Rover P6 2000TC - NEW EVIDENCE, what do you think?

[N Dentressangle]

Points taken, but given their obvious age I'd say the black and silvers are the originals. Whoever ordered the car presumably specifically requested them.

The reflectives in the photos from 1996 look way too clean and new for 26 year old number plates to me.

[lesapandre]

I wonder how would they have reappeared on the car?  When the change was made to reflective  - it unlikely the original plates wd have been retained? 

Possible of course - popped in the boot etc - but they would have to have survived ownership changes as well?

Cars in period look good with the reflective plates IMHO.

@LightBulbFun is our ninja guru here.

All very interesting as usual. Great car with whatever plates.

My family had two from new. Their one downfall (the car not my family!) was they were very slightly too small - we thought the back seat a bit cramped and the boot too small for us. But that was down to Rover's product planning - was where the Triumph 2000 had the edge there.

Was a turquoise 2000 then a brown 3.5.

But there was really nothing on the market at the time to match them. This was of course before foreign cars got any foothold. 

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, N Dentressangle said:

Points taken, but given their obvious age I'd say the black and silvers are the originals. Whoever ordered the car presumably specifically requested them.

The reflectives in the photos from 1996 look way too clean and new for 26 year old number plates to me.

back when this Rover P6 was new, a retroreflective plate would of been seen as the thing to have, as mentioned by @lesapandre, you even had motorfactors selling you kits to paint your old black number plates! you only really saw non-retroreflective plates on vehicles of this age on fleet vehicles and the such like, or if the first owner or person replacing the number plates was particularly stingy and or unbothered by modern trends at the time/an old giffer etc

you can tell in the current photos the front and rears are non-matching as the fonts of the digits are distinctly different, so even irrespective of the above there has been some plate replacement at some point in time

 

heres a comparison of the front with a known modern Tippers Vintage plate

and heres the rears compared with a couple known Ace plates from the period  

 

 

perhaps with a bit of careful work the original could be stripped back to its original finish?  

[High Jetter]

25 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

you even had motorfactors selling you kits to paint your old black number plates!

Really? Was not aware of that - wouldn't it have been illegal?

[lesapandre]

Quite legal. The reflective started as a safety feature I think @LightBulbFun - the legislation actually caught up later and made them mandatory?

So in the 1970's - 80's there were a fair few even 1950's cars with 'converted' plates.

[N Dentressangle]

From going through the history, it looks like the owner in the '90s was this gentleman:

http://www.pensailing.co.uk/0000/bernard-carter-psc-president/

Bernard kept all bills, receipts and detailed records of everything done to the car, but doesn't mention numberplates, and unfortunately we can't ask him.

Maybe an owner since changed things round?

[N Dentressangle]

First owner, until 1985, was a Mr Cain of Formby. Rightmove suggests Larkhill Lane is a pretty salubrious address!

[mk2_craig]

I bet that car had a really cherished existence for most of its life and if kept garaged/used sparingly then those reflective plates in the 1990s photos could well be the originals. Prefer them to the black and silvers in all honesty! 

[Dj_efk]

Yep agree it would have had reflectives when new on a J reg. To me anything after a G reg (at the very latest) doesn't look right with black and white / black and silver plates

[N Dentressangle]

15 minutes ago, Dj_efk said:

Yep agree it would have had reflectives when new on a J reg. To me anything after a G reg (at the very latest) doesn't look right with black and white / black and silver plates

Now I'm DEFINITELY scrapping it

[Dick Cheeseburger]

On 18/01/2025 at 18:11, N Dentressangle said:

 

Much better, although I'm still not that keen on the silver pin striping for some reason.

This looks spot on. 

[N Dentressangle]

Time to get it up in the air and fix a few issues:

• the rear brakes are pulsing quite badly, presumably a sticking caliper or warped disc
• there are a couple of rust holes at the end of each sill that need welding up
• box sections under the back seat need rust proofing
• remove fuel tank and free off the seized sender unit so the fuel gauge works

Up on the stands we go then:

No denying the sheer weirdness of the de Dion rear suspension:

There's surface rust from having been in storage for 17 years, but some of the original factory paint is left on the trailing arms. Good wire brush needed and maybe a lick of paint.

The two holes at the end of the sills look easy enough to weld up. No doubt they'll get a bit bigger when I attack them with the grinder and wire wheel, but the rest of the lower sill looks sound, and just starting to rust where the underseal has cracked:

I'll probably take the sill covers off for completeness and fix any more holes, but looking in one of the jacking bungs they're solid and covered in oil / waxoyl.

Arches look OK, just ready for a wire brush and fresh underseal:

Same story with the floors:

The infamous inboard discs are another bit of weirdness. The calipers look like they're working OK, and there's meat on the recent-looking pads, so I'm not seeing anything obvious so far which is causing the brake symptoms. Needs more investigation. You can see the fuel gauge wires and fuel pipe from the tank on the right of this pic too:

So there you go. I'll probably sort the bodywork first then see if I can be arsed with the brakes or farm it out to my local garage. Not as big a fan of lying under cars as I was 30 years ago 😉

[ETCHY]

This is a car that came out in 1963.. You look at them & think where did it all go wrong. We built something so advanced all that time ago.

Incredible cars, 62 years later & still cool.

I like the black plates, wrong or not.

[SiC]

How do you remove the rear discs on the P6? Presumably driveshaft out but is it just a case of undoing it on the disc side or does the wheel assembly need to come off too?

[N Dentressangle]

8 minutes ago, SiC said:

How do you remove the rear discs on the P6? Presumably driveshaft out but is it just a case of undoing it on the disc side or does the wheel assembly need to come off too?

Like this, I believe:

https://dev6.wirewheelswebbers.co.uk/rear-brake-pads-on-rover-p6/

Not as complex as you might think.

[SiC]

49 minutes ago, N Dentressangle said:

Like this, I believe:

https://dev6.wirewheelswebbers.co.uk/rear-brake-pads-on-rover-p6/

Not as complex as you might think.

I'm glad you said that. I know these have a reputation for hard to work on brake systems but when I look at those photos, I thought "that doesn't look too bad".

[Conrad D. Conelrad]

Check this area of your dedion elbows super close, they have a habit of rusting and then releasing your trailing arm at an inopportune moment. There was a bad incident a few years ago resulting in a fatality.  The car was outwardly immaculate. 
 

[Conrad D. Conelrad]

23 minutes ago, SiC said:

I'm glad you said that. I know these have a reputation for hard to work on brake systems but when I look at those photos, I thought "that doesn't look too bad".

My brake system meme is really about the rear callipers themselves, which incorporate the worlds shittiest handbrake mechanism which enjoys filling up with brake fluid and is a massive pain in the arse to rebuild.   

[N Dentressangle]

9 hours ago, Conrad D. Conelrad said:

Check this area of your dedion elbows super close, they have a habit of rusting and then releasing your trailing arm at an inopportune moment. There was a bad incident a few years ago resulting in a fatality.  The car was outwardly immaculate. 
 

You're not wrong 

http://www.roverp6parts.com/watchtheelbows.html

[tooSavvy]

@N Dentressangle.. "So there you go. I'll probably sort the bodywork first then see if I can be arsed with the brakes or farm it out to my local garage. Not as big a fan of lying under cars as I was 30 years ago 😉"

I popped into Kev, my greasy spanner, just this morning and have my Oil change + two Dipped bulbs..... 07:00 tomorrow 🙄

Weather is too $hite/ cold/ CBA = too fu#king old 😕

I get to make the tea..... Winnah 😁

🚙💨

[N Dentressangle]

Fuel tank sender is first in the queue.

The sender is on the bottom of the tank, which is a new one on me. Meaning the tank needs to be totally drained to remove it, unless you want an expensive shower in E5:

Two jubilee clips and two bolts later, and I win:

Good to see everything in there looking clean and rust-free. Inside the arches each side is sound too:

As for the main event, the sender unit is held in with one of those twist bayonet locking ring type arrangements. 

It turned easily and revealed why the fuel gauge wasn't moving:

Yep, that'd do it.

Bollocks - they're not cheap!

[Dj_efk]

Can you still buy a new one from somewhere like Rimming Brothers (© @Mr_Bo11ox) ?

[N Dentressangle]

Only JR Wadhams, for £65 + vat:

https://www.jrwadhams.co.uk/product/tank-sender-2000-2200-3500-html/

Not even original either, so I'd lose the nice screw fittings for the fuel pipes.

Better strip down the one I've got then. Some gentle brushing and then a blast with brake cleaner and results are encouraging:

Hmmm...

Given it was giving a stuck on 3/4 full reading before, I reckon this one might go again!

 

[SiC]

I've cleaned them up, lubricated and got everything moving before on various sender's like that with no issues.  I'd be tempted to replace the float though. Cheap and a bugger if it fails and needing to pull the tank again. That said, if it floats and no damage, I'd possibly stuff it in and send it...

[N Dentressangle]

6 hours ago, SiC said:

I've cleaned them up, lubricated and got everything moving before on various sender's like that with no issues.  I'd be tempted to replace the float though. Cheap and a bugger if it fails and needing to pull the tank again. That said, if it floats and no damage, I'd possibly stuff it in and send it...

It's now all cleaned, back together and reading the correct resistances full and empty. Woohoo!

Back together and re-installed tomorrow, with any luck.

[Dj_efk]

I was going to say 80 odd quod isn’t bad for a new one, but if it’s a cheap and nasty Chinese modern replacement I’d defo go with good used if yours was past it.

Luckily, a moot point - got to love a free fix!

[SiC]

31 minutes ago, Dj_efk said:

if it’s a cheap and nasty Chinese modern replacement

"Made in the UK by OE Manufacturer"

 

[SiC]

What's the inside of the tank looking like? Not bad or crusty as hell? Just wondering if a lot of crud is in there going by the shite on that sender. 

[N Dentressangle]

13 hours ago, SiC said:

What's the inside of the tank looking like? Not bad or crusty as hell? Just wondering if a lot of crud is in there going by the shite on that sender. 

Fair amount of nastiness in there:

so it's currently getting a soaking in citric acid solution.

[SiC]

Worth POR15 it? As a minimum possibly a collection of spare fuel filters kept in the glove box at least to begin with. Iirc @Conrad D. Conelrad had fun with his constantly clogging filters from crud in the tank.