Project Rusty Triumphs in Scotland - Fixing things... - 16/03/25

[320touring]

  On 17/07/2020 at 20:11, GingerNuttz said:

Turbo 1850 is what NEEDS to happen . 

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This guy is gunna go far!

[somewhatfoolish]

Given their kettling qualities WCPGW?

  On 17/07/2020 at 20:11, GingerNuttz said:

Turbo 1850 is what NEEDS to happen . 

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[GingerNuttz]

I reckon the 1850 could take 5-6 psi of boost with the right modifications .

[Tadhg Tiogar]

  On 17/07/2020 at 20:11, GingerNuttz said:

Turbo 1850 is what NEEDS to happen . 

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Has anyone tried it before?

[Jikovron]

The engine would piss half a bar of boost with barely any work, however 130bhp fed to the wheels via a single rail gearbox and banjo axle would be new territory lol 

[captain_70s]

Step one of tuning an 1850 is traditionally to drop in a Sprint engine, or at least a TR7 lump. The gearbox will barely handle 100bhp and often grenade with the stock 90 so Christ knows what'll happen there!

[somewhatfoolish]

What he said; the entire drivetrain is going to melt and even if it didn't the shit brakes will result in you dying at least twice every time you go for a drive. Ignoring the meltiness though I vote for a SAAB turbot lump dropping in on account of it being totally* interchangeable. 

  On 17/07/2020 at 21:55, Jikovron said:

The engine would piss half a bar of boost with barely any work, however 130bhp fed to the wheels via a single rail gearbox and banjo axle would be new territory lol 

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[JimH]

  On 17/07/2020 at 21:50, Tadhg Tiogar said:

Has anyone tried it before?

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I think SAAB has given it a bash on a few occasions. 

[Angrydicky]

Great progress! Some nice metalwork there. 

Old cars really are like icebergs aren’t they!

[GingerNuttz]

They say the Triumph spitfire gearbox and diff explode at 100bhp while there are people running 130 bhp with no issues, it's all down to how it's driven at the end of the day.

Many an MX5 swap in Spitfires/Dollies running standard rear ends too 

[Jikovron]

Your right on the money,  sensible driving would keep it together for ages tbf 

As an impetuous child 12 years ago in my 1500 I broke 2 gearboxs and made 3 diffs go noisey but all those would have been fine with a more considered application of drive takeup lol

[SiC]

  On 17/07/2020 at 09:27, captain_70s said:

Their panel prices aren't entirely out of the norm, but they're still expensive. To be fair you must have about £10k worth of hobby cars at the moment, I suspect you're closer to their intended market! ?

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Going on eBay auction sale prices, my Sprint actually is my most valuable car now - bizarrely by doing nothing but letting it sit! It's also by far the one that needs the most work too. ?

It's still waiting patiently outside the garage until I get my arse into gear and get the 1100 out of the garage. I'm probably going to have to buy the panels as I don't have gingernutzz panel beating skills to make any replacement panels of decent quality or shape that would be visible. 

Going on by what they're now worth, I probably need to do a reasonably decent job too as there could be a bit of money in it if I do. Which just adds pressure to doing a really good job of it. 

Still the intention is do make it good enough to be respectable rather than show quality. The jump between the two is an extraordinary amount of extra work. 

This thread is quite a lot of interest to me as I'll be needing to do some of the same jobs with the arches and such! The nose on mine isn't as buggered but it still has a good bit of crustyness to it. 

[GingerNuttz]

  On 18/07/2020 at 08:51, SiC said:

Going on eBay auction sale prices, my Sprint actually is my most valuable car now - bizarrely by doing nothing but letting it sit! It's also by far the one that needs the most work too. ?

It's still waiting patiently outside the garage until I get my arse into gear and get the 1100 out of the garage. I'm probably going to have to buy the panels as I don't have gingernutzz panel beating skills to make any replacement panels of decent quality or shape that would be visible. 

Going on by what they're now worth, I probably need to do a reasonably decent job too as there could be a bit of money in it if I do. Which just adds pressure to doing a really good job of it. 

Still the intention is do make it good enough to be respectable rather than show quality. The jump between the two is an extraordinary amount of extra work. 

This thread is quite a lot of interest to me as I'll be needing to do some of the same jobs with the arches and such! The nose on mine isn't as buggered but it still has a good bit of crustyness to it. 

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Make the panels yourself Sic, it's not hard when you have a complete car. The challenge with this one is half f it's missing ?

[GingerNuttz]

  On 18/07/2020 at 08:20, Jikovron said:

Your right on the money,  sensible driving would keep it together for ages tbf 

As an impetuous child 12 years ago in my 1500 I broke 2 gearboxs and made 3 diffs go noisey but all those would have been fine with a more considered application of drive takeup lol

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The gearboxes and diffs are made of cheese compared to others of the same period especially the 3.27 from the gt6. I've got a 4.11 in the Herald but will no doubt change it out to a 3.89 when I find a decent one. 

[Yoss]

  On 18/07/2020 at 03:13, JimH said:

I think SAAB has given it a bash on a few occasions. 

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Yes, I was going to say something along those lines though I don't know how much work Saab did to them to get them reliable (with or without turbos). I suspect it was quite a lot and I don't think there are many, if any, interchangeable parts between the two. 

[GingerNuttz]

Janspeed made 1 kit for a TR7 from what is documented 

[big_al_granvia]

what about for the 1850 finding a rotten scimitar (shouldnt be that hard) it provides back axle, gearbox, front suspension and brakes then to keep it sounding leyland drop in a rover vv8... or if you want to keep it triumph a rotten snag and take running gear from that with the rover v8... i know a lad in falkirk that has built numerous tr8's using the rover lump, unsure of drivetrain... willy toye is is name, raced them for years, there is still a few racing in scotland... a 1850 running that gear would be pretty epic.... most mental thing i ever saw a v8 in was a mini, spaceframe chassis with the bulkhead moved back 2 feet and bucket seats roughly where the back seat was... nuts 

 

[GingerNuttz]

 

  On 18/07/2020 at 16:39, big_al_granvia said:

what about for the 1850 finding a rotten scimitar (shouldnt be that hard) it provides back axle, gearbox, front suspension and brakes then to keep it sounding leyland drop in a rover vv8... or if you want to keep it triumph a rotten snag and take running gear from that with the rover v8... i know a lad in falkirk that has built numerous tr8's using the rover lump, unsure of drivetrain... willy toye is is name, raced them for years, there is still a few racing in scotland... a 1850 running that gear would be pretty epic.... most mental thing i ever saw a v8 in was a mini, spaceframe chassis with the bulkhead moved back 2 feet and bucket seats roughly where the back seat was... nuts 

 

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Bmw 6 cylinder on bike carbs would be a fucking hoot too using that running gear.

[Jikovron]

If I was building another v8 dolomite I would go ford 302 these days, unless a 4.6 tophat lined engine popped up of course! 

[Yoss]

Something in  my dim distant memory tells me that Saab also used the Triumph FWD gearbox as the basis for the 99 but I wasn't sure if I dreamt this so I've just done a bit of googling. 

 

Saab:

Triumph :

That's mine, best pic I can find at the mo. 

The diff cover at the front is very similar, though a mirror image. 

Saab:

Triumph:

I have literally just gone and taken this as I couldn't find a pic online. The subframe is in the way but there's no mistaking the similarity. 

It's not actually the same in any way but the family resemblance is obvious. The Saab box looks ally where mine is stupidly heavy cast iron. The Saab uses a chain to link the input shaft to the gearbox below where the Triumph uses a line of gears but the overall concept is the same. Seeing as the Triumph gearbox could barely handle the 61hp of a standard 1300 (though that was mostly down to the input shaft and was rectified on the 1500) Saab must have done quite a lot but looking at that it looks like it would drop straight in my car with a nice Saab turbo lump on top. Hmm... just thinking out loud. 

[Asimo]

SaaB used gears on the 99 for the first few years before changing to 3 rows of chain. Easy-change clutch was a bonus for both Triumph and SaaB designs, with their short pull-out clutch shafts.

As for swapping them, remember the Saab has the clutch at the front of the car...

[Yoss]

You're right. I found this Saab based article. They claim Saab turned the gearbox round to make changing the clutch easier as to leave it as it was would require having a removable plate in the front bulkhead. Which the Triumph has, of course, and my clutch is very simple to remove. 

This even has a picture of the Triumph lump. But another thing I notice is, looking from above, the Saab engine leans to the right. 

While the Triumph leans to the left. 

So I could just swivel the whole lot round 180° and we'd be back to square one. I realise it wouldn't be that simple and don't worry I'm not going to try it. 

Another thing I notice from the above diagram is that where Saab have turned the box round the the engine sits forward of the front axle whereas the Triumph has the the engine almost entirely behind the wheels. That has to be better right? We could almost say it's mid engined. Alright, I'm dreaming now but I know my car handles really well, not just for a 1960s car, but by any standards. 

[captain_70s]

  On 30/07/2019 at 13:44, Yoss said:

Fitting an 1850 might be easier than trying to fit a 1300 FWD. The FWD crank is different. The front end is tapered (unless it is a really, really, really early one), to take the front flywheel/starter ring.

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  Quote

Fitting an 1850 might be easier than trying to fit a 1300 FWD. The FWD crank is different. The front end is tapered (unless it is a really, really, really early one),

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  Quote

Fitting an 1850 might be easier than trying to fit a 1300 FWD. The FWD crank is different. The front end is tapered 

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  Quote

Fitting an 1850 might be easier than trying to fit a 1300 FWD. The FWD crank is different. 

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The FWD crank is different. 

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More info on this bundle of fuckery once I've eaten, I'm fucking starving...

[GingerNuttz]

Well some people just don't fuckin listen !!!

[SiC]

So you're fitting a 1850 engine then?

[GingerNuttz]

BMW 4 cylinder on bike carbs if we have our way ...

[captain_70s]

Am I fuck. Stupid things, steel studs through an alloy head, fucky water pumps, heads that warp when the thing inevitably overheats. Fuck that. They'd be a really nice engine if BL hadn't engineered so many flaws into them...

Cunning engineering solutions are being pondered by many people who are most certainly not engineers. Worst comes to worst @320touring and @jaypee have already convinced me and @GingerNuttz it needs a BMW lump of some description. ?

[SiC]

 

 

 

 

  On 19/07/2020 at 16:40, captain_70s said:

Am I fuck. Stupid things, steel studs through an alloy head, fucky water pumps, heads that warp when the thing inevitably overheats. Fuck that.

 

Yes it's why I don't know I'd want my Sprint as a long termer. Removing the head is a gamble that it'll come off nicely or (now) £2k+ for a replacement block/head.

 

Tbh just lob a MX5 drivetrain in there and be done with it.

 

Fuck BMW and their shitty engineering though. Makes Triumph engineers look like NASA engineers.

 

[Fumbler]

What's the state of that Spitfire engine you have/had? I forget if it went.

[captain_70s]

 

  On 19/07/2020 at 16:48, Fumbler said:

What's the state of that Spitfire engine you have/had? I forget if it went.

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It could probably be salvaged but needs a full rebuild.