19 Years of Tin Snail - Back to normality

[LightBulbFun]

5 minutes ago, dollywobbler said:

Valve clearances loosened up, manifolds swapped over, no joy. Bit worrying now...

I imagine you have already tried

but have you checked for spark/ignition timing etc?

[dollywobbler]

Yes. Electronic ignition, spark at the plugs, timing reset, twice. 

[LightBulbFun]

1 minute ago, dollywobbler said:

Yes. Electronic ignition, spark at the plugs, timing reset, twice. 

is it drawing fuel through? I remember someone else on here had issues with a 2CV drawing fuel though after it had sat for a long time

maybe squirt some easy start or whatever down the carb and see if it will run on that? might give you some idea on whats up?  

[Sir Chocolate Teapot]

Keep calm, plenty of tea and thinking time needed in situations like these, there is always something obvious forgotten, ( in my case anyway). 

For your trip to Croatia I do not know your route, I am based just east of torino Italy, if you need help, towing, garage space place to sleep or translation services let me know. Only thing is I am not returning there until 16th July. 

Sir Chocolate Teapot at your service

 

[dollywobbler]

Ouch! Noisy.

 

 

1 hour ago, Sir Chocolate Teapot said:

Keep calm, plenty of tea and thinking time needed in situations like these, there is always something obvious forgotten, ( in my case anyway). 

For your trip to Croatia I do not know your route, I am based just east of torino Italy, if you need help, towing, garage space place to sleep or translation services let me know. Only thing is I am not returning there until 16th July. 

Sir Chocolate Teapot at your service

 

Thank you. I do not know my route either, but I'll bear you in mind. Cheers.

[LightBulbFun]

Woop woop!

do you know what it was or did you just attack various things and pray? (hows compression now?) 

 

where DID this engine come from? I was only aware of you having ellys original engine spare 

[shedenvy]

Huzzah!

Reminds me of when a Citroen specialist called Michel came to fix my Dad's efforts at fitting a replacement engine to our 2CV.  It fired into life without the exhaust fitted, me & a mate thought a spitfire had landed on the driveway.

[dollywobbler]

45 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

Woop woop!

do you know what it was or did you just attack various things and pray? (hows compression now?) 

 

where DID this engine come from? I was only aware of you having ellys original engine spare 

Squirts of Easy Start began to induce coughs. Then I ran out. Carb cleaner caused more coughs. Then I ran out. Brake cleaner was my final resort! Maybe it cleaned the inlet valves up because then it started to properly cough on its own petrol. Then I ran out of volts...

So, Fox was hooked up (thank goodness my jump leads are long!) and there then followed a good ten minutes of almost-starting. She was blowing impressive smoke rings! Eventually, coughs added up to a splutter, before she finally roared into life.

Have since drained the oil, now it's nice and warm and started swapping stuff over from one engine to the other. Still going to be a while before I can actually go for a drive.

I acquired the engine in 2013 as part of a job lot. A 2CV that was quite rotten, and a complete rolling chassis. The chassis had sat outside, wrapped in plastic for gawd knows how long. I removed the engine and sold the rest. The oil filter was going rusty, so I suspect it had not run for a very long time.

[dollywobbler]

The cylinder head oil feed pipes were looking crusty, so I bit the bullet and did some stripping. All the cowling, manifold and front cover need to come off to allow access. Not difficult, just takes ages! Interestingly, and hard to see in this pic, the extra 25cc seems very obvious when you look at the barrels.

Since that photo, I've got the pipe fitted, the front cover back on, all the cowling and the manifold. Very nearly ready to run again, but I'm going to refit the fan in the morning and REALLY blow the cobwebs out. May wear ear defenders this time...

[gadgetgricey]

Great work Ian.

Garage looks a bit tidier as well

[Zelandeth]

Just make sure to have good ventilation when using brake cleaner like that...it breaks down into some *really* nasty stuff when it burns. 

Good for stripping the oil film from the cylinders too...which won't help compression.

I've got more than one engine up and running via WD40...guess it has to be useful for something!

Guessing you were initially fighting sticky/poorly seating valves and the inevitable low compression which comes with disuse, once you got it to fire that was that.  Real tell will be if it decides to play nice from cold again...any compression reading below 100psi I was told by an old engineer would likely cause poor starting or running.  Be interesting to see what it reads once you've got an hour or so run time on it...bet it's higher than the 60 you mentioned earlier!

[dollywobbler]

Indeed. Hoping for another start-up tomorrow.

Even before it started, compression was up to over 100psi each side (there was an awful lot of starter churning, in bursts, before it fired up), though it was leaking down, which does rather confirm the leaky valve theory. Hopefully it ran long enough to clean the valve seats a bit.

[richardmorris]

Exhaust blast noise aside, the engine sounds quite sweet. No nasty knocking noises.

[dollywobbler]

14 minutes ago, richardmorris said:

Exhaust blast noise aside, the engine sounds quite sweet. No nasty knocking noises.

To be honest, it'd be hard to hear any knocking over that!

[dollywobbler]

Exhaust fitted, first test drive enjoyed. 

 

 

[matara]

I love the way the whole front end strips away to let you work on this engine. I'd be tempted to see if you can get a thread insert put in the 652cc block and sling the short block in the boot with you just in case. Even dropping it off somewhere on the way to get done whilst your away. Perhaps Rich can have the mighty Dacia on standby for a return trip/rescue mission if required!

If this were on Netflix you would be binge watching it just to see what happens after each cliffhanger! Good work DW. 

[dollywobbler]

Back together. 

First few miles seemed ok, albeit slower than the 652.

Pushed on to Aberaeron.

Got confident, pushed on to New Quay.

Got home. Checked the car over. ARSE.

That's a pretty major leak. It is getting on that brake disc. And the exhaust. It smells horrible (which is why I was checking the car over). Not currently sure what to do other than have a cup of tea...

[Supernaut]

Put the 652 engine back in, then helicoil it.

 

It doesn't matter how long it takes, it should get you to Croatia significantly quicker due to all the power and speeeeed!

 

Seriously, though. That's a right pisser. I just finished watching the over-40-minute epic video you uploaded too.

[egg]

What's your hunch on the source of the leak?

edit: not that bloody oil pressure switch?

[dollywobbler]

7 minutes ago, Supernaut said:

Put the 652 engine back in, then helicoil it.

 

It doesn't matter how long it takes, it should get you to Croatia significantly quicker due to all the power and speeeeed!

 

Seriously, though. That's a right pisser. I just finished watching the over-40-minute epic video you uploaded too.

652 needs stripping to be able to Helicoil it. 

6 minutes ago, egg said:

What's your hunch on the source of the leak?

edit: not that bloody oil pressure switch?

No, not that at least! Pushrod tube seal is my guess.

Really not sure what to do right now. I think go and check the oil level to see how much it has lost on the 70-mile trip.

[LightBulbFun]

if your going to have to tear into it proper to fix the leak, I guess you could swap over the 652cc piston and barrels from the broken engine so at least you get a performance gain out of all the faffing around?  

(id also stick the 602cc piston and barrels on the broken engine just so you dont lose any bits or bobs)

[dollywobbler]

12 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

if your going to have to tear into it proper to fix the leak, I guess you could swap over the 652cc piston and barrels from the broken engine so at least you get a performance gain out of all the faffing around?  

(id also stick the 602cc piston and barrels on the broken engine just so you dont lose any bits or bobs)

It's a thought. My worry is, I reckon the 652 is hiding a deeper issue, which may or may not have caused that stud to pull out. There's definitely a knock on that side, unless that stud has gently been failing since I did the work. 

[richardmorris]

Given you’ve got three days I don’t think you can fiddle with a 652 upgrade, change the spectacle seals if you can get them in time, they originals are probably rock hard.

[SiC]

@Bucketeer may let you borrow his bike for you to ride to Croatia on?

[dollywobbler]

1 hour ago, richardmorris said:

Given you’ve got three days I don’t think you can fiddle with a 652 upgrade, change the spectacle seals if you can get them in time, they originals are probably rock hard.

I agree. Have started stripping stuff off the latest engine, ready for seal replacement tomorrow. A friend is bringing some over (and some moral support!).

[richardmorris]

[dave j]

Nothing like a tight deadline to focus the mind! Best of luck with it

[stuboy]

saying... never rains but pours

[matara]

Ian,

I have had the dreaded pulled head stud,with an aircooled VW motor that was giving exactly the same type of noise in your vid, not always there at tick over or light throttle, but when you put the gas pedal down that's when you are likely to hear the chatter. If it's left like that for a while the barrel can pound into the case, but I think you picked this up pretty quickly. On a VW this happens when you put 1600 barrels and pistons on an original 1500 case with old head studs. I think the metallurgy of a 30-50 year old case isn't up to the increased torque of the larger combustion.  Usually with a VW you would drill and tap for threaded case inserts on all jugs rather than just the single pulled stud, as it's likely to pull another stud if you just do the one. 

Good luck whichever way you go.

Cheers

Steve

[dollywobbler]

I did whip the head off the 652 yesterday evening. There was some nasty blow-by on the head joint, as you'd expect. Also seems a fair bit of side-to-side movement on the piston in the barrel, none up and down. I wonder if piston slap is what I was hearing because it's had a tap that side for at least 1000 miles, maybe more? Or was the stud already breaking free even then? That tap was more noticeable at idle, especially when cold. The stud-related noise on full throttle only started after I changed the oil for 20w50...

Anyway, a friend is coming over with parts and support and we'll crack on from about 9am. I'm just off to do another compression test, because previous tests have shown that the compression leaks away rather on the side we're working on. Wondering if it might actually make sense to lap the valves in.