The slow death of Vauxhall?

[Tadhg Tiogar]

....

The fact that Vauxhall head office are blaming dealers for not being able to sell an inferior product nowadays is hardly fair. Do they even do a hybrid?

There was the Vauxhall Ampera, but I hardly see any.

 

For me, PSA's involvement ultimately has priorities:

 

1. Protect the French marques above everything else. That means Peugeot first, and Citroën second.

 

2. The rest can fight for the corporate scraps.

[lesapandre]

Cherry-ade

[Mr Lobster]

I suspect the reason for thinning out the dealers is that there are too many at the moment. Vauxhall dealers (certainly around here at least) are like Ford dealers were until twenty years back in that there was one in every town.  If they cull a few franchises it gives the remaining dealers a larger territory and the chance to actually make a bit of money.

 

The range is a strange mix. I've had the (mis)fortune to drive a few - the Grand Insignia and newish Astra are actually very good pretty much on par with the competition. The Corsa is ok and serves a specific market - retail buying on finance and wanting a cheap finance / PCP on a new car - it's an OK care but Fiesta, Clio, Polo etc all drive better. Crossland is strange and unappealing. Mokka is seriously outclassed by the competition. Zafira was the future once but is just adrift in a sea of compact seven seaters these days and is no better or worse than the sector average.

 

They still shift a lot of cars though and you'd have to wonder how much profit per car they make given that perhaps more than many, so much of the sales go into daily rental and corporate fleets.

[Datsuncog]

But on a more positive not. I grew up near Luton - it was a real motor city and I had a friend who worked in the design department as a junior when Wayne Cherry was in charge. The droop-snoop Vauxhalls at the time were considered some of the coolest cars about - the company had a real swagger at that point and the design language fed through to a couple of generations of Vauxhalls. They were brilliantly designed right up to Cavalier 2 which still looks so good.

 

I think that's a tremendous point.

 

Consider the Vauxhall SRV concept that Cherry pushed to completion - a four-door four-seater that made Ferraris at the time look positively frumpy.

 

 

First shown in 1970 - at the point Vauxhall and Ford were still running out HB Vivas and MkII Cortinas respectively. I understand it garnered Vauxhall a fair bit of cred at the time... and I can see why.

 

While nothing quite like this ever appeared in a Vauxhall dealership, concepts are important statements of where the company's thoughts are heading at any given time. The Firenza Droopsnoots looked a damn sight more thrilling than the Brabham HB Vivas ever did; Gerry Marshall's Baby Bertha remains an icon of 70s motorsport, and sporty Vauxhalls of the era just look right in silver. It helped create a 'look' - a silver Chevette approaching in your rear view mirror might be an HS.

 

 

I only ever saw one Ampera on Northern Ireland's roads, but it looked like an impressive bit of kit both in terms of styling and ability. I dunno whether it was just fractionally ahead of the curve at its launch, since six years ago the charging infrastructure and public acceptance of hybrid evs wasn't where it is now. A great pity.

[SiC]

Here you go - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Confessions-quality-control-balls-ups-factories/dp/1532719795/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1524045873&sr=8-1&keywords=confessions+from+quality+control

 

(Apologies for derailing the thread, folks)

 

The previous comments about Opel are good. Some of us remember the Monza and Manta, and god knows GM could use some of that pizzazz right now.

Link broken!

[dieselnutjob]

The new Astra seems to be alright according to reviews

 

 

Maybe Ellesmere Port will be okay.  Personally I always thought that "Opel" sounds more upmarket and German than "Vauxhall" and I never quite understood why they stuck with it.

[Aston Martin]

Filth, ignore that it’s not a Vauxhall. The Cascada is pretty, as is the GTC.

The Zafira VXR, is one of those cars that somehow got past every exec.

[Kiltox]

Me,well 6 mths old anyway as i wanted a economical,comfy way of travelling approx 250 miles per week and my Alfa 156v6 is in need of some tinkering to get it back to good shape..tbh i have never been a Vorxall fan but this one is decent enough..

 

Late 2017 Astra 1.4 turbo petrol sri for £10k (tax man will pay for most of it) which is around half of the new mrp and paying only £10k gives me some free cash to continue with my classic bike collection...

Proves my point really doesn’t it?

 

Someone bought that car new at a huge discount I’m sure.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

With you on that. I mostly don't notice modern cars, but the Insignia strikes me as actually attractive, in a way no Vauxhall of that class has been since the Mk3 Cavalier.

 

 

 

The first Insignia was alright. I drove a couple when they came out as hire cars* and I found them to be fine. Good looking, enough go, not bad on fuel. Just the harsh ride on the SRi and the clutch/EPB needs time to master.

 

So Vauxhalls are unreliable? Really? Worse than VAG? I don't think so. Tsi nightmares, BMW N47 timing chains - every car has a problem. The CDTi oil pick up issue can be fixed with an hour's work to drop the sump, replace a 50p O ring and reassemble.

 

They're not fantastic, but I don't think they're worse than anything else now.

[Ghosty]

There was the Vauxhall Ampera, but I hardly see any.

 

Ampera was a rebumpered Chevrolet Volt, and was discontinued in 2015 because sales were poor (low thousands?). They were over £30k...

[sierraman]

Your a faster worker than me if you can whip the sump off, knock the driveshafts out and have it back together within an hour. The gearboxes aren't too clever either.

[AMC Rebel]

.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Your a faster worker than me if you can whip the sump off, knock the driveshafts out and have it back together within an hour. The gearboxes aren't too clever either.

 

 

An hour to get the sump off. Probably 2.5 for the whole job.

 

 

 

I'm bidding on a 13 plate 1.8i Insignia at the mo. Might be cheap.

[egg]

We can console ourselves that Amperas are solid gold futureshite though. Down to about £9-£10k now. Watching with interest!

[sierraman]

Better stomaching the low 30's MPG and the lethargy instead of the 2.0 CDTI. The 2.0 diesel wasn't too clever on the fuel round the houses. Reckon on 30mpg in town.

 

I'd check it doesn't whine like a tired child in 2nd or 6th though. I've known one that was ready for its third gearbox at 98k. All the 'used' eBay ones are fucked as well. I really wouldn't pay more than what I could afford to lose on one especially the diesel.

 

There is a good reason they are cheaper than a Mondeo.

[lesapandre]

Vauxhall story unravelling already?

 

https://www.shropshirestar.com/news/business/2018/04/18/jobs-secured-as-two-vauxhall-dealerships-saved-from-closure/

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

I want to give a grand for it, twelve hundred at a push. 78'000, needs two doors and a rear arch repair but it's the usual metallic charcoal colour so should find a pair of doors for 100 quid or so.

 

It's 2012, not 13. Being petrol might work in my favour.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

"Vauxhall director Denis Chick"

 

​He was at BL a very long time ago - must be knocking on now.

 

http://media.vauxhall.co.uk/media/gb/en/vauxhall/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/gb/en/2017/vauxhall/03-24-denis-chick-newspress-award.html

 

I'd like to see cunts like Evans Bastard Halshaw and Arnie Shark get the bullet. They do nothing for manufacturers apart from give stuff away and offer shit service, damaging residuals. I want to see small garages reappear where the boss in the office is accountable.

[sam simmons]

"Vauxhall director Denis Chick"[/size]

 

​He was at BL a very long time ago - must be knocking on now.

 

http://media.vauxhall.co.uk/media/gb/en/vauxhall/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/gb/en/2017/vauxhall/03-24-denis-chick-newspress-award.html

 

I'd like to see cunts like Evans Bastard Halshaw and Arnie Shark get the bullet. They do nothing for manufacturers apart from give stuff away and offer shit service, damaging residuals. I want to see small garages reappear where the boss in the office is accountable.

 

I used Halshaw as the benchmark price to knock Go Vauxhall down to a similar price as Go was originally £2k higher than Halshaw and a local "boss in office" type of garage was also selling a similar specc`d Astra for the same as Go Vauxhall but the local garage hadnt washed their cars and many incl the Astra i viewed were wearing tyres with little air,also needed a valet so i walked...Go Vauxhall had their cars well presented.

[cort1977]

Following on from the Ampera the new chevy Bolt is very good apparently, offering Tesla Model 3 range at less than $30k with federal discount.

 

Presumably no hope of being sold in Yurp now as no GM brand or dealer network. 

[busmansholiday]

We can console ourselves that Amperas are solid gold futureshite though. Down to about £9-£10k now. Watching with interest!

A colleague at work had one as a company car. Spent most of it's time in the Pauxhall dealers ( not the local one either as they weren't qualified to deal with it). When he got it back eventually the thing tried to incinerate itself. Sent it back and got a Toyota.

[Partridge]

Having worked in the fleet sector for a little bit, I think fleets are the driving force behind this, and perhaps (to a lesser extent) the rise of renting your car rather than owning it. Fleets want big garages in central locations with the manpower for fast servicing turnaround. Wankpuffin's Vauxhall of Frotting, the friendly local franchise can't compete with the big networks and out of town dealers when it comes to speedy servicing on the kind of scale major fleets demand.

When it comes to PCP and the like, I'm guessing those customers aren't fussed about who supplies the car, as long as they're easy to get to and make a decent cappuccino, and have a TV playing The Night Garden for the kids.

 

I'm not saying it's a good thing but it's the way things are going, not just with cars but with everything that we (the general public, not weirdos like us) consume. I don't know if it spells the death of Vauxhall (who does?), but it doesn't have to.

 

JLR seem to be going the same way, after Inchcape swallowed up H.A Fox (massive shame) and they are doing just fine.

 

I'd like to think PSA know what they're doing. Remember that not so very long ago Peugeot were looking like a lame duck, but seem to be having some kind of renaissance* right now.

 

*Apart from the "000" series, those are bloody awful.

[robinmasters]

Essentially Vauxhall's downfall rests purely on superficial marketing strategy, there's little wrong with the cars themselves compared to their equally mediocre contemporaries.

I've never understood exactly where Vauxhall sits. They seem to me to be of a comparable quality to Peugeot/Citroen, but are marketed (and I think priced) against Ford/VW/BMW, which are perceived by most add being a step up. Their primary market is people who think they're British-see the number of older Zafira's plastered in St George's flags (no comment on displaying the flag in general); do those people buy new cars?

 

Following from that, :

 

I'm always sad to see British jobs at risk, but, really, who gives a fuck about Vauxhall nowadays?

 

This. I don't want to see British people lose jobs, but did actually cares whether you can buy a contemporary car badged as a Vauxhall? Modern cars are so generic, and their manufacturer's so intertwined, does it really make any difference at all what the 50p's worth of chromed plastic on the boot lid says?

 

Anyway, the size of the UK car market is what it is, so requires a certain manufacturing capacity. Where this capacity is is depends more on international politics than on how the car's are branded.

 

Oh, and bring back Opel to sell mid-sized 'premium' saloons.

[AnthonyG]

In 1990 Ford and Vauxhall were more or less equivalent. After the Mondeo, every Ford product in an important segment (not guff like the Explorer or Cougar) seemed to be received better than the equivalent Vauxhall, and as such Ford were able to get a better image over time.

 

This is why Sam Simmons could buy a 6 month old Astra for £10k, 50% of list price, whereas the Focus would have been £15k, 75% of list price.

 

Ultimately with residuals like that no private buyer will touch a new one, and even fleets will run scared unless the initial discounts are massive.

 

Reducing rentals, pre-registrations etc will help, but ultimately they need more desirable products.

 

Rebadging as Opel is a waste of time, people are not stupid and won’t see it as a ‘new German brand’ just more confusion as with all the recent ‘Chevrolet’ nonsense.

[Braddon81]

There's nothing wrong with the current Vauxhall line up,in the current scheme of things it does well enough. What does affect things though is the current skewed market and the very dubious manner in which the "premium" brands are offering certain rediculously finance and lease deals on their products to which if you do the figure work don't really add up... unless their rigging the market to suit themselves which I believe is the case.

If you look around any newish build housing estate you will find parked outside new Audis Beemers Mercedes.. etc etc... which in pure retail value are probably worth in some cases of the larger cars nearly 50per cent of their property value.. and are all in most cases rented or leased. The economies of scale of this sea change have given the premium brands the power to do this..and also the power to muscle in on previous territories which were the preserve of the main players.

A class or Astra?... Joe boring UK punter would now go for an A class or 1series for his 200odd quid a month.

The irony of all this off course is that back in the day Premium cars were niche low volume high profit machines. Now they are high high volume with lower margin structures but profitable finance.

What Psa have realised in recent times is that you cannot compete with them on that level these days. To stay in the game their idea is to be slightly less volume oriented but work on a more profit per unit approach, which seems to have been working for them in recent times with Peugeot and Citroen. The shedding of Vauxhall dealerships clearly points to this and probably is happening throughout Europe with their Opel franchises too.

[sierraman]

Fatha Sierra got £2000 p/ex on an 09 Insignia diesel with 102k. Complete with rattling DMF. This was about 2 years ago though.

[sierraman]

Drastic oversupply of used ones in a few years and increasing interest rates will put the stoppers on people chucking £300 a month at an Audi.

[lesapandre]

Yes very good point about the 'premium brands'. Loads of kids in Mercs around us these days - all on contract I suppose. Vauxhall don't have the same image in Saaaf Londin unless they can invent one quickly? PSA have in recent years been very keen on pricing - but from looking at the cars are clearly seeking to move the DS range up-market and seem to be giving the Peugeot brand some light retro-feel with the new grilles and PEUGEOT badge on the top with a lot more chrome and a bit simpler styling. 403 and 508 compared.

[lesapandre]

Forget (the original) DS the middle market car for the French in the 50's was the 403. Beautifully made. The DS was really for posh people. Over 100 for sale on LeBonCoin if anyone is tempted. Shows haw many sold and how well made.

[lesapandre]

Feels like they are trading a bit on that solid reputation when the 403 was the gold-standard for solidity - really a kind of French Mercedes.