Ford timelord

[treehugger]

Possible it was raced, heavily damaged, put in corner of a yard then forgotten about?

[Datsuncog]

16 hours ago, auld_ALS said:

The list of entrants in the charity banger race includes 'PCs'  Loxton and Stamp from the Bill, I wish I could read the others.

If you haven't already, have a listen to KLFs Chill Out Album. It's a tremendous medley of clips constricted into a 54 minute track. Bill Drummond felt it illustrated how he percieved a journey through America's Deep South might sound. Even though neither of us have been there, I think it's a perfect rendition. There are some classic pieces in there such as Tuvan throat singing and clippings of speech from insane radio and televangelists. 

Yup, I've been straining my eyes trying to decipher that list of entrants too... Bruno Brookes seems to have been driving for Radio 1.

Sounds like it was a helluva night - just a pity there seems to be scant record of it available online.

I doubt a similar event will ever be recreated - can you imagine the risk assessment form?

Mind you, I for one could warm to the concept of shoving Piers Morgan into a fucked Granada estate with a slipping clutch, and letting the rest of the field chase him round the oval for a bit...

I really rate Chill Out - the sound of a group finally finding their groove.

Whereas the first two JAMs albums... well, they're a bit like being trapped in a demented DJ Jazzy Jeff karaoke with Peter Capaldi channelling Malcolm Tucker while riffling through your uncle's record collection... and not necessarily in a good way.

IMHO, of course. ?

[Datsuncog]

57 minutes ago, treehugger said:

Possible it was raced, heavily damaged, put in corner of a yard then forgotten about?

That's the theory I'm leaning towards, although I suspect it's about 98% wishful thinking...

I may need to take a handful of brave pills and email Bickers', just in the off-chance they can help put this one to bed.

[Sausage5000]

An unwanted rusted wreck that had been laid up for three years, was then owned or associated by a banger racer, and then disappeared for 29 years ... I’d say it’s long gone!

[Datsuncog]

Well, you'd certainly think that it'd be long gone by now...

...but then, you'd also think that a band who had just been certified the biggest-selling singles band in the UK for 1991 wouldn't then machine-gun the crowd at the Brit Awards and delete their entire back catalogue...

...and you also wouldn't think they'd burn a million pounds in cash from their royalties...

...or generally carry on in a fairly batshit fashion up to the present day.

Frankly, I'd say that all bets are off, as far as this bunch are concerned.

With much of their art ventures examining themes of destruction and sacrifice, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the post-race remains of the Galaxie were in fact stored away, for some unspecified purpose.

Certainly, some folks out there seem quite sure that it still exists...

And apparently the K Foundation has something big planned for 2023...

[DodgeRover]

On 7/5/2019 at 9:04 PM, Sausage5000 said:

An unwanted rusted wreck that had been laid up for three years, was then owned or associated by a banger racer, and then disappeared for 29 years ... I’d say it’s long gone!

You would be surprised how many times yanks get raced/ pulled out and raced again. If it was known to be something special there's a chance it was put aside for a big meeting, especially if it was going to take a lot of prep to get it in a state to race.

[bunglebus]

Fingers crossed. If nothing else, this thread is a fascinating yarn, and stranger things have happened. Who would have thought the much modified remains of a pre war Beetle, essentially a prototype, would be found and restored - with a surprising amount of its original parts being located to do the job. But it did.

[LightBulbFun]

like I imagine how people view my Invacar thread, 

I have no idea who the band is etc but I find this sleuthing and work to track down the car very fascinating and ineresting  

and that breakdown by @Datsuncog on page 4 is fucking amazing

[quicksilver]

Probably of no real relevance to the Ford Timelord story but the name Bickers of Coddenham seemed familiar and it was nagging at me. I've finally twigged why - they used to run a fairly well-known bus company but it was taken over jointly by Eastern Counties and Ipswich Buses in 1988. It appears that today's Bickers Action is actually the same company - Bickers of Coddenham Ltd now trading as Bickers Action. The reference in the Timelord blog to "BIckers old yard" suggests the former bus depot in School Road may have been the final resting place of Ford Timelord but I've looked on Google Maps and can't see any yards in School Road now so it must have been redeveloped. Sadly that means we're no closer to finding the car

[wrecker]

not the year of the galaxie,but earlier.

 

[Mrs6C]

Dropped off @LightBulbFun at Milton Keynes Central railway station this evening at around 6.30pm, after the Field of Dreams open weekend. Turning into the station forecourt, coming the other way was a wannabe Ford Timelord... a quick Google suggests that it may have been JDK 582N, which is a 1975 Dodge with a 402 motor...

No time to take photos, sadly...

[Datsuncog]

As a timely update to this never-ending saga, I've a ticket to see Bill Drummond on Saturday, touring his film 'Best Before Death' and live play 'White Saviour Complex'.

http://www.anti-worldsreleasing.co.uk/films/best-before-death/

Apparently after the show he typically sells copies of the play from the nearest bus shelter.

I'm hoping to obtain a copy of the play, and also casually enquire if he knows what became of Jimmy's old Galaxie…

I appreciate I'm unlikely to get a straight answer, but gotta be worth an ask anyway, hey?

[Split_Pin]

Excellent! He's a very interesting guy. I have listened do a few radio interviews with him, he certainly speaks his mind.

[Bren]

I still think the car exists.....

[Datsuncog]

I think it does too.

Probably smashed to bits, definitely hopelessly rotten, but my gut instinct (along with a number of anecdotes from assorted individuals) is that the remains were placed into storage and are still there, awaiting some future Drummond & Cauty event...

[sierraman]

Funny we’re on about this again. I was watching TOTP from 1988 and it was on a time lords video. 

[sierraman]

At a guess I’d say it ended up being raced, then the decimated remains buried on a farm or something like that in some sort of mock funeral. 

[chaseracer]

The baled remains were shipped to a Scottish island, painted to look like a million quid, then set on fire.

Possibly.

[DodgeRover]

Can't someone just stick their head in at Bickers yard and ask if anybody remembers it?

[Split_Pin]

He'll almost certainly be fickle about it but I can't wait to find out!

[egg]

We're counting on you DC! I'm ready to set up the crowdfunder for saving it once we find it 

[flat4alfa]

Not sure if this is linked, didn't see it

https://hunttimelord.wordpress.com/

[Datsuncog]

Just out from the Bill Drummond film/play/event.

Got talking to the man himself (very briefly) after.

I asked him about the fate of Ford Timelord.

He screwed his face up.

"Ehhhh... there's a lot of conspiracy theories out there."

I offered that it had been bangered by Paul Bickers in 1993.

"Ah, well... y'see... that's the thing...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

THERE WERE TWO OF THEM."

 

 

 

 

 

Mind

 

 

 

 

 

 

Blown.

 

 

 

 

Over and out.

[garethj]

More please!

[Datsuncog]

That was all. A handshake, a snatched opportunity for a brief few words... and the words were "There were two of them."

So... is it possible that the JAMsmobile - the Ford bought from Flinton Chalk which went to Sweden and suffered terminal engine failure - perhaps wasn't the same car as Ford Timelord, which they later took to Spain for the White Room film?

In those simple days, did they just swap the WGU18G plates around? (NOTE: the wreck on Jimmy's driveway in November 1991 had no plates on it...)

Let's have another look at the car in 1986 when Flinton Chalk (real name Gary Mitchell, apparently) owned it:

So, looking at the photograph taken in Sweden in September 1987 by an NME photographer, we can just about see that the words 'To Serve and Protect' are still written on the front wing, albeit badly faded...

But, after the car's return to London via an AA low-loader - and presumed engine repairs - a pic taken of the car in December 1987 by the Melody Maker shows no such lettering. The white roof paint is also fuzzy as if unmasked where it meets the rear flank; previously it seemed quite crisply done.

Now, of course it's entirely possible that the old lettering was obliterated in a fit of rattle-canning and then later re-lettered and distressed to give the appropriate look. None of this is conclusive. Note also that the bumpers are now black, not chrome, post-Sweden.

Some of the Timelords-era pics show a car with a domed blue roof beacon (as per the single cover), and with black A-pillars...

But in the video, the car has a red beacon and a loudhailer, white A-pillars, a half-tint to the windscreen plus what looks like a sheet aluminium repair around the offside headlights.

And the beacon doesn't always look quite the same.

Sometimes it has no loudhailer at all, and with the numberplate mounted on the grille.

Also: black A-pillars again; and it could be just the video colour balance, but the grille-mounted light looks clear/smoked rather than blue here.

Meanwhile, the car used in The White Room film in late 1988 has the roof beacon lens missing altogether and the deep sunstrip has gone (although the damage to the grille and front wing is consistent with the car in the Timelords video).

I'd assumed that various upgrades had been performed throughout 1988 as dictated by media appearances- but now I'm wondering if maybe that wasn't quite the case.

I also turned up this photo, which claims to have been taken in Oxford Street on 16 June 1987:

I'm not sure this date is correct, as that would place it around the time of their 'All You Need Is Love' release as The JAMs - and the car's sporting both a KLF logo on the bonnet as well as a set of roof lights and siren - neither of which seem to have featured on the car in other pics until mid-1988. Also, the rear arches are rough as guts here, as per the White Room stills shot in late 1988.

So I think this is a pic from mid-1988, not 1987, from the Timelords era and the band's first brush with chart success.

[^^^ Note: this earlier music mag clipping from September 1987 shows the car with black pillars.]

So were there in fact two near-identical Galaxies?

It's all up in the air.

The car was evidently heavily messed-about with in the four years between 1987 and 1991 when the band used and abused it. Paint, sunstrips, beacons, trim... none of this is in any way conclusive. It's very hard to tell by comparing smudgy stills from video clips and undated snaps from all over the internet.

Maybe one of the cars was indeed banger raced in '93, as witnesses claim - but is it possible that the other, perhaps the original JAMsmobile, was preserved in storage? Maybe it really is still in Norfolk, as the tale seems to go (although other rumours say that Bill keeps it in a lock-up in Sizewell).

 

Of course, Bill may well have been simply yanking my chain... or even genuinely mistaken after so many years: when he said "there were two of them", maybe he was referring to the 1971 car that was briefly owned by Jimmy but never ran right? Thirty years down the line, one big black and white yank's pretty much the same as another, right?

^^^ Still from the Beatmasters & Merlin's 'Who's In The House' video, where Jimmy brought both Fords over  - the only known pics of the LTD wearing KLF insignia.

Another music mag clipping (tiny, unfortunately) showing Simon 'Gen' Matthews of Jesus Jones posing with the ex-KLF Ford LTD.

My KLF- lovin' companion was deeply sceptical of the two-cars theory, reasoning that if one of the cars had survived, surely Drummond and Cauty would have dusted it down for their Welcome To The Dark Ages event two years ago.

He also reckons the model Timelord beside a shipping container included in Jimmy's 'Aftermath Dislocation Principle' art installation was nothing more than an in-joke acknowledging the various rumours.

Who knows? All I can say is, it's another twist in the tale...

Stay tuned, kids.

[LightBulbFun]

loving this thread still, esp as reading the new discoveries and how exciting they are for everyone especially the person doing the discoveries reminds me a lot of my own thread and how I feel when I make exciting new discoveries  

[quicksilver]

Call me cynical but I'd take Mr Drummond's words with a pinch of salt. If there's one thing the KLF like to do it's spread misinformation to add to their mystique so he might be taking this opportunity a create a new rumour. Maybe there were two Ford Timelords, maybe there weren't, maybe one survives, maybe they both got destroyed. Who knows? I doubt you'll get ever a straight answer, even from the man himself.

[Split_Pin]

I agree with DC's thought that Bill might be referring to the Ford LTD when he said that there were two. Certainly in several of the pictures posted, the rot in the rear wheel arch, lower rear wing and wing damage to appear consistent.

[Datsuncog]

 

On ‎9‎/‎24‎/‎2019 at 6:55 PM, flat4alfa said:

Not sure if this is linked, didn't see it

https://hunttimelord.wordpress.com/

Yep, I'd put a link up to Darren's blog a few pages back - there's a lot of good info and pics on there, though maybe not the easiest chronological thread to follow!

On ‎9‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 12:08 PM, LightBulbFun said:

loving this thread still, esp as reading the new discoveries and how exciting they are for everyone especially the person doing the discoveries reminds me a lot of my own thread and how I feel when I make exciting new discoveries  

Glad you're enjoying! I think we're still far from getting a definitive answer, but it's an interesting journey nonetheless...

On ‎9‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 1:47 PM, quicksilver said:

Call me cynical but I'd take Mr Drummond's words with a pinch of salt. If there's one thing the KLF like to do it's spread misinformation to add to their mystique so he might be trying to start a new conspiracy theory. Maybe there were two Ford Timelords, maybe there weren't, maybe one survives, maybe they both got destroyed. Who knows? I doubt you'll get ever a straight answer, even from the man himself.

Ah, I never expected to receive anything other than a gnomic response... although I was fairly sure he would have dismissed my query along the lines of "I can't remember, it was a long time ago" - which seemed to be his stock response when other event attendees asked him something about KLF-lore. So to get anything above that was unexpected.

But yes, it could of course be total bollocks - though there are a few inconsistencies in various photos which, when compared together, may give some limited credence to the two-cars theory (see pics now added to the previous post):

Of course, it's also entirely likely that even if it were true, neither car survived. Another online rumour I've recently encountered suggests that the car (or, one of them) was gutted by fire while in storage - maybe this was the rotten car that was eventually apparently bangered by Paul Bickers c.1993, or maybe it was a different car that was supposed to be preserved. Theories abound; evidence is in short supply.

 

But! There are several other things I've unearthed lately about the Ford Timelord saga:

1. WGU18G was not a Ford Galaxie. It was a Ford Custom, the trim level below the Galaxie - though using the same bodyshell. Without insignia though, it's quite hard to tell them apart.
   
   As with UK spec police cars though, US cruisers tended to involve a basic body fitted with the biggest engine possible - and so a real-life police version would seldom have been a Galaxie, and almost always a Custom.
   
   
   
   Kinda like The Sweeny's famous Ford Granada actually being a Ford Consul GT. But who, outside of car buff circles, would know that?
   
   We may stick to calling Ford Timelord a Galaxie, I reckon, otherwise it'll just get confusing.
   
    
2. The Ford also featured on the front of the Acme Auto Club's newsletter 'The Rocket' in 1986, when still owned by Flinton.
   
   
   
   This car certainly had more than its fair share of media exposure, what?
   
    
3. The car was apparently used during the filming of Superman IV, as a background vehicle. The sleeve notes of The Timelords single are indeed true. And here it is, still wearing its all-black paintwork:

However, the only sequence it was used in - a street fight outside the Metro Club between Superman and Nuclear Man - was filmed in early 1986 but completely cut during a hasty mid-production script rewrite. It was only made available as a bonus on a special-edition DVD (and, let's be honest, as a film almost universally acknowledged as one of the worst ever made, who would even watch 45 minutes of footage that wasn't deemed good enough?)

As an additional bit of trivia, the original script featured a very different incarnation of Nuclear Man played by a different actor from the one who eventually appeared in the much hacked-about 1987 cinema release (by which time the car was owned by Jimmy Cauty).

The finished film involved Mark Pillow as Nuclear Man fighting Superman on the Moon (or, as close to the Moon as £15-worth of paint and Styrofoam could get you at Pinewood Studios):



While the earlier version featured... erm…
 

The earlier version featured a rather different Nuclear Man trying to off Superman by pushing a load of rubber cars into him amid a frenzy of product placement.



This version of Nuclear Man was also played by Clive Mantle...



Yes, that Clive Mantle.



As seen for many a long year playing Dr Mike Barrett in BBC TV's long running primetime maim-a-thon, Casualty.

Don't say you never learn nothing here, folks.

[treehugger]

You need to get out more!

Brilliant!