Project Rusty Triumphs in Scotland - To gas or not to gas(less MIG) - 09/11/24

[captain_70s]

4 minutes ago, GingerNuttz said:

Nah i can't see any tape on either of his Triumphs ?

Well, he needs to learn a trick or two then.

[eddyramrod]

2 hours ago, GingerNuttz said:

Nah i can't see any tape on either of his Triumphs ?

My 1972  Toledo was wearing structural tape on the nosecone 40 years ago!

[Tadhg Tiogar]

14 hours ago, captain_70s said:

He has an equally daft Acclaim. He's basically me*

....

An Acclaim VTEC sounds hilarious 

[big_al_granvia]

@captain_70s your totally fucked engine, like the one with shells that are now razor blades. Dont chuck the pistons and rods. The guys at superlap Scotland use old pistons and rods polished up as trophies. Fancy donating yours for the classic and thoroughbred class. Can get them sometime

[captain_70s]

Back out at the car today.

I've bought a fuck load of shit for it recently...

New suspension bushes all round.
Payen head gasket set
Top/bottom end gasket sets
Timing chain tensioner/gaskets
Valve guides + stem seals
Cam followers
Oil pump
Coolant hoses
Brake flexis all round
30W running in oil
2x 20w50 mineral for the first two changes
Paint (twice)

I think I've now officially spent more money on the resto than I did buying the car in the first place. I'm gonna' tot it all up when it's done and not a minute sooner! ?

S0. To recap the car looked something like this a couple of weeks ago after significant prodding

It now looks like this:

Yup, first bunch of filler now on the passenger side and in the process of being sanded back. There is a lot of sanding to go mind, there should only be a tiny skim to even out the hammer marks by the time it's done... The driver's side still needs a couple of tweaks before it's ready for filler. Here is is pre-filler to prove it isn't sculpted from P38:

A fairly important thing to note here is that because the metal left on the car was so corroded there was essentially nothing left to work from. The lower corners of the front wings were entirely misshaped filler, the headlight retaining structure was gone entirely, as were half the bumper mounts. All the new metal work has been made by @GingerNuttz from scratch and working from photos online because there was either nothing left or what was left was bodge... 
It also appears that either there were a couple of varieties of front valance or that the tooling got so worn out the later cars were different to early ones...

The leading edges of the front chassis legs were also entirely replaced, as were several panels behind the valance - I cunningly failed to take any pictures.

In engine terms the basement raid came up trumps.

In 1970 the Triumph 1300 engine was significantly changed to share it's bearings with the 6-cylinder cars. This made them less rev-happy and caused premature failure of bearings. This meant there was also a change for the timing cover and crank seal, with later cars have a larger diameter and a much bigger pulley.

The Dolly being a '77 was running a "large journal" engine, the replacement is a mid 1960s "small journal" engine from a 1300fwd. This meant I needed an appropriate timing cover/seal, which I was lacking. Thankfully I'd picked up a Herald 12/50 1200cc engine for free a while back "just in case", and these feature the same diameter crank and use the same timing cover as the "small journal" 1300 units, so I had the required parts "in stock"!
I'll still have to use the smaller 1300fwd pulley as there is a taper on the end of the crank, but this should be fine provided I change the size of the water pump and alternator pulleys accordingly.

@GingerNuttz has rebuilt the cylinder head.

It has new valve guides fitted and a mixture of it's original valves and spares from @GingerNuttz's Herald re-lapped in. He's also removed a significant amount of casting flash and superfluous metalwork in the inlets for better air flow!

We pulled the cam out and found that there was some scoring to the end-most surface so it was swapped for the Herald's original cam as well, which also featured slightly more lift. We drenched it in assembly lube before fitting.

With that decided the gasket and front plate were fitted and the end float on the cam checked - We're in spec!

I checked the torques on all the main/big end caps and fitted the new oil pump. Then we checked the end float on the crank. It's within tolerance but not by a huge margin.

At this point we shall mention paint.

I'd been deliberating on a shade for ages and had come to the conclusion I wanted BRG, specifically Triumph's own variant. As per this:

There was a 2k paint kit on eBay for "BRG" from a supplier in the Midlands but not specifying an exact shade, so I phoned up and enquired and the bloke on the phone said that although they did have a generic "BRG" shade if I specified the colour code in a message with the order it could be mixed up and that they did do the correct Leyland BRG. Belter.

The paint arrived. It's labelled as "BRITISH RACING GREEN RAL6009" and is a putrid shade of very nearly brown and a consistency of water. GR9.

I'd ordered it straight to the workshop so the first time I actually saw it in person was today. It was just as horrible as it looked in pictures. So we went down to a local paint supplier and deliberated over swatches for far too long before picking an appropriate looking shade. They tap the code into the computer "it comes back as Leyland Brooklands Green". After all that we'd managed to pick out the exact colour the had been when it rolled out of the factory...

On the scrap plate to the left is the RAL6009, the paint on the tin lid is BL Brooklands and the paint on the car is... Something random it's been sprayed in the past. One thing is for sure and it's that it'll look ace in the proper colour!

By the time we got back from the paint shop it was packing up time so work shall continue tomorrow. I think the plan is to have the engine assembled so it doesn't get filled up with filler dust during the sanding marathon...

[big_al_granvia]

fantastic work lads

[TrabbieRonnie]

Yep, amazing to see this coming together, well done all!

[GingerNuttz]

 I was pushing for a mobility blue paint job but Brooklands green won in the end ?

[Jikovron]

Nowt could be done about the crank end float, it's got the thickest washers available fitted, the market for 20tho over thrust washers will be emerging shortly!

[GingerNuttz]

3 minutes ago, Jikovron said:

Nowt could be done about the crank end float, it's got the thickest washers available fitted, the market for 20tho over thrust washers will be emerging shortly!

Is it 15 thou ones that are fitted ?

[greengartside]

Excellent work, chaps. That’s coming on a treat. And mega points for choosing the original (and best) colour! That’s gonna look fab when it’s done.

[Jikovron]

Yeah 15s 

[320touring]

Glad that the timing cover will work.

 

Car is looking ace, and paint looks spot on!

[Yoss]

I know potato cams aren't the best for showing actual colour, and what I'm looking at may not be the same as what you've posted but I also had a Brooklands green Dolomite many years ago and it looked like yours. The stuff on that lid looks much darker. I wonder if it dries a lighter colour. Still, whatever colour it is it will look great with fresh paint on. 

[captain_70s]

Brooklands seems to be one of those colours where it has many shades and none are exact...

They seem to vary from more blueish greens to more brown tinged variants. The original is also very prone to fading so who know what colour Brooklands becomes after 40 years... My car has had at least three resprays and going by the door jams no two were the same shade! My only goal is to shift the green towards the bluer end of the scale rather than the brown... I'm also partially red/green colour blind so my opinion is largely moot, I've been asking Mr Nutzz and Girlfriend_70s for advice. ?

 

[Tadhg Tiogar]

The colour also changes depending on the ambient light, weather conditions and the viewer's perception of colour. 

[greengartside]

The Brooklands Green Sprint at the Haynes Museum...

I think that’s the original spray job as it left the factory to give you an idea of shades etc.

[dave j]

Great to see an update on this one, good work! 

[captain_70s]

Just realised I forgot the best picture!

The Dolly's old sump has been marinating in petrol for the last fortnight to shift the sludge. Result being the oil can be wiped away leaving the metally goodness behind...

 

The good news is we have enough material in there to melt down and make a new oversize thrust washer.

[davidfowler2000]

5 hours ago, GingerNuttz said:

 I was pushing for a mobility blue paint job but Brooklands green won in the end ?

INVADOLLY!

I'm genuinely looking forward to seeing the Dolomite finished now. Will maybe get out for some more restoration assistance* next week.

[blackboilersuit]

11 hours ago, captain_70s said:

Just realised I forgot the best picture!

The Dolly's old sump has been marinating in petrol for the last fortnight to shift the sludge. Result being the oil can be wiped away leaving the metally goodness behind...

 

The good news is we have enough material in there to melt down and make a new oversize thrust washer.

Panning for gold autoshite style with a dolly sump full of petrol! 

Amazing progress on this wee car, can't wait to see it in the flesh again. 

[dome]

Excellent work guys.

Bonus points for the hot cam and headwork

IS RACECAR NAO

[big_al_granvia]

aye cpt and his ladyfriend will be doing the monte carlo classique in january, glasgow (or paisley) to monte where he puts 2 bob on in the casino, lets it ride and wins enough to restore his other triumphs

[captain_70s]

Back at it today.

Timing chain is back on and in the correct place.

It was at this point we realised that the oil flinging washer from the Dolomite wouldn't fit this application because it's for the larger diameter crank... This was a "FOR FUCKSAKE" moment. Especially as I HAVE one the right size, on the engine in my basement. I just retrieved that tonight but won't be back at the car until next weekend.

The timing cover was also sandblasted/wirewheeled and painted. The sump was cleaned and painted.

The thrust washers being 15 thou over is a concern in combination with the crank end float being so close to tolerance. The thrust washers are half moon shaped and sit on top of the crank at the end cap and take up the fore/aft slop in the crank, they can also prove to be a major Achilles' heel. They are intended to be a sacrificial wear item and as the gap increases will wear faster and faster, it isn't unheard of for these to work loose when towards the top end of the tolerance and to simply drop into the sump with catastrophic results for the bearings and crank surfaces.

Given the slop is already quite high and the washers are the largest currently available I'm going to have a 20 thou washer custom made. A minor expense that will allow the whole enterprise to last longer and minimise the risk of thrust washers making a bid for freedom - Especially with me doing city driving and using the clutch a lot. The replacement engine is already machined to the maximum degree so any damage/wear would essentially render it irreparable. I'm aiming for 60-80k of careful use, if it throws a thrust bearing at 6,000 miles and lunches the crank I'll not be impressed for the cost of a £30 part!?

With the engine at a standstill awaiting parts we turned our attentions back to bodywork. In particular the bottom edge of the front wings are crusty...

Cut away the bottom of the wing.

Traditional end of sill rust. I cut another hole in the sill a bit further along to see the extent of the damage.

Fucker's mint inside! The only major rot is the outer at the bottom where it joins the inner.

The jacking point however was fucked. These are a vertical box section with a plate at the bottom and they always catch mud and rot out. More wing was cut away to get at it...

At the right side of this picture you can see two remaining sides of the box section jacking point. The other two were torn off largely by hand!

There had already been a plate welded in to the leading edge of the inner arch, that was all cut out as well - Quite an impressive pile of bits.

We started making various bits for the jacking point and sills out of 2mm galv steel. The galvanisation proved such a fucker to weld to we resorted to grinding it all off. ? We're also going to make everything in duplicate, because the other side will be just as bad...

While down there @GingerNuttz let out a cry of "whaaaaaaat the fuck?" and pointed along to the sill repair I paid the local garage to do 3 years ago.

So, it appears that's a sheet of steel wrapped over the original sill, except at the wheel arch end where they've had to lop it off and stick in a flat plate, it's then all been smothered in filler. I dug out the receipt for a laugh. £220.

So we'll need two full outer sills. I looked up the price of the TDC panels and reeled off the prices to @GingerNuttz who made dismissive noises and threatened to go into the business of making them by hand while under-cutting the TDC and still making fat stacks.

This was the first day I've actually cut any bits off the car or made up any bits to go on it. It'll not be the last...

[phil_lihp]

Super progress on this, great to see it improving so rapidly.

[paulplom]

Awesome

[sloth]

re: thrust washers.

as a serial big 6 fettler i know all abpout thse bellwanks dropping out.  the hot trick here is to pin them with a brass pin so they cant drop out when worn. 

 

have a gander here, there be some excellent links. if youve got them out, its worth doing. 

https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/30562-thrust-washer-pinning/

 

http://tr6.danielsonfamily.org/ThrustWashers.htm

[sdkrc]

Big fan of the confident "that's some strong filler" as he hammers through some weak filler.

This is a great read and loving the regular updates. Being of poor mechanical knowledge myself, this is why I fucking hate garages. There are some lazy, unscrupulous bastards out there and my hit rate of using good garages is very low. I'd be more than happy to pay decent £££ if I knew they properly cared about their work.

[GingerNuttz]

[captain_70s]

So, me, @GingerNuttz, @davidfowler2000 and @jaypee were involved with Dolly related shenanigans this weekend.

One major goal was to finish assembling the engine and shove it in the car so it could be sealed up away from grinding dust etc.

You know your car is high tech when it features wooden sealing blocks in the engine...

Mission accomplished! Big thanks to the whole crew for the aid in fitting it. The whole engine was lifted into the car and installed by hand because building the crane seemed like a faff...

More digging in the bodywork occurred and bad things have been found.

So, the tail end of the sill was at least three patches deep, with another underneath and one around the back. The inner arch also had several layers of "repairs".

The arch under the riveted repair panel was even worse than the other side. Further prodding revealed...

The entire inner arch was crafted out of filler, over the untreated rust metal, it'd then been undersealed. It mostly pulled apart by hand...

The entire inner arch will need replacing, the top of the sill and the door jam above the wheel can go back in but were removed for access. The rear inner sill and reinforcing panel were both remade and welded in in an attempt to give the car some structural integrity before the door jam was cut away.

Oh, the boot floor is also fillered, and sections of the trailing edge of the arch seemed to be entirely made of weld...

You can't get panels for the inner arches, we considered buying something similar for another, more popular car, but they're mega money. I also really need another wheelarch repair panel for this side, naturally there are currently none for sale, regardless of price.

Every "repair" that has been carried out on this car has worsened it's condition to the extent it is now well beyond the point where anybody would bother saving it. Especially as it's a sub-Sprint car, the man hours involved will lead to resto costing several times the car's end value. Naturally work shall be continuing onwards despite the fact we never expected the car to be this bad...