Highway Code changes 29/01/22 - what do you think about it?

[High Jetter]

The full info can be read here: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1037306/table-of-change-to-the-highway-code.pdf

Does anyone else think this bit is going to lead to more accidents when people stop suddenly to let someone cross, and the driver behind doesn't react it time?

Quote

Rule H2
Rule for drivers, motorcyclists, horse drawn vehicles, horse riders and cyclists:

At a junction you should give way to pedestrians crossing or waiting to cross a road into which or from which you are turning.

 

[New POD]

Wasnt rule H2 always a rule? I'm sure it was when I was taught to drive in the 80s 

Or maybe it was just my dad who said "for fucks sake mind that dickhead pedestrian who is about to step out" 

[Mally]

My driving instructor asked me 55 years ago. When do you stop for a pedestrian?

Zebra crossing sez I.

Wrong answer. Correct answer is always, because if you kill them, you are in trouble.

[meshking]

I also was taught that pedestrians have right of way at junctions. I was surprised that this wasn't actually the case until the end of this week. 

[Fumbler]

 

This helped me understand the rule a bit more. 

Edited to embed the video properly.

 

 

[3VOM]

Lots of videos on law and driving instruction channels recently. Various points arising:

Drivers not being ready to stop behind a car giving way to pedestrian.

Situation for drivers where large numbers of pedestrians present e.g. crowd coming out of football match.

Cyclists using middle of lane then switching to side of lane as other vehicle turns off.

Distances required to miss cyclists and horses impossible in some places.

Situations like jogger with headphones on, obviously about to cross a side road in a second or two. How much leeway is to be given as far as priority.

Cyclists encouraged to use middle of lane at times but not horses.

 

[cort1977]

I think it's a good idea and about bloody time.

It essentially enforces the hierarchy of vulnerability, pedestrians are the most vulnerable so everyone should take care with them, cyclists should take care not to scare horses and so on up the chain to HGV drivers who have to be especially careful of everything due to their size.

Despite the efforts to stir up an anti-cycling backlash by the usual suspects in the media I don't think it's a big deal. 

[dollywobbler]

The change is that previously, you had to give way to pedestrians already crossing. Now you must give way if they're waiting to cross.

At the end of the day, you are responsible for not crashing into the car in front of you, so always expect the unexpected. I don't predict accidents.

[Spurious]

The Daily Mail is having a field day here. Usual anti cycling nonsense. 

It's about time that it's recognised that people with a metal box around them need to show care and consideration towards those who are walking, cycling etc. We'll all get where we need to in the end. 

And I also am surprised that pedestrians didn't have priority at junctions. They always did in Ireland and I assumed it was same here. 

Edit

Ah @dollywobblerclears is up. Ta. 

[UltraWomble]

15 minutes ago, cort1977 said:

I think it's a good idea and about bloody time.

It essentially enforces the hierarchy of vulnerability, pedestrians are the most vulnerable so everyone should take care with them, cyclists should take care not to scare horses and so on up the chain to HGV drivers who have to be especially careful of everything due to their size.

Despite the efforts to stir up an anti-cycling backlash by the usual suspects in the media I don't think it's a big deal. 

The only point of concern I have is with cyclists potentially coming up the inside of a vehicle turning left or overtaking a vehicle turning right.
I totally get wait behind a cyclist that is in front if you want to turn rather than cut them up, but do worry that some people will just throw sense out of the window and assume that the vehicle ahead of you and indicating will see you and give way to you.
Im in a car - if I drive over the top of a cyclist I will suffer very little injury (and yes, I get that is the point of the rule changes).

[Missy Charm]

The only trouble I've had thus far with rules regarding crossing the road, as a pedestrian, is that cyclists consider themselves above stopping.  

[3VOM]

1 minute ago, HarmonicCheeseburger said:

Eventually one of them will kill someone and their will be a huge public blowout on this.  

I think that has already happened. Few years ago in Cornwall or Devon. I'd have to search for it.

[Spurious]

1 minute ago, 3VOM said:

I think that has already happened. Few years ago in Cornwall or Devon. I'd have to search for it.

Wasn't it a gobshite on a fixie? I seem to remember something. 

[D.E]

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leicestershire-60089225

Quote

• The technique is named after a method for opening car doors that has been standard practice by the Dutch for many years

Is it? Can't say I've ever heard of this...

[Spurious]

3 minutes ago, Spurious said:

Wasn't it a gobshite on a fixie? I seem to remember something. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/aug/14/cyclist-charlie-alliston-killed-pedestrian-blamed-crash-kim-briggs-court-told

Yes it was a gobshite on a fixie. 

[3VOM]

4 minutes ago, Spurious said:

Wasn't it a gobshite on a fixie? I seem to remember something. 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/aug/14/cyclist-charlie-alliston-killed-pedestrian-blamed-crash-kim-briggs-court-told

You appear to be correct. It was also London not the south west.

[SiC]

I don't understand the moaning about cars going into the back of another with this. Ignoring that the fact they should be prepared for a car to stop, the car will already be slowing right down anyway to make the turn. So if they stop dead, it's not as if they're doing an emergency stop from 40mph to 0mph in a short space. 

[inconsistant]

19 minutes ago, Missy Charm said:

The only trouble I've had thus far with rules regarding crossing the road, as a pedestrian, is that cyclists consider themselves above stopping.  

All cyclists?  
 

Btw. The only time I’ve ever been knocked off my bike was by a pedestrian walking out in front of me. That’s a pedestrian, not ‘pedestrians’

[Mally]

1 hour ago, Missy Charm said:

The only trouble I've had thus far with rules regarding crossing the road, as a pedestrian, is that cyclists consider themselves above stopping.  

Ever been to Holland😀

[Andrew353w]

1 hour ago, cort1977 said:

I think it's a good idea and about bloody time.

It essentially enforces the hierarchy of vulnerability, pedestrians are the most vulnerable so everyone should take care with them, cyclists should take care not to scare horses and so on up the chain to HGV drivers who have to be especially careful of everything due to their size.

Despite the efforts to stir up an anti-cycling backlash by the usual suspects in the media I don't think it's a big deal. 

Nautical rules have encompassed this principle for ages: steam gives way to sail, sail gives way to oar. (The bigger you are, the more responsible you have to be!)  

[AnnoyingPentium]

2 hours ago, New POD said:

Wasnt rule H2 always a rule? I'm sure it was when I was taught to drive in the 80s 

Or maybe it was just my dad who said "for fucks sake mind that dickhead pedestrian who is about to step out" 

I was always trained the same way when learning to drive. I'm failing to understand where it has changed.

[Daviemck2006]

I was always trained the same way when learning to drive. I'm failing to understand where it has changed.

I was taught that in 1980 too.

Sent from my SM-A125F using Tapatalk

[colino]

Defensive driving means you always know what is around you plus you expect everyone of them to do something stupid.  Don't really have any issues with the rules clarification, if a bag of bones gets injured because they do something catastrophic, hopefully the best result for them will be they will have their day in court.

Incidentally, might is right was always the actual practice at sea.  Don't remember doing many emergency reverses on a 600,000DWT tanker to avoid paddle boarders.

[AnnoyingPentium]

1 hour ago, Missy Charm said:

The only trouble I've had thus far with rules regarding crossing the road, as a pedestrian, is that cyclists consider themselves above stopping.  

It's lethal up in Glasgow. Was crossing today and some smart arse on his bike just about took me out. Ended up weaving through pedestrians during a green man.

[Unlucky Alf]

31 minutes ago, Andrew353w said:

Nautical rules have encompassed this principle for ages: steam gives way to sail, sail gives way to oar. (The bigger you are, the more responsible you have to be!)  

What about a Hovercraft?
 Technically that’s  an aircraft. Or is it…. 😜

 

Rules of the air  similar,  everyone gives way to hot air balloons as it’s difficult for them to get out of the way, gliders give way to balloons while everyone else gives way to gliders, powered aircraft (helicopters/fixed wing) give way to gliders and balloons. Etc  .👍 
 

 

[bunglebus]

My only problem with the rule changes is giving way to pedestrians waiting to cross the road, when I'm turning from a major into a minor road. Yes everyone "should" be able to stop, but if I've got a car/van/lorry bearing down on me, I'd rather continue into the minor road than risk getting punted. Chances are the pedestrian would end up getting hurt in that scenario anyway. 

It's not much good being right, but dead.

Similarly with cyclists passing on the side a vehicle is turning - it will be little comfort to them or their families if they get squished, but were "right" to pass.

I should also say my dad taught me to give way to pedestrians waiting to cross at the junction of a minor into a major road - you're going to stop or at least be going very slowly anyway at that point

[tom13]

2 hours ago, 3VOM said:

Lots of videos on law and driving instruction channels recently. Various points arising:

Drivers not being ready to stop behind a car giving way to pedestrian.

Situation for drivers where large numbers of pedestrians present e.g. crowd coming out of football match.

Cyclists using middle of lane then switching to side of lane as other vehicle turns off.

Distances required to miss cyclists and horses impossible in some places.

Situations like jogger with headphones on, obviously about to cross a side road in a second or two. How much leeway is to be given as far as priority.

Cyclists encouraged to use middle of lane at times but not horses.

 

This is all common sense and I don't see any being issues. I don't know about the why the last one is like it is though? Maybe horses walking are too slow or they need way more room to get around?

You should always be prepared to stop at any moment in any scenario, whether it be a person crossing, or a bike in the road.

Large crowds just is what it is. Can't have one rule for one scenario and another for a different one. Drivers will just have to wait.

[tom13]

I think everyone can see these are pretty well thought out but as always the biggest thing is getting drivers off their bloody phones. This is the perfect use for unmarked police cars. The amount you see all day everyday!!

[mintwth]

1 hour ago, Andrew353w said:

Nautical rules have encompassed this principle for ages: steam gives way to sail, sail gives way to oar. (The bigger you are, the more responsible you have to be!)  

Similar in aviation: powered aircraft give way to unpowered aircraft, unpowered aircraft give way to balloons. There's a whole hierarchy based on level of control over where you go and ability to stay aloft. 

The more control you have over where you go and the less likely you are to end up as a splat mark on the ground; the more consideration you have to show to others. 

 

[davocano]

If a pedestrian is engrossed in a smartphone while crossing a road into which or from you are turning, is it OK to floor the accelerator while leaning on the horn?

Asking for a friend*