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Cheap AWD for winter - trying to predict the weather....

83C

By 83C
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Captain Furious Rank: Citroen Ami

Captain Furious

Posted
Posted

Jag X Type, you won’t be able to have the diesel because they’re FWD only but a 2.5 or 3.0 is AWD

 

Would have thought 500 quid would get a suitably scruffy one with galloping rot.

  • rantingYoof and oldcars
  • Like 2
83C Rank: Renault 16

83C

Posted
  • Author
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Be careful of part worn tyres. Some are barely legal. Some bargins but be very careful. A Vitara or Fourtrak? Something late 80's early 90's. Might even go up in value?

Part-worns are ok if inspected beforehand - bearing in mind any used car comes with a set of part-worn tyres by default. That said, nowhere I know down here does them now.

Scruffy Bodger Rank: Renault 16

Scruffy Bodger

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Another vote for a Terios from me, my old man used to have one. It managed to survive 50K between oil changes at one point so can't be too bad? I did some fairly serious off-roading in it a couple of times and it coped very well indeed, even though it could have done with a low-ratio box really. It was excellent in the snow although as others have pointed out this doesn't mean it will stop any quicker.

Matty Rank: Lancia Gamma

Matty

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Part-worns are ok if inspected beforehand - bearing in mind any used car comes with a set of part-worn tyres by default. That said, nowhere I know down here does them now.

Spot on. Most folk with half a clue know what to look for. Even tread, no sidewall or beading damage, no poorly repaired punctures, esp in sidewall. Any place I've dealt with has been more than happy for me to choose my own from their stock, you are after all a customer looking to give them money!! Shame there's no places down at yours, there's a shitload round here but your not going to see any savings traveling from all the way down there for cheap tires!!!
Shirley Knott Rank: Renault 16

Shirley Knott

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The best car I've ever driven in snow bar none is Mrs Eunos's Lupo.

 

Last winter we had snow so bad that both of our workplaces closed for days on end and cars were strewn about in our street where people had tried to get moving and failed. The little Lupo with its combination of skinny tyres and the weight of a heavy 1.7 diesel engine forcing them into the ground was pretty much unstoppable. Seeing the bemused faces of people struggling with all four wheels spinning and sliding about in their expensive modern SUVs as I calmly pulled out and drove past them was priceless.

  • Lacquer Peel, chadders and ProgRocker
  • Like 3
UltraWomble Rank: Talbot Tagora

UltraWomble

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FWD - skinny tyres - high ground clearance - volcanic heater.

 

Citroen BX 1.7 TGD running 165 section tyres would be my choice.

Never got stuck in snow.

 

Or run a moped and buy some decent gloves.

rainagain Rank: Renault 16

rainagain

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I normally buy part worn winter tyres off eBay on the run up to winter. The ones I bought last year were so old they were rock hard ( I couldn’t ask the seller for the date code as it said on eBay words to the affect “this seller gets so many questions they aren’t answered so don’t bother”). My neighbour happy drove out our street whilst I couldn’t.

 

Of course the 307’s crap traction control that basically just stops the car didn’t help. This year I’ve purchased a button off the sport model from eBay to fit so I can turn it off and I’ve also bought some snow chains. The idea being the major roads are normally cleared quite quick so I stick the chains on, make it out my estate and then take them off. I still need to practice fitting them though!

Snipes Rank: Lancia Gamma

Snipes

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Thing is, 4WD only helps you get going. It does not help you stop. Or go around corners. In fact, if it's part time with no centre diff, then it'll be even worse at going around corners.

Four wheel engine braking. That's one of the things that made Audi so strong during the 90s BTCC days.

skattrd Rank: Lancia Gamma

skattrd

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Cross climates are mega soft, down to the cords in 10k in our case.

 

 

On my w203 I did 20k or so on cross-climates and still had 4mm or so left when I sold the car.

I'd definitely have them again.

  • Asimo and chadders
  • Like 2
leafsprung Rank: BL Wedge

leafsprung

Posted
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Just about everything I've ever owned has been either Land Rover or 4x4/AWD. Anything large land rover based will have its detractors and its die hards. I've always liked them but I'm happy to wield the spanners when needed. The current daily is an Octavia scout, the second generation sort which I had just after last year's OMGSNOKAOZ so haven't had it in the really slippery stuff and this year has been so dry my usual muddy haunts haven't been so testing. It's an instantly forgettable car that I find hard to warm to. The 140pd diesel is not bad and mid 50s on a long run driven gently isn't unheard of. It's still under 100k and no FTPs but it feels fragile, bits fall off too easily and the Haldex system already needs a damper replacing to cure an arse pummeling vibration at 1500rpm. Its also needed springs and dampers and I find identifying and sourcing spares a headache compared to LRs.

I've had two Subaru Foresters too, first and second generation non turbo, both of which I loved except the first had had LPG fitted because OMGMPG. Unfortunately that had shagged the valve seats and after 6 months of the dealer pissing me about I got my money back. The second generation one was awesome. Much improved to look at and sit in and felt like it would last forever. MPG hadn't improved sadly but was a lovely car to drive. I'd have another now if I was doing fewer miles.

Don't knock the Td4 Freelander for maximum cheapness. I had a commercial and it was probably the best all round car I've had. Subaru nicer to sit in and drive but close. It needed new brake pipes (cheap genuine part) and I swapped the soggy foam engine breather filter for an upgraded BMW centrifugal one and that's all it really ever needed. As with all LRs parts are cheap and easily available plus there's a specialist on every street corner. There's been lots written about Viscous Coupling Units seizing and knackering the rear diff and/or gearbox. Early ones they did get diff ratio wrong (I think) which prematurely wore the VCU but that was picked up and remedied. The VCU should always have been a service item, swap that and the support bearings (easy job) and no reason it shouldn't be perfectly ok. I think a lot of people remove the rear prop for mpg rather than because of problems. Recon diffs aren't exactly expensive in any case. Get a late HSE and there's all the toys you need, even a diesel powered heater. Loads still about for not very much.

In summary, for what it's worth, Forester 2nd gen if you can afford the fuel, Freelander Td4 if you can't.

  • Exiled_Tat_Gatherer, Justin Case, lesapandre and 1 other
  • Like 4
mat_the_cat Rank: Lancia Gamma

mat_the_cat

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Has anyone tried snow chains or snow socks?

 

Chains, yes.

 

post-5223-0-87041800-1542549956_thumb.jpg

 

Better than winter tyres alone, but a pain if the roads have been partially cleared/gritted. Can be difficult/slow to put on.

 

I rarely use them now, just winter tyres or more recently all-seasons. Maybe 80% of the snow grip, but much better wear resistance. Note that the type of snow has a big effect on grip - powdery snow is a lot better than the slushy stuff we usually get here.

  • forddeliveryboy, Lacquer Peel, UltraWomble and 4 others
  • Like 7
lesapandre Rank: Talbot Tagora

lesapandre

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Part-worns are ok if inspected beforehand - bearing in mind any used car comes with a set of part-worn tyres by default. That said, nowhere I know down here does them now.

Yea I put them on my AX Citroen - lots about and some fine tyres -I even got Michelin. I tried for my Landcruiser- one place had them...cracked sidewalls and about 15 yo and the other place worn in a band round the edges. Both dangerous and penalty points if stopped. Tyre place was quite happy to put them on...I said no. I suppose indicates the cost and rarity of 4x4 tyres.

John F Rank: Lancia Gamma

John F

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I've only ever used chains in the Alps, and only when absolutely necessary. They give an unbelievably harsh ride.

  • mat_the_cat and Exiled_Tat_Gatherer
  • Like 2
garethj Rank: Isuzu Florian

garethj

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I’ve used snow socks on an old Volvo 740 a few years ago and they worked very well. Easy to fit and it was just me and a few 4x4 pickup trucks on the road.

 

The only drawback is you can’t do more than 30mph in them so on the way home when the snow started to clear I couldn’t stop anywhere to take them off. All the side roads and lay-bys were still thick with snow so if I’d have pulled in I probably wouldn’t be able to pull out again.

 

Having said that, I keep a set in the boot of the car just in case, it’s more a “get you home” thing than something to use for several journeys over a snowy week.

  • Sloth in a bowl and UltraWomble
  • Like 2
forddeliveryboy Rank: Isuzu Florian

forddeliveryboy

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I've only ever used chains in the Alps, and only when absolutely necessary. They give an unbelievably harsh ride.

They're not that useful without winter tyres, either. I spent a winter in the Alps and locals only ever used them when snowing hard on really steep winding roads where you couldn't get up speed to carry your way - or when the police were out enforcing it on steep roads heavy with tourist traffic.

 

Perhaps a cheap Freelander with a set of winter tyres on, then it matters little whether or not the back axle is driving? As Lacquer Peel mentioned, ground clearance is everything (if you're outside the concrete jungle).

 

Me? If there was a need for a wbod as a second car I'd buy a Aldi80 with a folding roof and fit a set of winter 195-65R15s. Enjoy the Springtime sunshine then sell in early June. They don't have quite the traction of a Golf (less mass up front) but I used to live in a snow-prone steep-sided valley and they never struggled.

Noel Tidybeard Rank: Lancia Gamma

Noel Tidybeard

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i got some German remould King Meiler WT84 winter tyres which afforded me much normality in OMGSNOKAOS last year even in standard 225/45-17 size (rather than going down to 205/55-16) which i did previously

the WT84s even have the treaded holes for studs!

 

£72/pair by the way

Guest

Guest

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I'm living up in the Campsies for the winter, down a mile of single track road, so keeping the wee fella for the snaw. He was a little more than £500, but apart from having a few not very nice looking patches welded to it on the strut top and a couple underneath, he 's been great so far- does a lot of hauling trailers and caravans through deep mud and surprised me a few times, and much nicer on the road than a Jimny. Like's a drink though, and tax is quite dear.

 Plenty Suzuki Ignis around for sale up here for £500 ish, and even the SX4 is under a grand now.

 

post-62-0-00893000-1542562494_thumb.jpg

  • oldcars and Coprolalia
  • Like 2
Shirley Knott Rank: Renault 16

Shirley Knott

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Christ, I appreciate that's been a cat C but I genuinely didn't realise those had gotten that cheap, I'd be seriously tempted by one at that kind of money *Fires up ebay*

Guest

Guest

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Christ, I appreciate that's been a cat C but I genuinely didn't realise those had gotten that cheap, I'd be seriously tempted by one at that kind of money *Fires up ebay*

They haven't- That's what I was looking for originally and that one is cheap- most are tired and rotten off road day specials for that price, and good ones are on the climb, especially in America.

  • Shirley Knott
  • Like 1
dollywobbler Rank: Matra Rancho towing a Tagora

dollywobbler

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Four wheel engine braking. That's one of the things that made Audi so strong during the 90s BTCC days.

 

Seriously, when do racing drivers ever use engine braking? They're either foot-to-the-floor or slamming the anchors on. What 4WD gives you is traction, so you get away off the line nicely, and can just mash the throttle mid-bend with no worries (on a race track at least). While I can see that an engaged 4WD system will give you four-wheel engine braking in actual snow conditions, which is an advantage, I still reckon you don't get half as many benefits as you might expect. I should know. I've got stuck in the snow in all manner of vehicles.

  • mat_the_cat and Lacquer Peel
  • Like 2
bangernomics Rank: Isuzu Florian

bangernomics

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I remember a guy bringing one in on px against a new frontera 2.2 dti and he said it was ruining him. I took it home for the night and it did 3 gallons in to do a 30 odd mile round trip in crap traffic. Rocked when you revved it up.

83C Rank: Renault 16

83C

Posted
  • Author
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Christ that’s cheap, and local. Too much work for me unfortunately, doing a gearbox outside the front of the house on the road doesn’t appeal. Got a few Freelanders in my watch list, seems anything good is miles away. HMC’s Xantia would have been great with some winter tyres, set the suspension to maximum and keep plodding on.

puddlethumper Rank: Renault 16

puddlethumper

Posted
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Has anyone tried snow chains or snow socks?

I've got a set of chains for my old heap. Great if there is enough snow to not

have to keep taking them off when you hit tarmac. Tarmac will shag them real quick.

Great fun with a front wheel drive. Point and squirt. Good drifting.

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