Project Dollywobbler's Invacar - Ongoing

[BorniteIdentity]

21 minutes ago, brownnova said:

you do have to draw the line somewhere! 

Yes, but trailering is (IMHO) beyond the line. Otherwise we could all just drag our heaps to shows behind modern cars; possibly parking up around the corner to drive the final 1/4 mile so people don't know.

Good luck DW.  Is there any further expertise to be garnered from anywhere?

[SiC]

Having sat in this at the NEC, I'm not sure how you managed 2000 miles in this, let alone thinking of doing 800 miles in a weekend or so. Your back must be made of sterner stuff than mine. 

Is this drivetrain essentially the same as an ATV and other small farm machinery? Just wondered if in deepest wet Wales there is a Farm machinery mechanic/garage that could at least help diagnose problems. 

[Noel Tidybeard]

trailoring is the sensible option because SF19 gets 2  wobblimobiles instead of 1- phact

[brownnova]

4 hours ago, BorniteIdentity said:

Yes, but trailering is (IMHO) beyond the line. Otherwise we could all just drag our heaps to shows behind modern cars; possibly parking up around the corner to drive the final 1/4 mile so people don't know.

Good luck DW.  Is there any further expertise to be garnered from anywhere?

I meant specifically for this instance as it for a particular. In general I completely agree with you! Cars are there to be driven not trailered! 

[egg]

How about getting it trailered to the AC factory (I assume Surrey?) and then drive it to the Invacar factory (Thundersley)...the two places where it has its ancestry.

[LightBulbFun]

is She still making unpleasant mechanical noises on the over run as i know that was an issue at one point?

I will admit im in the drive it there and back camp, too many Model 70s have been bought as toys just to drag to shows and back and it makes me a bit sad.

I will say having a shadow car is not a bad idea

 

have you thought about removing the belt, getting the rear wheels off the ground and checking that both pulleys spin freely? if one pulley is dragging for some reason I could imagine that would make things very unhappy!

[dollywobbler]

Yeah, both pulleys spin freely - if I turn the driven shaft by hand, the car moves, and the drive pulley shaft is also fine. Belt alignment looks ok, but I guess if they're mismatched, they could be pulling out of alignment as speed increases. 

[LightBulbFun]

yeah, but the main issues you describe happen at slower speeds/when slowing down rather then as speed increases.

Like I said I think strapping a camera somewhere and videoing the pulleys and belt during a run out might provide some useful info

are there any rolling roads near you? might also provide some useful info (if say only 5HP is getting to the wheels then you know something is not right!) (also an Invacar on a Dyno would be fun to see regardless ) 

(as a side question did you end up doing a compression check on the engine BTW?)

as a probably longer term solution if we really cant sort out TWCs woes, if you can get in contact with st185cs again, I wonder if its worth buying another gearbox and engine lump out of one of the sadder Model 70s from that field? (I also recall OliD-E also found a bunch of Engine+Gearboxes at one point but I dont know what became of that)

(granted on the engine side of things, Steyr puch engines look pretty easy to rebuild so you could also do that ) 

[Mally]

You can buy Sticky belt spray. Not sure what it's called. Sticky belt spray maybe?

Have used it on my pillar drill for drilling too big holes and it worked. That's too not two.

[RayMK]

Is the belt V angle matched to the CVT pulley V angle?  If they are significantly different, squealing will be the result.   LBF's suggestion of mounting a camera to spy on the behaviour of belt and pulleys during representative driving is a good one.  It may show whether the belt is becoming misaligned due to the new pulleys being mismatched but I would be surprised if that was happening.  The passive, spring loaded pulley should accommodate whatever the speed sensitive pulley demands provided that the static belt tension is correct.  Have the belt or pulley driving surfaces picked up oil from somewhere?

There's nothing to be ashamed of regarding trailering TWC.  You have already demonstrated that long distances are possible.  A 400 miles trip each way is a serious distance in a car made for 'local' trips in a different era.  You can refer critcs to your TWC videos. 

[Skut]

Trailer. If the problem has persisted for a year or more, 1 week isn't going to sort it. 

[LightBulbFun]

20 minutes ago, Skut said:

Trailer. If the problem has persisted for a year or more, 1 week isn't going to sort it. 

well thats a good point, its been a problem for over a year

but I dont think its lead to an FTP? (apart from that 1 time DW fitted poorly pulleys and TWC shredded a Drive belt in protest  )

 

[dollywobbler]

Yeah, my only concern is being a mobile road block. I HATE holding up traffic, and it's not a joyous vehicle in which to do so (on account of you being so vulnerable in it). Maybe I'm over-reacting. After all, tourists don't seem to worry about dawdling along like twats, paying more attention to the views than the road. Maybe I should stop comparing a 500cc Invalid Carriage with a modern car.

 

I think I have to drive it. It's a pretty crap video otherwise. I am going to have to suffer for my art.

[BorniteIdentity]

25 minutes ago, dollywobbler said:

I think I have to drive it. It's a pretty crap video otherwise. I am going to have to suffer for my art.

I agree. This is what you DO. It’s your thing. It’s what people expect and it’s what makes for entertainment. To grow any audience you have to surprise and delight.

To counter what was said above about the problem persisting for a year: it’s also now unlikely to completely strand you. And if it does, what’s the worst that could happen? You apologise to motorists with a forgiving wave, you get pushed to the side of the road, you get recovered and you’ve still got some great content.

Good luck!

[LightBulbFun]

36 minutes ago, dollywobbler said:

Yeah, my only concern is being a mobile road block. I HATE holding up traffic, and it's not a joyous vehicle in which to do so (on account of you being so vulnerable in it). Maybe I'm over-reacting. After all, tourists don't seem to worry about dawdling along like twats, paying more attention to the views than the road. Maybe I should stop comparing a 500cc Invalid Carriage with a modern car.

 

I think I have to drive it. It's a pretty crap video otherwise. I am going to have to suffer for my art.

if I am reading things correctly she is able to keep up with traffic on the flats just fine right? so I dont think you will as much as a road block as you think you are, especially once your out of wales, and who knows this trip might finally provide a good opportunity to attempt a top speed run on a motorway or something  

(its probably a bit late to do it now for this trip, but in future you could try contact haflinger technik and ask about the feasibility of upgrading TWCs engine to 650cc Pistons and barrels like you did with your 2CV? if you cant solve the poor hill climbing issue, just power through the issue literally )

[Inspector Morose]

1 hour ago, dollywobbler said:

I think I have to drive it. It's a pretty crap video otherwise. I am going to have to suffer for my art.

Offer still stands. 

[Zelandeth]

I'm looking forward to getting to the stage of being confident enough to get TP out of town so I can do a few hill climb tests to give us something to compare to.

 

I do wonder though purely based on what my ears suggest at idle if TWC is just down on power and the drive is struggling as a result of that, which is where the trouble on hills comes from.

The squeaking is another issue entirely and I don't know quite what to do about that.  Since I've fitted the new (well, new ancient stock) belt to TP I've been getting a lot of squeaking  just as I'm pulling away and coming to rest - but I know full well that my pulleys aren't healthy in the surface department and I'm using an ancient belt...

What might be worth a shot much be putting something (thin paint? Ink?) on the belts or pulleys then drive a few feet to see if it can show you what sort of contact you're getting?  Just spitballing ideas really.

I would definitely second the idea of seeing if there's an ATV specialist in your neck of the woods who could take a look at it. I doubt there's anything in there which will surprise them.  These systems I'm sure are easy to deal with once you're used to them, but because the belt tension in particular seems to rely on being "just right" they can be really finicky until you learn the ropes.

 

It's a bloody long old trip you have lined up.  If you know there's a problem with the car before you even start (especially with the drive), there's no shame in trailering it.

[dollywobbler]

Thanks folks. She's certainly no worse than she was the first time I drove to Buckinghamshire, so as Stage 1 is to repeat that, I should just swallow a brave pill and get on with it.

 

FBP7 - a bit of shadowing might be appreciated. I may well drop you a message at some point tomorrow. Assuming I don't forget. I've just remembered something else I was meant to be not forgetting for about two weeks. I'm going to go and do that now...

[Inspector Morose]

I’ll give you a nudge on Friday then. ?

[dollywobbler]

Sounds about right! I might actually have* some sort of plan* by then. 

[LightBulbFun]

41 minutes ago, dollywobbler said:

Thanks folks. She's certainly no worse than she was the first time I drove to Buckinghamshire, so as Stage 1 is to repeat that, I should just swallow a brave pill and get on with it.

 

FBP7 - a bit of shadowing might be appreciated. I may well drop you a message at some point tomorrow. Assuming I don't forget. I've just remembered something else I was meant to be not forgetting for about two weeks. I'm going to go and do that now...

will you be swinging by Zels place and saying hello to TPA again? , if so I might just throw my back out again and pop down when you do because I dont think chances to see TWC in person (let alone with TPA) like this will come around often, and of course its a chance to say hello in person!

(if thats ok with you and Zel!)

[dollywobbler]

That's the plan. 

[dollywobbler]

Had a few moments to play with this today. Points gap was very slightly tight, and is now bob on. No difference. I also loosened the belt, which initially seemed to improve matters, but I'm now pretty sure that has made no difference either.

About the only thing I've got left to try is to fit a different belt. I do have a surprisingly varied selection.

[dollywobbler]

Here's a video of magic.

 

[LightBulbFun]

21 minutes ago, dollywobbler said:

Here's a video of magic.

 

while that was very interesting to watch  (if a bit nerve wrecking going by how it looks like the belt is about to fly off the edge of pulleys there, especially as you have no cage installed!)

what I meant by video the pulleys was

gaffer tape a camera to the inside of the transmission cover, bolt everything back together, and go for a real drive, and hope the loud *crunch* you heard half way through the drive was not the sound of your camera getting shredded by the belt and pulleys  and then watch back the footage to see how the belts behave under a real world load

[dollywobbler]

Problem is, I don't want to go for a drive without the cage and cover in place. It'll then be really dark...

[LightBulbFun]

8 hours ago, dollywobbler said:

Problem is, I don't want to go for a drive without the cage and cover in place. It'll then be really dark...

most Phones these days have a flashlight function you can enable while recording or such, or just strap a torch in there with the camera

[Zelandeth]

Space is an issue too.  It's not really apparent, but the parcel shelf of the service hatch is sitting pretty much on top of the belt cage.  Trying to find somewhere that gave you line of sight of the belts with the (honestly essential) safety gear in place would be tricky.  If you've got something like a GoPro with a million ways to attach it to stuff you might be able to do something like attach it to the inlet manifold or a suspension trailing arm... it's more awkward than it sounds to set up.
 

Will be doing testing myself tomorrow as my secondary pulley is officially as clean as I can get it with my equipment now...so will feed back any useful findings.

 

[LightBulbFun]

im sure something could be bodged up  this guy figured out how to do it in 2008 long before go pros existed! (action shot is at 51 seconds in)

 

[dollywobbler]

I reckon he just ran without any form of safety...