Mid 80's+ silver = rot?

[Timewaster]

After seeing the Cavalier Commander on the ebay thread http://www.autoshite.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7118&start=7275#p231002 and the theory that they rotted more than other Mk 2 Cavs got me thnking.....

 

I remember reading somewhere that the Silver 1985 Mini 25 special edition rotted much much quicker than other minis of the era (some feat!)

I also recall my brother had a C reg Xr3i in silver - admiredly built in the era of Ford using see through thin pre-rusted steel. That literally disolved over one winter.

 

So is there any scientific reason that silver cars of that time should rot? Anyone else know other examples?

 

Was it early days of metallic paint technology, or maybe the cars didn't show the dirt so much and didnt get washed?!

[Rusty Pelican]

Ive been told some colours protect better than others but no idea if its true or what ones , My Pops bought a MK2 Escort new in metallic paint that needed a respray two years later , paint just fell off

[red5]

I seem to recall a shortage ? around that year, or certainly poor quality steel being used. ceratinly remember 84/85 model year cars seeming to dissolve before your eyes. or am I imagining the whole thing?

[Pillock]

Could it be that there's some sort of metal content in metallic paint which reacts with the metal panel, and sets up one of those scientific things that makes it oxidize?

[Angrydicky]

I was told it was the gold Mini Piccadilly's of the mid 1980's that rusted quicker than any others, not sure how true that is as all Minis seem to rust equally bad.

[Lukas]

It´s the same with Subaru Leones. The Leone II (79-84) didn´t rust as fast as the Leone III (1985-1992), so I think the mid-80s-cars where the most rustprone cars ever.

[Anglevan]

I dont think there is anything specific to silver, but metallics in general did tend to rot more than the soild colours of the day. How many remember Vauxhalls where the metallic paint just shelled off leaving a green undercoat?

My blue metallic Mk2 Cav was like that.

Did people have more confidence in touching up solid colour cars? metallics always looked a sod when sprayed with aerosol, solid colours you could get away with a lot more, did people leave metallic colours hence they died sooner ?

Vauxhalls in the early eighties were painted in one pack metallic colours rather than clear over base (not sure if that would have a bearing)

I just suspect that metallic colours in general didn't have as much product on as a metallic colour of today. Also metallic colours were not as popular then so not many sold so not many survived. Colour brochures of the eighties had majority of solid colours and then 2 or 3 metallic options

 

Anyway thats my 2 peneth.

 

Ref the Commando - I used to work as a valeter at the local Vauxhall dealer on Saturdays (15 at the time) and I remember valeting a brand new commando, cav cabrio , bemont GLS (when was the last time you saw one of them !!) Oh the memories

[In The Pit]

Ive been told some colours protect better than others but no idea if its true or what ones , My Pops bought a MK2 Escort new in metallic paint that needed a respray two years later , paint just fell off

 

Can I ask was their MK2 Escort an early one? a 1975/1976 car? as I believe that Ford were having trouble with some of the metallic colours in the late MK1 Escorts early MK2 Escorts, the early silver colour on MK2's was an example.

[aled]

ford silver fox was a bastard of a paint, my father had 2 silver fox fords that had to be resprayed.

[Rusty Pelican]

Ive been told some colours protect better than others but no idea if its true or what ones , My Pops bought a MK2 Escort new in metallic paint that needed a respray two years later , paint just fell off

 

Can I ask was their MK2 Escort an early one? a 1975/1976 car? as I believe that Ford were having trouble with some of the metallic colours in the late MK1 Escorts early MK2 Escorts, the early silver colour on MK2's was an example.

MK2 on an N Plate IIRC , A sort of light metallic blue colour , I remember it peeling of the roof first , Pops was not a happy bunny

[In The Pit]

Ive been told some colours protect better than others but no idea if its true or what ones , My Pops bought a MK2 Escort new in metallic paint that needed a respray two years later , paint just fell off

 

Can I ask was their MK2 Escort an early one? a 1975/1976 car? as I believe that Ford were having trouble with some of the metallic colours in the late MK1 Escorts early MK2 Escorts, the early silver colour on MK2's was an example.

MK2 on an N Plate IIRC , A sort of light metallic blue colour , I remember it peeling of the roof first , Pops was not a happy bunny

 

So it was a 1975 car then, that light blue colour was called Miami Blue. The early silver I was refering to was not Silver Fox or Strato Silver, but two little known silvers called Astro Silver and Aero Silver both available at the same time, I have a sheet from Ford dated 27 June 1975 stating that the two colours were getting confused, not suprising seeing as the names are nearly the same and to add to the confusion Ford also called Aero Silver, Stardust!!!

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

The strange thing is I have noticed how certain colours of XJ40 now seem to be over represented in survivors, and how some colours seem to have died out even though they were reasonably popular when the cars were built. They all seem to be metallic red or dark blue these days! Years ago there were large numbers of silver blue ones (like mine) pale green metallics and naturally, gold. Never see them now.

 

It could be an urban myth, but the special edition SL spec Alfettas with their two tone bodywork are said to have been first made to cover up rust on the door bottoms spotted when the cars were imported. Some special editions are jinxed from the start!

[Pete-M]

The strange thing is I have noticed how certain colours of XJ40 now seem to be over represented in survivors, and how some colours seem to have died out even though they were reasonably popular when the cars were built. They all seem to be metallic red or dark blue these days! Years ago there were large numbers of silver blue ones (like mine) pale green metallics and naturally, gold. Never see them now.!

 

I know mine's been treated extra well because it's Flamenco red, an XJ40 colour that only a few X300s seemed to get. Tis a bloody good colour, the later metallic red on the X300/X350s is quite a bit darker and nowhere near as funky. Previous keeper wanted a Flamenco red one, and waited for the right one to come along.

 

All the light metallic blue / green / JRB XJ40s seemed to be worthless very early on. Maybe because there were so many in those colours. They'll never be as worthless as a white or solid beige one, but they were the more common colours to be seen on ebay.

 

I've definately chosen certain cars over others purely down to colour before now. I don't bother with white cars at all, favour black ones over most other colours, and tend to buy most stuff in dark metallics.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

All the light metallic blue / green / JRB ones seemed to be worthless very early on. Maybe because there were so many in those colours. They'll never be as worthless as a white one, but they were the more common colours to be seen on ebay.

 

I've definately chosen certain cars over others purely down to colour before now. I don't bother with white cars at all, favour black ones over most other colours, and tend to buy most stuff in dark metallics.

 

'JRB ones' - I like that!

Definately true! People don't seem to have valued the colours like mine as much and they depreciated very rapidly when they were new. Even now after all this time I think Flamenco, Morocco and Regency red Jags are worth more because people like them. I wonder if the pale colours show the rust more too and my blue and that strange muddy sage green seem to loose their shine very rapidly and to look tatty before the red cars. I like my blue, but I am alone!

 

My dad had a long history of buying cars with controversial colour combinations and specifications which then plunged in value. The last car he bought was a BMW with a beige leather, beige carpets and beige headlining and with walnut everything. The salesman tried to talk him into black with black and more black with a silver stripe, saying it was "good for resale". The old fella told him he wasn't buying it for the second owner. The salesman was mystified by this approach.

[M'coli]

I noticed that C and D reg Metros were the worst for rust. Could it just be that the steel they were made from wasn't as good as before and after because of a lack of coke available due to the miner's strike?

[CortinaDave]

Mid 80s fords were made from sausages. Regardless of colour anything from about a B to an E reg was just terrible. If you sit a Y plate sierra next to a d plate one and compare the build quality the difference is massive

[warren t claim]

Ford used to charge extra for lacquer on metallics. They called it two coat metallic iirc.

[Cavcraft]

Still vividly recall a couple of traders telling me '1975 was a bad year for the tin' and suggesting the steel available was very poor quality.

 

Vauxhall metallic blues have suffered quite badly over the years, saw countless 'Lacquer Peel Blue' Mk2 Astras especially for some reason.

 

Intreesting what you say about colours Pete(M), some cars can look great in one colour and terrible in others. Those twin headlight E-series Mercs (from around 1996/7 on) look absolutely terrible in white yet reasonably pleasant in darker colours or metallic red..

[Bren]

A lot of these issues have to do with the locations of the cars being built.

 

Lower spec MK 3 escorts were built at Halewood - the higher spec ones were built in germany / belgium, where the standards were much higher, which is why MK 3 ghias seemed to last longer than the poverty spec models.

 

On the subject of silver paint, many moons ago I had an 85' SD1 Vitesse that was silver. I am sure that everybody on this site knows how badly they can rust, but this one was a shocker. Sills, inner wings, front wings, bulkhead, you name it, it was rusty. Eventually it went to the dogman, as with a lot of cars that are near the end of a production run the manufacturers don't seem to be as bothered about the build quality of a model that will soon be obsolete.

[In The Pit]

A lot of these issues have to do with the locations of the cars being built.

 

Lower spec MK 3 escorts were built at Halewood - the higher spec ones were built in germany / belgium, where the standards were much higher, which is why MK 3 ghias seemed to last longer than the poverty spec models.

 

I've never been convinced of this the German built Escorts were better that the British built ones, i've had 7 MKII Escorts 6 British built ones and 1 German built one and the German one was far more rusty than the British built ones (and it had a careful owner who looked after it well). My theory on this is that the Ghia's (German built) would have cost alot more money and would have gone to private owners who would have had them rust protected from new and looked after them more so than bottom of the range British built cars that many would have sold as hire cars and to people on a limited budget who wouldn't have had rust protection or looked after them so well. Thats why with most classics the rare ones are often the bottom of the range cars and most survivors coming from the top of the range.