What car for free* motoring?

[tom13]

K11. Prices will continue to rise and they are cheap and reliable to run and repair.

107, C1, Aygo. They are mega cheap to run and spares are cheap plus you will always get back what you pay.

MK4 escort, mk2/mk3 golf, E36s can be a good reliable appreciating classic but they need a bit of love to keep rust at bay.

Anything bigger or premium has the trouble of one big bill causing you to lose money on it.

[PrinceRupert]

1 hour ago, sierraman said:

It had to be a certain emissions level etc as well. Personally it’d be the initiative to find another employer if they wanted to dictate your life to that level. 

They only want to do so for the car they are paying for, though ... ?

[sierraman]

1 minute ago, PrinceRupert said:

They only want to do so for the car they are paying for, though ... ?

£200 though a month? As if that’s going to get you anything, you’d be spending another £200 to get near something worthwhile. 

[PrinceRupert]

4 minutes ago, sierraman said:

£200 though a month? As if that’s going to get you anything, you’d be spending another £200 to get near something worthwhile. 

Sorry, missed that - agreed would tell them to shove their car allowance.  I wonder if their logic is "you'd pay x if we didn't give you allowance for something non-premium, so here is 200 quid a month to upgrade your non-premium car to a premium car".

[LoftyvRS]

We manage the vehicle fleet for a major pharma company and they offer car allowance to folks as well. No age restrictions on the cars either.

One guy has a 19yr old Porsche 911. Fair play to him. 

[horriblemercedes]

Who decides what is and isn't premium though? Premium is a relative term

[Rust Collector]

2 minutes ago, horriblemercedes said:

Who decides what is and isn't premium though? Premium is a relative term

Presumably you can't drive base spec models like an L, only the premium spec versions like the GLS

[sierraman]

1 minute ago, PrinceRupert said:

Sorry, missed that - agreed would tell them to shove their car allowance.  I wonder if their logic is "you'd pay x if we didn't give you allowance for something non-premium, so here is 200 quid a month to upgrade your non-premium car to a premium car".

Indeed. People are daft though and think it’s a £200 a month pay rise when in reality it’s a £300 a month pay cut when you factor in the extra needed to buy a suitable new car and maintain it

[RoverFolkUs]

If you find a decent MK2 Focus you can easily be quids in. If you buy a rough one then you can easily spend the purchase price again on trying to improve it, so you have to tread carefully. 

Mine was already an excellent example when I bought it, and in just under 4 years the only things that "went wrong" were a broken spring, a wheel bearing and the instrument cluster needing re-soldered. Total cost of me of about £60? Alongside normal servicing + tyres, brakes etc which I do not consider as anything other than a cost of running the car in the same way as your yearly VED because they are wear and tear items that any car will need, so I don't count it towards the car itself. 

I paid just £750 for it. 

Fast forward to earlier this summer, it mysteriously* found itself in a puddle of water, and the long and short of it is that it needed a replacement engine. Looking around, if I wanted to replace it with an equally looked after, same spec GHIA example as mine is, I would be paying between £1500-2000 (!) 

It's current insured/suggested market value is £2200. I know that is not an actual agreed valuation but it is the figure that my insurance company calculated so I left it be. 

So I decided the sensible thing would be to spend what ended up being well in excess of £800 on everything to get it running as good as new. That includes the replacement engine which was not the car's fault, and I went all out doing as much sensible preventative maintenance along the way as seemed appropriate. It didn't have to cost £800, I just chose to spend that much.

At the end of it, I have an excellent example and despite it approaching 18 years old now, it drives very close to brand new and far better than many other cars multiple times its value!! 

If I sold it I think I would have no trouble asking £1500 for it, even close to £2000. It may take time for the right person to come along but £2k is still absolutely feck all in the grand scheme of things for a really well sorted car, and to me it's just perfect, even after all this time the thought hasn't crossed my mind about "upgrading" to something newer. It does nearly everything a newer car is capable of doing in such an aggressively cheap, low liability way 😂

They are very porridge cars, there's not much exciting about the way they drive or perform, but in my opinion they are genuinely comfortable and extremely reliable if you buy a good one. 

There are probably better suggestions above in terms of the diesel Mercs, however if you happen to need something ULEZ compliant, the petrol models are all Euro 4 so that box can be ticked as well. 

Another car which I was mightily impressed with was my Rover 45, paid £550, needed next to no repairs in 2 years, only a bit of welding, couple of tyres, and an alternator which I refurbed myself at a cost of £15. Sold it after 2 years of usage for £600. 

You can't ask for less depreciation than zero!?

I think the crux of the matter in terms of running costs is whether you have the means to maintain and repair it yourself. I think you can run many cars for next to free if you buy it cheap, look after it appropriately without the mindset of running it into the ground, and then sell it on as close to your purchase price as possible. If you have to pay out garage rates to maintain and fix it, it's a lot more difficult. 

Dont get me wrong though, there are many ungrateful bastard cars out there which will financially break you even if you don't have to pay out labour costs! Don't buy those ones!

[leakingstrut]

52 minutes ago, RoverFolkUs said:

MK2 Focus … the instrument cluster needing re-soldered.

Did you have to bash the top of the dash while trying to start it? Mine did that, also the cluster would randomly die while dying or just not work. I assumed it would be more than a £60 fix and scrapped it…. it was also rotten and free to be fair. It was a gift* from my dad when I’d found him a nice mk1 Volvo s40 and I’d figured out an upcoming work project would give me enough miles to claim to buy something nice**. 

*Saved him scrapping it, it had cost him £450  and lasted a couple years already
**£3200 worth of rough Freelander 2

 

[RoverFolkUs]

25 minutes ago, leakingstrut said:

Did you have to bash the top of the dash while trying to start it? Mine did that, also the cluster would randomly die while dying or just not work. I assumed it would be more than a £60 fix and scrapped it…. it was also rotten and free to be fair. It was a gift* from my dad when I’d found him a nice mk1 Volvo s40 and I’d figured out an upcoming work project would give me enough miles to claim to buy something nice**. 

*Saved him scrapping it, it had cost him £450  and lasted a couple years already
**£3200 worth of rough Freelander 2

 

Yes exactly those symptoms, it's a very common problem across the late 00's era of Ford. 

In fact the £60 was for the wheel bearing and spring, I resoldered the joints within the cluster myself at no cost, it took less than half an hour and it's something that anyone handy with a soldering iron can tackle really. That was almost 2 years ago and touch wood it's been spot on since then. 

To an untrained person it would come across as a pretty major fault, the main problem is that when the cluster sprung back into life when driving it would then be in "acceleration reduced" mode.. in the case of a diesel, it simply reduces acceleration as the wording suggests, but in my case being a petrol, it would act as if someone has dabbed the brakes for half a second or so when pulling away and changing from first to second, pretty dangerous. 

They can be repaired professionally for about £150 if need be, so it's really not too bad to fix 

[EyesWeldedShut]

7 hours ago, Shite Ron said:

Another good  choice is a Volvo 740 or 940 estate.

I'd second this - if they do throw a wobbly there's loads of room to work on 'em.
Not that economic though at 23 mpg.

For a proper daily driver I would recommend a BX - loved mine, never went wrong. Up to you if you want a N/A or turbo diesel but either would give a good mpg.
Maybe a bit of a hydraulic nightmare but there's plenty of internet help on them these days.

[jon.k]

7 hours ago, motorpunk said:

Give us some good examples of specific cars that would work well in this scenario, if you like 👍🏼

I've done this with a diesel 406 and tdi mk3 golf with success. Both had plenty of faults but they didn't actually stop the cars from driving or being reasonably safe, so I just ignored them. It was liberating on one level but a bit inconvenient at times.

[Saabnut]

Admit it, you all know what I am going to say!  

Bought about 15 years ago for £600 with no MOT, strong money back then but the shell was solid. Expenses have been a new roof (£1600), a few bushes and a rear calliper and now needs a tailpipe. Had a bit of welding a couple of years ago. Total costs about £300. Value today? £5-6k.

Today, Turbos make strong money but N/A cars don't so a useable car can be had for around £2k. Most will become MOT and Tax exempt over the next few years, so will continue the rise in values that they have at last started to receive.

[ETCHY]

K11 Micra. Providing it's not rusted out already, walking is more expensive than running one of these.

[Snake Charmer]

15 hours ago, Talbot said:

Indeed.  I may be 20hp down on your CDi, but it's still a laugh, especially if you're doing so while stinking of chips.

Mmm..... 

[TheIsleofShite]

Not quite what you had in mind I don’t think but I’d say Aygo/C1/107. I have had a 2013 Aygo for 3 years, put 25k miles on it and it’s probably worth the same now. Free tax, incredibly efficient, nothing really has gone wrong. I think it’s the cheapest car you can run realistically. 

[EyesWeldedShut]

15 hours ago, horriblemercedes said:

Who decides what is and isn't premium though? Premium is a relative term

Indeed - anything with a sale price of over £6K would be premium in this household. 

[Rustybullethole]

Loads of ways to look at this. £800 quid is still the top wack i've paid for a four wheeler. All have needed running repairs of course though have only paid out more than 200 quid once on parts when a maté rebuilt a gearbox and did clutch and wheel bearings at the same time. Some of that was labour of course which i had to force into his hand!

All the vans ive had have paid for themselves in jobs and running scrap within the first few months. My last transit was given to me, ran it for 5 years with a parts total of about a grand. It definitely didn't have a couple of grands worth of acquired for free cherry run through it in that time though it definitely did earn me a whole heap of money whilst being used as a camper/family transport too.

Apart from the aforementioned gearbox clutch episode which was wholly down to time and me nit having any i do my own repairs and dont count my time as largely i enjoy it. Its part of my own way and f beating the system and allows me to keep a van and a motorcycle for me and a car for the mrs in the road. 

The key for me is to know when to pull the plug and take it to the bridge. Have sold a few for profit, a few for a loss and scrapped many after running them into the ground a couple of which have weighed in over the purchase price. 

Berlingo cost 700 quid has had about 200 in bits and is just shy of 10 k in four or five months ish. Has been used as family transport though also has allowed me to work netting more than its total each week. 

[motorpunk]

Lots of love for the Aygo/C1/107 here. Junior had one and it was a needy little bastard, clutch went at v low miles, and it sprang a fuel leak which meant carpets out to clean, and then I saw floorpan rust and it just felt like a cheap, horrible little car. Maybe we just got a bad one, but it was a hoot to drive. 

K11 Micra, love 'em, and was expecting this as a suggestion. Rust, though, right? And 'normal' tax. 

Volvo 740.. this was my thinking all along, the earliest are now tax and MOT free and almost certainly classic insurance possible. Never owned one (had an 850 and a V70, though, which were both awesome). Yeah, crap fuel costs, but a better, bigger 'all round' car than the Aygo and C1. The, say, £500 a year you'd save on tax, MOT and insurance over the smaller, newer cars would get you about 2000 miles worth of petrol, which would sort of cover the additional thirst, right?

That leads me to this. I guess it's worth £150+ as scrap, so the net cost of the car is almost nothing, soon to be MOT and tax free, too; https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/145413563279?hash=item21db52e38f:g:Q9QAAOSwwpJlRmIA&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4OOSSiqNwgnbWnLCs5AWeeFs1Ddq70csJID1RlH8TFCk7Jqi1rAQwUBhoWfABSCnJ1%2FK3q9qHPjPG3rpO3Tc43i65JDembcjxoSH8PmI8jpX9RsXswWsXcghSSIz%2FCxPIIEex%2BfKbtCnANokHoxHU7JhiOV2lQ9%2FxvIn23%2BBvqcnYUIv2VlV%2Bvo00CpROEFGyv6PROFOa25CLlY%2B2LcNrMzRVEb%2FvrLRIygtsgETYdijwH7oKaA%2Fx0r9rZJ36wLj1M3h0CjLvPTkIdiWgvWn8Y24mjYXMEUISW2358FVkDtk|tkp%3ABk9SR8SKtbj2Yg

Volvo is a cool brand, no-one is making many new estate cars any more, and it's RWD and manual, which I think are all good ingredients for something that might appreciate in value eventually. 

Is this 'free motoring'?

[Rust Collector]

I was thinking about this as I was driving to work this morning and I think we need to extend the parameters of what makes the car 'free motoring'.

A city bug seems like a good idea on the face of it, but I think they can be ruled out by the fact that they don't have a huge cargo area or towing capacity.

I think that whatever the car is, it should really be an estate car (or a 4x4 if fuel economy isn't a factor) that comes in a 7 seat configuration and it should be equipped with a tow bar and a roof rack. The towing capacity should be at least 2 tonnes.

My reasoning is that if I owned a city bug, I would be forever having to rent or borrow larger vehicles to move furniture, tools, tow trailers, move extended family around when they visit. That would detract from the vehicle's 'freeness' in my opinion.

A big Volvo or Merc estate is probably the best car to go for with this in mind.

[320touring]

I've previously run a couple of cars as "minimum investment, maximum return" beaters for work.

 

Neither were what would be considered classic, but one is likely now in that space.

First up was a MK1 Octavia TDI.

£200 to buy it, £50 for new brakes. £50 in two services/fuel filters

Ran it for 6 months on 100% veg (40p/litre). Remapped it from 90bhp to 140bhp. Got 700 miles from a 55l tank, so about 3p/mile in fuel. 45p/Mile expenses. Paid for itself in 3 weeks, scrapped it for £150. Made approx £3k in mileage claims.

 

Next was an Alfa 156 2.0tspark.

£250 to buy, no repairs beyond a bulb or two, and a blown brake line (whilst drag racing)

Ran it for 6months I think. 32-35mpg on pump petrol. Still claimed the 45p/mile.

Got to MOT time, and raffled it off here for £2 a ticket. Made approx £1200 profit from mileage claims.

 

I'd argue the 156 Is into proto-classic territory now, and you'd likely get back what you paid for it when you came to sell it.

 

[EyesWeldedShut]

1 hour ago, motorpunk said:

Lots of love for the Aygo/C1/107 here. Junior had one and it was a needy little bastard, clutch went at v low miles, and it sprang a fuel leak which meant carpets out to clean, and then I saw floorpan rust and it just felt like a cheap, horrible little car. Maybe we just got a bad one, but it was a hoot to drive. 

K11 Micra, love 'em, and was expecting this as a suggestion. Rust, though, right? And 'normal' tax. 

Volvo 740.. this was my thinking all along, the earliest are now tax and MOT free and almost certainly classic insurance possible. Never owned one (had an 850 and a V70, though, which were both awesome). Yeah, crap fuel costs, but a better, bigger 'all round' car than the Aygo and C1. The, say, £500 a year you'd save on tax, MOT and insurance over the smaller, newer cars would get you about 2000 miles worth of petrol, which would sort of cover the additional thirst, right?

That leads me to this. I guess it's worth £150+ as scrap, so the net cost of the car is almost nothing, soon to be MOT and tax free, too; https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/145413563279?hash=item21db52e38f:g:Q9QAAOSwwpJlRmIA&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4OOSSiqNwgnbWnLCs5AWeeFs1Ddq70csJID1RlH8TFCk7Jqi1rAQwUBhoWfABSCnJ1%2FK3q9qHPjPG3rpO3Tc43i65JDembcjxoSH8PmI8jpX9RsXswWsXcghSSIz%2FCxPIIEex%2BfKbtCnANokHoxHU7JhiOV2lQ9%2FxvIn23%2BBvqcnYUIv2VlV%2Bvo00CpROEFGyv6PROFOa25CLlY%2B2LcNrMzRVEb%2FvrLRIygtsgETYdijwH7oKaA%2Fx0r9rZJ36wLj1M3h0CjLvPTkIdiWgvWn8Y24mjYXMEUISW2358FVkDtk|tkp%3ABk9SR8SKtbj2Yg

Volvo is a cool brand, no-one is making many new estate cars any more, and it's RWD and manual, which I think are all good ingredients for something that might appreciate in value eventually. 

Is this 'free motoring'?

Without physically kicking the tyres I'd not like to say 'free' or not for that particular one but I like your way of thinking. If you can find a decent 'everyday' one that is circa-40 years old then, yes, almost free.
I ended up with a 1997 940 as I could not find anything (at the time) that was nearing 40 which was not knackered. If this one lasts then it'll hit 40 years 5 years before I hit 70 so I could be quids in. Of course, either of us could FTP permanently at some point before then 💀
I'd not factor in any final resale or scrap value though. Only car we've had that's appreciated in value is a 2008 Bini which is (apparently) worth double what we paid for it in 2019 but I think that's bollocks and maybe a bit of post-COVID price weirdness.

[garethj]

I’ve had a Volvo 740 estate, mine was 2.3 litre manual with overdrive and it had about 170,000 miles.  At the same time we had a Volvo S80 with 100,000 miles and the 740 felt much more solid, like another 170k wouldn’t trouble it.

On a long run it would crack 35mpg because the overdrive and torque meant it wasn’t working hard once it was up to speed.

As with many of these suggestions, finding a good one is a significant problem.  Can you seek out a non-rusty Micra?  They do exist, but it might take you 3 months to find one in the colour, engine size and mileage you want, within a hundred miles of your house.

In a similar vein to the Scimitar, a Ginetta G26 gives you most of the benefits of plastic body, cheap-ish components and a bit different, with the benefits of a galvanised chassis.  And pop-up headlamps, which is automatically a win👍

 

We just need to be realistic that a Cortina engine is never going to be as reliable as a Focus and that some of your time will be spent undoing the work of previous owners or the clueless twat who built it.

[sierraman]

Cheap end Kit cars usually fell into the category of being between slapdash and downright lash ups. The average Cortina based kit car was bodged to fuck in some council lock up, painted with a roller and a medley of fucked components. Unlike fine wine, they will not have improved with age. 

[garethj]

1 hour ago, sierraman said:

Cheap end Kit cars usually fell into the category of being between slapdash and downright lash ups. The average Cortina based kit car was bodged to fuck in some council lock up, painted with a roller and a medley of fucked components. Unlike fine wine, they will not have improved with age. 

But when you strip them down, you’ll have a nice stock of self tappers and twin & earth cable for the shed.

The flip side is that they’re normally easy to work on, and as I said, it’s as much about finding one in the condition you want.  That’s true for a Volvo, Merc, Focus or kit car.  There are gems and dogs out there.

Besides, this is for a hypothetical chat, not a genuine piece of consumer advice, where the answer for most people (not us, I mean normal people) is “Don’t bother”

EDIT: just reading back what Sierraman wrote and that could apply to 75% of second hand BMW coupes, so I don’t think it’s just kit cars😀

Edited November 9, 2023 by garethj

[dozeydustman]

On 08/11/2023 at 12:23, Rocket88 said:

One of these….

 

On 08/11/2023 at 12:24, motorpunk said:

MOT and tax free, classic insurance, plaggy body, reliable old engine, plenty of space and relatively cheap to buy. Good call!!!

Yes. But check the A and B Pillars where the steel is bonded into the GRP. It’s difficult but not impossible to repair. Later cologne engined ones should have most of the chassis etc galvanised but whether this extended to the body strengthening areas I can’t remember.

Mechanical bits are pretty good to get hold of and in fine fettle these are good dailies, particularly overdrive ones.

[Volksy]

The Mercedes 2004 C180k I just sold to Mr Earrings on here had been the cheapest to run  and most reliable car I've pretty much ever had. 

Only needed service items throughout my three year tenure. Pads, tyres etc. 

Never FTPd and even gave pretty good MPG's. 

Parts cheap when required, and most things DIYable. They are pretty much at rock bottom price wise, and if you get a good one - of which there seems to be a lot of low owner, low miles ones around. I guess they appealed to a demographic that did buy them privately. 

Of course I sold it, replacing it with a two tonne behemoth in a somewhat questionable state of repair. 

 

 

[grizz]

Not read through all the replies responses etc..

Loving the red SAAB.

They are one of my favourite shapes. 

 

Quoted from a 4 year old thread. 

I have been offered a 2001 2.3 Auto, with towbar and 102k miles on the clock for £750.00 by a grandad who has bought a smaller car.

MOT History seems decent on it REGISTRATION: N999RAM

 

I look at cars as working tools, because they essentially are a continual running expense, depreciating mostly up to a point, some recover and increase in value.

So I buy for function, mostly, not form.

 

I ended up buying it for £600.00

Drove it for a year (I also had a company car so only used it  to do work) and despite a thirsty 2.3 petrol auto making people step away from buying it, it towed very well.

In 3000 miles, I calculated it either made or saved me around £6000.00 

Sold to a nice Nigerian to break and export for £750.00 a year later when I bought the S10 truck.

At the time, banger racers lowballed me around £300.00 as they want the engines, and would sell the rest for £300.00 so free engine.

 

Anyway, I always try to look at the money cars either make or save me buy fulfilling a specific purpose.

 

[sdkrc]

Classic insurance

70mpg

Cheap parts / simple mechanically  (except the rear axle)

Scotland ULEZ exempt