invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[Slowsilver]

I was watching an episode of a series called "The Protectors" on our PVR last night and spotted this:

Potatocam photo of paused TV so not great but you can see that it is an Invacar Mk12, registration FNO 100H.
From the copyright info this episode, entitled "Think Back", was first shown in 1971 and was broadcast again on Talking Pictures TV (Freeview channel 81) at 06:00 on 15/09/2021.
@LightBulbFun don't know if this is one known to you but thought it might be of interest.
 

[LightBulbFun]

4 hours ago, Slowsilver said:

I was watching an episode of a series called "The Protectors" on our PVR last night and spotted this:

Potatocam photo of paused TV so not great but you can see that it is an Invacar Mk12, registration FNO 100H.
From the copyright info this episode, entitled "Think Back", was first shown in 1971 and was broadcast again on Talking Pictures TV (Freeview channel 81) at 06:00 on 15/09/2021.
@LightBulbFun don't know if this is one known to you but thought it might be of interest.
 

Ah thank you for the heads up  I have known of this one for a good few years now as its on the IMCDB https://www.imcdb.org/vehicle_38695-Invacar-Mk12-1968.html

but I appreciate the heads up  

BTW while it is indeed an FNO-H car, I had doubted it was FNO100H as as Invacars went up/where registered in blocks of 100 and generally started from x01, for example the FNO-H block is FNO101H to FNO200H  there are exceptions to this rule, but generally its quite rare, and indeed looking it up FNO100H is on a Honda moped of some kind (sadly no Invacars from the FNO-H block survived into DVLA lookup range)

the picture is not very clear but looking at it and your picture id say it was FNO180H

 

[barefoot]

Not specifically Invacar, but the protectors is the best telly programme for chod spotting ever. Check this little lot out!

http://www.imcdb.org/movie_68122-The-Protectors.html

 

[LightBulbFun]

I did some further fettling with REV, managed to wedge the choke on with a screw driver strategically jammed in in the linkage assembly for it LOL

but sadly I have not had any luck still no signs of life, basically made no difference sadly (turns over fine just no signs of firing at all)

but one of the kids from the school next door said "nice car!" while I was working on REV so not all bad  

 

I also think I need to replace the ground cable from the battery to the chassis as its not looking too clever, dont think its bad enough that its preventing things from firing, but I can feel several broken strands at the crimp, and by the way it flops about when you disconnect it from the battery,  im not sure how many more connection/disconnection cycles it can take! (and what voltage drop there is probably is not helping matters!)

so I have ordered a new suitable length ground strap (actually 3 pack but thats just how they seem to come on amazon) hopefully I will be able get the nut/bolt on the chassis end of the existing ground lead undone, I dont think it has been removed in a very long time! and I dont have much strength for undoing stubborn fasteners! (even pain/disabilities aside, I just dont have much in the way of mass/muscle strength LOL)

(oh and I also placed an order for shit load of Zip ties just for good measure!) 

[3VOM]

40 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

 and I dont have much strength for undoing stubborn fasteners! (even pain/disabilities aside, I just dont have much in the way of mass/muscle strength LOL)

Long term you could look at a battery impact driver / nut runner to help you out.

[Slowsilver]

2 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

BTW while it is indeed an FNO-H car, I had doubted it was FNO100H as as Invacars went up in blocks of 100 and generally started from x01, for example the FNO-H block is FNO101H to FNO200H  there are exceptions to this rule, but generally its quite rare, and indeed looking it up FNO100H is on a Honda moped of some kind (sadly no Invacars from the FNO-H block survived into DVLA lookup range)

the picture is not very clear but looking at it and your picture id say it was FNO180H

I took a very close up picture of the number plate as well but didn't bother to upload it before as it is very fuzzy. But here it is:

Not particularly clear but after a closer look it could indeed be FNO 180H.

Originally posted picture cropped to just show number plate:

Not much clearer. But from your in-depth knowledge of all things Invacar, especially the registration blocks, I am sure you must be correct.

 

[Dobloseven]

Get one of the kids from the school to hold a plug lead while you spin the engine over to see if there's a spark! 

[somewhatfoolish]

A means of cranking the engine from in the engine compartment as implemented by @Zelandeth would be a boon for you working alone. A skoosh of petrol(disposable syringes are my go-to for this duty) down the choke may coax it into life, even briefly.

[AdgeCutler]

Sorry to hear you've not managed to get a pop out of REV as of yet Dez, hopefully a second pair of locally dwelling hands will present themselves before long.

After having become frustrated that spare hours have been eluding me for a good few months now I decided to take a days holiday today, even better a very skilled friend decided he'd join me and waste one of his free days on Brian. Between us we spent 14 man hours bringing the first Mk12e chassis to be built in 50 years near to completion. A few more components were fabricated, many measurements taken and taken again, gauges and mounting aids made up, components removed from the old chassis and cleaned up, the lathe put to work, marking out, drilling and out came the MIG welder.  We are oh so close to having the chassis for a dry mounting of the engine cradle, drop arms and bodywork but once again were called to other duties. Hopefully in the not too distant future I'll be ready to mock up everything and check everything fits as it should, once that is done it can all come back to pieces a few welds finished off, be painted and then set about the re-build.

Here's the chassis at the end of todays efforts: 

[Mrs6C]

13 minutes ago, AdgeCutler said:

the first Mk12e chassis to be built in 50 years near to completion

This is looking fantastic! It is great to see it all take shape.

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, AdgeCutler said:

Sorry to hear you've not managed to get a pop out of REV as of yet Dez, hopefully a second pair of locally dwelling hands will present themselves before long.

After having become frustrated that spare hours have been eluding me for a good few months now I decided to take a days holiday today, even better a very skilled friend decided he'd join me and waste one of his free days on Brian. Between us we spent 14 man hours bringing the first Mk12e chassis to be built in 50 years near to completion. A few more components were fabricated, many measurements taken and taken again, gauges and mounting aids made up, components removed from the old chassis and cleaned up, the lathe put to work, marking out, drilling and out came the MIG welder.  We are oh so close to having the chassis for a dry mounting of the engine cradle, drop arms and bodywork but once again were called to other duties. Hopefully in the not too distant future I'll be ready to mock up everything and check everything fits as it should, once that is done it can all come back to pieces a few welds finished off, be painted and then set about the re-build.

Here's the chassis at the end of todays efforts: 

wow that is some seriously really amazing stuff! this really be the best Invacar out there after your done! it really could not have fallen into better hands!

and im glad to hear you where finally able to take some time off for Brian after being flat out with other things  

I am really looking forward to seeing everything come together at long last  (indeed it is pretty much 50 years on the dot since the Last Invacar Mk12E chassis rolled off the line since the 2nd Invacar Model 70  off the production line was registered on the 1st of November 1971)

[LightBulbFun]

today was a good day! with many thanks to @Mrs6C and @Six-cylinder who very kindly volunteered their time today and braved central London to help me with REV  

turns out she wont start as her fuel pump is knackered and wont draw any fuel through no matter what we tried, but she happily runs on ether/starter fluid so Ill take that as a good sign!

current plan is to fit a simple electric fuel pump and bypass the mechanical pump entirely, to that end @Zelandeth if have any tips or tidbits I should know or have links to the setup you use that would be most helpful! although I do understand you got gifted the setup so probably cant link to it on eBay or what have you!, but if you have any pictures showing how exactly you set it up or any pitfalls I should be aware of that would be good to see/know  

not that I for-see it being hard to install one at all its just disconnect 2 fuel pipes reconnect them to the electric fuel pump, secure the pump somewhere in the engine bay and find an ignition switched Live!

we also managed to sort out the issue of the door falling off  

old knackered and incorrectly installed bobbins (which we where pretty sure where made of wood! very much looked/broke apart like it!)

and new bobbins installed correctly  (although the split pins where past it, so they are only held in with wire passed through the holes but it should be good enough until some properly sized split pins can be found)

all in all a pretty good day! im glad to know why REV would not run and that she does with assistance and I am very thankful once more to @Six-cylinder and @Mrs6C for the visit and help!

I really could not have done it without them   

[Zelandeth]

The pump I've got is a pretty generic type, so long as you find one that's specifically stated as suitable for carburettor engines rather than injection you should be fine.

That type of pump is always best installed near the tank as they're generally far better at pushing than pulling fuel.

Mechanically they're basically the same as the one on the engine, just actuated by a solenoid rather than a lobe on the camshaft.

 

I really need to do something to properly sort the doors on TPA at some point too as the rollers really don't on the one I use!

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

The pump I've got is a pretty generic type, so long as you find one that's specifically stated as suitable for carburettor engines rather than injection you should be fine.

That type of pump is always best installed near the tank as they're generally far better at pushing than pulling fuel.

Mechanically they're basically the same as the one on the engine, just actuated by a solenoid rather than a lobe on the camshaft.

 

I really need to do something to properly sort the doors on TPA at some point too as the rollers really don't on the one I use!

ah cool good to know  

I have found these on amazon

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Litensh-Universal-Electric-Pump，Heavy-Pressure/dp/B09F9DFN4L/ref=sr_1_14?crid=2QFY25KB9Y6PF&keywords=fuel%2Bpump&qid=1636826789&sprefix=fuel%2Bpump%2Caps%2C172&sr=8-14&th=1

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Electric-Outlet-105-99L-2-3-5PSI-Pressure/dp/B085H9B8Y8/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=2-3.5PSI%2BLow%2BPressure%2BPump&qid=1636831174&sr=8-2&th=1

cheap and cheerful but I can get it here pretty quickly which appeals to me, but Im worried the pressure might be a bit high, from talking to a good friend of mine it seems I want something in the 2.5-4.5 PSI range, the 2nd one one looks suitable but googling its PN shows pumps by the same part number but listed as 4-7PSI and like wise for the first i get identical listed parts rated for 2.5-4.5 instead of 4-7PSI so im not really quite sure what to trust LOL

said friend did recommend some good options that he has used on his MGB but they are quite pricey! for now im just trying to get things up and running, so if anyone has anything they would recommend im all ears  

[auntiemaryscanary]

1 hour ago, LightBulbFun said:

today was a good day! with many thanks to @Mrs6C and @Six-cylinder who very kindly volunteered their time today and braved central London to help me with REV  

turns out she wont start as her fuel pump is knackered and wont draw any fuel through no matter what we tried, but she happily runs on ether/starter fluid so Ill take that as a good sign!

current plan is to fit a simple electric fuel pump and bypass the mechanical pump entirely, to that end @Zelandeth if have any tips or tidbits I should know or have links to the setup you use that would be most helpful! although I do understand you got gifted the setup so probably cant link to it on eBay or what have you!, but if you have any pictures showing how exactly you set it up or any pitfalls I should be aware of that would be good to see/know  

not that I for-see it being hard to install one at all its just disconnect 2 fuel pipes reconnect them to the electric fuel pump, secure the pump somewhere in the engine bay and find an ignition switched Live!

we also managed to sort out the issue of the door falling off  

old knackered and incorrectly installed bobbins (which we where pretty sure where made of wood! very much looked/broke apart like it!)

and new bobbins installed correctly  (although the split pins where past it, so they are only held in with wire passed through the holes but it should be good enough until some properly sized split pins can be found)

all in all a pretty good day! im glad to know why REV would not run and that she does with assistance and I am very thankful once more to @Six-cylinder and @Mrs6C for the visit and help!

I really could not have done it without them   

Really pleased to hear some progress has been made on your Invacar today. Sounds like you've had some really good practical help from @Mrs6C @Six-cylinder.

12v oil pumps were mentioned when you had issues with over filled oil in your vehicle. Lidls have them in currently at £9.99 if it help you in the future.

[Dobloseven]

That's brilliant!The 6 Cylinders really are lovely people. Thinking about the fuel pump, could a mechanical one be sourced from the Haflinger parts people? The door rollers, according to the manual, are made of Tufnol, which would, I suppose degrade in a similar way to wood. 

[LightBulbFun]

24 minutes ago, auntiemaryscanary said:

Really pleased to hear some progress has been made on your Invacar today. Sounds like you've had some really good practical help from @Mrs6C @Six-cylinder.

12v oil pumps were mentioned when you had issues with over filled oil in your vehicle. Lidls have them in currently at £9.99 if it help you in the future.

Thanks   

Thats good to know  but the problem is I dont think theres any Lidls near me, I certainly cant ever recall seeing any in the area! (not within walking distance)

not sure I have ever actually been in one!, (I think I was once in an Aldi about 20 years ago but thats all I can recall) but I appreciate the heads up  it will be good to know for when I have REV up and about tho  

17 minutes ago, Dobloseven said:

That's brilliant!The 6 Cylinders really are lovely people. Thinking about the fuel pump, could a mechanical one be sourced from the Haflinger parts people? The door rollers, according to the manual, are made of Tufnol, which would, I suppose degrade in a similar way to wood. 

indeed! I am very much indebted to them for all the things they have done for me over the past couple years!

indeed as you say im sure a replacement mechanical pump could be relatively easily sourced, but I can see fitting it being a bit of a pain (certainly if I have to do it on my own)

I think an electric pump is much easier to bodge in there for someone like me  

[auntiemaryscanary]

5 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

Thanks   

Thats good to know  but the problem is I dont think theres any Lidls near me, I certainly cant ever recall seeing any in the area! (not within walking distance)

PM sent. The "middle of Lidl" stuff - tools, camping equipment, toys clothes, all sorts of non-food random shite are seasonal, in one week and when they are gone that's it for 3,6, 12 months depending on type. Car stuff & tools seem to be on a 3 month rotation.

When you get the Invacar running an occasional trip is advisable for their "stuff" or weekly for the cheap and healthy food. You'd save a fortune on your food shopping too.

[AdgeCutler]

Is the fuel pump easy or hard to get to? They are generally a simple affair,  just a diaphragm and two one way valves, it may just be some crap holding a valve open.  They give simple, reliable service and probably from new or rebuilt will outlast a cheap spark fuelled one.  Electric fuel pumps are a quick and simple work around to get you going again and wont be an irreversible alteration but (call me a rivet counter), for the sake of originality it would be nice to get the original unit operational again even after having run an emergency modern pump.  

[Six-cylinder]

Just now, AdgeCutler said:

Is the fuel pump easy or hard to get to? They are generally a simple affair,  just a diaphragm and two one way valves, it may just be some crap holding a valve open.  They give simple, reliable service and probably from new or rebuilt will outlast a cheap spark fuelled one.  Electric fuel pumps are a quick and simple work around to get you going again and wont be an irreversible alteration but (call me a rivet counter), for the sake of originality it would be nice to get the original unit operational again even after having run an emergency modern pump.  

 

[NorthernMonkey]

Pretty certain I’ve got an electric pump  I took off a Moggy a while back when I fitted a new one at the customers request.
Turned out it was an air leak on the fuel line from the tank so there was nothing wrong with the old one. I’ll have a look next week…if I can find it, I’ll happily stick it in the post to you 👍

[Six-cylinder]

I made a trip to London and could not find the London eye so settled for Invacar hunting!

The fuel pump made its failures know as there was a fuel filter with no petrol in it so that's where we started. Mrs6C sucked and blew down the pipe and then we started the engine on Easy start  and held the revs up but still no pumping action. Remounting the door was good. Small jobs such as changing the windscreen wiper and testing the washers work along with fitting hub caps were also achieved.

A Dragon Rapide passed over head and we believe it was the FORD Motor Company looking for ideas for single person personal transport!

Morris, Light Bulb funs cat told me all about the problem he is having getting food because of supply chain issues!

And yes what a wonderful Rover SD1 that belongs to a neighbour of LBF to keep us company while we worked.

 

[JJ0063]

Good work six-cylinder and co!

 

That SD1 is a beauty, looking at the MOT history it’s quite literally been driven to the closest MOT place and home again for the last few years!

[gm]

26 minutes ago, Six-cylinder said:

I don't know why you love these so much but you clearly do - good luck getting that first drive asap  

[Dick Cheeseburger]

Great to see steps forward LBF. Those 6Cs seem such decent sorts! 

Your cat is a beauty too. My fiancée was determined that our current tom was going to be a ginger, which he most definitely is. Black and grey cats are the ultimate though 😉

[Mally]

32 minutes ago, NorthernMonkey said:

Pretty certain I’ve got an electric pump  I took off a Moggy a while back when I fitted a new one at the customers request.
Turned out it was an air leak on the fuel line from the tank so there was nothing wrong with the old one. I’ll have a look next week…if I can find it, I’ll happily stick it in the post to you 👍

A moggy pump may be OK, but be aware that  If an electric pump is used that has too high a pressure it may force petrol past the float valve and cause carb flooding and overflow.

Sometimes a pressure regulator is needed. Fibreglass burns.

[3VOM]

If you do go electric pump, then in an ideal world you want a cut off for the power to "kick in" in the event of an accident. One method was getting a used Ford cut off from cars like fiestas IIRC.

[Mally]

I'd take the feed pipe off the pump, see if fuel runs out and stick it back on quick.

I'd then take the other pipe off, spin the engine see if it pumps fuel out.

If you take the centre screw out of the cap, there's likely to be a rubber gasket and a filter, which may need cleaning. Fuel may well run out whilst you do this though. 

Silly question, but there is fuel in the tank and the breather holes not blocked?

I won't tell you what mistake I made  today, I'll save it for my own topic.

[Dobloseven]

Looking at the photos of the pump, it seems to be a  Solex with 6 screws rather than the 5 of the Weber. There seem to be overhaul kits available and cleaning the filter under the cover is a routine service job. Would think repairing or replacing the "proper" pump would be easier and neater than fitting an electric one. Give all the nuts and screws a good soak in WD40 before you start. The fasteners are unlikely to be very tight. A 1/4" drive socket set should be adequate with the small size an advantage for access. Best of luck,I'm quite fascinated by this, and hope to see it one day, perhaps at the FoD. 

[High Jetter]

I think @Six-cylinder and @Mrs6C should be overwhelmingly thanked for their generosity of time, as well as knowledge. Let's get this party Invacar started!