Cars of Crackers: Wagon In

[LightBulbFun]

11 hours ago, Crackers said:

I've been thinking about bringing it up to the FoD this year but that's M3/M25/M40 so not exactly ideal roads for it.

please do try and bring it up the FoD when im attending! 

I am annoyed that I missed the one FoD gathering when @mat_the_cat came in his so I dont want to miss another!

call me weird, but the more horrible someone describes a vehicle the more eager I want to drive it and experience that for myself

 

like sure you can describe to me the latest Porsche and how it sticks to the road and and goes round a one way road in Germany the quickest

yeah whatever

but describe to me something your fighting to keep on the road at 40Mph and has more steering slop in it than a bowl of porridge?  fuck yeah that sounds awesome, I wanna have a go! LOL

 

[mat_the_cat]

6 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

but describe to me something your fighting to keep on the road at 40Mph and has more steering slop in it than a bowl of porridge?  fuck yeah that sounds awesome, I wanna have a go! LOL

I know what you mean - I find there is a strange appeal to a long journey in an inappropriate vehicle. Taking the iLoad on a trip just doesn't have the same sense of adventure! 

[N Dentressangle]

A Series 3 should't be that bad.

The steering should be precise enough to allow you to stay in lane easily - no more than an inch or so of play at the steering wheel It shouldn't wobble or veer, or feel especially dangerous. It won't feel like rack and pinion, cos it ain't - it'll feel dead and vague by comparison - but should be usable and safe. Check for easily adjusted play in the steering box, loose drop link, worn ball joints, worn swivel pins etc. All of these things can make a Series horrid to drive.

Steering should be so heavy that parking is awful. Compared to moderns it will be a workout, but if it feels stiff then suspect all of the above plus tyre pressure / choice.

Brakes will be 10" drums in yours, no servo. They should pull up straight but need a very good shove to do so. You should be able to lock the wheels with them if you push hard enough. They will utterly lack feel and be wooden as a sideboard, but they're OK for the speed of the vehicle and a bit of forward planning. V easy and cheap to rebuild. You can fit 11" drums on the front and a servo, and the brakes will be sharper and require much less push. They'll still have no feel whatsoever though, and the 10" drums are OK for the limits of the vehicle tbh.

Diesels will be dog slow and really noisy. No way round that. 50-55 flat out eventually, if your ears can stand it.

Petrols should be much better. Quick enough up to 40, then ever more sluggish after that. Flat out will be 55-60, up to 65 if you dare and have no mechanical sympathy. Setting the tappets properly will help, as will a decent carb. The Zenith is OK when it's working well, but an SU conversion is much better. 750's help with the low gearing. Overdrives are ca £1k, are usually worn out and whine like a pack of hounds. I wouldn't bother.

HTH

[Talbot]

11 hours ago, mat_the_cat said:

 @Talbot is probably the one to ask about just how bad is 'normal' steering!

Ho Ho Ho oooooohhh... urgh.

Series steering.  It is at very best medeocre, and has about a thousand things that can go wrong and make it utterly terrifying.  In order from the steering wheel to the contact patch on the road:

• The steering shaft upper bearing can sometimes come out of the steering column.  if it has, shove a new one in there.
• The steering box is often quite worn on these and hasn't been lubricated in several millenia.  Change the oil in them.  EP90 is what it should have.  If in doubt, over-fill it.
• Then comes the for-and-aft drag-link.  A balljoint at either end, both of which can have slop.  Replacements are cheap.
• Next is the steering relay, which is like an offset bellcrank that goes through the front crossmember.  This will also be as dry as the proverbial and probably have play in it.  They are available to be replaced, but are an absolute swine to get out of the chassis.  Fill it up with oil.  Make sure it doesn't all immediately leak out (which it probably will)
• Next is drag link number 2.  It goes from the steering relay to the Nearside front wheel.  2 more balljoints to have play in.
• Then you have the nearside swivel.  Should have a bearing in the base and a railko bush at the top.  Probably all worn out with miles of play.  Strip and rebuild.  There are hundreds of arguments online as to whether you should use EP90 or one-shot grease in the swivels.  Quite frankly, as long as there's some lubrication in there that isn't mud, you're doing well.  They do have a specification for pre-load, but as long as they're smooth in operation and have minimal play, that's always been fine for me.
• Then comes the third (and final!) drag link, connecting the Nearside hub to the Offside hub.  2 more balljoints to have wear in.  This may also have a steering damper fitted to it, which is usually a good thing.  This is also where the tracking is set, which should be very fractionally toe-in, or pretty much zero.
• Finally (!) the offiside hub, with all the same issues as the Nearside one.

Every single one of those items listed can have play in it, making the steering "wandery" at best, working through "holy fucking shit this is going to kill me", up to "I am dead".  If there is a dry or stiff joint anywhere, you'll be fighting with the vehicle for every single second of travel.  Also, every single item above has adjustment in it, meaning that someone who doesn't know what they are doing can *utterly* screw up all the steering angles, meaning you end up with more lock one way than the other, or over-turn one of the steering swivels and ruin the seals.  They need setting up properly.

One good thing with the steering system is that the two "ends" of the arrangement are visible at the same time.  If you reach in through the drivers window to waggle the steering wheel back and forth, you can watch the driver's side wheel and see how much movement is needed at the steering wheel to produce movement at the roadwheel.  It should be less than an inch of travel at the steering wheel.  I've seen a half-turn before now.

To strip and rebuild the steering system (not including the steering box) is a solid day's work.  The difference can be amazing.  I've driven everything from abysmal to near-perfect, but even the best are nowhere near as good as a rack-and-pinion steering system.

For many years, I had a series IIB forward control.  2.7 tonnes of perkins-powered slightly-odd-looking land-rover.  It had exactly the same steering setup as above, but with 9.00x16 tyres, (and 3" twin-leading-shoe brakes) It required almost herculean effort to steer the fucker.  If you were parked on concrete, it was physically impossible to dry-steer.. any steering effort would just deform the tyres, and as soon as you let go of the steering wheel, it would whip back and remove all your digits.

Fun?  Yes.  A precision instrument?  Not even slightly.

I could go on about the brakes, the engines, gearboxes, overdrives, etc...  but I won't.

@Crackers Bring it to the FoD at some point.  Cruise at 50 and bollocks to everyone else.  Expect 20mpg.

[Talbot]

2 hours ago, N Dentressangle said:

. Overdrives are ca £1k, are usually worn out and whine like a pack of hounds. I wouldn't bother.

I absolutely would.  A decent overdrive (and they can be rebuilt with new bearings etc..) makes a world of difference on a longer journey.  To the point I've moved an overdrive from one vehicle to another before driving it 250 miles.

A friend who built his Series 3 up from a galvanised chassis when he was 16 (and still has it) did all the gearing mods:  He put in 4.1:1  differentials (rather than the stock 4.7:1) 7.50 wheels/tyres and an overdrive.  Whilst it's still pretty underpowered (67hp from the 2¼ diesel) it does at least drive in the gears you expect now, rather than being in 4th at 20mph and having nothing left by 45.  It will grumble along at 65 quite happily on the motorway, and has been known to see 80 downhill.

He also did all the right mods to make it driveable on a daily basis:  11" twin-leading shoe brakes on the front, a servo, steering system completely overhauled, etc.etc.  It's still a hard-work vehicle to drive, and you end up deaf after a couple of hours, but it's a lot better than many other Series I've driven.

[N Dentressangle]

Yes, worth it if you do long journeys, but I've got other cars which are better at those so my Series stays pretty local.

[Crackers]

Happy Anniversary! A year ago today I bought this handsome beast.

Do I regret it?

Yeah, I do. But also no I don't. Make of that what you will.

I've missed my opportunity for working on it before summer, with end-of-year exams approaching at uni meaning I can't dedicate the time to take it to bits and solve some of the problems. I must go and dig it out and blow the cobwebs out soon as I'm missing that V8 rumble in my life, but I think come the end of May I'll be able to spend more time (and money) on the old barge to make it as good as it should be.

[chaseracer]

On 13/03/2022 at 23:32, Crackers said:

I've been thinking about bringing it up to the FoD this year

YES

No other option can be considered

MESSAGE ENDS

[Zelandeth]

Have to admit I'd love a shot...have driven plenty of miles in a very well kitted out SIII and a V8 but otherwise basically empty airdrop spec, which was borderline terrifying.

Both of these were >20 years ago now so I'd be curious to see if I can still remember how to manhandle one into making progress in the direction I want.

Worst thing I ever did with the airdrop one was hit a non-signed hump back bridge I completely misjudged the steepness of at speed.  I think we'd gone a good quarter mile down the road before we stopped bouncing and I considered myself back fully in control.

Much to the amusement of my mate in the car that was following us and saw this unfold.

[Crackers]

On 14/03/2022 at 10:25, Talbot said:

@Crackers Bring it to the FoD at some point.  Cruise at 50 and bollocks to everyone else.  Expect 20mpg.

Cheers for all this. I'm sure it'll come in very handy when the time comes. Dad's tame LR mechanic, who works on his Disco for him, has offered to inspect it for free in a couple of weeks, so we should soon have decent picture of where we stand with all the stuff you mentioned. I'm sure there'll be plenty of knackered bits, it's to be expected of a vehicle that spent its working life on a farm.
The aim is to make it a reasonable example in terms of mechanicals, reliability (stop laughing) and safety, while leaving the externals absolutely untouched unless necessary.

59 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

I completely misjudged the steepness of at speed

I did that over a set of speed cushions. 90% sure it hopped the rear axle, which was really comfortable*.

[Crackers]

An unexciting post, but relevant to some of the comments above ref gearing, tyres and overdrive. 

A full set of wheels from a 109" has been acquired with fairly chunky looking 7.50 tyres. Dad's spoken to the previous owner of the Series, who confirmed that it did have an overdrive in his ownership, but it was so noisy he had no choice but to remove it.

The 7.50s should make cruising slightly more tolerable and will give it a bit more of a meaty look. The wheels will be refurbished at some point as they are tired (pun not intended. Not one bit). 

In other news, it emptied all its brake fluid on the floor the other day (easy fix - hose gave up), so I hope some of you kept the receipts for your comments about the P6's brake reservoir! 😉

[Crackers]

🎵 THE WHEELS ARE BACK IN TOWN 🎵

FFS Phil, not now!

Before/After:

 

Almost unrecognisable!

The pristine finish will need toning down a bit as they're far too shiny for the car they're going on, but that can be sorted in time and they will naturally weather in with use. The main thing is they've been done properly, and for not a huge amount more money than an equivalent DIY job.

Next job is to get a set of tyres fitted (we're thinking Avon Rangemasters, but having experienced Avons perishing very quickly, I don't really want him to spend a load of cash on something that won't last.) 
General Super All-Grips or Michelin XZLs are other contenders but are significantly more expensive and probably not worth it. We've looked at budget options but there's not really that much more money to be saved, unless he finds some at the Beaulieu autojumble this weekend.

Dad's been working through a few issues including a persistent leak from the water outlet at the back of the head to the heater box, which he thinks is now sorted. Unfortunately now the header tank appears to have sprung a leak so that'll be either plastic-welded back up with a soldering iron or replaced. I'd like to give it an oil change before the FoD trip as it's quite black now, and dad's back isn't really in a position to be working underneath a car at the moment so I'll do that one next time I visit.

Hopefully with that sorted, it'll then be ready for a FoD road trip at the start of June. Anyone fancy being my official escort vehicle, y'know, just in case, like?

[Matty]

How's about being escorted by me, SiC, HMC, Captain 70s,  Vulgalour etc in a veritable parade of unreliability.

[Bradders59]

Does she use it to hang her handbag on and then ask why the cars is running rough ? 🤪

[Crackers]

2 minutes ago, Bradders59 said:

Does she use it to hang her handbag on and then ask why the cars is running rough ? 🤪

I have literally no idea what you're talking about. Wrong thread?

[Matty]

1 hour ago, Crackers said:

I have literally no idea what you're talking about. Wrong thread?

Choke

[Crackers]

1 hour ago, Matty said:

Choke

Nope, still confused. I posted about wheels and suddenly we're onto choke jokes (snigger)?

[Matty]

Yeah maybe it wasn't in context. It's an old joke about a woman going to a garage complaining about her car. I just knew the punchline is all 

[Bradders59]

Sorry. Either wrong page on this thread or wrong thread altogether. Im getting old you know. 🤪

[Crackers]

Dragging my thread up to the top for no reason other than "because I can".

Looks like some tyres have been decided upon at last. Ebay wasn't turning up any decent options for any less money than new tyres, everything on there was either 20 year old tyres or brand new ones at retail prices.

We'd dismissed Dad's local tyre place out of hand initially, as they don't stock any 4x4 tyres and they generally just cater for normal cars. However, by complete chance, it turns out they can supply and fit General "Super All Grip" radials at £20-a-corner less than anywhere else we've managed to find, which is good - so it looks like that's what he's going for; just need to buy some decent inner tubes now. Crossply Super All Grips were standard fitment on Land Rovers sold in South Africa, for a time.

Great service as usual from the chaps at Merityre Frimley. The place has been going for longer than I've been around and every time I've used them they've been brilliant - prices and service are top notch. Subject to a couple more maintenance jobs and an oil change, it looks like the FOD trip over the Jubilee weekend is a goer! 

(Image lifted from LRUK.)

P6-related content will resume in June after the FOD weekender, not that anyone cares.

[chaseracer]

14 hours ago, Crackers said:

P6-related content will resume in June after the FOD weekender, not that anyone cares.

I do.  I still have naughty ideas about that car.

[Crackers]

More preparation for the June FOD - new tyres fitted on the refurbed rims this week. General Super-All-Grips, a modernised version of a period tyre. Noice.

The difference in size compared to the 6.50s is quite noticeable and has definitely improved its stance.

On the 6.50s, about 53 felt like you were pushing on, with the steering becoming quite unpleasant and the engine feeling a bit too revvy. On the same stretch of road he's now had 60mph out of it (still pulling, but ran out of space), reporting much improved steering behaviour as well as less bleeding ears.

I'll do an oil change on it next weekend and there's a couple of hoses needing changing. Then we should be all set for FODding.

[Crackers]

So... The FOD mini-road trip was a success! 

The Land Rover put in a stellar performance over the weekend. I avoided motorways but a did do a few bits of dual carriageway at a 55mph cruise which was OK. I tried 60 briefly but it didn't really like it, so 55 is good enough for me. 

Mostly drove around at 50mph on single carriageways as going any faster just means more braking and acceleration around bends - waste of fuel. 

Due to the Sunday weather forecast I ditched early and drove home last night which was great fun. The dip beams are woeful, but the main beams are much better and are good enough to drive on dark roads at a decent speed. 

The route home took me down all manner of winding lanes and b-roads, which was fantastic fun keeping the momentum up around bends and over hills. It definitely got a good Italian tune up with a damn good thrashing all the way back, and seemed to be grateful for it.

I doubt it's ever been driven as hard as that, but it did well and with the new 7.50x16 tyres the cornering is much improved and once you're up to speed, it carries its momentum very well - you really get into a rhythm with it. 

Didn't consume a drop of oil or water, nothing fell off, and bar a couple of minor random wiring faults it all went brilliantly well. If I didn't trust it before, I sure do now. 

Scores on the doors are roughly 16.5 MPG which seems to be about right for one of these and not bad at all given most of it was driven at race pace. 

I suppose that pretty much sums up the trip and all that's left is to share a few photos from the evening.

[Crackers]

It's a bit dusty like, but it's alive! 

Started on the first attempt - what a machine. 

Battery still had 12.5 volts left after 7 months in storage, so that was handy. Had plenty of juice to crank it over for a while to spread the oil around before reconnecting the coil.

First start video coming later. I can confirm it still sounds absolutely bloody brilliant. 

[LightBulbFun]

6 minutes ago, Crackers said:

It's a bit dusty like, but it's alive! 

Started on the first attempt - what a machine. 

Battery still had 12.5 volts left after 7 months in storage, so that was handy. Had plenty of juice to crank it over for a while to spread the oil around before reconnecting the coil.

First start video coming later. I can confirm it still sounds absolutely bloody brilliant. 

Fuck yeah! awesome to see the Brown beast is out from hibernation  

 

[chaseracer]

1 hour ago, Crackers said:

It's a bit dusty like, but it's alive! 

Started on the first attempt - what a machine. 

Battery still had 12.5 volts left after 7 months in storage, so that was handy. Had plenty of juice to crank it over for a while to spread the oil around before reconnecting the coil.

First start video coming later. I can confirm it still sounds absolutely bloody brilliant. 

As part of my first attempt at hypnotic mind control, I need to remind you that you agreed to sell this car to me and I'll be round to collect tomorrow...

[Crackers]

9 minutes ago, chaseracer said:

As part of my first attempt at hypnotic mind control, I need to remind you that you agreed to sell this car to me and I'll be round to collect tomorrow...

As part of my attempt at hypnotic wallet control, I need to remind you that you agreed to an extremely amicable* purchase price which can be paid in advance to my account...

[chaseracer]

Paided*... 😉

[Crackers]

Washeded. 

[Crackers]

An video. 

Nothing too exciting, just the start up, lots of idle noise and some revs while letting the choke off.

The smoke visible in the 2nd and 3rd clip is nothing to worry about, just some crap burning off after it's long sleep. Once up to temperature the exhaust is completely clean as usual. 

Featuring my entry for "campest mince away from camera" in this year's Olivier awards.