The grumpy thread

[artdjones]

I was brought up in Wales myself,not Ireland.My Mother went to school in Ireland and left at the age of 12 in 1939.She was a very fluent reader and writer.

I believe that phonics is an important part of teaching reading here.I have no children myself,but friend's children all read very well,and my own opinion is that the Irish education system is superior to the English one.I believe that around 20% of those in their late teens are functionally illiterate in England.

 

A friend of mine who has two small girls is thinking of moving to Birmingham next year.I'm trying to think of a tactful way of enquiring as to his sanity, particularly regarding what the move would mean for the girls'education.They are in a really good local Gaelscoil now.Gaelscoils are Irish medium,but they speak,read,and write English to a very high standard for their age.

[artdjones]

I suppose the high rate of functional illiteracy in the UK is down to society's general attitude towards literacy.Oh well, even if the children can't read,at least they are world leaders in making Plasticine worms.

[AMC Rebel]

Having spent a lot of time in recent years working with Irish colleagues (mainly in Dublin, but in other parts of Ireland too) my anecdotal experience is that the education system does seem superior.  Not only that but the levels of good manners, decency and sense of humour have been better than many of my UK/US colleagues. 

[Tadhg Tiogar]

..... even if the children can't read, at least they are world leaders in making Plasticine worms. go into government

 

FTFY.

[mrbenn]

On Anglesey at the moment. Bit breezy but didn't seem too bad so I went for a walk around the block. It's bad. Something flying through the air hit me on the side of the head, knocked my glasses off. Amazingly, I found them about 20 yards away stuck in bushes (ever tried to find something when you're short sighted and don't have glasses on? Not easy...). Right lens badly chipped and scratched, pad missing but could have been worse.

 

So yeah, if you're in the bad weather, watch yourself!

[GrumpiusMaximus]

Why would you teach anyone to read out words in their native tongue that they don't know? Surely children are taught to read using simple books containing words they already know.Once they have some level of literacy then more advanced texts are gradually introduced,and also the use of a dictionary with pronunciations can be taught.

Nope. That’s not how it’s done...

[artdjones]

Nope. That’s not how it’s done...

Well that's how it used to be done.The improvements* in the education system since the sixties seem to have resulted in a regression of standards.

[GrumpiusMaximus]

Well that's how it used to be done.The improvements* in the education system since the sixties seem to have resulted in a regression of standards.

 

 

I think I've addressed this in a previous post.  Bar specific issues like Phonics, I think education is much, much better than it has been at any other point.  Outcomes have certainly improved enormously.

[artdjones]

Well according to the OECD,the UK is bottom in the developed world for literacy and second bottom for numeracy.So these vast improvements seem to be rather theoretical, unless you are comparing the present with the time before the 1870 Education Act.

 

Look at the average private eBay ad for a car.Does it look like it comes from a country where literacy standards are better than ever and "outcomes" are better than ever?

[New POD]

On Anglesey at the moment. Bit breezy but didn't seem too bad so I went for a walk around the block. It's bad. Something flying through the air hit me on the side of the head, knocked my glasses off. Amazingly, I found them about 20 yards away stuck in bushes (ever tried to find something when you're short sighted and don't have glasses on? Not easy...). Right lens badly chipped and scratched, pad missing but could have been worse.

 

So yeah, if you're in the bad weather, watch yourself!

Parents live in Llandonna. I suspect if the wind gets worse they will be replacing the greenhouse again for the er third time.

[mrbenn]

You may well be right. Just stepped outside to get something from the car, got about 10 yards before I thought better of it and went straight back in the house.

[richardmorris]

Not really. When I was booted into private education in 1981, Latin was compulsory from age 11 onwards up to 15. I remember it being fun, and it taught me how grammar works, the origins of language and why we (still) have the words that we do.

I did Latin in comprehensive school for two years from about 1983. Oh poor caecilius!

[sheffcortinacentre]

Was in Iceland (the supermarket not the country ) yesterday woman on till late 20s was in a flap as till roll had run out & she didn't now how much change to give me without it!

 

I'd spent £7 & gave her £10!

[GrumpiusMaximus]

Not really. When I was booted into private education in 1981, Latin was compulsory from age 11 onwards up to 15. I remember it being fun, and it taught me how grammar works, the origins of language and why we (still) have the words that we do.

 

 

Latin was fine.  The odd part for me was that I was in a state school and I started in 1999...

[GrumpiusMaximus]

I did Latin in comprehensive school for two years from about 1983. Oh poor caecilius!

 

 

Canis est in via...

 

Grumio est anxius...

[dozeydustman]

I did Latin in comprehensive school for two years from about 1983. Oh poor caecilius!

 

 

Cambridge Latin course. I remember it well with my Latin & Classics teachers.

 

Caecilius est pater et dominus. Metella in horto vinum bibit. Grumio in culina coquaat.

 

Best word I learnt in Latin? block & tackle - polyspaston

[DodgeRover]

Romanes eunt domus?

[drivewaymyway]

Walking out of shops because the queue is too long is a hobby of mine but today was a first, I drove passed the shop window of a Lidl and didn't bother to park because I could see the store was awash with people and few tills open so pointless even going in.. me1, Lidl 0...

[MarvinsMom]

Romanes eunt domus?

have you rememberd to conjugate the verb?

now write it out 150 times.

and if i catch you doing that again, i'll cut you're balls off....

[anonymous user]

Was in Iceland (the supermarket not the country ) yesterday woman on till late 20s was in a flap as till roll had run out & she didn't now how much change to give me without it!

 

I'd spent £7 & gave her £10!

I hope you persuaded her that you'd take £5 change to make it easy and she could keep the difference.

[Parky]

My son is doing Latin as part of the gifted and talented set. It’s one of the few subjects he actually makes an effort in.

 

He just scored 98% on a Cambridge Latin comprehension competition in an intra school test which apparently is the highest ever scored which isn’t bad for a monosyllabic Brooklyn Beckham lookalike who spends all day playing Counterstrike..

 

I did two years of it in grammar school. Canis est in horo is about all I can remember. That and Grumio est in Canis but I think that’s illegal....

[somewhatfoolish]

I quite agree.

 

I'm not a psychologist but there are many studies out there that show that the simple act of communicating with and to children improves their knowledge of English.  The most critical time period for this is before formal education even starts.  Reading and writing are things that can be taught effectively any number of ways and this focus on one method that I also feel is inherently unsuitable for the English language is a major mistake.  It does work - but there are so many other methods that also work.

 

To be honest, I'm not the best judge of this because I could read and write before I ever stepped into a classroom.  I'd be interested in knowing what experience others have had...

My parentals bought stuff to teach me the basics, flash cards and books before I went to school(also read to me and with me regularly) and as a result I was reading well before the age of 5. As a child I wore out my library card and continue to be a voracious reader.

[Isaac Hunt]

I learned to read using my Dad's Car Mechanics and Practical Motorist Mag's.

 

I can string together very complex letters when situations require in business, but have to work hard when speilchucker wants to do its own thing.

 

Only the other day the word counsel appeared in one of my letters as council, not sure it it was me of the spielchucker, I failed to notice until it was too late, mind you so did everyone else that read the draft !!.

 

I am sure and English Teacher or someone well learned in English would torch my letters with Red ink.

 

I'm not good at spotting typo's and spello's because I read to fast. I refuse to play charades as I struggle with the vowels adjectives nouns constants and all of that stuff, should have paid more attention, hated school.

 

Still learning language M8, cos TADTS and WCPGW 2nite, innit M9, GLWTS Orite

[GrumpiusMaximus]

Fucking Dilveroo bicycle in Canterbury. In the middle of the road, swerving about. I give him a blast of the horn, he breaks a red light and gives me the finger. Then tries to bait me for half a mile into overtaking as he goes over to the inside then swerved suddenly into the middle. Probably trying for an accident. I turned off and he held up other cars after me because he wasn’t looking behind him.

 

Two things though. i) No helmet so if he carries on that way he might get brain damaged. Not that he’d notice. ii) If he does insist on cycling slowly in the way of cars, he’ll get fewer jobs done and get paid a lot less.

[xtriple]

I want to do stuff to the XJ but.. weather! Wasn't raining for a few minutes so took the dogs out (Phoebe managed to walk about 50 yards unaided   ) but the wind was blowing at about 100mph. By the time I got home, it was raining again. So few jobs, so little opportunity!

[chaseracer]

I did Latin in comprehensive school for two years from about 1983. Oh poor caecilius!

 

Me too, about four years ahead of you!  Managed to blag an O-level in the subject in 1982, which has proved surprisingly useful.

[Pillock]

I didn't say that they were any less intelligent, just that their intelligence is less used. There is no need in the current climate to be any more than reasonably intelligent and reasonably nice so why test their intelligence too much.

 

Most older kids could tell you far more about ancient Egyptians than they could tell you about managing money or healthy eating for example. Pointless

Exactly this.

 

Schools push for high grades because they're a business, effectively. They get to out banners up outside and advertise in the paper boasting about their grades and hope more parents send their kids there (even though it's miles away)

 

But they push for high grades in all subjects. My daughter decided she wanted to do nursing, so took all the right sciences and maths and stuff. But still they're hassling her over Geography grades and English Literature.

 

And the thing she's found most useful now she's in uni halls? The fact her mum taught her to cook some basic meals, how to work the washing machine, and how bus timetables work. Three weeks in and there's girls she lives with who haven't cooked anything other than super noodles or a jacket potato.

 

Some of the most important things you'll learn don't have a grade at the end. Has she used her geography GCSE? Has she bollocks.

[chaseracer]

I did two years of it in grammar school. Canis est in horo is about all I can remember. That and Grumio est in Canis but I think that’s illegal....

 

All together now, you know the tune...!

 

Quis costet canis in fenestram

Qui habet caudam moventes...

 

etc.

 

[Richard]

I did Latin at school too. It was possibly the most useful thing I did at secondary school, but that's not saying much.

[GrumpiusMaximus]

Just about the most useful thing I did at school was setting fire to my own hair and brutally high-tackling the physics teacher who was also the Rugby coach...