Project Dollywobbler's Invacar - Ongoing

[egg]

I wonder if that group is full of Apes? 

 

I read that as Apes as in Simian rather than Piaggio!

[LightBulbFun]

I read that as Apes as in Simian rather than Piaggio!

 

LOL! thats not the first time iv made an unintentional/subconscious dig at something/someone im not happy about

 

mrbenn knows 

 

(I mentioned apes as from monitoring the microcar world FB page im part of, they seem to be pretty common/popular there)

 

 

Duh! 790 is exactly the right size. Not sure how I managed to overlook that one...

 

Red5 - that post makes no sense!

 

glad we manage to catch that before you placed an order, they dont look cheap!

 

I do wonder what the difference is between the 790 and 795? I wonder if its worth asking the shop about seems like they might know

[captain_70s]

have you told them that the Model 70 was actually available for the everyman to buy new if they so wished? 

 

They're probably the sort of people who get very annoyed at the fact they paid £10k for a Messerschmitt or something and some tosser has come along with a worthless invalid carriage and tried to present themselves as an equal...

[LightBulbFun]

just watched the video (twas saving it for when i had a nice hot chocolate to hand ) and i was thinking with the snapped spring, can you swap springs around from the rough one to the nice but broken spring one?

 

I wonder if some lube (heh!) would help with the rough one?

 

(if all else fails, that website you linked with the pulleys for sale, also do a nice selection of other parts, including springs I think )

[red5]

If there is a knack Meredith on available if like to have a shufty with the engineering students.

 

Wt actual f ?

 

Phone auto-correct possibly...can't see how though.

 

a knackered pulley

[MorrisItalSLX]

Just watched the video, is it possible to stand on the new pulley, thus compressing it enough to see if it has the second groove down below? I’d imagine this would be easier with a second pair of eyes and don’t come running to me if you break your ankles in the process!

 

On second thought, that’s a bloody stupid idea that will only result in injury. Perhaps some form of hydraulic press could be utilised, if one could obtain the use of such a device.

[dollywobbler]

just watched the video (twas saving it for when i had a nice hot chocolate to hand ) and i was thinking with the snapped spring, can you swap springs around from the rough one to the nice but broken spring one?

 

I wonder if some lube (heh!) would help with the rough one?

 

(if all else fails, that website you linked with the pulleys for sale, also do a nice selection of other parts, including springs I think )

 

It's the pulley faces that are the problem I think. They're in a terrible state. As is the shaft, so it's not adjusting very easily. Could be possible to dismantle, but they really can ping off rather dangerously. I'm leaving well alone and have ordered a 390. We'll see what happens...

Wt actual f ?

 

Phone auto-correct possibly...can't see how though.

 

a knackered pulley

 

Ah, got you. Should be possible.

 

Just watched the video, is it possible to stand on the new pulley, thus compressing it enough to see if it has the second groove down below? I’d imagine this would be easier with a second pair of eyes and don’t come running to me if you break your ankles in the process!

 

On second thought, that’s a bloody stupid idea that will only result in injury. Perhaps some form of hydraulic press could be utilised, if one could obtain the use of such a device.

 

No. A press or chunky vice should do it. Hoping to visit a friend tomorrow for experimentation.

[dozeydustman]

Having a quick shufty through the manual PDF that LBF linked, and making guesses based on the information contained therein, I would say your new pulley has the lower circlip groove.

 

Also nice to see that most transmission parts are still available at a price.

[Remspoor]

Just watched the video. Thought there were some turkeys running around in the back at one point.

[Zelandeth]

Good to know the bits are out there at least. Pricing isn't that bad really compared to sorting out a misbehaving automatic gearbox if you look at it that way is it?

[Mrcento]

Might be a crazy shout, but how about taking a pair of pulleys to an engineering/machining shop and having them properly refurbed?

 

They'll definitely be able to refinish them, reface anything that's worn and bring the units back into spec, replace/make an internal spring etc.

 

Would likely be a lot cheaper and a lot less faff in the long run rather than trying to source more used ones that are just as likely to be knackered, or different ones that might just plain not work/not fit.

[dollywobbler]

They need a chrome finish, so not as easy as that. I've got one pulley that should work if I can find a press, and one on its way that also should work (it'll definitely fit, the only query being about how the spring rate affects how it drives.

 

Won't be any further progress until next week I suspect.

[Angrydicky]

There is a very good hard chroming firm my employers have used in the past, called AM Philpot. They're Luton way, I think.

[dollywobbler]

There has been progress.

 

Brand new pulleys meet their ancestors. This is not a matched pair. The top one is from a snowmobile. The bottom one is for a go kart. However, they are certainly identical to the old ones in looks, if not entirely in springing. Well, the bottom one is pretty similar - very hard work. The top one, I can't open at all by hand.

 

Neither has the mounting holes for the lock tab washer, so I've settled for Loctite and a bit of welly. I went for a nervous, gentle drive...

 

I'm not testing it on hills yet, because you are meant to break in a new belt gently. However, some gentle climbs did demonstrate some good CVT going on - ie consistent revs. After a few miles, I used a downhill section to get some speed up - allowing the pulleys to move to their extremes. By heck! Massive difference! The CVT effect is still happening at 50-55mph now, but she's much smoother, and feels faster - or certainly a lot more comfortable at speed. I managed just over 60 before I decided slowing down for a bend was a good idea.

 

I look forward to more testing in due course. 

 

In other news, ordering washer pumps from Ebay can be dangerous. The new one is about three times the size of the old one! I can only assume it's for a  truck. I'm going to plumb it in (same size pipe) but won't be fitting it to the dash. Should be good enough for MOT. Am even wondering if a bit of bracketry might make it suitable for foot operation...

[PhilA]

Excellent news. Await video.

 

F5 F5 F5 F5

 

 

 

Phil

[dollywobbler]

You may wear out your F5 button. I won't have it ready for viewing until at least Wednesday.

[LightBulbFun]

just finished updating the software on my laptop, what a great invacar update to reboot into as well 

 

Awesome to see the new pulley setup is working well

 

just to confirm your using the 790 set you ordered yourself right? (and which belt are you using, an original Model 70 one or a HP2020?)

 

(interesting that you say it was still CVTing at 50-55Mph, seeing as the Model 70 workshop manual PDF states CVTing stops at 45Mph and it goes into fixed ratio mode, I wonder if thats one of the differences between the 790 vs 795? it would actually be quite interesting to hook up a tachometer and see what the engine is rotating at, at various road speeds)

 

I also eagerly await another 0-60/top speed run 

[dollywobbler]

Yes, the pulley sent to me from America, and the 790 I purchased. I think it's the HP2020 belt, but everything was a bit rushed. I'll confirm later.

 

A friend has a huge, blacksmith's vice, which was used to compress the number 1 pulley. Sadly, no video of that as not everyone wants to be filmed.

[jumpingjehovahs]

 

Spotted TWC The Modern the other day. I know which I’d rather have...

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dollywobbler]

Ha! Likewise. There is only one true TWC.

 

That was taken during a second test drive today. Went fully for gentle today, trying to keep on part throttle as much as possible. Down a slight downhill, that still meant 55mph! The difference at 50mph is enormous, as the revs are much lower. TWC with overdrive!

[PhilA]

Ooh, hubcaps.

 

Phil

[LightBulbFun]

Ha! Likewise. There is only one true TWC.

 

That was taken during a second test drive today. Went fully for gentle today, trying to keep on part throttle as much as possible. Down a slight downhill, that still meant 55mph! The difference at 50mph is enormous, as the revs are much lower. TWC with overdrive!

 

very happy to see she is running well

 

im wonder if before, the old pulleys where not extending all the way, as such getting stuck into fixed ratio mode sooner then they where meant to be (like being stuck in 3rd gear out of 4)

 

if she crused well at 50Mph before hand with the old setup, does that mean she is now the ideal* motorway cruiser at 70 with  the new setup? 

[stuboy]

never driven one, but looks fun

[Zelandeth]

For the sake of clarity, could you just confirm (whenever it's convenient!) exactly what the parts you're using there are and any modifications needed?

 

Given my plans for the future this is an area I may well opt to splash out on for TP in the interests of long term reliability. I know the fan attached to the back of my secondary pulley is disintegrating for one thing, and at the very least that can't be helping the balance.

[Ghosty]

never driven one, but looks fun

 

It is.

[dollywobbler]

very happy to see she is running well

 

im wonder if before, the old pulleys where not extending all the way, as such getting stuck into fixed ratio mode sooner then they where meant to be (like being stuck in 3rd gear out of 4)

 

if she crused well at 50Mph before hand with the old setup, does that mean she is now the ideal* motorway cruiser at 70 with the new setup?

Haven't found a long enough stretch of road to see if 70 is possible. Still trying to brake the belt in, but may have a longer trip out today.

[dollywobbler]

For the sake of clarity, could you just confirm (whenever it's convenient!) exactly what the parts you're using there are and any modifications needed?

 

Given my plans for the future this is an area I may well opt to splash out on for TP in the interests of long term reliability. I know the fan attached to the back of my secondary pulley is disintegrating for one thing, and at the very least that can't be helping the balance.

I need to dig out paperwork to confirm the first pulley. Second pulley is a Comet 790 (rather than the 795 apparently fitted) ordered from a Go Kart specialist. Belt is a brand new ATV one that LBF probably remembers the code for as I don't...

[Sir Snipes]

It was all this cross reference parts shinnanigans that made me eventually sack off my old S12 Silvia. Though, in my defence, I didn't have any where proper to keep it.

 

Even the usual go-to supplier, Rock Auto, failed me.

[LightBulbFun]

I need to dig out paperwork to confirm the first pulley. Second pulley is a Comet 790 (rather than the 795 apparently fitted) ordered from a Go Kart specialist. Belt is a brand new ATV one that LBF probably remembers the code for as I don't...

 

if your using the Modern ATV belt that would be "the HP2020" one

 

technically for a Kawasaki I think but I think Dayco said it was the best modern match for what the Model 70 originally came with

 

when you say first and second pulley, is that in accordance to the Manual or? because I recall you had to order a new "domed" pulley which is actually the 1st pulley rather then the second one, but I may have miss read something somewhere

 

 

 

It was all this cross reference parts shinnanigans that made me eventually sack off my old S12 Silvia. Though, in my defence, I didn't have any where proper to keep it.

 

Even the usual go-to supplier, Rock Auto, failed me. 

 

Keep in Mind pretty much everything in a Model 70 is from some other manufactures parts bin, I think Zels DC3esk description of a Model 70 sums it up best "a collection of spare parts from every manufacture driving in loose formation" or something like that 

 

I think the only main bespoke components on a Model 70 are the chassis and body work

 

luckily said parts bin parts where all very common parts at the time so finding replacements (for the most part) has not been too difficult

[dollywobbler]

Yes, as per that diagram.

 

Pulley one is apparently from a John Deere Gator UTV. I would guess that it is this one.

https://www.geminikarts.co.uk/product/cometsalsbury-780-driver-clutch/

 

The driven pulley (pulley 2) is this one.

https://www.geminikarts.co.uk/product/comet-salsbury-790-driven-pulley-pt-no-301289c/

 

I've had a longer run today. Interestingly, she is no faster than she was, perhaps because the engine is still at CVT revs (not sure exactly what revs, but a little lower than designed at a guess) until 55mph. I don't think she's got the power to overcome the gearing in other words. Maybe I should slacken the belt slightly. Much better at hills, though she'll never exactly fly up them. But, she definitely is not bogging down like she was. Major success!

 

I've also had instances of that unusual CVT effect where you ease off the throttle, but keep accelerating. Rolls much more easily, feels much more relaxing to drive.