1925 Trojan

[plasticvandan]

A rare thread from me, inspired by the super sentinel thread and now being on furlough for three months I thought I would start a thread on what I'm doing,though progress had been rapid so far so no doubt other projects will get done too! 

A bit if background,after years of wanting a vintage car,to complement his vintage bikes,my dad bought this 1925 Trojan Utility car in late 2018. A well known car with a trials history dating back to the late 1920s,heres a pic of it now and in 1929:

Anyway the engine had supposedly had some work done on it before he got it and my dad drove it about three times before it cut out and had to be pushed back in the garage.on trying to start it (hand lever pull start) it got tighter and tighter until it locked up solid. Eventually he craned the engine out,a bizzare four piston but two Conrod 1488cc two stroke,and eventually managed to pull the crank out with pistons,it has a blind head as the block is all one piece,so no tappy action to be had at the piston end. Doing that in January combined with arthritis and a lack of enthusiasm,and the death of my grandad in June 2019,the engine has laid in bits strewn about the car ever since.Following my moving down to Dorset to live with him after my marriage breakup,I've long been meaning to get into it and sort it out once and for all,and now being off from Wednesday for three months,it was the perfect time. More to follow

[New POD]

Perfect for an EV conversion ? 

[barrett]

That's one of the Potters' old cars. I suspect the engine in it now isn't the one that they were using for trials etc but a 'spare' that was lying around. Fortunately, only seven moving parts so they're always rebuildable.

If you get overwhelmed by the eccentricites of the motor - it really is unlike anything else - then I can put you in touch with my friend Jim, who probably knows more about the inner workings of a Trojan than anyone else, having run them as daily drivers from the 1960s until relatively recently. Here I am enjoying not having to drive our Trojan in Wales a few years ago - much better on solids!

 

[plasticvandan]

Great to hear from you barrety,any info you might have squirrelled away greatly relieved,we do have a large file of info on it,it did come with a spate motor in bits,we have been wondering wether this was indeed a different engine.

[Tamworthbay]

There is a road in Tamworth named after the Trojan cars, on an estate all named after British car makers.

[Uncle Jimmy]

Bloody fantastic. Love the shank of hemp rope slung about the front.

Do they have any form of suspension at all?

[Tigerfox]

Lovely car

Well you wont get nicked for speeding anyway,  anything over 30 is i recall is unusual.

I take it has chain drive to the nsr wheel ?

[vulgalour]

Fabulous.  Very keen to read and learn more about this car, I've had an interest in Trojans for a while (and know next to nothing about them) and always enjoy your threads.

[Asimo]

 

[New POD]

Wow. 2 pistons per con rod. 

[somewhatfoolish]

Yep, a few ended up in production, Triumph of Germany did quite a few of this type of two stroke in motorcycles.

[FakeConcern]

I have just finished reading a book (well three in one re issue) by AN Wilson, called The Lampitt Papers and one of the characters drives a Trojan, it is refered to as "that contraption".

It's very interesting to see pictures of a real one!

[plasticvandan]

More pics to come this evening,been a busy day

[plasticvandan]

First thing to try and work out was why it locked up,cold and just on the starter.the pistons were still tight in the bore when the cover that goes over the crank was removed,and the white metal bearings all looked good.On removing the crank my dad found s fair amount of carbon build up on the ring grooves,which he cleaned out before the work stalled.I decided that the problem must be with the rings.Now,I can't find any reference material giving ring gaps,the manual simply says if you have any piston problems to send the engine to your dealer or the factory....

I found a calculator online that suggests ring gaps should be 0.04 X bore size, this has a 2.5" bore which gives a 0.10 gap. On removing the rings and trying them in their respective bores,which my dad had honed beforehand,I found the problem.Nearly every ring had no gap whatsoever! No wonder it locked and ran fairly poorly beforehand. Armed with that knowledge I filed all the rings down and got them all pretty close to ten thou. 

After cleaning the crank went back in

Added some lubricant and success,it spins over nicely.madevs new gasket from greaseproof paper (can't be any thicker than 0.05" according to the manual)  and added wellseal

Assembled back together and tightened down and it still spins over,so hasn't tightened up which is good news.

Today's job was two coats of enamel

Then made new gaskets for the manifold and side flame traps,painted manifold and refit oil lines

Got the mahoosive flywheel extracted from the 2 speed band gearbox and found my first problem,the self aligning bearing had broken,so now got to find one before I can refit the flywheel to the engine.ince that's done it can be craned back into the car.

 

 

[LightBulbFun]

5 hours ago, plasticvandan said:

A rare thread from me, inspired by the super sentinel thread and now being on furlough for three months I thought I would start a thread on what I'm doing,though progress had been rapid so far so no doubt other projects will get done too! 

A bit if background,after years of wanting a vintage car,to complement his vintage bikes,my dad bought this 1925 Trojan Utility car in late 2018. A well known car with a trials history dating back to the late 1920s,heres a pic of it now and in 1929:

Anyway the engine had supposedly had some work done on it before he got it and my dad drove it about three times before it cut out and had to be pushed back in the garage.on trying to start it (hand lever pull start) it got tighter and tighter until it locked up solid. Eventually he craned the engine out,a bizzare four piston but two Conrod 1488cc two stroke,and eventually managed to pull the crank out with pistons,it has a blind head as the block is all one piece,so no tappy action to be had at the piston end. Doing that in January combined with arthritis and a lack of enthusiasm,and the death of my grandad in June 2019,the engine has laid in bits strewn about the car ever since.Following my moving down to Dorset to live with him after my marriage breakup,I've long been meaning to get into it and sort it out once and for all,and now being off from Wednesday for three months,it was the perfect time. More to follow

 for some reason this was giving me a big case of deja view!  like iv seen it before! quick bit of searching shows it to be the car you posted about back in Late 2018  

very happy to see it crop up again   I look forward to seeing how it progresses! I always love these sort of threads

[Asimo]

Marvellous.  I've wanted a proper look inside one of these engines since reading about them in Dad's "Newton & Steeds"  (1930s edition)

Are the pistons iron?

[martc]

2 hours ago, somewhatfoolish said:

Yep, a few ended up in production, Triumph of Germany did quite a few of this type of two stroke in motorcycles.

The Puch Split Twin is the one I'm familiar with having read an article on one years ago - the summary?  11/10.

 

[Skut]

Fascinating vehicles. Doesn't one branch of the Conrod have to bend slightly in use or am I misremembering that. 

[LightBulbFun]

9 minutes ago, Skut said:

Fascinating vehicles. Doesn't one branch of the Conrod have to bend slightly in use or am I misremembering that. 

I seem to recall reading that too somewhere as well, but im not sure where!

[plasticvandan]

Update time!

A new flywheel bearing was needed,an imperial (obvs) self aligning bearing,which put a hold on things over the weekend,dad had found one last week and it arrived Monday and was dropped in after heating the flywheel

Then attached and a new gasket made for the water jacket cover

Tuesday was heavy lifting day!

And the rest of the day spent bolting in and reassembling the hand starter

All working,Wednesday was getting the ignition working again,carb and exhaust attached and:

[plasticvandan]

Carb needs a strip and clean,needed doing before,it floods trying to start then does t get enough fuel to keep running.but I wanted to leave it till I had checked my engine work was ok and that it would actually run before messing with it,overall I'm really pleased,exactly one week from a dismantled engine in various places under the car and tubs of bolts to back in and alive,oh,and this is what my arm now looks like after a day of pulling the starter,this is why people weren't fat in the 1920s!

 

[sierraman]

On 4/2/2020 at 1:33 PM, New POD said:

Perfect for an EV conversion ? 

And while you are at it build a Barrett Estate on Stonehenge. ?

[New POD]

Permisson 

[Angrydicky]

Superb! Love these old boneshakers. 

Ive got a cracking brass model of a Trojan in my cabinet, I’ll have to stick a picture up of it.

[vulgalour]

That is a very strange engine.

[plasticvandan]

44 minutes ago, Angrydicky said:

Superb! Love these old boneshakers. 

Ive got a cracking brass model of a Trojan in my cabinet, I’ll have to stick a picture up of it.

Would love to see that,I've been trying to find one and haven't found one yet

[brownnova]

Possibly my new favourite thread on AS!! What a car!!!

I always remember as a youth finding the one in Gaydon fascinating as it was different to the other cars of the time, particularly its solid wheels. 

[motorpunk]

Great thread. I’m learning lots here. Thanks!

[Skut]

It sounds 'sportier' than I'd imagined

[junkyarddog]

An amazing personal conveyance sir!