Zel's Motoring Adventures...Volvo, Renault, Rover, Trabant, Invacar & A Sinclair C5 - Updated 13/11.

[Zelandeth]

An absolutely huge box arrived this morning containing the gasket set for the Rover, so time to have a look at getting the inlet valve cover gasket swapped out.

Step one, get this lot out the way.

Which vastly improves access in general.

I then made A Discovery.

Whoever fitted this gasket apparently felt the need to use some form of sealant between the head and the gasket.  Fair enough, but what they apparently used was blue Loctite.  This had essentially welded the gasket to the head.  Nearly three bloody hours later I had *most* of it removed.

If I ever come across who fitted that gasket, I would like to make them *eat* the remains of it.  That should have been a 20 minute job.

It was definitely the source of A leak though - the entire section along the rear of the head, yeah that wasn't actually in contact with anything at all - it was just sticking out the back.  So definitely the source of at least one of our leaks.

While I had things already partly stripped down and the weather was pleasant it seemed a good idea to swap the remaining coolant hoses.  I'm planning to take this along to ConFuzzled at the weekend, so that's an hour's drive into Birmingham.  Would be nice to have confidence in the cooling system for that run.

The original lines were quite crusty.

Though after 60 years, I don't think they owe us anything.  I'm sure the replacements will have long turned to dust after that long.  With the exception of two I had to change due to the new hoses being thicker, all of the original hose clips were reused as they came undone like they were put in place yesterday - and plainly are still fit for service.

Couple of hours later this lot had been evicted.

This one was moderately fiddly.

Though the real swear fest of the day involved this.

Specifically, trying to get the bottom hose back onto the stub on the radiator.  This involved a solid half hour of increasingly vocal swearing as the new hose is quite a snug fit.  It's a long way down to the bottom of this engine bay so you can only use one hand, and are working right at the limit of your reach.  Fun.

I then had a brief pause in progress because she wouldn't start.  Cause?

Yeah... there's a distinct lack of centre post there.  Which surprises me as she was running fine when parked up.  I'm *hoping* this has just fatigued from the cap having been on and off so much lately.  

Chucked the modern cap and leads on for testing.

...Which also took me ten minutes to sort as I initially had the rotation direction wrong so had fouled up the firing order.  My ears stopped ringing from the resulting backfire after about an hour.

I then had an abrupt reminder of something.

Mechanical cooling fans are purpose made to demonstrate to you exactly how much coolant you spilled over the radiator when changing the hoses by finely atomising it and blasting it in your face the first time you bring the engine off idle.

After a bit of faffing about bleeding the cooling system (there are no actual bleed valves on this car) we seemed to have a water tight cooling system.  Nearly.

New leak from here.  Not sure if this has been leaking there for ages and it's only just become visible, or if the pipe being manhandled while I was trying to get the hose that was well stuck to the front end of it off fatigued it.  Hopefully it won't be too tricky to resolve that.  

Took her out for a quick bumble round the neighborhood and we didn't lose any coolant.  My perfectly clear blue coolant however had turned the same slightly muddy colour as what came out though.

This is more where I was interested in looking though.

(Old photo).  I think we might have got it.  I sat watching for a couple of minutes and didn't see a single drip, whereas we were getting one every second or two when I took that photo.

I left some cardboard there for about an hour and there were only one or two drops on it, which could well have mostly been there from beforehand given how much it had dumped down the side and back of the engine.  I'll give the general vicinity a dousing with some degreaser if I get a chance in the next couple of days.

I did dig out one of the spare correct style distributor caps.  Though they are both pretty worn.  Hopefully these are still available.

This does look so much better than the modern style cap and leads in this engine bay though.

So doesn't really *look* like I've done much!

Despite that there's pretty much a full afternoon of work in here!

Slightly concerned about the self destructing distributor cap - will definitely keep a spare in the car from here on just in case.  However having the cooling system refreshed aside from that one bit of metal line will definitely help my peace of mind when driving the car now.  I was definitely rather nervous that one of those hoses was going to let go before.

[Rovorsche]

If it was Blue Hylomar then I believe it was a Rover recommended sealant especially for joints where no gasket was intended to be installed.

https://hylomar.com/en/universal-blue/

I have used it every time I had the 2300 engine to bits to seal the camshaft carrier and it has never leaked or clogged the oil ways.

[Zelandeth]

21 minutes ago, Rovorsche said:

If it was Blue Hylomar then I believe it was a Rover recommended sealant especially for joints where no gasket was intended to be installed.

https://hylomar.com/en/universal-blue/

I have used it every time I had the 2300 engine to bits to seal the camshaft carrier and it has never leaked or clogged the oil ways.

Nope, hylomar remains kinda gummy or plastic like - this had set like bloody concrete.  This wasn't a case of "scrape it off" so much as "chisel it off hoping the head underneath survives."

[SiC]

Caps are still readily available

https://www.johnwearingp4parts.co.uk/proddetail.php?prod=539570%2FGDC101

GDC101 iirc and used on a lot of other stuff. That one that broke I believe or at least looked like an original Lucas part. 

This was my drive just 3 years ago

It's a bit harder to know now when a car has an oil leak through the other brown rust and black oil staining  🫣

[Zelandeth]

Thanks for that.  I'd kept meaning to look it up but kept forgetting!

My driveway has never really recovered from the residence of the XJ-S given the plethora of areas it leaked oil from.

Just discovered why the ride has always felt a little bouncy.  It appears that both rear shock absorbers have almost completely seized!  There is still a little movement I think, but barely any.  That would definitely explain it.

That water pipe which has failed isn't helpfully a standard plumbing size, as I'd wondered if I could just stuff in a length of 22mm copper pipe.  However that's a good 5mm too large so a bit of a stretch, especially as the front hose in particular is already a very snug fit.

Cue salvation presenting itself in the form of something in the "sure that will be handy one day" pile in the corner of the garage.

I'm not absolutely sure what this originally was, but it's reasonably thick walled steel so will do for now at least.  Helpfully already painted black like the original too.

It does sit slightly askew as the original pipe had a support bracket welded to it that was bolted to one of the exhaust studs - I'll ponder a solution to that at a later date.  For now it's fine.

Coolant topped off and test run completed, everything seems to be happy.

The old pipe definitely looks worse for wear.

The heater is probably going to be rather more effective now too...

You can actually see daylight through here, but it's plenty restricted with rusty gunk for sure.

Edit: Been out running various errands today and on no point did I come back to find any oil drips under the car.  Think we can call out the inlet valve cover gasket as the main culprit for the leak then.  Sure there are a thousand small leaks which will leave the odd drop, but I can deal with that.  Engine oil dripping off the rear axle, not so much!

[Zelandeth]

Out and about again, running all over the bloody shop trying to get everything organised before tomorrow.

Probably best part of 100 miles covered during the day.  No meaningful oil leakage apparent, all the coolant appears to be staying in the engine and the distributor cap doesn't appear to have eaten itself again so far.

Gave the inferior a quick going over with the vacuum cleaner to get rid of the dead leaves and abundance of dog hair (how?!?  They've never even been near it!) from the carpets.

I will need to see if I can come up with even a temporary solution for a carpet in the back.

Did spot something less than ideal when cleaning the carpets though.

Don't think you should be able to see daylight through there!  Not hugely surprising really but still not ideal.  

Did miss rolling over a mileage milestone on account of there being nowhere to pull over to grab a photo when it happened, so you'll have to take 5 miles later.

Imagine that's 150K based on the wear on the seats and pedals.  Though despite being scruffy how tight the car feels is definitely testament to how solidly built these cars were and that mechanically this one was obviously fairly well cared for.

[SiC]

Do not poke!!

Shame I didn't see that when I did the other bits. I did look at that area as its a common P4 point, but I certainly don't remember seeing it. Especially that looks only a 10 minute job to fill and grind that up with the welder out.

Should be far enough away from the chassis mounts that its shouldn't be dangerous. Worth putting krust and paint on to stabilise it though.

[Zelandeth]

1 hour ago, SiC said:

Do not poke!!

Shame I didn't see that when I did the other bits. I did look at that area as its a common P4 point, but I certainly don't remember seeing it. Especially that looks only a 10 minute job to fill and grind that up with the welder out.

Should be far enough away from the chassis mounts that its shouldn't be dangerous. Worth putting krust and paint on to stabilise it though.

Don't worry about it, we've all been there.

Do not poke I think is the overall mantra with the body on this car!

I'll look to get that painted up once I'm back from this weekend away.  There are going to be a few high priority areas I'll probably look to get sorted either myself or get someone to weld up just to help ensure the car doesn't start to decay more quickly.  That spot, the bit forward of the NSR wheel and the bottom of the B pillar on the nearside are the main items on that list so far.  Full restoration isn't the plan, but I'd like to sort those areas as they have the potential to go south if left unchecked.

Had to do something about this.

Mainly because I discovered today that if I drive at speed with the window fully open it wiggled around on the cable making a fantastically irritating clicking noise.

Had a dig around in the random part store and found one screw which isn't the *right* size, but is close enough for now.

It's held in place by one screw for now...at least it's not clicking in my right ear any more!

I'll dig out a couple of screws which are actually the right size after the weekend.  Or in a couple of years when I remember.

[Zelandeth]

Yep.  Evidence suggests I have arrived in the correct car park.

 

Also noted: 80s BMW 318, Renault Avantime, Citroen GSA, Chrysler New Yorker, classic Land Rover and probably a bunch I've already forgotten.  The actual car related bit of our event is lunchtime tomorrow, so I expect there'll be photos of most of the above plus a bunch more then.

Rover didn't miss a beat on the way over here (unsurprisingly - but it's always reassuring when you have had a bunch of stuff apart to not have gremlins).  Only observation really is that she evidently does have a bit of leakage through the inlet valve stem seals - after a long downhill stretch there's definitely quite a distinct puff of blue smoke the first time you put power down again.  Not even *close* to anything I'm worried about, I've never been aware of any smoke at all at any other times, it's not serious, and given the age and mileage it's not unexpected.

[Zelandeth]

The Rover was quite well received at our little event.  Not a classic car show as such, more just an excuse for a bunch of enthusiasts to get together for a few hours and socialise.

Oh, and get quite sunburnt.  Oops.

First up though, a very nice tribute I thought to one of our number we lost very suddenly to cancer a few weeks short of a year ago.  Last time I saw them was at this event last year when they seemed fine.  

This was a nice touch.

Mostly newer cars, think the Rover was one of three vehicles from the 60s or earlier.

Other things from a similar or earlier vintage were the big Simca 4x4 truck I was parked next to in the car park (and apparently failed to take a separate photo of here), a Land Rover and a big old Crysler.

Have to wonder what the story behind this is... it's a ways from home.

Have to wonder how it wound up in England.

Always nice to see a proper old Yank Land Yaught.

Though this is on air suspension and does all kinds of ridiculous things which aren't really my thing.  Still a nice car though.

Few things more on topic for this forum there too.

The epitome of Autoshite?

My brain still can't quite process that they weren't launched "a couple of years ago" yet.

Anything with a BL badge I think automatically qualifies.

Even if this does have a V8 crammed under the bonnet and a huge wing on the back.

These Mercs really do have a timeless look to them.

Not many cars I'd actually pick in white, but this is one of them.  Just really suits the car.

I had hoped to speak to the owner of this Rover but sadly never caught them.

An increasingly rare bird these days.  We did end up parked next to each other after the event though which pleased me.

Speaking of things which were just launched two minutes ago and have absolutely no business being old enough to start appearing at shows...

Really like that colour.  If it weren't for the stupid road tax cost for them I really would have considered one at some point.  

This MX-5 was lovely.  Beautiful colour, perfect interior to complement it, and not messed with.

Not half as unusual as seeing a Skyline in stock form though.

I was even more surprised to find it was an automatic.  Can't be many of those around.

Missed getting a photo of this at the event, so had to snap one in the car park later in the day.

Apparently one of three the owner has.  I am more than a little jealous.  Except not...finding bits for the 25 is bad enough.  Never mind something that complex.

The GSA in the foreground here is a really tidy example and in regular use in the summer I believe.

Another car I'd love to own one day, but I think I've missed my chance as the prices for good ones have soared beyond anything I can really justify now.

I can never quite decide if these are true Autoshite sports cars or not.

The completely random parts bin nature and often questionable build quality to me say yes.  What I do know is that they're absolutely stupidly entertaining to drive and I have always wanted one.

These definitely are right at home here - the absolute definition of the underdog in its field, but despite its flaws in my opinion a bloody decent little car that is a lot of fun to drive, which is what it was designed for.

Think that's pretty much everything I really found interesting.  I probably would have taken a few more photos but between talking to folks and periodically trying to hide in the shade to limit quite how fried I got by the sun I just didn't have time.

After another few days, we all went out separate ways and headed home.  Glad to report that the Rover again didn't miss a beat.  Plus she's been in pretty daily use since with only two issues to report.

First was day before yesterday when while in traffic she developed an erratic miss.  I abruptly decided to abort the whole queuing thing and head back towards home once I detected something was amiss - and the problem promptly vanished.  Guessing it was a bit of crud in the carb needle or similar given how it vanished.  I don't think it was a heat soak issue given when it occurred.

Secondly we have a fuel leak from somewhere around the filler.  Exactly where I'm not sure yet, but I noticed when I topped off the tank recently that a not insignificant amount ended up on the floor rather than in the tank, so I'm guessing the rubber boot at the tank end of the filler neck or the breather hose has failed.  Both are cheaply and readily available so no huge headache.

Shortly before the weekend away I had the tyres rotated on the Caddy, during which it was noted that the brake pads were wearing very thin, so I booked it in to have those changed which was done today.

Yes, those had had it.

One of the sliders on the offside was quite well stuck too so it was a job worth doing.  For the price asked (£89 including the pads, fitting and VAT) it just wasn't worth me doing it myself.   Especially given the Caddy needs to Just Work, me not having time to get to things just isn't an option.  Even though they'll still need to bed in the brakes definitely feel more positive already.

Hoping to get a quick driving video of the Rover done this weekend if I can borrow another family member to hold the camera.

[LightBulbFun]

Awesome to see you had a good weekend away, while we had ours so to speak, and very awesome to hear the Rover is continuing to provide sterling service  I look forward to that driving video when it can be done  

and dont worry I also got very badly burnt, my face/forehead was/is definitely giving a lot of cars in the lacquer peel thread a run for their money! and the tops of my hands have turned some very funny shades that I dont think I have seen before...

[LightBulbFun]

Hey @Zelandeth check this out! its period picture of one TPA's close relatives   

a really good high resolution picture at that of a really good example showing what TPA would of looked like when she was new, with dash change, plastic Desmo mirror, 12 inch wheels, and the orignial Ace pressed metal plates with the uniquely serifed P  

@dollywobbler gave me a heads up the picture existed, so I quickly tracked it down and pinched from https://ialwaysbelievedinfutures.com/6-static-caravan-parks-in-british-beauty-spots/ some digging around on the server presented an awesome 5000x3470! version to me  https://ialwaysbelievedinfutures.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/annie-spratt-CjWpx0xDoBU-unsplash.jpg and it looks like the blog post(?) got it from here https://unsplash.com/photos/CjWpx0xDoBU

its also is fitting, as it goes very well with this previous picture I had of one of TWC's reletives's also very original (and also like TWC750K, TPA729M did not survive for all that long sadly, coming off the road pre 1983)

On 26/02/2023 at 10:33, LightBulbFun said:

Whoa! check this out its another TWC! TWC750K, not DVLA live so it came off the road within a couple years of being photographed 

https://www.facebook.com/olivier.stourme/posts/pfbid0367cPhnEhZQto6zBVDi6QbGTcaTsUJqTAdT8FiMniaCyTxnxx8oJFxu2i97wLWipnl

always wondered if any of TWC's sister cars had been papped! Obviously like most other Model 70's there was a whole block of TWC's TWC701K-TWC800K

so the possibility was always out there, but the statistical chances of it where slim, so this is very awesome to see! its also awesome to see as its a highly original spec car, and shows what @dollywobbler's TWC would of looked like when new (give or take some wheel trims!)

complete with original rear lights, dash-change still even (which is pretty interesting to see still present in 1980) and  Tippers pressed number plates  

 

[Zelandeth]

This afternoon's entertainment.

Wanted to see if I could get to the bottom of a few electrical issues.  Three things that didn't work were the clock, the radio and brake fluid/handbrake warning light.  

First up, a disclaimer.  I know this car is positive ground - for the sake of clarity I am using the terms power and ground here.  Power in this case is -12V, and ground is the body ground - so battery positive.   Using power/ground just makes it easier to keep track of rather than trying to keep your head wrapped around what is positive and such.  It doesn't really make any odds as far as working on the system is concerned - you just have a negative sign on the multimeter - nothing is actually wired any differently to a negative ground car - it's literally just the battery leads are swapped round.

The reason (well, *a* reason anyway) the radio didn't work was immediately apparent.  The power supply not being connected to anything would do that.

I'm guessing that was originally connected to this.

Which ran to one of the ignition switched terminals on the ignition switch.

Not  worrying about that too much just now as this will need it's turn on the workbench before I even think about supplying it with power.

Odd looking setup.  My guess is that the big finned block up top is the output stage, so they're using a purely transistor based driver for the audio side, my guess is using some of the funky field effect valves which allowed you to get away with only a 12V HT rail, so doing away with the need for a vibrator for a high voltage supply.  

The clock it turns out does have 12V, so will need to be serviced separately.

Next it was time to look into the brake warning light.  I'm definitely not the first person to be in here.

That red wire with a white tracer is a hot wire from the panel lighting rheostat which has apparently been bypassed (except for the clock), and is indeed live (I have since put a terminal on there so it's now got no potential for shorting out on anything).

Figuring out what's going on with the brake warning light requires a bit of thought.  If you supply power to the lamp it will light, the ground is solid.  I'd originally thought it was the ground which was switched (as tends to be the normal practice for warning lights), but looking at the circuit diagram it's actually the power side which is switched.

Now it would have been smart if I'd looked at this *before* I spent time actually poking around.  I do now know that, so I'll have another look another day.  We don't have a short to ground anywhere at least which is a good start.  We just seem to be missing our supply.

Something I did find floating around behind the dash was a bit of speaker wire which was poorly stuffed into one of the butt connectors.  Following that and adding a proper connector resulted in this springing to life.

Didn't even know it existed when I started out today.

Imagine it would have had a cover at some point, but that seems to be long gone.  The passenger door switch doesn't work either.  Better than nothing though.

What then followed was a battle.  One of the first things I did here was disconnection of the speedometer drive cable.  This is necessary to get the instrument panel folded down to any usable extent.  

Putting it back together is a pretty simple task.  Offer cable up to back of speedometer head, wiggle it around a bit until it seats properly, then push the retaining collar up and screw it back together.  Simple.

In theory.   However there is nearly no slack in the cable to work with - and being typically over engineered as things on this car tend to be, the speedometer cable isn't just some plastic sheathed thing - no it's a stinking great metal spiral wound thing that's a good 1/2" thick - think trying to manipulate a very chunky shower hose, with the tips of one and a half fingers.  I found that I had just enough strength available to either hold things in place OR rotate the retaining collar.  Not even close to enough to do both however.

It took me over an hour of fighting with it to eventually get it back together.  I'm going to investigate when I next end up back there whether there's anything I can do to avoid that farce - if it can be released at the gearbox end without a major operation to give us a bit more play I'll take that route, as this was really a pain!

Thankfully I managed to not end up with anything else not working!  All three lights in the area I'd been poking around with were still working.

 

[Zelandeth]

Would you look at that...

We have a working brake fluid level/handbrake warning light.

Turned out to be really simple - I noted that one of the terminals on the brake fluid reservoir had been replaced and covered in heat shrink.  Turned out that one wasn't actually captive in the crimp at all.  Which turned out to be the one which supplies 12V to the circuit (from there it jumps off to the handbrake switch as well).  One new crimp later and it's working as intended.

Definitely not something you can miss - the lens is structured such that it's very much focused on the driver.

Which given the whole only having single circuit brakes thing means that you REALLY want to know if there's been any loss of fluid isn't a bad thing.  Exactly the same reason fixing this was high on my to do list.

The fuel leak from the filler neck was similarly easily resolved, even if it was a bit fiddly.

Cause turned out to be the hose clip at the filler end not actually being in place.

My guess is that it's been like that for a while but I disturbed it enough to break the seal when I replaced the missing retaining bolts for the filter neck itself a little while back.  So it then peed petrol all over the place when I filled the tank last time.

Evidence of which can clearly be seen both on the exhaust and from the stain on the pavement.

The clip has now been coerced back into the correct location and tightened up.  I've since fuelled up without any leakage, and the smell of fuel from that corner of the car is basically gone.

The rubber elbow is a bit perished though so I'll probably order a replacement to have on hand next time I'm putting a parts order in.  That's probably insurance against it getting any worse!

[Surface Rust]

Great work.

I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with your clock as mine has never worked either, and I've no idea where to start.

I did manage to get all my door switches working again, it was mostly just corroded wire crimps. The interior illumination is lovely in them, and each rear door has its own lamp as well.

[SiC]

Well I'm not doing very well here! What with missing the points gap on number 1 dizzy cam and now this.

I put the heatshrink and replaced the crimp that after noting the crimp was in a poor shape. Heatshrink was even so it was strain relieved properly. Picture evidence says I replaced it but I must have done a crap job. Sorry about that! Was the wire missing entirely from the crimp or did it not crimp properly?

I spent ages trying to find why that light wasn't working and trying to find the other end of that circuit!

 

Interestingly that same picture group, I did take a picture of the regulator. I didn't see the split wire that you did and can't see it in this photo either.

 

Now the brake light works, you might have to adjust the handbrake switch under the car so that works properly again. I tried my best but it was getting late and the light wasn't working yet anyway. 

[Zelandeth]

1 hour ago, SiC said:

Well I'm not doing very well here! What with missing the points gap on number 1 dizzy cam and now this.

I put the heatshrink and replaced the crimp that after noting the crimp was in a poor shape. Heatshrink was even so it was strain relieved properly. Picture evidence says I replaced it but I must have done a crap job. Sorry about that! Was the wire missing entirely from the crimp or did it not crimp properly?

I spent ages trying to find why that light wasn't working and trying to find the other end of that circuit!

 

Interestingly that same picture group, I did take a picture of the regulator. I didn't see the split wire that you did and can't see it in this photo either.

 

Now the brake light works, you might have to adjust the handbrake switch under the car so that works properly again. I tried my best but it was getting late and the light wasn't working yet anyway. 

Don't worry about it.  We've all been there!

The one wire just pulled out with very little effort so I don't think the crimp had grabbed it properly.  The other one was at least reasonably firmly attached.  If it didn't work when you got the car either there's definitely an element of bad luck there too as you wouldn't have had the thing you touched as a point of suspicion.

Handbrake switch based on fiddling with it in the driveway appears to be working fine.  Will know for certain after I next take the car out.

I could have saved myself most of an afternoon of messing around chasing it yesterday if I'd looked at the wiring diagram first!

[High Jetter]

21 hours ago, Surface Rust said:

Great work.

I'm looking forward to seeing what you do with your clock as mine has never worked either, and I've no idea where to start.

I did manage to get all my door switches working again, it was mostly just corroded wire crimps. The interior illumination is lovely in them, and each rear door has its own lamp as well.

This company advertises in the back of PC, and their website states they do Smiths time clocks as well as gauges: https://classicsparesengineering.co.uk/classic-spares-services

[Zelandeth]

3 hours ago, High Jetter said:

This company advertises in the back of PC, and their website states they do Smiths time clocks as well as gauges: https://classicsparesengineering.co.uk/classic-spares-services

Useful to know if I get stuck.  Hopefully will just need a good clean and couple of drops of the correct oil in the correct places though.

[High Jetter]

T'was more for @Surface Rust's benefit actually, as I guess you'll probably be able to sort yours out yourself. Still, you never know when knowing about a firm like that will come in handy.

[Zelandeth]

Work day for the Rover.  Recycling centre run time.

Which was also required to empty my waste oil container so I can do an oil change on the Rover.  Though I do need to pick up a larger oil pan first - this thing holds two GALLONS of oil...which is roughly twice the size of my current one.  The tray (which I think is actually a battery box) I use for the van won't work as it's too tall.

A box of bits arrived this morning.

The radiator cap is obviously a quick and easy one.

The old one has had it.  While the seal is actually in good shape and still pliable the spring has lost all its tension so it just sort of sat there rather than holding any pressure.

The distributor cap doesn't look that great externally, but the actual machining of the posts internally looks decent enough so I'll give it the benefit of the doubt.  Will try to get that installed tomorrow.

Now I've been having a bit more of a think and poke around regarding my issues with the rear suspension.  I'm less convinced now that the shocks are actually responsible.  

I've established that if you rock the car there is actually movement there, but it's very stiff.  For instance if I sit down on the boot lip, the suspension doesn't visibly move at all.

Having had a crawl around under the car I have a theory.  What I can see of the springs are very dry and rusty looking.   Now from what I remember of the theory of how multi layer leaf springs work, the leaves *need* to be able to freely and smoothly move against each other...otherwise it's basically just a big block of metal.

Ideally the whole lot needs to come apart to be cleaned up and lubricated.  I'm assuming you'd want to use something graphite based so that even if it dries out the lubricating properties will be retained.  What I've dealt with in this regard before was on ancient agricultural equipment, where it was annually painted with hot oil...which while I'm sure wasn't the manufacturer approved solution seemed to always work.  

I'm inclined to go and drown the whole area in penetrating oil then after a while with something more likely to stick around better.  Long term it all needs to be dismantled and serviced, but that's not going to be happening in the near future.  I can't see this hurting anything.

I will need to check the ride height as well - I've no idea how old these springs are and it's not unlikely that they're very tired.  If that's the case it will probably make sense to replace them.  They're not cheap at £180 a side - but from what I've heard from the last couple of folks I know who tried to get a set of springs re-tempered and had an absolute nightmare of a time, that's likely to be by far the lowest stress option.

I'm curious to see if a thorough in situ oiling does anything though.  Watch this space I guess.

While crawling around under the back of the car I did notice something I'd previously missed.

That would explain the intermittent hollow metallic rattle from the nearside rear corner.

After a rummage through the drawer of random fasteners (doesn't everyone have one?) I had sorted that.  The clamp sort of squished rather than gracefully closed up, but it is now firmly holding the pipe - and the rattle is gone.

I couldn't find any washers the right size...but it's an exhaust clamp.  It'll be fine.

Last thing for the day was cleaning out the crankcase breather oil separators.

Don't reckon it's long since they were last done as there was very little crud in there.  There's one more on the other side buried under the inlet manifold which I'll need to check on at a later date.  Though it's clear that this engine has really little blow by, which supports my belief that this engine has seen quite a bit of work over its life.  At 150K miles otherwise I'd be expecting this to be showing signs of being really rather tired, which this engine really doesn't show as far as I can tell.

Glad to report that in normal use that the handbrake light does indeed work perfectly now, so the work SiC did in reviving the switch has worked perfectly, likewise his setting of the adjustment.

[SiC]

There is a brand new oil filter and radiator cap in the box of bits I left with the car. 

[Zelandeth]

Apparently I totally missed that!  Oh well, cap was only a few quid, and the oil filter can be in stock for the next change.

[barrett]

Get an old paint brush and slather on a load of old engine oil to the sides of the leaf springs when you do the oil change. There probably was a manufacturer-approved product at the time, but using old oil is general practice in the Vintage car world for anything with leaves. Possibly not much help if they're already totally seized up but I make a point of doing it every now and then with my old stuff and it certainly doesn't hurt things.

[Zelandeth]

Ah.  This seems familiar.

It's not immediately obvious where this is coming from, but it's a leak present whether the engine is running or not (unlike the original one I fixed), and I think my prime suspect is the sump gasket itself.  Based on the length of the dipstick it looks like the oil level does sit higher than the base of the block, so a failed gasket would cause a steady drip.

While looking around I noticed this.

The clamp on the upper hose just needed to be nipped up a bit.

Only other job I had time for was finally fitting the new distributor cap.  Which as the leads need to be screwed into it from underneath does take a few minutes longer than on modern style ones.

I do really need to check the timing given when I had the distributor apart it was put back in purely by eye.

[PhilA]

The springs on mine have a thin metal case around them to prevent dirt ingress.

The approved lubricant is regular grease, injected under pressure through a hole either side on the lowest leaf.

Because it required a stupid machine to do it at the dealership it never got done.

But yeah, pulling them apart, cleaning up and greasing is important.

[SiC]

23 hours ago, Zelandeth said:

prime suspect is the sump gasket itself

There is a bunch of posts I've seen recently on the P4 Drivers Guild Facebook page where people have been removing the sumps as apparently many P4 of this age are pretty sludged up. Probably because the engines are built well and so don't need any more than regular oil changes and not a rebuild for many, many miles. So unlike the equivalent OHV A/B series/SC lump/etc that need a rebuild after 60k to 80k, at 100k+ these can still be happily running. 

So if you do the sump gasket, probably worth buying a few cans of brake clean or a spare can of petrol to get scrubbing if it needs it while you're there. 

[SiC]

Timing wise, I couldn't see anything on the pulley to indicate TDC (but I didn't look massively hard). I couldn't find a reference to one in the Autodata manual that I had (and should still be with the car) either. So you may have to pull number 1 plug and have a turn till you find it and go from there with an adjustable timing gun. 

I did wonder when ignition timing lights were invented? Old strobes on cameras used to be one shot things until Xenon flash tubes became common place. I guess we have a resident expert on this thread who probably knows or would want to find out that little bit of information 😂

 

[Zelandeth]

13 hours ago, SiC said:

Timing wise, I couldn't see anything on the pulley to indicate TDC (but I didn't look massively hard). I couldn't find a reference to one in the Autodata manual that I had (and should still be with the car) either. So you may have to pull number 1 plug and have a turn till you find it and go from there with an adjustable timing gun. 

I did wonder when ignition timing lights were invented? Old strobes on cameras used to be one shot things until Xenon flash tubes became common place. I guess we have a resident expert on this thread who probably knows or would want to find out that little bit of information 😂

 

They were certainly around when this car was built, though probably using a neon light source similar to this: Link rather than xenon like more modern ones.

I tend to buy brake clean by the box every six months or so, so there's plenty here if needed.

[Zelandeth]

So where were we?  I had a mystery fluid leak on the Rover.

Which after a bit of examination was found to be coolant.

The bit of oil in there was already in the pan.

This prompted me to do a bit of digging.  The suggestion I'd seen from someone of possibly a core plug being to blame didn't seem that unreasonable as we clearly had coolant running down the side of the block.

Which I had originally thought was just historic oil leakage - which it obviously isn't given that it dried up after leaving the engine warm for half an hour or so.

The core plug suggestion looked doubtful by this point though as the dampness looked to start higher up than that.  A suspicion which was confirmed by further running tests with the intake ducting out of the way so I could get a better look.

That is water dripping off the rear of the cylinder head.  Hmm.  Two possible causes I can see for this.  The obvious being a leak from the head gasket, secondly would be if there's a core plug or similar on the rear of the head itself, that having failed.  The coolant could then track along the seam from there and run down the side of the engine.  Though the way forward for either of these is identical, as the rear of the head is pretty much hard up against the bulkhead so there's no access to the rear of it to do any remedial work - I've not even been able to get a look to see whether there is anything back there despite having spent a good few minutes faffing about with mirrors and such.  

I *will* be making absolutely completely sure it's not tracking along from the thermostat housing or something daft like that, but I don't think it is, it's the rear where things look wet.  Front of the engine is dry.

Conveniently, I do already have this in stock.

As it was the more sensible way to buy the inlet valve cover gasket given I knew I was probably going to wind up needing to replace a decent number of those seals at some point anyway.

Doesn't look like a bad job to get the head off.  

[] Remove distributor cap and HT leads as one assembly.

[] Drain oil (which annoyingly has only been in there for a few hours of run time!).

[] Drain coolant.

[] Detach top radiator hose at thermostat housing.

[] Detach coolant lines from underside of intake manifold.

[] Unbolt heater hose bracket from rear of intake manifold.

[] Disconnect vacuum line.

[] Detach carb from manifold - I think it can just stay where it is.

[] Disconnect and remove ignition coil.

[] Disconnect temperature senders (there are two - one for the temperature gauge, one for the cold start reminder light).

[] Remove intake valve cover.

[] Unbolt head and remove.

I think that's basically it.  No need to distrurb the distributor as it runs into the block rather than the head and there looks to be enough clearance.  Obviously no need to mess with the exhaust thankfully as that whole side of things is attached to the block because this is an inlet over exhaust engine.

To be honest, the head was likely going to have to come off at some point anyway to deal with the perished O-ring which sits between the head and water pump.  Which I'm sure will be an absolute pain to get back into place.

So the Rover has now assumed it's position for the next week or two in the "patient under treatment" bay.

I get the impression from the amount of rust staining on the side of the block that it's been weeping for quite a while, just slowly enough as to not really be obvious - until I fixed the rest of the cooling system and it ran up to the correct pressure for the first time in forever.  That's what I get for fixing things!

In other news, these arrived a few days ago.

Which after no small amount of searching, hopefully contained replacements for the failed gear shift bushing on the Renault.

I ended up with two candidates arriving from totally different sources arriving at the same time, one being a NOS single bush, the other a more recent complete kit for replacing all the other bushes on the linkage.

The two clear bushes on the left were what I was interested in.

A quick comparison with the mangled remains of the old one showed I did have the right part at least.

Not much left of the old one.

Sorted!

Yeah...that was "fun" to get in place.  The bush is made of a very stiff material.  I wound up having to use a G-clamp to press it into place in the linkage and the same again then to pop the bush onto the ball on the gear selector shaft.  No way I was ever going to manage it by hand.

There is now also a loosely fitted zip tie around the upper linkage shaft just to catch the lower one if it were ever to come apart in future, preventing things from being able to drop far enough to hit the road.

Guess I should probably remove the boot full of bits of Rover before I start actually using it as a car again... though I need to really get my behind in gear regarding getting the welding it needs done as the MOT isn't far off due now.

However the car has actually moved again for the first time in well over a month.

Which is a nice morale boost at least.