Cort1977's Fleet - Saab MOT, results are in

[cort1977]

Evening all,

After wanting to do this for many years I have bitten the bullet and made a start on my V8 Sierra project.  I saw this heap on ebay last week, got some good advice on a thread I started which was mainly to leave it because it was overpriced and shit.  I ignored this advice and went ahead with it because I'm an idiot.

 

So yesterday morning this turned up at my door.  Initial thought was 'what the fuck have I done?', the drivers window was hanging half open, the sunroof was open, the Mondeo alloys were horrible and it was filthy and rusty.  Top tip, don't buy shite sight unseen because you're bored with lockdown.

After a restorative cup of tea I started poking around to see exactly how bad it was.  Window was off its runners but managed to get it aligned again, greased the rollers and it seems all right.  My boys were amazed at the concept of windows you have to wind yourself.  Sunroof closed up OK and keeps water out. 

The 90s car alarm was ripped straight out and consigned to the bin.  I gave it a wash and had a good poke around the arches and underneath.  

The good points are the interior is complete and in pretty good shape, the body is structurally sound and I like the colour.  The original engine, bumpers and wheels are long gone which is fine with me as i might feel a little bad doing this to some old giffer's pride and joy.  The bad points are it's covered in dents, the bumpers are cracked and the paint is terrible in places.

So the plan is to fit a 5.0 litre V8 from a 1995 Mustang.  As luck would have it I got one of these a few months ago with the gearbox, propshaft and all the ancilliaries I could strip off the donor car.  

 

[jonathan_dyane]

Excellent project, I’m looking forward to seeing this progress

[stripped fred]

This sounds fun!

[Popsicle]

Cracking project to be doing, good luck with it!

[cort1977]

Did some more work on this today, charged the battery overnight and got all the electrics working except the central locking.  Couple of bulbs, fuse for the wipers and put some washer fluid in and it's all good.

In a fit of enthusiasm I had a go at starting the engine.  It coughed a bit and was making some horrible noises.  The seller reckoned it had jumped a tooth on the timing belt so I reset the timing belt, something i haven't done on a Pinto for 20 years.  I got the camshaft pointer lined up and the crankshaft marks aligned, checked the distributor position, checked the HT leads were on in the correct firing order but can't quite get it to fire.  Sounds less likely to start than before although the horrible noise has gone.  There was fule spitting out the top of the carb when i took the filter off so somethings not right but seems like the timing is OK. Ideas?

Other than that i did a bit of turd polishing and general fiddling.  Ford really stripped these things out, the dimmer for the gauges and the intermittent wiper adjustment are both deleted, how much did those things cost really?

[Popsicle]

Not sure what they cost back then, but I sold a 1986 Mk1 XR4x4 in 1996 for £2,000 - needed the money for a deposit on my first house.

[billy_bunter]

What suspension and brakes are you going to put on it?

[cort1977]

Not sure yet  there are a few options for brakes but mostly cosworth based so not cheap.  Its struts up front so shouldn't be too difficult to make some bigger brakes fit. Rear brakes I will go with sierra discs in place if the drums it has now.

Not sure how much heavier the v8 will be than the pinto, will need to look in to that and try to work out the spring rate required. 

[Iamgroot]

I'm already on the vinegar strokes here, top marks!

[Scruffy Bodger]

49 minutes ago, cort1977 said:

Did some more work on this today, charged the battery overnight and got all the electrics working except the central locking.  Couple of bulbs, fuse for the wipers and put some washer fluid in and it's all good.

In a fit of enthusiasm I had a go at starting the engine.  It coughed a bit and was making some horrible noises.  The seller reckoned it had jumped a tooth on the timing belt so I reset the timing belt, something i haven't done on a Pinto for 20 years.  I got the camshaft pointer lined up and the crankshaft marks aligned, checked the distributor position, checked the HT leads were on in the correct firing order but can't quite get it to fire.  Sounds less likely to start than before although the horrible noise has gone.  There was fule spitting out the top of the carb when i took the filter off so somethings not right but seems like the timing is OK. Ideas?

Other than that i did a bit of turd polishing and general fiddling.  Ford really stripped these things out, the dimmer for the gauges and the intermittent wiper adjustment are both deleted, how much did those things cost really?

Timing 180 degrees out?

[Shite Ron]

7 hours ago, cort1977 said:

Not sure how much heavier the v8 will be than the pinto, will need to look in to that and try to work out the spring rate required.

Is this any help?

https://www.gomog.com/allmorgan/engineweights.html

The Buick / Rover engine weighs the same as a pinto, the Ford V8 looks to be considerably heavier.

[Jikovron]

I bet v6 4x4 springs would be a decent match as a cologne and its front diff are likely a similar weight to the 302 possibly more especially if fitted with alloy heads and an alloy 4 barrel manifold.

British Leyland V8s weigh 175KG in EFI guise with a 50kg gearbox, and the later 4.0,4.6 puts on about 10kg due to a thicker crank and block. 

[cort1977]

8 hours ago, Rovorsche said:

When you pulled out the alarm did it possibly have any immobiliser function ?

Is the fuel pump running ?

I'm pleased to see H967BEG is still out there, Sierra Sapphire with a Rover V8.
That was fun but it had to go when life went to shit so I could keep the house.

It had an LSD which was great in the dry and cornered like a Go kart, undriveable in the wet though, sideways with a whiff of throttle.
Standard vented discs up front never seemed to fade but it had a high lift cam that only came on song at 3,000 rpm and the P6 exhaust headers seemed to stop the party before 5,000.

I don't think the alarm had an immobilizer; the only connection to the main loom was at the ignition barrel so think it was a fairly simple one.  Fuel is getting to the carb so I think that's all right too. 

I will check that I'm on TDC on the compression stroke today.  I think @Scruffy Bodger is correct and it's 180 degrees out, I forgot that the cam goes at half speed of the crank and so it can still be wrong even with the marks lined up.

@Shite Ron that's helpful cheers.  Approximate weights are 450lbs for the V8 and 320lbs for the Pinto which I make out to be a 60kg difference.  A set of aluminium heads will bring that down a bit but it's still a lot of mass.

[Rod/b]

How heavy is the lump in the saffer XR8? If close can you find a set of NOS struts over there / copy the spring rates etc

[Asimo]

Glad you are going the proper 302 route for this. Moving the battery to the boot would go a long way to getting the front to rear weight ratio back to standard.

South Africa didn't do that though. Wonder what suspension their XR8's used?

edit - Too slow!

[Rod/b]

If the alarm had a connection to the ignition barrel the. It might have an immobiliser, if the wire was cut . These old systems usually just act as a fancy switch in the ignition circuit so i’ve seen them installed like a bridge on the ignition circuit / starter circuit at the switch. Alternatively even bodgier and more common was the snip into the LT side of the coil in full view of anyone who really wanted to take your car away. 

[cort16]

Is the pintosaurous injected in this ? I’m surprised it’s got a pinto on a k reg what size is it?

 

[cort1977]

XR8s are cool even if they look a bit odd.  There's an article here that isn't bad compared to some of the crap that gets written about them https://www.modernclassicsmagazine.co.uk/buying-articles/ford-sierra-xr8

1 minute ago, cort16 said:

Is the pintosaurous injected in this ? I’m surprised it’s got a pinto on a k reg what size is it?

 

No, it originally had a CVH injection with cat.  It narrowly falls under the MOT emissions standard for post 1992 cars which means getting a ticket may be a headache.  Not sure if it ever had an MOT with this engine fitted.  Another reason why it possibly wasn't the best buy but hey ho.

[cort16]

There was a surprising amount of sierras that had the cvh and twin cam engines ditched for a pinto.

if its got a mechanical fuel pump they can really take some cranking to get going . Can you see fuel at the carb. I also found mine was a bastard to start as the auto choke didn’t work . I used to close the butterflies manually on the carb sometimes to get it to go.

did the xr8 have a solid rear axle ?

[Scruffy Bodger]

If it's got the auto choke the best thing you can do is bin it. All the Pintos I ever ran were converted to manual pretty much as soon as I got them. Fingers crossed for you on the timing, it's easily done. I had a rally spec Pinto built, stripped, dipped, pistons pocketed etc etc, got it back and would it run, would it fuck? His lacky must have wanged the dizzy in and it was 180 degrees out.

If it's a conversion what gearbox did they sling in it? Pinto's are demanding a lot more money than they used to as are Type 9 gearboxes, dunno about the MT75 tho, haven't looked.

[sutty2006]

Mmmmm 302 Windsor motor. Got that same unit in my Mercury on a little less powerful. Lovely smooth engine though.

[cobblers]

The MOT goes on the age of the engine or the car, whichever is oldest. And obviously, the engine is from a 1991, quite clearly. And you have a letterheaded bit of paper from some nondescript US breakers yard to "prove" this

[cort1977]

22 minutes ago, Scruffy Bodger said:

If it's a conversion what gearbox did they sling in it? Pinto's are demanding a lot more money than they used to as are Type 9 gearboxes, dunno about the MT75 tho, haven't looked.

That's one of the reasons i want to get it running, to see what state it's in before trying to sell it.  It's only a 1.6 but I'm hoping it has a matching type 9 as they are worth a bit these days.

[andy18s]

My last Sierra was a K plated Azura,which had the 1.6 pinto as standard.

Carburettor and no cat,it was a real "flyer"...lol

[sierraman]

You might want to ask Sheffcortinacentre about it, he knows a lot about putting big engines in old Fords. 

[cort1977]

14 minutes ago, andy18s said:

My last Sierra was a K plated Azura,which had the 1.6 pinto as standard.

Carburettor and no cat,it was a real "flyer"...lol

Oh.  Maybe this is the standard engine then, i thought after 1989 they were all CVH.  That's what is implied in parts listings and the Haynes BoL.   

[Tamworthbay]

I remember searching the auctions for a pinto powered one for a kit car project (Robin Hood 2B), I just used to kneel down and see what side the exhaust manifold came down. There seemed a real mix and match for a while.

[spartacus]

Great project, there's nothing like a V8 in a relatively light shell.

[andy18s]

I have no idea,according to wiki there were so many engine options over the years it gets a bit hazy

I'm betting that Ford just threw in whatever parts they had lying around in the final years of production 

[LightBulbFun]

Ohhh this looks like fun  

looking forward to reading the future installments and updates