which jobs do you do to 'save' a car? Interested in views.

[egg]

I know I already have a thread about my Mondeo, but I want to ask a more general question to shitters...

 

Assuming your car isn't near 'end of life'.... 

 

how far do you go with pro-active maintenance and improvement?

 

I'm prone to overthinking, and this is just how my obsessive-type brain works...(apologies to the arch-pragmatists and logic types)

 

For example, Mondy seems to run cold....

 

so, replace the thermostat and change the coolant for OEM spec. So far so easy, could do that myself taking it slowly... 

 

But then you could change the themostat sender to check it isn't that. And well, the water pump looks original and is therefore 23 years old - so if you drain the system you might as well change that as well. And of course that means aux belt needs to come off - all original by the looks - so, do belt, pulley and tensioner. Of course that means the cambelt (probably last changed in 98!!) needs to come off, so do that and the pulleys as well, so then you can also do the leaking rocker cover gasket. 

 

That's £200+ in parts + £250 in labour probably. But if the cambelt goes it is all over.

 

I think the power steering pipes need doing as well + fluid change.

 

It's done 56,000 miles - if I do all this - really, only rust can definitely kill it. So, would you get the body work issues done first of all anyway?

 

Call me a dithering idiot if you will, and being autoshite, some will. But I'm interested in a shitters take on this (so - how do you take decisions like this on your own car? And do you get it wrong sometimes?)

[HH-R]

Depends on if you like the car really and are keeping it. If you do/are I'd get the lot done personally. I'm going to have to swallow a belt, tensioner, pump and aux belt replacement soon too.

 

Not sure about the rust, only had one rusty car and I didn't want it anyway so got shot.

[Tamworthbay]

Always worth a few cans of dynax to keep the rust at bay, unless you are only keeping the car a short time.

[Jifflemon]

For me, I like to establish a base line. First thing I do with a new (to me) car, is a basic oil change. That's it.

Drive the car, make a list, see if you actually like the car or whether it's just a hack.

My personal rule of thumb is to budget £100 a month for the car - some people may do more, some much less. I do £100 simply because i like to do things once. I will change shocks in pairs, tyres will ALWAYS be new and from one of the what are now being called "premium brands".

Plan the jobs, and you'll be ok.

[egg]

If the cam belt has not been changed since 1998 I would do it NOW.

 

Ben

 

I'm not certain of this - but this is the last recorded.

[egg]

I like the car, I've got a bit of a daft 'save it for the nation' mentality too - I'm only aware of a few that are earlier than mine and are being cherished - and there are probably less than a couple of hundred base models left.

 

Anyway - I'm more interested in the wider question. There are a lot of end of life cars on autoshite, great - I love 'em, and they often amuse me. And I understand why DW is investing money in a 2cv - there's no question for a car nut it is the right thing to do (same goes for the Toledo's and the capri that's getting a respray, and almost anything pre-86!)

 

But these cars in the middle that other shitters own - could go one way or another - how do you decide (if you are lucky enough to have the choice) whether to blow £500 or a car worth less than that?

[beko1987]

I'm at this stage almost with the zx. I bought it 6k into a new cambelt, and the coolant looks like lhm so it had been looked after.

 

In 20k I've put new tyres on, new front brakes, replaced most of the moving parts of the front suspension, new exhaust and backbox 4 oil changes and washed it once.

 

Its making a whine/drone at 50, and is down on power. I don't know what's wrong with it, I've checked the brakes and its not those. The steering is also very heavy.

 

It could be the aux belt, it could be the power steering pump, it could be the rack, it could be the gearbox. That's the order I'm gonna work to to fault find, but...

 

It cost me £350

I got £50 back the next day when the front wheel fell off

Ive probably spent £200 over the years on it, including tyres

Ive done 20k

Its at 287,438 miles

It leaks water in despite a sealed up sunroof

 

And I'm getting a bit bored of it. I keep thinking of other cars.

 

So, I'll Potter at it, I need it to get me to work and back, a job it has never failed at yet! If I do the aux belt, and maybe change the power steering fluid properly, and that doesn't fix it, I'll possibly look to move on. I'll enter a few more raffles and maybe squirrel £300 away over a few months. Then sell it here for £100 with mot until Jan, and lots of good parts.

 

Or it will turn out to be something simple, and a shiter or 4 will help me fix it and provide nice parts, I know we have a few spares zx's amongst us.

 

I think I'm only out of love with it because it's running a bit shit, if it gets fixed ill be happier, but even so, I've been thinking of a nice mondo, or vectra, or primer, or accord, or a fucking laguna 2 now ffs, so I'm gonna go on record and say that by the end of the year, I'd like a new car

 

Which is a shame, as I did want to see 300,000 miles. Id pull up on the hard shoulder of the m40 to take a picture of that!

 

Ask yourself a question, do you really REALLY like the car?

[beko1987]

Plus time. I get no time now with 2 kids, I can't even find time to do bloody hoovers and I can do those on the front room floor.

 

Spending a weekend washing it is but a pipe dream!

[Stanky]

2 questions

 

1. Do you like it?

 

2. Can you buy a different one, in better shape or a different car you want for less than the repairs would cost?

 

Case in point being my Almera. It cost £400 several years ago. It required a new gearbox last christmas. A box, clutch, gearbox oil and time (I needed professional help, as with most things in my life) added up to about £180. I liked the car, so TICK on point 1. I couldn't get a less bad one for less money than the repairs would have cost, I couldn't get a different car in better condition for less money, so I spent 1.8x the residual value of the car fixing the issue, belt and braces. Point 2 TICK.

 

I could have saved £50 or so by recycling the oil gearbox oil and not doing the clutch but decided to do it properly because of point 1.

 

The car now has a new lease of life and I still like it.

[billyboy406v6]

If its a keeper put new bits on it.If its a work hack /banger,then gaffer tape and cable ties and scrapyard parts will do, anything dearer and its going over the bridge.

[egg]

2 questions

 

1. Do you like it?

 

2. Can you buy a different one, in better shape or a different car you want for less than the repairs would cost?

 

Point 2 is a tricky one, really good Mondeo's fetch under £1000, there's a rare 4x4 available at the moment for £475 that looks good. But, may come with an equally long list when you get into it...

[mercrocker]

I make this decision about every other year with Mrs Rocker's 190E. 

 

For old stuff like my Morrises and expensive to replace stuff like my camper van its a no-brainer. 

 

But I could get an equally good W201 for a couple of grand.  More than likely it would be a 2 litre instead of the 1.8 but that's the only real improvement I could make. 

  

Trouble is it would probably need tyres, maybe an exhaust, certainly some pads and discs.  Ours has only just tipped 100,000 miles and has had buckets spent on maintenance.   I suppose if a really big bill was looming I might think differently.   But even a major engine job would probably be cheaper than a £3000 replacement that still needed disc, pads, exhaust, well you know what I mean. 

 

The only justification I have ever felt worthwhile was changing a car because either I stopped liking it (and similar ones) or I could be sure of buying a much better example and keeping it longer....  

 

I used to change my motors annually but haven't done that now for 8 or 9 years.  Probably because old cars have got ever more expensive whilst newer "everyday" stuff has got ever more undesirable to me.

[Stanky]

Point 2 is a tricky one, really good Mondeo's fetch under £1000, there's a rare 4x4 available at the moment for £475 that looks good. But, may come with an equally long list when you get into it...

 

Can you do the logical minimum of a thermostat and coolant and see how you get on temp-wise? This should cost <£20 and take an hour or so to do. Then, if the car runs at temp again, consider the cambelt and water pump next.

 

This way, worst case scenario is the belt snaps and scraps the engine and you've lost £20. If the car still doesn't get up to temp, but you know you have replaced the coolant and 'stat, then consider what you want more - new belt and cool running, or sender and old belt. Choose your preference and get that fixed in maybe a month or so time.

 

How cool does it run? I had a Mk2 zetec 2.0 and it always pointed at the 'O' of 'Normal' which seemed to be more like 80 celcius than 90 to me, but it still delivered 38mpg over about 20k miles so was obviously fine.

 

I don't do pure bangernomics, I replace the things that NEED replacing with secondhand parts using my own hands as required. The things that are niggly but not important get done as and when I have money and time. I'd say get the belt and pump and coolant done and let it run cool for now. That won't kill it. Then in a couple of months change the stat of its still running cool. Then, if the gauge is still showing it running cool, but you know the pump is fine, the stat is fine and the coolant is fresh, think about the sender but probably don't bother. you know its fine so leave it.

 

Aux belt? Whats the worst that can happen if that snaps? You lose the alternator and have to stop within 15 miles or so? Lose A/C? never mind. Lose PAS? Never mind. What else does it drive? If it goes, replace it and the tensioner but otherwise sod it. If the cam belt obscures the aux belt then get the aux belt done at the same time as the cambelt. Can you change the pulley and tensioner with the belt in situ? if so, leave these bits and do them in due course.

 

Why do the PAS pipe need doing? do they leak? do they leak badly? if not, then don't worry about it. If they do then maybe think about having them replaced. Probably after the cambelt though.

 

Or drive the fucker until something chronic happens, buy another identical one and swap the best bits over before scrapping the remnants of the first one

[sierraman]

I used to be like that but you end up wasting no end of money. The mk1/2 Mondeo does run cold by nature, should read with the standard stat at 1/3 on gauge. You can fit, as I did, a hotter stat.

 

PAS pipes, I'd check if they are weeping, if not then paste with waxoyl. The PAS pumps on these always weep, they did this almost from new, so long as you aren't topping it up all the time id leave it.

 

The drive belt on these isn't a difficult job, have a go yourself. You could easily waste thousands on replacing things unnecessarily.

 

You can't make anything last forever, that's out of your control.

[egg]

PAS pipes run along the front subframe, very exposed to the road, and are heavily corroded.

 

Mine is running on the 'o' of normal...and I've read should be nearer the 'r'? Not sure if that is rubbish or not. I've also read that water pump failure kills a lot of zetec-e's...

[Dave_Q]

General sequence for me is:

 

Think of a car. "ooh I always liked those, can I afford one yet?"

 

Look at prices for a good one vs a shit one.

 

Buy the shit one as it's cheaper.

 

Drive it for a while, like it, do things like cambelt etc in chunks of about £100 at a time every other month or something.

 

Spend more in total than buying a good one in the first place.

 

"Oh shit, I've won a roffle/bought something else/got bored."

 

Am now a distressed seller needing to get rid due to storage.

 

Sell for an overall loss somewhere between mild and medium.

 

Return to start, do not pass Go, do not collect £200.

[stripped fred]

I think it's important to not get carried away and try and replace everything that might fail. It's hard to predict exactly what component may go wrong. I would focus on those parts that would cause the most damage such as the belts, water pump etc and of course safety items such as brakes and tyres. Oil and all the filters should also be a regular thing. Other parts can be changed when required. Preventative rust proofing and cleaning the wheelarches with a jet washer will also prolong it's life so I try to do that too.

 

It's all time though isn't it and we also have to work, tidy the house up, keep the Mrs happy, spend time with kids, go to the pub etc (delete as applicable).

[sierraman]

PAS pipes run along the front subframe, very exposed to the road, and are heavily corroded.

 

Mine is running on the 'o' of normal...and I've read should be nearer the 'r'? Not sure if that is rubbish or not. I've also read that water pump failure kills a lot of zetec-e's...

The water pump runs off the drive belt, it won't chuck the timing belt off. I've known pumps go on them but rarely without good warning, either pissing water out or rumbling. The thermostat, if it was faulty would go to cold when you put the heater on. As I've said they do run cold, unlike the duratec, if it bothers you that much put a hotter thermostat on, not a difficult job at all. Particularly on yours as it's the steel housing for the thermostat, given its a silver top.

 

If the pipes aren't actually leaking I'd paint them with some underseal after wire brushing them or if you've got some waxoyl all the better.

[vulgalour]

1 - Buy car.  Assess whether I like it or not after a few long drives and short drives.  If it doesn't suit, punt it on.  If it does suit, assess condition.

2 - What is broken.  With the Rover I needed to replace the front brakes, the radiator, the clutch and the rear suspension bushes, in that order, as that's what was wrong with it.  I started by swapping bad cosmetic items for good ones.

3 - Fix the actual problems.  Break more things in the process and fix those.  Cry a little bit.

4 - Enjoy functional car.  Discover more niggles, break down at least once.  Cry a little bit.

5 - Resolve all the real problems, drive around any problems that aren't really problems.  Spend on items you don't really need.

6 - Enjoy trouble free motoring for quite a while.  Experience FTP.  Cry a little bit.

 

Never add up how much it has cost.  I did that with the Rover and learned I've spent about £150pcm over the last 9 months including the purchase price of about £300.  Thing is, it's worth it to me because I really like it.  I suspect I have a track record of overspending on cars, I've never added up what the Princess stands me at and I don't think I ever should, it will be considerably more than the car is worth, I'm sure.

 

 

TL:DR - Prioritise by spending money on items that need to be fixed to keep the car safe (tyres, brakes, having enough fluids in the engine) and use to make sure you have confidence in the car.  If it's good and you like it, keep spending.  If it's bad and you hate it, punt it on.

[Noel Tidybeard]

PAS pipes run along the front subframe, very exposed to the road, and are heavily corroded.

 

Mine is running on the 'o' of normal...and I've read should be nearer the 'r'? Not sure if that is rubbish or not. I've also read that water pump failure kills a lot of zetec-e's...

 

i think the point is the whole of the section is labeled   normal   so anywhere within  normal  is normal  

[mercrocker]

^^No implications should be drawn from French market versions of K Series cars reading "Normalement" across the temp gauge....

[Split_Pin]

My general rule is 'do what's necessary'.

[xtriple]

Everything! I am OCD about a lot of things but cars/bikes in particular. I cannot stand anything wrong with them, however minor.  I never use the radio or cassette but have just spent a fortune to get a head unit that works on all the systems. Stupid...

 

The Mazda is already booked in to the bodyshop in June for a spray on the bonnet (it's not quite the same finish/shine as the rest of the car) and an investigation into the drivers side wheel arch. I 'suspect' it has had a new one at some point and I want to know! There's no rust or anything wrong with it other than a slight blemish when the sun shines on it and I HAVE to know....

 

There were a lot of things on the dollop that I 'could' have lived with for a while, but I know me so it all got done in one BIG hit. It is driving me crazy that there has been a load of rain the last two days and the car is covered in sahara sand, I've already washed it twice this week and don't want to do it again (feeling poorly!) but I'm going to have to, for my sanity.

[Parky]

Tend to do engine and gearbox oil as a minimum, just so I know it's done. After that it's brake fluid and often pads and shoes once I start investigating the brakes.

 

Coolant usually follows although oddly I tend not to touch the plugs if it's running OK. Apart from that a good clean and sensible stuff like checking battery terminals are clean and tight, hinges are lubed, and wipers are ok

[stripped fred]

I used to be a bit OCD about my cars but I now find it less stressful to accept imperfections particularly bodywork ones. Of course this is easier to do when they've only cost a few hundred quid. It means that if they gain a supermarket car park dent I just shrug and drive home. I'm more careful about my mr2 but even that has some imperfections not helped when I reversed it into the garage door, twice!

[PhilA]

Agreed on a lot of the above. I've spent more on the car than the car is worth in money on maintenance and repair, however I wanted the car to be reliable and economical.

 

Also, things that should function are repaired unless they serve no nominal use (front fog lights, replacements are expensive) and things it needs to be safe (tires, ball joints etc)

 

Spread out over the course of a few years is ultimately cheaper than the new car. I actually drive it more than the Challenger. I don't mind pouring the miles onto it because very little of the moving parts and anything that would make it a concours example is long gone, so as a slightly tatty example it's fun to drive, fairly easy to fix and I don't mind putting short journey stress on the engine because I can always fix the issues that causes. The modern not so.

 

Phil

[sierraman]

I look after them well but sack them off usually when something like a DMF or the head gasket goes. I had a Fiesta that ran well, didn't owe me a penny, but then I discovered the floor had started to go. Could have had it welded up but I thought fuck it. It's easy to get into the mentality of 'I'll not change it, you never know what you're getting' unawares your own car is a nail.

[Bren]

The autoshite way is to spend £500 on improving and then selling for £250.

[HH-R]

Xtriple, I thought of you today when I realised my car has been washed about 4 or 5 times in 14 months! The odds of me not being at work, having free time and it not raining at the same time are the same as winning the Lottery jackpot.  The old girl needs a wash desperately.

[Stixy]

When a cars time comes depends on the owners enthusiasm for it   

 

If you like a car put whatever ££ into it to keep it going .

 

But then again i do things like this  

 

 http://autoshite.com/topic/20414-how-i-spent-my-bank-holiday-weekends-ford-focus-in-many-bits-content/?do=findComment&comment=750733

 

so probably not the best person to give an opinion