The grumpy thread

[eddyramrod]

FUCKING FIREWORKS!!!!!!!

 

FUCK RIGHT OFF WITH THEM!

 

It sounds like fucking Beirut out there tonight.  No wonder my poor little dog won't go out.

[dollywobbler]

Your careless generalisations are troubling.  There is a vast gulf between "lack of work ethic" and "principled refusal to be exploited".

 

Though to be fair, the UK comes 13th on the list of 'productivity' while the USA came third. I've encountered a 'lack of work ethic' amongst employees at many, many different vocations, right from my very first retail job (the classic start re-arranging stock on shelves if you see a manager).

 

New Zealand came 28th...

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_hour_worked

 

It is certainly true that 'vacation' allowances are far more generous in the UK. I had a friend who worked in Texas for a while, and apparently it was two weeks holiday per year, and that was your lot.

 

EDIT - I will add that I've also seen excellent demonstrations of work ethic in many vocations. It isn't all one or the other.

[Tamworthbay]

Though to be fair, the UK comes 13th on the list of 'productivity' while the USA came third. I've encountered a 'lack of work ethic' amongst employees at many, many different vocations, right from my very first retail job (the classic start re-arranging stock on shelves if you see a manager).

 

New Zealand came 28th...

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_hour_worked

 

It is certainly true that 'vacation' allowances are far more generous in the UK. I had a friend who worked in Texas for a while, and apparently it was two weeks holiday per year, and that was your lot.

 

EDIT - I will add that I've also seen excellent demonstrations of work ethic in many vocations. It isn't all one or the other.

Ah productivity, the measure that the very rich apply to just how much they can get out of a person before they finally drop.

[Guest Hooli]

Grin...my mk2 Granada has never idled properly since I've had it, it always felt like you were keeping it running against its will, it shuddered and vibrated sat at traffic lights and trying to crawl along in traffic. I had tweaked the carb and timing till it's eyes popped out but only ever achieved a marginal improvement at best, This progressed into a low down misfire on the last couple of trips during the summer and I hadn't touched it since then.

 

So today, before tucking it away for the winter, I did the plugs, leads, and valve clearances, my God...it idles like a Rolls Royce Phantom now! Even when you put it into drive which drops the revs to about 600 it's barely perceptible that it's even running from inside the car. It's also released a fair few extra horses now that all 6 cylinders are joining in, it will sit happily at <ahem> motorway speeds without needing the pedal buried in the carpet. I'm literally on a high that I've actually fixed something!

 

So where does the grump come in...well, I found 5/6 of the exhaust valves to have no clearance at all and the other one had barely any, the previous owner told me it had hardened valve seats fitted for unleaded petrol, but unless the last guy to set the valve clearances was completely clueless this has all the hallmarks of valve seat regression, so I'm thinking it probably does not have hardened valve seats after all. I'll probably have to run an additive in it from now on to be on the safe side.

 

 

I'd run it without & recheck them in a few thousand miles. If they've not changed then forget about it.

[purplebargeken]

Lovely friend of mine did a demonstration at a hall in Herts today. Some twat stole her camera and money. Bloody shitheads.

[DodgeRover]

Valve clearance are an often forgotten service item. They've probably not been checked since it was built

[richardmorris]

Your careless generalisations are troubling.  There is a vast gulf between "lack of work ethic" and "principled refusal to be exploited".

I first read the original comment, not as a lack of work ethic, but more a creeping expansion of the C word holiday. Coming to the end of the year people notice that they have leave remaining and book it to go shopping.

 

I noticed yesterday that Waitrose has cards and calenders out!

 

We close over Christmas to new year as most of our customers do too ( universities and U.K. Manufacturing chemical companies who usually do a fortnight shutdown and deep clean). I'd rather have a week off in the summer but hard luck!

[richardmorris]

Lovely friend of mine did a demonstration at a hall in Herts today. Some twat stole her camera and money. Bloody shitheads.

Not like, but commiserate.

 

We really do need a "sympathy", "commiserate " button Slartibartfast.

[Guest Hooli]

Valve clearance are an often forgotten service item. They've probably not been checked since it was built

 

That's true too.

 

When I had my XR4i  & did a proper service on it, that run smooth as silk too. So much so it was disappointing as even with almost no silencers it didn't sound like a grumbly old V6 anymore. Went a lot better mind.

[STUNO]

Though to be fair, the UK comes 13th on the list of 'productivity'

 

New Zealand came 28th...

 

 

 

At least we are happy

don't believe all the statistics you read   

[Cheggers]

Ah productivity, the measure that the very rich apply to just how much they can get out of a person before they finally drop.

How else would you propose measuring the effectiveness of your workforce?

 

 

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[HH-R]

I think I'd just end it all in a country where you're expected to do long hours every day as well as weekends and getting hardly any holidays.

[Tamworthbay]

How else would you propose measuring the effectiveness of your workforce?

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Why do you need to? If the company is making a decent profit all is good surely? Why put stupid numbers on to push and push until people either become less productive or leave. And do we really want to live in a culture like South Korea? High ‘productivity’ and a ‘top class’ education system but also the highest suicide rates going and escalating mental health problems. Is that productive? I suppose it doesn’t matter to the company if someone tops themselves as they just get someone else in.

 

There is much more to life than making money for someone else’s benefit.

[captain_70s]

I think I'd just end it all in a country where you're expected to do long hours every day as well as weekends and getting hardly any holidays.

The Japanese have a specific name for that (Karōshi) as it's so common in their workforce. Figures suggest their work hours are behind the Americans in this regard until you realise that they don't count overtime as actual work and people often go years without taking any days off work and will sleep at their desks rather than go home...

[omegod]

Fucking dog's scared shitless, for an area with no cash some people must have money to burn...literally, no doubt there will be some knobhead around 11pm coming in from the pub who remembers his box of OMG ISIS STRENGTH MEGAFUCKLOUD BOMBS just as mutley is settling down

 

TWATS

[Cheggers]

Why do you need to? If the company is making a decent profit all is good surely?

A couple of things...

 

If you work for my company, I’m investing in you. Only a fool wouldn’t track the effectiveness of their investment.

 

How do you think a decent profit is achieved? - It doesn’t just happen without careful management and, yes, measuring a number of factors including productivity. BL’s productivity was notoriously shit compared to the rest of the market and looked what happened there.

 

Sorry, but to expect to get paid for doing a job without having your effectiveness measured is naive in the extreme. If you were paying me to work on your house, wouldn’t you want to know whether I’m ripping you off or not?

 

 

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[Guest Hooli]

Why do you need to? If the company is making a decent profit all is good surely? Why put stupid numbers on to push and push until people either become less productive or leave. And do we really want to live in a culture like South Korea? High ‘productivity’ and a ‘top class’ education system but also the highest suicide rates going and escalating mental health problems. Is that productive? I suppose it doesn’t matter to the company if someone tops themselves as they just get someone else in.

 

There is much more to life than making money for someone else’s benefit.

 

So you wouldn't mind if the team you're in is working twice as hard as the people next door for the same money?

[reb]

Liked for the excellent jump leads.

 

Ben

Mildly pilfered from dad. I'm probably going to need to give them back now.

 

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[Tamworthbay]

A couple of things...

If you work for my company, I’m investing in you. Only a fool wouldn’t track the effectiveness of their investment.

How do you think a decent profit is achieved? - It doesn’t just happen without careful management and, yes, measuring a number of factors including productivity. BL’s productivity was notoriously shit compared to the rest of the market and looked what happened there.

Sorry, but to expect to get paid for doing a job without having your effectiveness measured is naive in the extreme. If you were paying me to work on your house, wouldn’t you want to know whether I’m ripping you off or not?

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You aren’t investing in them, you are paying them to do a job. If they do it they get paid, if they don’t they don’t. Simple isn’t it? People don’t become more productive my continually being measured, as the old saying goes -a tree doesn’t grow any faster if you measure it more often.

 

BL went tits up because the design of the cars was crap, why would you buy a 70s BL car when the opposition were miles ahead in terms of looks and modernity? It’s amazing how many people seem to ‘forget’ what the problem at BL was. There were thousands of cars sat in holding lots, the workers could have built ten billion, but its no use if no one wants to buy them!

[Cheggers]

You aren’t investing in them, you are paying them to do a job. If they do it they get paid, if they don’t they don’t

And how do I know whether they’re doing what I pay them for without measuring their productivity?

 

 

 

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[Tamworthbay]

And how do I know whether they’re doing what I pay them for without measuring their productivity?

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If you are the boss and you don’t know what you asking someone who works for you to do and how much to pay them and whether it has been done then I would politely suggest you aren’t the man for the job.

[Cheggers]

If you are the boss and you don’t know what you asking someone who works for you to do and how much to pay them and whether it has been done then I would politely suggest you aren’t the man for the job.

But that’s the whole point, I do know. I know very precisely.

 

Because it’s measured!!!!!

 

 

OK, let me ask you...I and 149 others work for you. How do you know whether I’m actually doing anything?

 

 

 

 

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[Tamworthbay]

But that’s the whole point, I do know. I know very precisely.

Because it’s measured!!!!!

OK, let me ask you...I and 149 others work for you. How do you know whether I’m actually doing anything?

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I don’t need to continually measure the people I manage, I know the job is being done right and I trust their professional judgement. Production of numbers is just a paper exercise. It’s the old Macnamara fallacy- to manage you have to measure.

[dollywobbler]

Our motor industry collapsed because companies like BMC didn't bother doing any cost analysis. That work has to include productivity. Instead, they set car prices based on what they thought people would pay, even if it meant making a loss. If you want to make a business work, you need to be able to analyse things. I don't think it's unreasonable.

 

Also, what makes you think that countries with high productivity have unhappy workers? Isn't Norway always coming out as one of the happiest places to live? It also happens to be one of the most productive. Shit managers (Tesco, I'm looking at you) will use productivity as a tool to batter employees. Good ones don't.

[DVee8]

FUCKING FIREWORKS!!!!!!!

 

FUCK RIGHT OFF WITH THEM!

 

It sounds like fucking Beirut out there tonight.  No wonder my poor little dog won't go out.

Last night was like that here,nextdoor setting them off like some ww2 battle,this morning the street was strewn with spent fireworks,I had 3 round my cars,but nextdoor had a spent firework on the bonnet of there 67 plate Nissan.

[Cheggers]

I don’t need to continually measure the people I manage, I know the job is being done right and I trust their professional judgement. Production of numbers is just a paper exercise. It’s the old Macnamara fallacy- to manage you have to measure.

"I know the job is being done right"

 

How?...Do you really not measure output and effectiveness at all?

 

 

 

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[Tamworthbay]

"I know the job is being done right"

How?...Do you really not measure output and effectiveness at all?

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The world keeps turning, no one gets killed, everyone can be seen to be doing what they need to be when I ‘do the rounds’. I don’t need to have pieces of paper to show me what I already know to be the case. Sadly I drown in paperwork at the best of times without adding to it with more pointless stuff.

[Cheggers]

The world keeps turning, no one gets killed, everyone can be seen to be doing what they need to be when I ‘do the rounds’. I don’t need to have pieces of paper to show me what I already know to be the case. Sadly I drown in paperwork at the best of times without adding to it with more pointless stuff.

Let's just agree to never work for each other...

 

 

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[Tamworthbay]

Let's just agree to never work for each other...

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You wouldn’t even get an application form

[Cheggers]

You wouldn’t even get an application form

We'll just have to acquire you then

 

 

Then you'll know what measurement really feels like

 

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