2006 Toyota Land Cruiser - Staying Put

[Zelandeth]

Ah, memories of this thing...

One of the valves concerned with the self levelling had gone porous and was near impossible to get hold of.  

It behaved perfectly when running, but over the course of a few hours after shutdown the air in the suspension would find it's way all into one side or the other.  Resulting in quite an alarming looking lean at times.  

Have to be careful not to park too close to anything as it dropping on the bump stops on one side will kick out well over a foot at the roof level...

 

I'm with you on sorting the air suspension though.  While there are more bits involved than with steel springs the majority of them are unlikely to ever need attention, and I'd personally far rather change an air bag, pneumatic line or pump than a bloody metal spring...Plus it will always ride better on air, which you really want on a big old beast like this.

[goosey]

17 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

Ah, memories of this thing...

One of the valves concerned with the self levelling had gone porous and was near impossible to get hold of.  

It behaved perfectly when running, but over the course of a few hours after shutdown the air in the suspension would find it's way all into one side or the other.  Resulting in quite an alarming looking lean at times.  

Have to be careful not to park too close to anything as it dropping on the bump stops on one side will kick out well over a foot at the roof level...

 

I'm with you on sorting the air suspension though.  While there are more bits involved than with steel springs the majority of them are unlikely to ever need attention, and I'd personally far rather change an air bag, pneumatic line or pump than a bloody metal spring...Plus it will always ride better on air, which you really want on a big old beast like this.

Unfortunately the world of Pneumatics moves pretty quickly and what would seem like a standard Valve or fitting becomes obsolete overnight.  When I used to deal with Bus company’s in my old job, I found Bus manufacturers would purchase “end of line” Pneumatic parts or use anything they could get hold of that just about did the job, which caused me many headaches

[St.Jude]

Heard a clunk from the Land Cruiser today. I ignored it.

200 yards down the road, I hear a louder clunk. I turn round and go home.

Whats the problem guy?

Other than my truck defying gravity judging by the photos, the drivers side air bag looks like it wants to escape. It’s hissing like Polly your Polythene Pal while you stuff her back in to her box.

Currently on a train now to rescue my Peugeot from my moms, as I can’t drive this thing now and I’m in no position financially to pay to get this fixed. 

[warch]

The parts themselves don't seem overly expensive, is it the fitting that's the issue or do you need speshial tools/calibration? 

[St.Jude]

14 minutes ago, warch said:

The parts themselves don't seem overly expensive, is it the fitting that's the issue or do you need speshial tools/calibration? 

No idea. I don’t know how they work.

I mean, I don’t think it should look like that, it shouldn’t hiss. But is that because it’s unseated and if I reseat it will that be enough or because it’s gone like that is the bag buggered?

[warch]

I've had a little look online, they do look fairly straightforward to change, albeit much easier if you have a ramp. Having suffered with effing awful Land Rover cartsprings most of my vehicular life the airbags do look quite an elegant solution to quite a few off road problems and not necessarily unreliable.  

[St.Jude]

Thanks @warch I will have a look later.

I swear there is an invoice for the bags being changed a few years ago, so I’m surprised they’re fucked like this so soon.

[St.Jude]

So thinking about this, if I do this job properly with Toyota parts I will be looking at £1,700. This is on top of the £1,600 spent earlier this year.

I can, of course, buy the air bags for £35 from eBay. And the shock absorbers for £200. And the height sensors for £100 for the pair. Which makes it £500. But these are eBay parts, with their own risks no matter how many “1 year guarantee” there is.

However, I think it’s best that this moves on. It owes me a substantial amount of money without taking in to consideration the £1,600 spent. So I can sell it with the knackered suspension for less money, or I can fix it up with eBay parts and move it on that way.

So that’s what I’m going to do. It’ll still be January at the earliest though before I even touch it, but I’m done with it. Which is a shame but I’ve no trust in it.

At least now I can let my mind wander on to what replacement I will get. I did consider a Duster, but at my price point they will have the rocking drivers seat which put me off them. 

[grogee]

18 minutes ago, St.Jude said:

So thinking about this, if I do this job properly with Toyota parts I will be looking at £1,700. This is on top of the £1,600 spent earlier this year.

I can, of course, buy the air bags for £35 from eBay. And the shock absorbers for £200. And the height sensors for £100 for the pair. Which makes it £500. But these are eBay parts, with their own risks no matter how many “1 year guarantee” there is.

However, I think it’s best that this moves on. It owes me a substantial amount of money without taking in to consideration the £1,600 spent. So I can sell it with the knackered suspension for less money, or I can fix it up with eBay parts and move it on that way.

So that’s what I’m going to do. It’ll still be January at the earliest though before I even touch it, but I’m done with it. Which is a shame but I’ve no trust in it.

At least now I can let my mind wander on to what replacement I will get. I did consider a Duster, but at my price point they will have the rocking drivers seat which put me off them. 

Hmm, this is a shame what with all the professional level swearing you've put into this. 

I do think I agree with you, fix it with cheap bits and punt it on. Maybe refresh the MoT if that's short? 

What sort of job is it to change the parts - doable or requires £grease monkey?

[St.Jude]

1 hour ago, grogee said:

Hmm, this is a shame what with all the professional level swearing you've put into this. 

I do think I agree with you, fix it with cheap bits and punt it on. Maybe refresh the MoT if that's short? 

What sort of job is it to change the parts - doable or requires £grease monkey?

It is what it is, but I’d rather put this effort in to my Lada than something which has turned out to be ungrateful.

The MOT was done in August, so it’s got more than 6 months. Depending on when I get the work done I’ll think about a renewal at the time.

I think it’s doable. I’ve got tall axle stands which I bought for the Lada which are meant for a 4x4. The sensors are apparently a prick to change, meaning the bolts will need to be drilled out and replaced. The air bags take about 3 hours to do, require a special tool which can be replaced with tweezers apparently.

I would rather not send it to a garage to do it, I need to minimise the outlay on it now. 

[Dick Cheeseburger]

On 11/12/2022 at 3:27 PM, St.Jude said:

Heard a clunk from the Land Cruiser today. I ignored it.

200 yards down the road, I hear a louder clunk. I turn round and go home.

Whats the problem guy?

Other than my truck defying gravity judging by the photos, the drivers side air bag looks like it wants to escape. It’s hissing like Polly your Polythene Pal while you stuff her back in to her box.

Currently on a train now to rescue my Peugeot from my moms, as I can’t drive this thing now and I’m in no position financially to pay to get this fixed. 

Shit the bed, you don't seem to have much luck with Toyotas do you? My MR2 has been ultra reliable during my 7+ year ownership but is a much simpler beast in comparison. 

What about a spaceship Civic or something? Most seem to suggest they don't want for much. A bit dull though...

[St.Jude]

17 minutes ago, Dick Longbridge said:

Shit the bed, you don't seem to have much luck with Toyotas do you? My MR2 has been ultra reliable during my 7+ year ownership but is a much simpler beast in comparison. 

What about a spaceship Civic or something? Most seem to suggest they don't want for much. A bit dull though...

I’m thinking I’m cursed with 4x4 Toyotas. My Corolla never let me down. It wouldn’t be such an issue if it was a simpler machine, or less uptight. I still want an Amazon, I will have an Amazon, just not now or in the immediate future.

I do like the Civic, but the next car has to be practical. Along the lines of an estate, something that if it does shit itself it’s either cheap to fix or cheap to dump. Fuck this noise of champagne motoring for caviar prices!

[RoverFolkUs]

If the bag is hissing then it's fucked, it does happen and is a pitfall of any bagged suspension. We look after loads of land cruisers and are yet to see any specific air suspension issues other than punctured bags. 

Becoming displaced like that can sometimes happen if it's been jacked up and carelessly dropped down without keeping an eye on the bags. That applies to any airbag suspension 

Imagine puncturing a bike inner tube and then trying to inflate it - it goes a weird shape. That's what's happened there

They are fetching insane money at the moment, I'd say fix it as cheap as possible with eBay parts, it shouldn't need new ride height sensors. Just the offending bag replaced. 

Are the bump stops intact? Their brackets had rusted away and the stops disappeared on one that we look after, replacements cost an eye watering £180 + vat from the dealer IIRC 😬 - just for two bits of rubber!

[goosey]

Probably best to change both airbags as the other side looks pretty rough, they look straight forward enough to change. You managed to sort your Injector issues out yourself so you’ll be ok with swapping in some new airbags

Roughtrax 4x4 sell genuine Toyota Airbags at a reasonable price 

[warch]

On 11/14/2022 at 4:42 PM, St.Jude said:

So thinking about this, if I do this job properly with Toyota parts I will be looking at £1,700. This is on top of the £1,600 spent earlier this year.

I can, of course, buy the air bags for £35 from eBay.  

I was driving along yesterday in the pissing rain with the wipers merrily clearing the way, wondering how long it had been since I fitted that emergency backup 12 quid wiper motor I bought new off ebay (four or five years?). It certainly outlasted the genuine used one I paid 4 times the price for from a scrapper. 

I suppose it depends on the usage; you might want a genuine set if you're crossing Western Australia with a three tonne caravan on the back, but a set of Chinese bags might see you right if you're just driving around the West Midlands with a pushchair in the back. Plus you can see what the issue is before you spend a fortune on parts.  

[808 Estate]

12 hours ago, goosey said:

Roughtrax 4x4 sell genuine Toyota Airbags at a reasonable price 

Another vote for Rough Trax. Its where I get all my parts from.

[St.Jude]

I’ve used Roughtrax for the timing belt and water pump stuff, which I’ve not fitted yet. 

I think though I’d be better to do it cheap to move it on. I’m still not convinced keeping it for the long term is an option given how fucking ungrateful it’s been.

We have been here before!!!

[big_al_granvia]

should i start looking for another snotter so you can have paddy back, i know i am just the custodian

[big_al_granvia]

what you want is a manual p2 volvo v70 d5

[St.Jude]

31 minutes ago, big_al_granvia said:

should i start looking for another snotter so you can have paddy back, i know i am just the custodian

No it’s fine, I need a minimum 4 doors to get the baby in the back. 

I am thinking along the lines of Subaru Legacy, MG ZT-T or the Saab 93/95 estate. 

[tom13]

25 minutes ago, St.Jude said:

No it’s fine, I need a minimum 4 doors to get the baby in the back. 

I am thinking along the lines of Subaru Legacy, MG ZT-T or the Saab 93/95 estate. 

Just saying but it's actually easier to slide the seat forward and put our little one in the back of our 3 door MK6 golf than it is in most 5 doors.

[grogee]

1 hour ago, St.Jude said:

No it’s fine, I need a minimum 4 doors to get the baby in the back. 

I am thinking along the lines of Subaru Legacy, MG ZT-T or the Saab 93/95 estate. 

I've gone right off Subarus since that crispy Legacy on here, sorry I know that's not very specific. 

The Saab I had was ace, it did need some fixerating but the hardest bit was the HVAC (not strictly necessary).

Haven't had a 75, but they're probably* alright as long as it's not a V6 OMGCaMbElT m9

[big_al_granvia]

If you can live with the shit fuel consumption you can't do better than a Subaru forester xt. Take an impreza chassis with its single turbo flat 4 engine and awd. Put it onto a body that is big enough to fit a fridge freezer in. Handles in all conditions like it's on rails, ground clearance of a  4x4. Yes the std brakes need upgrading but the impreza is one of the most modified and tuned there is. Avoid diesels

[Back_For_More]

45 minutes ago, big_al_granvia said:

If you can live with the shit fuel consumption you can't do better than a Subaru forester xt. Take an impreza chassis with its single turbo flat 4 engine and awd. Put it onto a body that is big enough to fit a fridge freezer in. Handles in all conditions like it's on rails, ground clearance of a  4x4. Yes the std brakes need upgrading but the impreza is one of the most modified and tuned there is. Avoid diesels

I've just grabbed one from here and I'll second this. Utter joy and can swallow more than that Katey Price bint.... 

[St.Jude]

2 hours ago, tom13 said:

Just saying but it's actually easier to slide the seat forward and put our little one in the back of our 3 door MK6 golf than it is in most 5 doors.

I know but on the Corolla @big_al_granvia is on about only the passenger side seat scoots forward enough to allow access. Which isn’t an issue normally but with the seat I’ve got I’d have to contort around the baby seat to put him in. Plus the wife would divorce me if it came back (at the moment at least!).

2 hours ago, grogee said:

I've gone right off Subarus since that crispy Legacy on here, sorry I know that's not very specific. 

The Saab I had was ace, it did need some fixerating but the hardest bit was the HVAC (not strictly necessary).

Haven't had a 75, but they're probably* alright as long as it's not a V6 OMGCaMbElT m9

If I got a Scooby again I’d want to make sure the clutch wasn’t heavy or it was an automatic. I did damage to my Achilles with the last Subaru I had.

Thing is too with the ZT/75, I’d want a V6. I don’t mind hard work, if it needed a belt I’d do it. I’ve done worse jobs!

Ive got time to think anyway. This will be a new year job!

[grogee]

1 hour ago, St.Jude said:

I know but on the Corolla @big_al_granvia is on about only the passenger side seat scoots forward enough to allow access. Which isn’t an issue normally but with the seat I’ve got I’d have to contort around the baby seat to put him in. Plus the wife would divorce me if it came back (at the moment at least!).

If I got a Scooby again I’d want to make sure the clutch wasn’t heavy or it was an automatic. I did damage to my Achilles with the last Subaru I had.

Thing is too with the ZT/75, I’d want a V6. I don’t mind hard work, if it needed a belt I’d do it. I’ve done worse jobs!

Ive got time to think anyway. This will be a new year job!

Haven't done one myself but I'm sure @RoverFolkUs or @sierraman can tell us what they're like. I think the main issue is lack of access, it's hard up against the side of the engine bay, as so many are. I might have dreamed it, but is it an engine out job?

The more I think about Rover 75s the more I'd want one in beige 1.8 flavour for the full Terry and June effect.

[RoverFolkUs]

10 minutes ago, grogee said:

Haven't done one myself but I'm sure @RoverFolkUs or @sierraman can tell us what they're like. I think the main issue is lack of access, it's hard up against the side of the engine bay, as so many are. I might have dreamed it, but is it an engine out job?

The more I think about Rover 75s the more I'd want one in beige 1.8 flavour for the full Terry and June effect.

Cambelt is doable in situ on the KV6 but it's tricky. Not quite Renault level of difficulty where you can barely slide a sheet of paper between the pulleys and chassis leg though 🤦🤣

Doable at home with a decent tool kit and experienced spannering

Somebody, I think Mr Bollox, documented doing it on a Rover 45 a good while back and I remember the concencus being "fuckin nightmare m8"

But yeah, doable. Not like Renault V6's where it's usually engine out

1.8 is ok for boat anchorage purposes but not a motorised conveyance... 😁 Honestly - too slow. They're heavy barges. 1.8T would probably be acceptable though.  

Edit - last one I did, think I "budgeted" 5-6 hours. Bear in mind that's workshop. I expect garages would look to charge 5-7 hours depending on how many they've done. Cambelt changes usually allow 2 hours for single cam and 3 hours for diesel/twin cam so make of that what you will (not literally an extra hour for being twin cam but you get the jist) 👍

 

[Back_For_More]

There's a green ZT saloon on that there Gumtree for 995. Croydon area.... Looks smart enough but a bit Barry wheels

I was thinking of it but 1 purchase this month is enough. 

EDIT - it's gone..... Bu66er

[RoverFolkUs]

1 hour ago, Back_For_More said:

There's a green ZT saloon on that there Gumtree for 995. Croydon area.... Looks smart enough but a bit Barry wheels

I was thinking of it but 1 purchase this month is enough. 

EDIT - it's gone..... Bu66er

A ZT for a grand isn't going to hang around these days, they're starting to touch £1500-2000 for an unexceptional example as long as it runs well with a decent amount of test

[BeEP]

Also £1000 for this V6 example with one owner (presumably plus whoever's selling it), 74k and MOT to April.

https://www.gumtree.com/p/mg/mg-zt-2001/1446164227