Peugeot 306. Open surgery

[D Spares & Tyres]

My family heirloom 273,000 mile Peugeot 306 passed its MoT on Friday.

 

One small advisory. I keep on top of my cars and have reasonable mechanical knowledge so MoT tests hold no fear for me and neither are they needed to satisfy myself that my cars are safe.

 

I have heard stories about 306s hiding rot around the rear seatbelt mount so thought I would take the trim off and have a look....

 

Ah.

 

After a gentle prod with a screwdriver it looked liked this

 

The seatbelt is barely attached. We imported an expensive child seat from Sweden as their standards are higher than ours but for the good it would do in an accident with this car I may as well have used bungy cords.

 

Oh and the shock absorber than should have failed due to weeping fluid was disguised with spraying wax underneath. It still works as it should for now but weeping fluid is a failure. Non shock absorbing qualities however are not a failure as they are no longer allowed to test them....

 

CHILD AND 306 / ZX OWNERS BEWARE!

 

So it looks like I shall be welding in a heat wave today.....

[Jazoli]

Welding?

 

I'd be scrapping that asap, what price safety?

[Tickman]

Fuck! That's bad.

[bunglebus]

Why do you say shock absorbers can't be tested? They use shaker plates at a lot of places which look at shock function.

[Cavcraft]

That's exactly what happened to my old 306. The seatbelt didn't retract and (after all the other repairs had been done) they discovered the same problem, but on smuch worse scale. I don't often get attached to cars, but it was a sad day when the metal yard collected it.

[trigger]

That's horrific and it's a bit chilling to think what could have happened in a accident, sorry but i agree with Jazoli, i'd be running that down to the bridge as a punishment to what could have happened, It's really not worth the risk.

[D Spares & Tyres]

Welding?

 

I'd be scrapping that asap, what price safety?

What price half a days MIG welding and some thick steel?

 

Around £50 is your answer

[D Spares & Tyres]

That's horrific and it's a bit chilling to think what could have happened in a accident, sorry but i agree with Jazoli, i'd be running that down to the bridge as a punishment to what could have happened, It's really not worth the risk.

If that happened every time a car had rot in a dangerous area there would probably be around 50 pre 1980 cars left in Britain....

 

What risk would you place on it after I have finished welding it? The rest if the car is sound. Not sure why people fear welding, beats putting a DMF on it

 

[Jazoli]

What price half a days MIG welding and some thick steel?

 

Around £50 is your answer

 

Nope don't agree at all, all cars come to the end of their life, your 306 has, it it was some rare classic then yes fix it, but its not, what other horrors is it hiding? I would not be putting my kids in that again ever.

[D Spares & Tyres]

The rest of the car is sound, this is a known 306 rust trap....

 

Why will it not be safe after that???? Have I inadvertantly signed into a Daily Mail forum??

 

My Renault 16 was quite rusty. I have replaced both sills. 3 floorpans, a B post and lots more. Should I have just weighed it in? It was unsafe before the welding so I assume it must now be unsafe??

 

Rant over... ☺

[Captain Furious]

Jesus, that is bad...probably the most worrying thing is that you couldn't reasonably expect it to be discovered on an MOT either.  I guess nothing is infallible but it makes you wonder what horrors old cars can be hiding that we're blissfully unaware of.

 

No reason why someone competent with the sparkly stick can't make it safe again though.

[trigger]

With fear of sounding all mumsnet I still wouldn't risk it, It's not like it's a small hole and it's only a old 306's at the end of the day. Since having children I've got very matter of fact about these things, if my child got hurt because of something like that, i wouldn't ever forgive myself or hear the end of it.

 

My mate was driving his daughter about in a old Cortina which was held together with underseal, the inner sill and much of the floor was missing and full of fiberglass and underseal to hide it (I still don't know how it kept passing the mot), he didn't seem bothered, but the car would have folded up in a side impact.

[D Spares & Tyres]

Why do you say shock absorbers can't be tested? They use shaker plates at a lot of places which look at shock function.

They aren't allowed to 'bounce' the car anymore. Not many places round here have shakers. The shocker will get done this week, I just didn't have time before the test

[The Moog]

What causes it to rot there? Is it a drain blocked or something? 

[Supernaut]

What causes it to rot there? Is it a drain blocked or something?

306 pedant mode activated!

 

The later models of 306 (I think phase 3, but perhaps phase 2 as well) have arch liners in all 4 wheel arches.

For some weird reason, the earlier ones have arch liners in 3 of the arches, but not the left rear. Hence they collect mud in the left rear arch and rot out.

[BorniteIdentity]

They aren't allowed to 'bounce' the car anymore. Not many places round here have shakers. The shocker will get done this week, I just didn't have time before the test

Am I right saying that in Northern Ireland they have shakers as part of the test? I remember watching my friend's Renault having its dentures violently shaken during a test about 10 years ago.

 

I'm not sure about the whole welding thing, and in fact asked this very question in the stupid question thread earlier in the year - is a car weaker/stronger after welding. The conclusion is it couldn't possibly be safer, at which point I'd be sacking it off.

[D Spares & Tyres]

Fuxxake people its just metal

 

It used to be bean tins and washing machines which were melted and made into sheet metal.

 

These pieces of sheet metal were then formed into shapes and WELDED together.

[BorniteIdentity]

Fuxxake people its just metal

 

It used to be bean tins and washing machines which were melted and made into sheet metal.

 

These pieces of sheet metal were then formed into shapes and WELDED together.

 

 

Discussion Forum:  is a general term for any online "bulletin board" where you can leave and expect to see responses to messages you have left.

[Liggle]

We imported an expensive child seat from Sweden as their standards are higher than ours but for the good it would do in an accident with this car I may as well have used bungy cords.

Talk about a contradiction! An old 306 is already unsafe by modern standards, nevermind a rotten one like that. Look at the size and shape of that hole! I can't believe you don't see the issue! 

 

Stop being a tight arse and buy something safe to ferry your kids around in, jeeeeez 

[beko1987]

I'm in the weld it up camp, especially knowing the standard of your welding. Maybe check the other side too. Or put the child seat in the front.

[Sigmund Fraud]

If a repair panel is liberated from a scrapper or made in the correct steel gauge and then seam welded, I honestly can't see how that pillar will be significantly less strong than a factory-fresh 306.

 

Agreed that a brand-new 5-series would be safer in a crash than a 306, but hundreds of thousands of kids have been driven around in 306s since the early 1990s and I suspect that most of them are still alive.

[sierraman]

I'd fuck it off. The MOT man wasn't wrong, he can't disassemble to check for rust.

 

Once you are into welding fist sized holes in the body it's time to sack it off, if you've had your money's worth get shut. You don't want to be having your kids riding about in something that's rotten as fuck like that.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Hmmm.......

 

One one hand, in a collision you don't have the full weight of an adult pulling at the mount, just that of a child.

 

On the other hand, rebuilding that area to correct strength (notice the indentations and shape) won't be easy. The ONLY way to repair that is to replace the entire panel - would probably be easier than starting with a bit of sheet steel. Either new or cut from another car, cleaned up and welded in.

 

 Remember also that this panel is shaped and designed to crumple in a hard rear end collision.

 

SUM UP: Repair it properly with a replacement panel or weigh the fucker in. Or don't carry rear passengers.

[theshadow]

ive welded worse get it done,transits,moggy minors with no inner wings,floor pans,sills,crossmembers,106,205,etc etc.ive even done one of these,half boot floor missing,customer still has it 4years on,still passing mots fine,leaking shocks will just get advisory now,or as some do fail a shock,than do sod all.....

[sierraman]

You can't live like that, not carrying passengers in the back cause the seatbelt isn't mounted to anything. Even a child in it that say weighs 20kg, plus the seat, if you hit something at 30mph it would pull that clean out of the bodywork.

[Dave_Q]

Pics of finished repair pls, only then can I decide whether you are facing mumsnet doom or not.

[stephen01]

We're talking like we dont drive around in cars that have probably had worse welding than this done over the years, at least he's doing the work and not just covering it up!

 

Wasn't there a 10 year old x type that was complety fucked and welded back up, to a very impressive standard if i remember, whats the difference here? a perceived safety issue.

 

and as for this safety talk, get a grip, by modern standards a 306 is crap compared to a new 208 for instance, not everyone can afford to splash 2-300 a month on a new car. I've driven my kids around in a 67 herald with no rear seat belts, I must be the worst parent on earth!

[Dave_Q]

The best way to settle this would be to send the car for a Euro NCAP crash test once the repair is done.

[Sigmund Fraud]

I've driven my kids around in a 67 herald with no rear seat belts, I must be the worst parent on earth!

 

You should see what kinds of cars my parents drove their kids around in - and I suspect the same applies to many others !

[DSdriver]

Hmmm is it about time they used xray or radar sensing on known rust traps in the MOT? The technology seems to be there nowadays what with airport scanners/dentists and stuff.