Truck Shite

[Cavcraft]

A few of the lads that come into work have Dafs. They seem to cover the miles ok and are petty cheap (so they said) but the autoboxes are hopeless with liquid loads.

[cms206]

The ZF AS-Tronic as fitted to the DAF/MAN/Iveco and others is absolutely fucking useless. We've a MAN 440-mill in our Neoplan Tourliner mated to that 12 speed sneezymatic 'box and it is referred to as "The Mistake".

 

Our 365bhp DAF/ZF 6 speeds all do 12mpg. The Neoplan does 6.5 if it's on the cruise control on a flat motorway for 4.5hrs at a time. Parts prices are pantshittingly expensive. The gearbox is absolutely fucking useless and it has a superb* stabilty program I found out about on Sunday afternoon when I launched it into a corner at 50-odd mph and it decided I was out of my depth and threw on full service brakes. The weight shift put me on the wrong side of the road and nearly into a ditch.

 

Scania make shit buses but the lorries are good. I'd go Scania.

 

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[Eddie Honda]

I'd go Volvo, but it's only so I can slag off fannies in their Scannies (usually with all their tat accessories)

 

I did feel a little bit sorry for the Muller Wiseman bloke on the M74 trying to get up a modest incline in his fleet-shit spec DAF though. They are wank.

[Eddie Honda]

a superb* stabilty program

I hate those driver "aids". If I want to fling an empty trailer round a bend, be it on my head Mr Trailer, don't go dicking around with the brakes whilst I'm trying to drive the thing.

[gordonbennet]

Arsetronic ruins any and every lorry its fitted to, so rule out Daf MAN and Iveco, unless you can talk the gaffer into a proper gearbox...the only saving grace is that they are pretty well the best for reliability.

 

Volvo's autobox is the most reliable, and best to use, of them all, which is just as well cos Volvo's and Scania's manual boxes have always been second rate compared with Eaton Fullers and such, synchromesh has no place in a lorry box it just baulks all the time making the piss easy job of lorry gearchanging bloody into hard work for no benefit whatsoever.

Our Scania auto boxes have not been reliable but they are better than before, helped in later versions by the exhauster slowing the engine quickly between upshifts for faster changes, aslo by the time our Scanias have done 5 years with us at full weight the engines are using oil, make of that what you will.

 

If it were my choice i'd have a Hino, and no i aint joking either, the shiters choice of lorry.

[cort1977]

One of my colleagues made a rather crude joke the other day that the recent terrorist attacks in Berlin and Nice were copycats of Harry Clarke the Glasgow bin-lorry driver. However he does have a point - a lorry can be just as dangerous whether your foot is on the floor intentionally or through passing out. Would these new safety aids such as active braking systems have prevented or mitigated against these disasters? I don't know if they've hit production yet but all the major manufacturers have promoted them.

 

 

I understand that the active braking did mitigate the casualties in the Berlin attack: http://www.autoblog.com/2016/12/28/automatic-brakes-berlin-christmas-truck-attack/

[DodgeRover]

If it were my choice i'd have a Hino, and no i aint joking either, the shiters choice of lorry.

Can you actually buy a Hino over here? They're popular in Aus and NZ for basic durability

[Noel Tidybeard]

Can you actually buy a Hino over here? They're popular in Aus and NZ for basic durability

 

sort of in Irelandland

http://www.hino.ie/ContentBuilder/DisplayPage.aspx?PageType=PUB&DataId=DA000009&Rnd=1651473744

[Jim Bell]

Before Planet Express delivered.

 

[wuvvum]

There's plenty of Hino tippers round these parts.  Don't think I've ever seen a Hino artic though.

 

If I were in the market for a big truck I'd be looking at importing one of those Isuzu Gigamaxes with the 30-litre NA V10.  Don't know how hard it is to do IVA for an HGV though?

[rml2345]

I imagine bloody hard but it would absolutley be worth it just for bragging rights.

"16 litre eh? I used to have a small engine too."

[scruff]

According to lads on Trucknet a new Iveco 460 can b had for 3yr lease at £299 mth, no deposit. No brainer !

 

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Good deal granted, would prefer outright purchase though for a number of reasons. The firm who look after our wagon run some on their fleet and the general opinion is they are nothing special but a good workhorse.

[willswitchengage]

A small number of Hino artics did make it over here, but were only available in 4x2/6x4 AFAIK which obviously limits their appeal. After I think it was Euro III or IV they couldn't support the emission standard so could no longer market heavy trucks in Europe, but saying that I've never heard of any LHD versions on the continent. I'm surprised that the other Japanese truckmakers never had a heavy offering over here, but then again their characteristics of huge NA engines, ruggedness, manual gearboxes (with fewer gears) and no-frills cabs did seem quite at ends with the 'luxury' trucks that focus on efficiency and refinement that the Germans make. But then again there isn't really an export market anymore for super efficient trucks, so only we tend to really buy them now.

 

[mercrocker]

Liking the cheeky Seddon badge!

[wuvvum]

And the upside down Mk3 Astra in the back.

[Supernaut]

There's plenty of Hino tippers round these parts.  Don't think I've ever seen a Hino artic though.

 

If I were in the market for a big truck I'd be looking at importing one of those Isuzu Gigamaxes with the 30-litre NA V10.  Don't know how hard it is to do IVA for an HGV though?

I didn't believe you, so I googled it. The Isuzu 10TD1 engine is indeed a 30.39 litre V10 turbo diesel.

[Felly Magic]

Blimey 30 litres?????? Enough torque to pull a mountain I'll bet. I remember reading an article about a Hino op that towed a small tanker trailer in the Lakes, bought because it was knife and fork engineering and they could no longer buy a Foden

[gordonbennet]

Seeing what's happening to VW and now possibly Fiat, it appears Cummins and latterly Hino might have done the right thing not bothering to fuck their engines up trying to meet ever more stupid EU regs, if some bright spark at a testing facility decided to investigate modern lorry engines as well as cars i wonder what they might find.

 

Hino are well regarded in tipper/mixer world for making tough simple motors, and sold quite a fair number of euro 4 8 wheeler chassis, quite why the old school operators who ran Brit artics wouldn't give them a decent trial during that period i''ve never understood, every bugger seems to be on new with 5 year leases now, but with full R&M cos eff me there's some bloody crap to go wrong now, from the truckers forum bloke with an out of warranty MAN needed a new exhaust, that'll be £11,000 sir, which he managed to get down to a bargain* £8,000, thats just taking the piss.

[twosmoke300]

Sounds like some of the parts prices of the agri stuff !

[rml2345]

Was weight not against Hino in the end? I know they got quite a few sales after Paccar dumped the Foden marque but it seemed to dwindle after which was a shame really as they're tough old things. I think most British bulk operators miss the days of UK designed trucks as they had a knack for making strong but light 8 wheel chassis with a genuine 20 tonne payload without skimping on equipment. 

[gordonbennet]

Happy to be put right but i've always understood Hinos to be at the lighter end of tare weights yet strong enough to stand the work, helped no end IMHO by that Toyota Industrial ethos of if it aint broke don't fix it.

 

Happened to walk past a working 8 wheeler Hino 2007 grab loader at Northampton last year (whilst my MAN was being fixed, again), engine on fast idle sounded sweet as a nut and as close in sound to a 14 litre Cummins as i've heard in many a year.

[Jim Bell]

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[Jim Bell]

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[CreepingJesus]

****warning modernz content****

 

Do any of the truckers among us drive a Volvo??

 

I am shopping for a newer unit at the mo and pretty convinced by an FH... cracking prep+warranty package on offer on the 'approved' used stock and even shopping at what is admittedly the lower price end of what they deal with, the Volvo salesmen seem the most sound. Went to look at a 13 plate yesterday and it was a bit rough TBH, had tipping gear and obviously been used for some hauling some pretty corrosive stuff. The cab was also covered in dents, though fair play, it was mintola inside. The FH seems like a damn nice place to spend the working day, am I wrong? Hope not, my arse is gonna be the one in the seat.

 

Some other observations - the Daf auto really is as bumshat as you have all led me to believe, a shame as I quite like the XF, pretty workmanlike and our garage run em so theres always spares on the shelf. There's a few manuals still about but the boss wants an auto for the 1 day a year he might drive it which is fair enough, he writes the cheque after all.

 

MANs are well cheap, put off by horror stories of the 440 engine tho, and the 480s seem to be mythical beasts which when they appear for sale are either absolutely banjaxed or have over a million clicks, which is a bit much. Shame you can't buy one with a Cummins!!! 

 

Surprised how cheap Mercs felt considering how much they hold their value

 

Scania just didn't do anything for me... salesmen seemed keen to flog me a big fuck off V8 for £60k+ but not much else. Ovlov dealers are closer anyway.

 

The hunt continues, though I am flat out with exhibition work in the old Daf for at least the next month so no rush.

 

The older FH (not the one with the glass roof and the electronic park brake) is a sound choice for small operators/ODs/farmers etc, because they're very well built, and tend to last. 460bhp is as much shove as you'll need, and anything under 750thou has got years left in it. Ergonomically sound, once you get the seat - wheel relationship right. Which takes forever.

Wouldn't be my choice though (and I'll probably get ejected from the SVM for saying that): that pusher axle in the 6x2 chassis makes it handle like shit. 99% of them are iShift, which flatters to deceive too: how a system built by a Swedish company couldn't cope with hooking up in snow, was beyond me. Then there's the sloping lockers over the windscreen too: I'm no giant, and I brained myself on them more than once.

To be fair, the Renault Premium is basically an FH with a Renault cab on, so worth looking at I reckon. The high mileage ones I've had have been surprisingly good.

 

Daf would probably get my coin (if I'd any to spend) but not with ArseTronic. ZF EcoSplit for me thankyou very much: although there's a 6 over 6 synchro available for those too. The 460 is plenty enough for the tough stuff, and it'll do 10mpg if you're being really feather footed. Sounds quite nice too, I think. Comfy cab, good visibility, cracking bunk (if it's got the Lux mattress, and most XFs have), handles well, loads of small independent garages franchised to them yet, which is nice. Rumours of 550/600bhp versions on the way too!

Although, the very latest ones with the Eco Mode ArseTronic are the work of the devil: the kickdown's vanished, as has the exhaust brake button, and manual mode reverts to auto in about 30 seconds. Oh and the ignition key thing, where if you've cut the engine - say when you roll up at the gatehouse, and Auld Jimmy's hearing aid is playing up - you can't then just restart it. You have to go all the way off, pause, all the way back on, let it do its' checks, then start the engine. Fuck that. I reckon it's a software thing, so I'd be having a word at the garage if it were mine.

 

MANs...jebus cripes, where do I start? In their defence, if you can get a good 480 (the old 13L engine), it'll probably run forever. Provided you're handy with electrics/electronics and don't mind the interior being held together with self-tappers, cable ties and gaffa tape. Oh and most of the exterior plastics too. And hoping the ministry aren't about when you fire it up from cold. And you've got a very big drum of oil handy.

The XLX and XXL cabs are immense, and a great place to be, if the bunk is spoiled by the thin mattress. The very latest ones also come with a new integrated 'engine retarder' which is nifty - no problems over the A68 full loaded with that thing - but the new 480 is a 10L engine with two turbos and about 4000PSI of boost. Consequences predictable.

Most of the shit that goes wrong with them is irritating, but I've had a few genuinely dangerous things, like the wheels coming off, and the engine and gearbox getting in a tizz, and deciding not to talk. At which point the engine decided not to bother engining. At 50-odd mph.

MAN service are frequently an utter joke too.

 

I still rate the older Actros models: the wee V6 was a plucky thing, definitely got a participation medal for trying hard in 440 or less form, the later 460/480 engines were quite pokey. MegaSpace cab was massive, and had one of the highest floors of anything; it could be a real pain in tight spaces, because you were so high up. Interesting on city streets. Did regular Edinburgh - Cannock double manned night trunks in one years ago, couldn't fault it. Plenty enough space for two blokes to leave a pile of gear in it all week, including kettle and biscuits.

Not so sure about the newer ones. I've only had 450s and they don't pull that well. The 420 is terrible apparently - one company I frequent had one on hire, and sent it back in favour of a 480 MAN, because the Merc couldn't hack it loaded both ways on the A9...

 

If you can get a go of a Scania R450, do it! It's actually pretty damn good, better than the old R440 anyway. Not that that's saying very much. For some reason, Scanny are trying to punt R580s with 2-pedal Opticruise at the mo. I know not why, but then nothing else in the truck stop screams 'wanker' like a split new R580 with eleven billion lights on it. And a big box full of Griffin branded accessories nailed on. The problem with them is you're only King Dick til something gruntier turns up, and there's quite a few contenders.

The thing to watch with newer Scannys is actually that poxy lightweight centre axle. 6100kgs on full size tyres. Might as well have a Cortina axle under there. Doesn't even steer any more unless you pay extra. As I found out last year, a G410 with a decker on its' back is nobody's idea of a fun time. Centre axle flagged up on the weighbridge (where the Mercs and Dafs we were also using didn't), chronic understeer everywhere, from walking pace upwards. Oh dear Scania, what have you done? Taken a perfectly good motor, and made it MAN good, to appease the gaffers, that's what.

[Richard]

What is it with 54 year old lorry drivers? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-38575843 last week and http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-38629591 this week.

[DodgeRover]

Co incidence but going to work in SevenOaks there was a blue T plate Hino coming the other way. No idea what model but looked TK Bedford sort of sized

[willswitchengage]

Whats the difference between the G and R series?

[Guest Hooli]

Axel Roses?

[Felly Magic]

MAN engines are known to go OMNOMS on themselves too I hear

[Jim Bell]

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