Are Old Cars Really Unreliable?

[Negative Creep]

One of the young lads at work as one of those insurance telemetry boxes and he is prohibited from revving the motor. Probably a sensible thing in regards to his driving but staying below 2000rpm literally all the time can't be doing the motor any good. It's already 8 years old and he's committed to a 5 year payment plan. I quietly think he's going to have trouble with it in a couple of years time (not to mention he's paing £2500 insurance and already has a 50/50 fault claim in his first year....

5 years of payments on an 8 year old car? I dread to think how much that will end up costing him

[sierraman]

There's lots of cars you'd now consider old that, when they were current were expensive to repair. The mk1 Mondeo for example, when they were fairly modern people were terrified of the clutch going as it was mega bucks, same for if the cat went or if you had to replace those 'low profile tyres'. As soon as they were past their first flush of youth it became less an issue.

[Snipes]

There's lots of cars you'd now consider old that, when they were current were expensive to repair. The mk1 Mondeo for example, when they were fairly modern people were terrified of the clutch going as it was mega bucks, same for if the cat went or if you had to replace those 'low profile tyres'. As soon as they were past their first flush of youth it became less an issue.

That clutch job still is mega bucks isn't it? Just less remarkable since the addition of DMFs and multiple knackered starter motors?

[Wilko220]

One of the young lads at work as one of those insurance telemetry boxes and he is prohibited from revving the motor. Probably a sensible thing in regards to his driving but staying below 2000rpm literally all the time can't be doing the motor any good...

Sounds bloody dangerous to me, leaving aside any long-term impact on the engine.

[UltraWomble]

I cant really add a lot that hasnt been said already.

 

Old cars require more fettling than newer cars to keep them running in tip top order.

 

That said old cars tend to be less complex beasts when they go wrong.

 

Horses for courses - can you fettle with a car? Then get something older ( 70's early 80's) and enjoy it. Dont like getting your hands dirty? Then buy something from Kneecap Direct Finance and change every 3 years.

[sierraman]

That clutch job still is mega bucks isn't it? Just less remarkable since the addition of DMFs and multiple knackered starter motors?

Yes but you just scrap it and get another for £4-500. Last time I put a clutch in a mk1 it was £325 for cash. Not bad to say it had done 120k on the original

[RoadworkUK]

Are old cars really unreliable?

 

Only really unreliable ones.

 

NEXT QUESTION

[paulplom]

5 years of payments on an 8 year old car? I dread to think how much that will end up costing him

Yes but it'll be automatic autoshite when it's paid for FTW!

[Bobthebeard]

Old and basic cars can be reliable if well looked after. Stuff from the 1970's or 80's. Later cars with the new fangled electronic stuff from the early 90's may pose a problem at times though.

[nisfan]

Over the years ive had a few problems with shitters and managed to get them going again, ive got a 1991 civic that is like a newer car with electronics and can i get the fucker to start? Not a chance, im thinking i might have to get a garage involved! Perish the thought

[Snipes]

I'm going to stick my neck out and say the best invention to keep the motoring masses reliably moving was fuel injection.

[SiC]

I'm going to stick my neck out and say the best invention to keep the motoring masses reliably moving was fuel injection.

Only by the time they'd refined it in the 90s and early 00s. By early 10s, they decided economy wasn't good enough and went direct injection on a lot of petrols (especially VAG). Not much simplier than a common rail diesel.

[RayMK]

Over the years ive had a few problems with shitters and managed to get them going again, ive got a 1991 civic that is like a newer car with electronics and can i get the fucker to start? Not a chance, im thinking i might have to get a garage involved! Perish the thought

 

When I had my Nissan QX (1996 model: 2 litre V6), bought to bring some refinement and Japanese reliability in to my life, I was profoundly disappointed.  Refined, yes, the engine was the smoothest and quietest I've ever owned, but the suspension was poor except on motorways.  Reliable?  Was it hell!  Three FTPs in the first three months.  A Japanese car specialist diagnosed various sensor failures and replaced them.  Great, I thought.  Forgiven.  A few weeks later it failed to start - symptoms were identical to the first time.  I got it recovered to a Nissan main dealer, described its recent past and showed them the receipts and they diagnosed another sensor as u/s and replaced it.  I drove away somewhat disgruntled at yet another £100+ bill.  A week later....you get the picture.  I had it recovered back to the main dealer who said they'd fixed it.  They fixed it again and wanted me to pay again.  I kicked up a fuss and they let me  have it for free as a gesture of goodwill.  A week or two later the bugger failed to start.  This time, I whipped the plugs out at work and roasted them in an oven, then rushed out, refitted them as quickly as possible and it started after a short struggle.  I thought bollocks to bloody electronics and their equally idiotic diagnostic machines.  It was (fairly) obvious to me that the starter was not spinning the engine fast enough despite the new battery fitted by the selling dealer.  I bought a new starter and spent about three hours excavating a route down to the starter through miriads of pipes and wires, fitted it, refilled the hole with all  the bits I'd removed and it started as good as gold.  Despite the fact that it did not FTP again in the next 30K miles, my trust in it and my faith in over-complicated electronically controlled vehicles was destroyed.  I now run a Peugeot 205 automatic which has given me a bit of hassle twice in 2 years and 20K - but it is so fixable and easily maintained that I am less concerned about reliability issues.  That doesn't stop me lusting after an old Camry though....at some point, maybe I will.

[Skizzer]

I took a brave pill and drove my 19-year-old, 160k-mile, overdue-a-service Discovery the 200 miles to work in London this week, instead of the modern BMW that's supposed to do that job.

 

So far so good: the only fault was the Gorilla tape sealing the for'ard sunroof went a bit flappy on the motorway. It's also more comfy and a great deal easier on my dodgy knee than the BM or the Audi 80. It's like driving a V8 conservatory, it's great.

 

Ask me about reliability again after it's battled the traffic jams homeward on Friday night. Fingers crossed.

 

It's a well-loved workhorse Land Rover, so of course the cruise control doesn't work, some buttons have fallen off the stereo, the digital clock reads E:98 when it's half past six and it's a bit leaky from the various unnecessary skylights. But none of these are what people in stripey shirts call mission-critical.

[Pete-M]

That wasn't the question.

I know.

 

I like old cars. I also like new cars.

 

If I required a car to do a flat out run across Europe I'd take a new one, because it is less likely to FTP.

 

If I required a car to stand next to at a cars and coffee meet, I'd take an old one.

[danthecapriman]

I know.

I like old cars. I also like new cars.

If I required a car to do a flat out run across Europe I'd take a new one, because it is less likely to FTP.

If I required a car to stand next to at a cars and coffee meet, I'd take an old one.

Fuck that! I'd take my Mercury. It's what it was built for and it'd make a great road trip.

[scruff]

I reckon that anything post 1980 ought to be up to it given basic servicing, people getting the jitters about driving something from the 90s a few hundred miles amuse me but hey we've all got different comfort zones.

 

My only transport is my ex-cros A35 and it's the tits. No FTPs, done a bit of tinkering to it because it's old and you know what I like old stuff. It replaced a 1952 series 1 Land Rover and the Austin feels like a Rolls-Royce in comparison, having a heater is a novelty which hasn't worn off yet. 

[mercrocker]

Without exception, every broken down vehicle I pass is newer than anything I have.    Sometimes very new.   QED.

[Skizzer]

people getting the jitters about driving something from the 90s a few hundred miles amuse me

 

Sorry if I'm not hardcore enough for you.

 

Feel free to be 'amused', but as posted elsewhere my Discovery has recent history of leaking ATF, cutting out at idle and being reluctant to start when it rains. But who said anything about jitters? I just got in and drove it.

 

The whole point of my post was it's an old car by most people's standards and yet it isn't unreliable. As per thread title.

[scruff]

Blimey Skizzer I wasn't attacking you, sorry for any internet offence I may have caused, it was more of a general observation than a dig at anyone in particular. 

[New POD]

 

 But none of these are what people in stripey shirts call mission-critical.

 

I think the aerospace reliability engineers, also use a term Derogated performance.  So failure of speedo lighting, in a car does not leave one stranded, but is a failure, or evidence of unreliability.

The trick is to make the "nice to have" features not stop the mission.

I'm not sure, I've ever owned a car that didn't have a fault. Even the 19K cavalier we were given by my father in law, had a faulty intermittent emissions warning lamp, and had been dodgy since new. Always passed emissions even when the pissburg carb was worn to buggery at 130K.

[DodgyBastard]

I've been driving the 305 to work this week

 

Applecross in a 305 by srblythe, on Flickr

 

I've been running it into the ground ever since I bought it, I've covered over 8k miles in the last year or so and only replaced a seal on the pump and welded the exhaust back on. It's a bit of a chore to drive at this time of year because it's slightly damp inside so frost appears on both sides of the glass and it takes ages to demist.

It's due its mot at the end of the month and definitely needs some love and attention. Are old cars unreliable? It really depends who you buy them off...

If you buy from me it's pretty much guaranteed to be totally fucked due to neglect and doing the bare minimum to keep it going, If you buy from someone like Wilsonx2 who spends money fixing most of the faults then sells them on at a loss you'll very likely get a reliable car...

[gtd2000]

I can only say that from experience as a youngster my father tended to have new or nearly new Fords from the 60's through to the early 80's. There was also a FIAT 126 (NSG916M) that was bought brand new and run for two years and traded in a for a brand new Ford Escort MK11 Estate (KKS429P).

 

All of them were absolutely WANK at starting during the winter and rusted like buggery!

 

That all changed when my Dad bought a Datsun Sunny Estate in 1983 - best thing since sliced bread as far as I was concerned.

 

I've been an Asian car buyer from day one as a result...

[Cheggers]

I've been an Asian car buyer from day one as a result...

My mate Raj is one of those...

[Skizzer]

Blimey Skizzer I wasn't attacking you, sorry for any internet offence I may have caused, it was more of a general observation than a dig at anyone in particular.

 

Apologies for my over-reaction, I should have known better. Let's shake hands and I'll buy you an internet pint.

 

An A35 and a 1952 Land Rover as dailies are indeed pretty heroic, which would have been a better response.

[danthecapriman]

I can only say that from experience as a youngster my father tended to have new or nearly new Fords from the 60's through to the early 80's. There was also a FIAT 126 (NSG916M) that was bought brand new and run for two years and traded in a for a brand new Ford Escort MK11 Estate (KKS429P).

 

All of them were absolutely WANK at starting during the winter and rusted like buggery!

 

That all changed when my Dad bought a Datsun Sunny Estate in 1983 - best thing since sliced bread as far as I was concerned.

 

I've been an Asian car buyer from day one as a result...

Weird really, other peoples experiences.

I've got three old European Fords of that era, and all three of them are on the button starters even in freezing weather. In fact even my old Volvo wouldn't start a few years ago when we got all that snow but the Capri did! It's never failed me that car!

Mind you, the Capri and now Transit have both had their original Ford carbs replaced for Weber's so maybe that's the key? Old Ford carbs never did have that great a reputation. The VV my Transit had until a few weeks ago was a right pig but it always started, just never ran smoothly.

My Granada still has it's original Pierburg carb though, still runs fine after nearly 200k miles!

[gtd2000]

My mate Raj is one of those...

 

Haha Jolly good!

 

A few years back, I would have been "Japanese" but there's been a couple of Malaysian and a number of Korean cars sneaking in over the years now

[gtd2000]

Weird really, other peoples experiences.

I've got three old European Fords of that era, and all three of them are on the button starters even in freezing weather. In fact even my old Volvo wouldn't start a few years ago when we got all that snow but the Capri did! It's never failed me that car!

Mind you, the Capri and now Transit have both had their original Ford carbs replaced for Weber's so maybe that's the key? Old Ford carbs never did have that great a reputation. The VV my Transit had until a few weeks ago was a right pig but it always started, just never ran smoothly.

My Granada still has it's original Pierburg carb though, still runs fine after nearly 200k miles!

 

Could be down to being almost on the equator in Hampshire vs up here in the Artic?

 

My mother's '78 Mini was never as bad at starting but when she traded up to an '83 Honda Civic (Accclaim Style) it was a league apart in comfort.

[sierraman]

Not necessarily. I wouldn't like to bet a 2.3 Sierra Diesel would make trouble free pleasant transport now. A lot of the old percieved reliable stuff like old 405 Diesels and Cavaliers with the Isuzu lump is just worn out now.

[twosmoke300]

I had a 2.3 d sierra a couple of years ago for a year . Lovely drive just so bloody slow on the hills . Not great on fuel either