

also for comparison sake here is a nice 1965 5ft 65W Atlas Atlantic 3, Wide body Batten with enclosed trough reflector, that I picked up with the ADO16 a few posts before the Retro rides unit

(outfitted with a deep cap Atlas Super 5 is from my collection) its quite an interesting comparison in this regard as they are both industrial enclosed reflector trough reflector fixtures, and would of been specified for the exact same use cases, so we are seeing the direct evolution over 15 years or so  

[captain_70s]

On 23/02/2026 at 14:09, Sheefag said:

Dodgy or not?

I suspect it is a real car and somebody has attempted to "enhance" a crap photo with AI.

[keef]

Check out your message requests from Austin Maxi on Facebook. I’ve sent you several pics that might interest you.

Also see you appear to have acquired a VDP Princess! Here’s my 1965 version.

[LightBulbFun]

also for @AdgeCutler, from @st185cs who happened to speak with a chap who was involved with them, a picture of the Oddingley 5 I had not seen before  a fun picture of them after they had been unearthed from the hedge row but before they where whisked away, the way they are all lined up and "standing to attention" reminds me of March of the penguins somewhat or something along those lines

also a bit like an Autoshite version of Wheres Waldo, "Wheres Brian the Invacar Mk12" (its one of those 5!)

[Christine]

Nah , looks like Rise of the Zombies...

[lesapandre]

The Day of the Triffids...

[captain_70s]

Were the Mk12s in service right until the end in the 2000s or where they withdrawn earlier once Model 70s were widely avaliable?

[LightBulbFun]

6 hours ago, captain_70s said:

Were the Mk12s in service right until the end in the 2000s or where they withdrawn earlier once Model 70s were widely avaliable?

 sadly pretty much every Villiers machine had been withdrawn/scrapped by 1983, i'd say based on my DVLA block bashing, only about 60 maybe even less, Villiers machines where still on the road by 1983, by the end of the scheme all together in 2003, only one Villiers machine was said to still be in service still JPE798C a 1965 AC Acedes Model 57

in a good number of the "sole vehicle in a block of Invacar Mk12's to show up on the DVLA still" ie machines that survived to some point after 1983, where private machines!

its one of the things that makes Villiers machines so rare today, and why if you find one that was abandoned after Ministry service its usually in such a sorry state as by the time anyone has found it would of been sitting around rotting for so long, because they came off the road so long ago, and at a time when very few people sadly cared, in the 1960's-1970's-1980's, no one would of cared about just another Invacar going to scrap, they where just seen as end of life vehicles to be replaced by another, especially even going back the 1960's-1970's.

Ministry machines where generally given a 7 year life, so after 7 years you got a new vehicle issued to you, so if you where driving a 1958 Harper Mk6, in 1965 you would then be given say a new Invacar Mk12B, and then in 1972 you would be given a new AC Model 70, with your previous Harper Mk6 and Invacar Mk12 usually sent off for scrap

for example @egg's Mk12 was Last taxed in 1980, and @AdgeCutler's Mk12 was last taxed in 1979, and both had to be unarchived from the DVLA's "these vehicles have been off the road for so long we took them off the main computer" archive

a fair majority of the Villiers machines which are actually in reasonable condition today, only exist through the efforts of Julian Nowill, who managed to convince the Ministry to let museums around the country to have a Villiers machine from their Heywood stores, and even then most museums just took a token AC Acedes Model 57, only the Combe Martin Motorcycle realised the significance, and they went out their way to take one of each time (sometimes multiple!) but sadly their excellent Invalid Carriage collection was scattered to the 4 winds in the mid 2000's I am still actively trying to find out where they ended up,

 

also of note there was also concerted preservation efforts by michael lawrence, (which is where the Science Musuem have a fair number of their Fully bodied Villiers machines from), and the Clark and Partners collection, they where a very Large approved repairer, who in the late 1970's-early-80's very much had someone high up in their staff ranks, who knew where they where looking at Invalid car wise and made an effort to preserve some of these machines as they came out of service in the late 70's early 80's

 

I think the latest I have seen an Invacar Mk12 survive in Ministry service would be the early 1990's, KWC896J probably is one of the latest in Ministry service

funnily enough, I later learned that this machine DPL767J was actually Michael Lawrence's last MInistry machine, and there is actually a picture of it in the Heywood stores still in 1996 after it was withdrawn in 1994, I have always wondered about that keeper change date in 1998, was it actually preserved by someone given if its significance as his last machine, alas so far 1996 is the last time it was pictured

On 11/06/2021 at 01:29, LightBulbFun said:

of note from this block is DPL767J that one with its 1994 Tax due date has to be the one of the longest surviving In ministry service Villiers machine iv come across outside of the actual machines which where the last Villiers machines in Ministry service (like JPE789C) 

rather interestingly it has a keeper change 4 years after its tax due date and No scrapped marker, I almost wonder if this one escaped somehow and still survives somewhere, one can always be hopeful!

but I digress! 

 

[UltraWomble]

23 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

Random Lightbulb interlude  for those who remember this post in this thread

well when I went to the National Microcar rally last year, I did finally manage to get these, (well the Omega BC tube, the Philips BC tube was completely cactus as I thought!) and most recently I finally got around to giving it a good look over  

and sure the Omega tube and its gearbox that was still abandoned in situ , fired up without a hesitation after who knows how long  the control gear unit is quite interesting its a starterless type of the Quickstart type but it appears have an Open circuit voltage above that of mains voltage, so its topology is something I am quite keen to figure out! as the boosting of mains voltage like this is quite unusual for a Quickstart setup

When I next pop to my mothers I must nip up into the loft and photograph the old flouro tube with that set up that is fitted to a joist, which is where i used to have my train set. The tube is secured in place with Terry clips!

No idea how old it is - about 50 years + would be my guess as the train set was up there over 40 years ago.

[Weird Car]

[LightBulbFun]

30 minutes ago, Weird Car said:

thats the Science museum's one

https://collection.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/objects/co8555994/harper-mark-vi-three-wheeled-car

[LightBulbFun]

had another short Jaunt into the City with the VDP yesterday, still doing an car things very well (tho I really need to do something about the main battery wire thats gone dodgy, and there is still a slow speed, but engine speed dependent squeak-squeak going on sometimes, that first showed up last time out on the big jaunt, some sort belt in the engine bay perhaps?) was nice driving it in decent weather for a change!

I had actually hoped to finally get mum behind the wheel this time, but alas she sat down in the driving seat and immediately asked for the seat to go back, but it was already at maximum extension, so that was the end of that! she is fine in the passenger seat, but she says the driver seat, seats her much lower down which throws things off, I know theres a set of seat rail extender thingies in the boot, suppose I should figure out how they work/are installed (I am not sure if they go in place of the existing rails, or bolt onto back of the existing rails?)

I did rather amusingly managed to photograph it with a different coach each time, the @quicksilver special episode?  

[martc]

I'm sure by page 523 we've already had this, but just in case....

I've just watched The Comic Strip Presents - Dirty Movie. It has plenty of red hot action, Invalid Carriage action. Unlike, spoiler, the Dirty Movie itself.

Here's a copy on You Tube, it's a bit poor, but you can watch it on Channel 4's catch up service.

 

[Mr Pastry]

7 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

I had actually hoped to finally get mum behind the wheel this time, but alas she sat down in the driving seat and immediately asked for the seat to go back, but it was already at maximum extension, so that was the end of that! she is fine in the passenger seat, but she says the driver seat, seats her much lower down which throws things off, I

Not sure if this would apply to the VDP as seats are different, but on the lesser 11/1300 models the seats are only attached at the front and can tip forward,  even on the 4 door models, so it is quite easy to add blocks under the back legs to raise the seat.  One of ours certainly had this mod so my mother could drive it, can't remember the exact details now.

[Andyrew]

The seat rail extensions I made may not suit your mum as the seats get lower as they go back, the rails are quite sloped IIRC. Maybe some cushions on the seat to  raise her up and change leg positions a bit would help. 

What's occurred with the battery cables. Think I knocked up all new ones on this car?

 

 

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Andyrew said:

The seat rail extensions I made may not suit your mum as the seats get lower as they go back, the rails are quite sloped IIRC. Maybe some cushions on the seat to  raise her up and change leg positions a bit would help. 

yeah I mentioned cushions to her, but she has concerns about then running into the steering wheel, ill have to try seat her in the drive-seat again some time and take a closer look as to whats what, I know part of the problem is that she cant get her legs straight like she wants them, so I figured having the seat further back would at least hopefully solve that problem

1 hour ago, Andyrew said:

What's occurred with the battery cables. Think I knocked up all new ones on this car?

where the negative wire itself goes into the battery terminal with the 2 little screws on it, I think have gone high resistance, at least thats the section I have deduced thats gets warm which I need to then wiggle to get all the electricity to come back  (so ill start by checking if those little screws need tightening up, and if they continue to give grief ill see whats involved with crimping on a set of battery terminals)

[LightBulbFun]

in invalid Carriage news, a Tippen Delta 5 I had been long wondering about, BWK894D, showed up again  I have little info on this vehicle, (other than a rattling thought in my head that one of the owners of MHJ107P had something to do with it) but what I did have was these 2 pictures of it from some 15 years ago or so? clearly preserved to some degree, showing it in fairly good condition in a trailer

and this much more recent picture from I think the late 2010's maybe 2020?

alas thats all I had of it until recently, when It showed up again in a fairly disassembled state, again sadly very little story other then "found after someone died and we where clearing the land", I get the impression that someone may of started doing work on it, but never finish the work 

but I was able to convince @st185cs to purchase it, to go with his Tippen Delta 8 ORW413G

it is unfortunate that has sadly fallen into such a state of disrepair, but I am very pleased its popped up again and has been rescued, and has enabled me to glean its fine details like its Chassis plate/number, and see that it is a private example, which is nifty! (which is probably how it managed to survive, not being part of any Ministry edict to be destroyed at the end of life etc) and with a bit of TLC, hopefully in time we will be able to recreate this Photo  

[D.E]

2 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

 

 

Every single time this picture is posted my eyes are drawn to that Consul Capri. Looks gorgeous in red and on Rostyles!

[Snake Charmer]

On 07/03/2026 at 15:56, D.E said:

Every single time this picture is posted my eyes are drawn to that Consul Capri. Looks gorgeous in red and on Rostyles!

Great photo.