HMC P4 action

[Dobloseven]

About the time BL was formed,BMC were shifting about 40k Farinas a year,the sort of figure that'd make it a best seller today.Always makes me smile to think the 1800 should have been their replacement in 1964,but was actually outsold by them.Even when the Maxi replaced the A60 in 1969,the Oxford carried on for another 2years till the Marina came along.Truly a car that refused to die.

[HMC]

I like the idea that the 1800 was not appealing to some vs the Fossilised Farina and that Issigonis was presumably mystified by such luddites.

[danthecapriman]

  On 28/01/2025 at 18:02, HMC said:

I like the idea that the 1800 was not appealing to some vs the Fossilised Farina and that Issigonis was presumably mystified by such luddites.

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It was probably build quality issues that cost the 1800 sales. I mean things had become so bad they’d actually even fitted the engines the wrong way round!😄

[HMC]

Ive never driven a farina before. a30s yes. minors aplenty. I wonder how this will compare.

 

[Dobloseven]

Think the 1800 was planned to be a smaller car with a 1600 engine,but grew to a size and price that nobody really wanted.Then the Maxi came along which wasn't as popular as planned either.Meanwhile,the Farinas plodded on unchanged.There's an black and white estate car round our way that seems to earn it's keep towing trailer loads of pallets.Think the owner might have a Mk 4 Zodiphyr as well.

[artdjones]

  On 28/01/2025 at 19:14, Dobloseven said:

Think the 1800 was planned to be a smaller car with a 1600 engine,but grew to a size and price that nobody really wanted.Then the Maxi came along which wasn't as popular as planned either.Meanwhile,the Farinas plodded on unchanged.There's an black and white estate car round our way that seems to earn it's keep towing trailer loads of pallets.Think the owner might have a Mk 4 Zodiphyr as well.

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BMC's product planning and marketing disasters show the dangers of listening too closely to people who feel that they are geniuses.

[plasticvandan]

The farina is my dad's favourite car out of the 400 odd he's owned since 79,which must mean something.hes half looking for one again for dailying inn fact,his thoughts are it's a comfortable minor with a bit more go.

[Yoss]

  On 28/01/2025 at 18:27, HMC said:

Ive never driven a farina before. a30s yes. minors aplenty. I wonder how this will compare.

 

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I hope you'll be pleasantly surprised. The gearboxes were supposed to be the best of their time. All the controls should feel nice and precise if they're not worn. I used to attend a Farina group monthly pub meeting (in my Landcrab, god forbid) and there were plenty of people still using them daily and I see no reason why you still couldn't. 

[Yoss]

  On 28/01/2025 at 19:14, Dobloseven said:

Think the 1800 was planned to be a smaller car with a 1600 engine,but grew to a size and price that nobody really wanted.Then the Maxi came along which wasn't as popular as planned either.Meanwhile,the Farinas plodded on unchanged.There's an black and white estate car round our way that seems to earn it's keep towing trailer loads of pallets.Think the owner might have a Mk 4 Zodiphyr as well.

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The Landcrab is actually shorter than a Farina, it just looks longer because of the odd proportions. It is slightly wider and heavier and certainly has a lot more room in it. 

It's not unusual to offer an outgoing model for a short while alongside a new one but people kept buying the Farinas so BMC kept making them. For seven years. It's a strange business model but there you go. 

I think a lot of people were scared of the newfangled technology in the Crab which is odd because it never worried them in the mini or ADO 16 so that doesn't make a lot of sense. I guess people buying bigger cars were generally older. 

[High Jetter]

I had an 1800, loved it. Big enough for comfortable christenings, unlike a Mini.

[Asimo]

  On 28/01/2025 at 20:43, Yoss said:

All the controls should feel nice and precise if they're not worn.

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Except the steering.*

The steering will feel heavy, floppy and vague. Like a Moskvich or a Frontera  for example. But in a good way.

** Good driving gloves really help with the thin and shiny steering wheel rim.

[Yoss]

  On 28/01/2025 at 22:43, Asimo said:

Except the steering.*

The steering will feel heavy, floppy and vague. Like a Moskvich or a Frontera  for example. But in a good way.

** Good driving gloves really help with the thin and shiny steering wheel rim.

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Agreed, but no worse than other cars of that era and I'm sure @HMC has driven many of those. I kind e meant all the switchgear but I could have been more precise I guess. 

[lesapandre]

  On 28/01/2025 at 18:02, HMC said:

I like the idea that the 1800 was not appealing to some vs the Fossilised Farina and that Issigonis was presumably mystified by such luddites.

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Poor product planning by BMC.  There was an arrogant 'we know best attitude' that prevailed right into the BL years. 

Consumers voted with their wallets.

The Cambridge Farina line should have sold in all those markets that the Peugeot 404  and Mercedes W110 did - they are tough and comparable sized cars - but like a lot of BMC stuff just failed to be as good as the opposition in a few crucial places.

[adw1977]

The 1800 Landcrab was about £100 more than an A60 Farina, which was a significant amount in the 1960s.  About 14% more expensive, so the 1800 couldn't really be a replacement for the A60.

[Joey spud]

It's nice when an image can trigger a forgotten memory.

Back in the mid eighties I was just starting my working life at the village garage who's owner Alan was a bit excentric to say the least. He would supply cars to some of his equally excentric customers one being Joyce the horsey lady who was in need of a new car after her Fiat 124's engine had seized when its corroded sump had burst after hitting a large divot while towing a horse box out of her field.

Joyce was probably younger than she looked (fifty) and without fail was always dressed in the full horse regalia and often had a certain dungy odour about her. Alan had sold her the Fiat and so she came to him to see again.

This time an F reg blue and cream A60 Cambridge was supplied as it had a tow bar already fitted. At this time the car was about 18 years old and it was taken for a 'gentle' MOT which it failed due to chassis corrosion and a worn kingpins.

From memory these cars had a double angled outrigger affair behind the front wheels that filled with mud and then rotted out and to repair well looked quite time consuming but Alan had been bought up old BMC stuff and simply cut a triangular piece of metal to cover up all the rust damage.

I remember him laughing and saying "what the mot man can't see he can't fail". Looking back it was probably a recognised repair to keep these cars on the road.

It was a trooper of a car it broke a main leaf spring once and as a (not so) temporary repair we clamped it to the others using exhaust U clamps and when the trailing edge of the front wings got really frilly we patched them up with aluminium and pop rivets before brush painting the repairs with matching Valspar enamel.

Despite the A60 not really being suitable for horse duties (she did eventually replace it with a swb Landy) it did well and finally got parked up in the stable yard and used for storing stuff that she didn't want the Rats to get at rather than go for scrap.

Nearly forty years later I can still remember this A60's unique interior smell. A mixture of damp carpets and whatever bmc used to stuff the seats with a sprinkling of straw,mud and horse shit.

[HMC]

Its here!

 

[somewhatfoolish]

Does it come with a pipe, trilby and a car coat?

[holbeck]

Very nice. 

Exactly the same as one in which I was taxied* to school circa 1974.

I can still hear the whirr of the gearbox accelerating through the gears

 

 

* rural area, not enough of us for a bus

[Dobloseven]

Lovely!If that appeared at the start of Heartbeat, you'd sort of know it was going go meet a lorry on the wrong side of the road coming the other way.And roll down a steep embankment and hit a tree.Or roll into the river.Or something.......

[N Dentressangle]

Pleasantly scruffy.

Look forward to hearing more about it 👍

[camryv6]

  On 30/01/2025 at 13:28, somewhatfoolish said:

Does it come with a pipe, trilby and a car coat?

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That just described my grandad and he used to have one of these !

[High Jetter]

Lovely - very similar to the first car I drove*  as a 4 or 5yo sitting on Dad's lap.

[bigstraight6]

  On 30/01/2025 at 13:57, holbeck said:

Very nice. 

Exactly the same as one in which I was taxied* to school circa 1974.

I can still hear the whirr of the gearbox accelerating through the gears

 

 

* rural area, not enough of us for a bus

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Yes, that’s a very memorable sound for me as a family member had a late 60’s Morris Oxford in the mid/late 70’s that I was regularly given lifts in. 

[captain_70s]

  On 30/01/2025 at 12:59, HMC said:

Its here!

 

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What a nicely proportioned car. How far we've fallen...

[HMC]

Been for an early evening potter. My seat is very firm. Thats because, its not a british effort to make a saab rivalling level of ergonomic comfort, but as i discovered, the webbing had partly collapsed and im sat on a block of wood 😂 Suprisingly comfortable!

I Love driving it. It seems to have a special smell- leather, vinyl and eau de longbridge?

[plasticvandan]

All the tickets 

[danthecapriman]

  On 31/01/2025 at 17:35, HMC said:

Been for an early evening potter. My seat is very firm. Thats because, its not a british effort to make a saab rivalling level of ergonomic comfort, but as i discovered, the webbing had partly collapsed and im sat on a block of wood 😂 Suprisingly comfortable!

I Love driving it. It seems to have a special smell- leather, vinyl and eau de longbridge?

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One of those cars I’d never get bored of looking at if nothing else. Lovely.

[lesapandre]

  On 28/01/2025 at 20:55, Yoss said:

The Landcrab is actually shorter than a Farina, it just looks longer because of the odd proportions. It is slightly wider and heavier and certainly has a lot more room in it. 

It's not unusual to offer an outgoing model for a short while alongside a new one but people kept buying the Farinas so BMC kept making them. For seven years. It's a strange business model but there you go. 

I think a lot of people were scared of the newfangled technology in the Crab which is odd because it never worried them in the mini or ADO 16 so that doesn't make a lot of sense. I guess people buying bigger cars were generally older. 

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As someone there in the 1970's and with direct experience of a Landcrab - our neighbours had one and I travelled in it - their criticisms were:

High fuel consumption. - uncomfortable driving position (difficult to reach all the controls) - heavy steering - austere interior and just so ugly - a bit too big and wide to manoeuvre easily (down to the steering again).

[HMC]

  On 31/01/2025 at 17:48, lesapandre said:

As someone there in the 1970's and with direct experience of a Landcrab - our neighbours had one and I travelled in it - their criticisms were:

High fuel consumption. - uncomfortable driving position (difficult to reach all the controls) - heavy steering - austere interior and just so ugly - a bit too big and wide to manoeuvre easily (down to the steering again).

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I wonder if the 2200/6 had PAS? otherwise that would have been a work out!

[lesapandre]

Some of the later ones did I think. I'm not sure it was even an option originally.