The new news 24 thread

[Mrcento]

35 minutes ago, Wibble said:

But the plane doesn’t know it’s not configured correctly for weight, or runway length. Featured many times on air crash investigations.

Also things like humidity or altitude of the runway can make an error in calculation they'd be able to recover into a massive one that isn't saveable. Definitely seems like if there was no systems failures, they realised something was up almost instantly given they didn't even attempt to raise the landing gear (suggesting alarms were going off all over the place and they never really established a positive climb)

There's a lot of conflicting info out there, some say it took off fairly normally (up to a point), some say it used up all the runway, hard to tell from the CCTV footage.

Seen some footage of it with audio and it doesn't sound 'right'. Almost sounds like the RAT is deployed, albeit it isn't visible in any of the clips and hard to tell. but it 'could' point to an electrical failure if it was indeed the case, but for one that catastrophic at that point so soon after takeoff (or at least past decision speed) to knock every system out at once would be almost unheard of.

[barefoot]

RAT?

[Supernaut]

16 hours ago, captain_70s said:

£140

Oof. 🥲

I'm assuming there's five £20 notes inside that wee box...?

[Stinkwheel]

12 minutes ago, barefoot said:

RAT?

Ram Air Turbine, as below

Gives some power if electricals and batteries fail

[Slowsilver]

15 hours ago, High Jetter said:

I'm quite impressed with those pumps,  first I'd come across that spin one way for front washers and the other way for rear, neat. Only come across that on 3-phase stuff before.

My 1999 Vauxhall Zafira does the same. The original pump failed (after 25 years) so I bought a replacement from ebay. No indication on the pipes to the pump of which was front and which was rear so I carefully marked the pipe positions on the original pump before removal. Piped up the replacement pump exactly as before and guess what. Front switch now operates rear washer and vice versa. New pump obviously rotated the opposite way for the same polarity. Attempted to reverse the pipes and managed to break off one of the very fragile pump to pipe connectors so had to buy yet another new pump. Grrr!. Fortunately they weren't too dear (about 7 or 8 quid IIRC).

 

[Momentary Lapse Of Reason]

2 hours ago, barefoot said:

RAT?

"Dropping the RAT" in aviation has a different meaning to the toilet meaning ...

[jonathan_dyane]

Thanks @Dave_Q @Bear @SiC for advice and assistance.

I managed to get an old dead windows 8 laptop back up and running with 32bit Windows 7 thanks to Bear gifting me the discs and managed to obtain dodgy eBay VCDS and VAGTACHO. These allowed me to replace my knackered instruments in the Golf.

The diesel VDO ones were £££ (well like £60) so I bought some petrol ones for £20. They seem to work fine except the EPC light has replaced the flow plug light and the rev counter scale goes up rather further than what the TDI can achieve.

One casualty was the VW Gamma stereo system which must have been coded to the old cluster. I have instead fitted the radio out of the 406 which is 'resting'. This leaves a gap where the old separate CD player lived hence wanted add shortly to appear for single DIN tray...

 

[jonathan_dyane]

I just need to get some acetone or some shit to melt off the soft touch crap

[Metal Guru]

17 hours ago, Wibble said:

Yes, flaps a major issue but an experienced pilot, so raises many points to investigate. May they rest in peace.

Oh, and always book seat 11a.

I’ve seen a couple of crappy films on Netflix recently where just one person survives an air crash, and thought “how far fetched”.

Even then I thought , the survivor would be at death’s door , clinging on to life. I don’t know what injuries the guy has, but it’s incredible he seems fully conscious and just in a normal hospital bed. 

[Wibble]

5 minutes ago, Metal Guru said:

I’ve seen a couple of crappy films on Netflix recently where just one person survives an air crash, and thought “how far fetched”.

Even then I thought , the survivor would be at death’s door , clinging on to life. I don’t know what injuries the guy has, but it’s incredible he seems fully conscious and just in a normal hospital bed. 

Yes, it’s quite miraculous really. I read about another guy who survived a crash and was also sat in 11a.

[wuvvum]

From the footage I've seen he actually walked away from the plane and called his family to let them know what had happened.

[High Jetter]

5 minutes ago, wuvvum said:

From the footage I've seen he actually walked away from the plane and called his family to let them know what had happened.

That's incredible, lucky guy.

[stuboy]

I think I may of sorted the mighty moped...  now gonna leave it overnight and see if starts tommorow...

[Stinkwheel]

Got a new welder to replace my 20 year old snap-on 2135.

Got the e-bay special Blackline Mig 200 as reccomended and used by a few on here

 

Only tried it on a few off cut scraps so far,  5kg reel of 0.8mm wire, straight CO2 as shielding gas,  just to make sure it works. Holy Cow its easy to use, It turns out these new  fangled IGBT MiG's are excellent, Would recommend to anyone.

[Lord Sterling]

3 days and £321 later and the Vectra has a new rad. Brill. Hopefully this'll stop any further coolant disappearage. 

Obviously it'll be a test when I take it to work next week. 

Next on the list for the garage is the Jag for a new condenser. 

Maybe I can have actual working air-con for this summer????

[Sunny Jim]

@Lord Sterling your jag's an X300 like my hearse isn't it? Providing the torx bolts which hold the radiator bracket aren't too recalcitrant removing the rad isn't too much of a chore and the condenser is in front of that. Presumably the system no longer contains any gas so you don't have to worry about any escaping? Could save yourself a chunk of garage labour, I'm no star mechanic but replaced my rad without any issues.

[Mrcento]

12 hours ago, Stinkwheel said:

Ram Air Turbine, as below

Gives some power if electricals and batteries fail

yup, effectively a windmill/alternator that drops to give some power to critical systems.

Have seen some images that show it may well have deployed (it certainly sounded like it had in 1 of the videos, very distinctive sound, like a WW2 bomber)

Top images are from the doomed plane coming down, bottom is an example....

And here's what it sounds like (Most audible from 13 seconds in)

which would give some basis to say there could well have been a systems failure/dual engine/hydraulic failure, but it may also have been thrown out in the panic when they thought they'd lost thrust and were stalling, when in fact they'd lost lift.

There's an excellent video online from 74 Gear (A 747 pilot) going through what he sees an he's pretty much saying similar, RE flaps not being in the correct config. His working theory is pretty much that it looks most consistent with the co-pilot possibly retracting the flaps instead of the landing gear by mistake given the moment it happened, the lack of flex in the wings and the stages of the change in AOA of the nose as it goes into stall.

But the possible RAT deployment does throw a few more questions into the mix.

[High Jetter]

Ironically, we're in the middle of watching the series on Pan Am 103.

[Wibble]

56 minutes ago, Mrcento said:

yup, effectively a windmill/alternator that drops to give some power to critical systems.

Have seen some images that show it may well have deployed (it certainly sounded like it had in 1 of the videos, very distinctive sound, like a WW2 bomber)

Top images are from the doomed plane coming down, bottom is an example....

And here's what it sounds like (Most audible from 13 seconds in)

which would give some basis to say there could well have been a systems failure/dual engine/hydraulic failure, but it may also have been thrown out in the panic when they thought they'd lost thrust and were stalling, when in fact they'd lost lift.

There's an excellent video online from 74 Gear (A 747 pilot) going through what he sees an he's pretty much saying similar, RE flaps not being in the correct config. His working theory is pretty much that it looks most consistent with the co-pilot possibly retracting the flaps instead of the landing gear by mistake given the moment it happened, the lack of flex in the wings and the stages of the change in AOA of the nose as it goes into stall.

But the possible RAT deployment does throw a few more questions into the mix.

Even I couldn’t mistake flaps control for landing gear, they’re not even close. More to it I think.

[Mrcento]

7 minutes ago, Wibble said:

Even I couldn’t mistake flaps control for landing gear, they’re not even close. More to it I think.

Agree, but i do think it's something along those kind of lines alongside that something else.

I would say there's another issue that has distracted them (potentially explaining the potential RAT deployment) and if there hasn't been some kind of unimaginable systems failure, in the panic of that other emergency, there's also been some kind of wild error made trying to 'clean up' the plane to get some airspeed up etc. 

Of course, all assuming they had working controls at that point.....

[Wibble]

9 minutes ago, Mrcento said:

Agree, but i do think it's something along those kind of lines alongside that something else.

I would say there's another issue that has distracted them (potentially explaining the potential RAT deployment) and if there hasn't been some kind of unimaginable systems failure, in the panic of that other emergency, there's also been some kind of wild error made trying to 'clean up' the plane to get some airspeed up etc. 

Of course, all assuming they had working controls at that point.....

At this point I’m still betting on a hydraulic or system failure, or bird strike, although there’s no sign of obvious birds from the footage, particularly in light of other 787s having had flap deployment issues recently. I think the captain was too experienced for a configuration error but it could be of course, so I still think hydraulic failure. We’ll all know eventually, of course and may they rest in peace.

[Mrcento]

2 minutes ago, Wibble said:

 I think the captain was too experienced for a configuration error but it could be of course

I always think in all walks of life, it's best to treat the mega experienced as potential absolute beginners and leave no stone unturned.

Some of the worst mistakes i've seen in any field have been from the most experienced people within them.

Sometimes, arrogance and complacency takes over. 'I've been doing this 20+ years, i know all there is to know, i don't need no handbook or supervision, i can do this in my sleep etc etc' Giving it 10% attention and 5% effort.

I hope that is not the case here, and i'm kind of with you that at very least it seems likely 'something' else has happened that may have taken it out their hands entirely, or at very least they've been fighting something on the plane like a hydraulic failure prior to something else happening in the seconds after. The initial findings are going to be fascinating. RIP to all who were lost.

[Wibble]

13 minutes ago, Mrcento said:

I always think in all walks of life, it's best to treat the mega experienced as potential absolute beginners and leave no stone unturned.

Some of the worst mistakes i've seen in any field have been from the most experienced people within them.

Sometimes, arrogance and complacency takes over. 'I've been doing this 20+ years, i know all there is to know, i don't need no handbook or supervision, i can do this in my sleep etc etc' Giving it 10% attention and 5% effort.

I hope that is not the case here, and i'm kind of with you that at very least it seems likely 'something' else has happened that may have taken it out their hands entirely, or at very least they've been fighting something on the plane like a hydraulic failure prior to something else happening in the seconds after. The initial findings are going to be fascinating. RIP to all who were lost.

Aviation has always been a fascinating subject for me, especially with my dad being involved in it for his whole career but, I think we need to wait for updates from the professional investigators. I don’t think us pound-shop, autoshite air-crash investigators, of which I’m clearly one, can add anything of real value to be honest. My only flight experience is half an hour  in a glider and Microsoft flight simulator 2000.

[Metal Guru]

10 hours ago, Wibble said:

Yes, it’s quite miraculous really. I read about another guy who survived a crash and was also sat in 11a.

Ryanair will put a £1000 premium on 11a.

[wuvvum]

Helluva storm here at the moment.  Most intense lightning I've ever seen in this country. 

[Markeh]

6 hours ago, Metal Guru said:

Ryanair will put a £1000 premium on 11a.

Ironically I think 11A is the one window seat on Ryanair's 737 MAX that doesn't actually have a window, so arguably worse!

[comfortablynumb]

6 hours ago, wuvvum said:

Helluva storm here at the moment.  Most intense lightning I've ever seen in this country. 

Strange how these work.

Other side of the county to you, and not a drop here.

Shame, I enjoy a good storm

[barefoot]

My Scirocco won the 'best original patina ' award at the local car show this morning. 

[SiC]

33 minutes ago, barefoot said:

My Scirocco won the 'best original patina ' award at the local car show this morning. 

Was that a nice way of them saying "by far the most fucked looking out of all the cars"? 😉

[SiC]

Went to a local show today. Dig for Victory - WW2 themed event. 

Not usually my bag but I saw there was plenty of vehicles on show and on the moves, I decided to give it a go. The classic car area was pretty Spartan which was a disappointment to see the lack of attendance (I guess you could say the same to me that I didn't show mine...) but the rest of the show was excellent and I really enjoyed it.

Trucks, tractors, tanks, traction engines, artillery, exhibits and loud bangs!

Loads of photos uploaded in no particular order (blame Android for doing that).