invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[LightBulbFun]

major update time!

visited Zels yesterday to try sort out the government BS, and also got a driving lesson

the driving lesson was very awesome, out side of go karts, and a traumatic experience in a land rover at my dads place

this was my first time driving a car In real life

we wanted to do the lesson in the Van or the Xantia, however Zel could only get the Lada covered with temp insurance for a sensible amount

so it was "off the deep end" in the Lada, it really is quite the brute to drive LOL

especially as id turn the steering wheel, and id think "oh iv hit lock" then realise I have to just man handle the wheel and there's 3 more rotations in there!

which results in a hilarious picture like this

the first time I get behind the wheel in a power steering equipped vehicle, im probably going to end up ripping the wheel off the column now LOL

My clutch control definitely needs work, but I have been told, that Ladas do just kangaroo a bit even with a good driver behind the wheel

here's a more sensible picture of me behind the wheel  

I wonder how many people we made go "wat?!"

 

and in invacar news the person with the 2 Model 70s emailed a couple videos of the 2 Model 70's and a bunch of pictures of a bunch of the spares he has, as well as a inventory list

first up here's a couple screen shots from the videos that were linked  to me (sadly I have not yet got a close up fine detailed pictures of the 2 Model 70's so im still waiting to ID the "spares car")

he sent a video of REV451R shunting back and forth

 

 

and a video of the "spares car" engine starting up and running, looks like it cleaned up pretty well

 

I am very happy with what I see  REV451R is exactly what im "looking for" in a Model 70, and even the "spares car" looks to be in better condition then I was expecting  (I noticed its an AC rather than an Invacar, well at least that's what the badge on the front says!)

 

the person also has these 2 books, that Id love to go through, read and digitise!

 

 

and check out this picture from the spares parts book, stuart had mentioned that some of his ex DHSS documentation mentioned there being a "Model 70A and Model 70B"

well check out what it says bellow! its very awesome to read about in offical documentation (also more chassis numbers/regs to add to my list  ) most curiously the VIN plates on Model 70s do have a space for "Mark" but its not populated with anything

 

I think the changes was to do with chassis strengthening for crash test compliance, and also the change from 12 to 10 inch wheels, curiously despite the face lift and rollover bar etc fitted in 1975/1976 there was No Model 70 Mark C AFAIK (the spare parts book is dated 1984, so long after Model 70 production ended)

 

and finally for @Zelandeth @dollywobbler and @OliD-E here is the list of parts he has, (i noticed the total price, so im not sure if he wants £1800 for the 2 Model 70's and spare parts, or if its £1800 for the 2 Model 70's and he also has spare parts for sale)

Invalid car.xls

so yeah Im really quite excited by it all, and am hoping I can figure something out so I can buy REV451R

 

and many thanks to Zel for accommodating me yesterday and today, and giving me an awesome first driving lesson 

[loserone]

Some of our most prolific and well respected posters have learnt to drive in the time I've been reading AS and are now probably considered experts in their field.  I can imagine you may well fall into this category in a few years.  Actually, you're probably already an expert in one field.

 

Good luck!

[LightBulbFun]

10 minutes ago, loserone said:

Some of our most prolific and well respected posters have learnt to drive in the time I've been reading AS and are now probably considered experts in their field.  I can imagine you may well fall into this category in a few years.  Actually, you're probably already an expert in one field.

 

Good luck!

Thanks for the kind words

one thing that im taking as a good sign, is I know a lot people can be quite terrified during their first few lessons, but I actually enjoyed it very much, and was able to somewhat hold a conversation too while driving  (mind I was just going round a car park in a loop and then moved onto slaloming between the arrows on the road in the car park, and obviously working out the clutch and gear change and braking during all of that)

[egg]

Get them bought man! That's quite a day you had.

If someone else buys the spares car, I could probably store it on a drive way in Herne Bay for a short while (I'm about 30 miles away), though it probably makes far more sense to transport both in the direction of LBF in the first place.

Who was interested in the spares car?

[LightBulbFun]

26 minutes ago, egg said:

Get them bought man! That's quite a day you had.

If someone else buys the spares car, I could probably store it on a drive way in Herne Bay for a short while (I'm about 30 miles away), though it probably makes far more sense to transport both in the direction of LBF in the first place.

Who was interested in the spares car?

Indeed it was quite the day

i need to work on formulating a proper email response to the person (I sent a quite "im very happy with what I see" email while I was at zels place, and told the person ill send a proper email once im home)

I have 3 people showing various degrees of interest in the spares car right now  (I know I could like advertise it on the microcar world facebook group, and get lots of interest, however I want to make sure it goes to a good home, to someone who appreciates and understands what it is )

and thank you for the offering of a temp storage space, always handy to know the option is there!

[egg]

I assume the Ali G car has the roll cage and other later 'improvements' as compared to TWC?

[LightBulbFun]

3 minutes ago, egg said:

I assume the Ali G car has the roll cage and other later 'improvements' as compared to TWC?

I would think so yeah  (but I have not had it confirmed yet)

BTW as a side note, I noticed, it looks like the spares car still has its internal vin plate so thats good

[LightBulbFun]

Woo! just had someone who was showing interest in the second Model 70 more or less confirm that they are up for it 

now that I have at least 1 person that has confirmed they are willing to do this thing with me, it will make formulating my full email to the seller much easier for me

as I can in short go "Yep looks good to me, when can I buy/collect?"

as you can probably tell im very excited about everything

[Christine]

Re v. 4  sir   is a valuable plate ! 

[LightBulbFun]

15 minutes ago, Christine said:

Re v. 4  sir   is a valuable plate ! 

LOL I Never noticed that

but the plate is going to stay with the Model 70, I dont like plate raping living cars in general

but especially so when it comes to buses and invalid vehicles I already had 1 Plate Raped Model 70 cause a whole bunch of confusion, which I ended up sorting out in the end LOL

(VES108S, it used to be XEV88S but someone transfered XEV88S off, what does that spell to you? LOL, if it was still XEV88S, me and stuart would have found out about the XEV-S block much sooner which in turn would of meant we would of figured out the last of the Invacar Model 70's much sooner too, and also have figured out what was up with WOO848S)

but because of the "scottish" plate, and the fact it was the highest Numbered invacar known to have existed (well before I showed up and discovered SOI7570 and then the XEV-S block  ) 

people thought it was a Privately sold Model 70, and was the last Invacar Model 70 off the production line

I kinda felt sorry for the owner when I busted those 2 things, I dont think the owner believed me at first until Stuart agreed with my findings

much like Buses, the Number plates of Invalid vehicles carry a higher than normal significance

[LightBulbFun]

Alright the "yes I want to buy this I have the moneys" email has been sent! now comes the nerve wrecking part of "Did i word everything right?!" and waiting for a response back  

I have also sent PMs to the 2 other people who expressed interest, letting them know, and giving them the heads up just incase, I dont want to cause upset with anyone, so im just making sure that they are ok with everything as well

[GrumpyCat]

This photo was posted on my local Facebook page, thought you may like it.

 

 

[dollywobbler]

You need to work on your 'feed the wheel' technique.  Great that you had a drive though. If you can drive a Lada, you can drive anything... Top work Zel.

Interesting about TWC's bodywork. She really is a Bitsa! I guess many were in service. Also explains why the fit of the rear body is not very good... (close to the wheel one side).

The Lakeland Motor Museum has had a move around by the way!

[Mrs6C]

Found this interesting:

http://www.virtualgaz.com/invacarpage.htm#update

[LightBulbFun]

58 minutes ago, GrumpyCat said:

This photo was posted on my local Facebook page, thought you may like it.

 

 

a pretty old tippen delta that, id say mid 60s at the latest for that photo  (the later tippen deltas had a squarer front end)

34 minutes ago, dollywobbler said:

You need to work on your 'feed the wheel' technique.  Great that you had a drive though. If you can drive a Lada, you can drive anything... Top work Zel.

Interesting about TWC's bodywork. She really is a Bitsa! I guess many were in service. Also explains why the fit of the rear body is not very good... (close to the wheel one side).

The Lakeland Motor Museum has had a move around by the way!

haha yeah it was mentioned, I just kept getting caught out by how heavy the steering was, luckily I managed to avoid crashing into anything (and I only brushed the curb once!  ) 

happy to see RPF19R has been dragged out of the corner she was shoved into

and thank you for grabbing/sourcing those photos for me its worth noting RPF is another AC that has an Invacar badge for some reason (I know of 2 other Model 70s like that, those aint survivors tho sadly)  although saying that, whats the chassis number on the actual Chassis!

I wonder why the engine number was crossed out then stamped again but upside down? chassis number on the VIN plate matches up with the DVLA database at least  sadly the year of manufacture and Contract No are out of focus

on that note any chance you could upload your TJN352R pictures?  

 

30 minutes ago, Mrs6C said:

Found this interesting:

http://www.virtualgaz.com/invacarpage.htm#update

 

ah yes a valuable source of info during my early days, but quite a few things there are sadly not correct or need to be taken with a pinch of salt

I do wonder where he got all the pictures from, its a shame they are so low quality

[LightBulbFun]

16 hours ago, dollywobbler said:

Also explains why the fit of the rear body is not very good... (close to the wheel one side).

@Zelandeth found that IIRC on TPA one of the rear body section mounting bolts had pulled through the body work allowing that section to flap around

it might be worth checking out that section on TWC to make sure everything is ok  

https://autoshite.com/topic/29443-zels-motoring-adventureslada-citroen-mercedes-ac-model-70-1706-actual-invacar-bodywork-progress/page/45/?tab=comments#comment-1789104

 

[Dick Cheeseburger]

I've been away for the week with fifty two Year fives on residential, so not been checking in here. 

Great progress I see - when's D day?

[LightBulbFun]

Ahh I remember my residential from the home made raft we made falling apart on the water, some girl losing her shoe in the lake, and then me falling very ill during the last day or so, fun times LOL!

 

as for D day, not sure yet, hoping to hear back from my email in a couple days, if I dont ill give the person another call on tuesday I think  (the other person im going half and half with, has the money ready and is just waiting on my instructions so that's good ) 

(I think it's technically their work email im sending emails too, so im not sure if they see it over the weekend)

 

since things are properly getting "serious" now, I have been meaning to ask, one of the things I will need is insurance of course

so has anyone got any insurance suggestions?

Yes I am well aware this is not going to be easy given my situation, age and lack of normal car

and hence why im asking for suggestions here , I think hargerty is already out as they say on their website no under 25s, so im guessing no point calling those guys right? 

as I mentioned my mum does want to use the Invacar to nip around like I do, so a policy where I can add her as a named driver would be nice (or the other way round with me as a named driver, as my mum would be using it pretty regularly I dont think it would be classed as fronting?)

 

[mrbenn]

Well, this all sounds very positive! Am pleased for you LBF!

Re insurance and fronting, the general rule is that the person that will be using the car most must be the main driver on the policy. If your Mum will be using it more than you, she would be the main driver. Some insurance companies require the registered keeper, policy holder and main driver to be the same person, some do not so ask around.

[LightBulbFun]

48 minutes ago, mrbenn said:

Well, this all sounds very positive! Am pleased for you LBF!

Re insurance and fronting, the general rule is that the person that will be using the car most must be the main driver on the policy. If your Mum will be using it more than you, she would be the main driver. Some insurance companies require the registered keeper, policy holder and main driver to be the same person, some do not so ask around.

Thanks It's nice to have something positive happen in the shit show/cluster fuck that is my life

good to know on the insurance front, as mentioned if anyone knows of any insurance companies that might be worth giving a call, do let me know

 

on the note of legalities, out of curiosity, would a provisional licence holder be allowed to drive a single seater car like an Invacar these days?

I read that back in the day there was a rule that if the vehicle could not seat a passenger then the provisional licence holder could go out on his own

but im not sure how that stands these days, and quickly googling things does not turn up anything specific, so I wonder what people's thoughts are on that

[mrbenn]

I can't imagine you'd be able to go out on your own, have a look at this:

https://www.gov.uk/driving-lessons-learning-to-drive

 

Re insurance companies to try, I'd suggest:

MSM insurance

Footman James

RH

You'll have to ring up  and describe the scenario, a website might say no but a person may say yes having discussed the circumstances.

[LightBulbFun]

Yeah that's what I figured, I was just wondering if there where any weird exceptions etc (like how you can drive a bus privately on a car licence, as long as the bus is 30 years or older) I like to know what options are open to me

thanks for the suggestions  ill scope em out, (I have already been scoping out Footman James, looks like they do do something for young drivers, so I think thats a good sign https://www.footmanjames.co.uk/news/classic-car-insurance-young-driver )

on the link above it says:

Quote

 

Young enthusiast qualifying criteria for 18-24 year olds include:

The car must be over 20 years of age;

The owner must limit their mileage to either 3000 or 5000 miles per year depending on the age of the vehicle;

Young drivers need to have held a licence for a minimum of 12 months;

Maximum ABI group 20.

 

I fit most of those sections, however I fall short on the licence one, im not sure if they mean a full drivers licence or any type of licence (and either way I have had my provisional since the 26th of August 2018, so not quite 1 year yet)

(not quite sure what the ABI Group 20 thing is about either)

[LightBulbFun]

yeah this is going to be a phone call Job... they dont even have Invacar listed as a manufacture, and for AC, they dont even have the AC petite listed let alone any sort of invalid vehicles LOL

[SiC]

I can't see how an insurer will cover you on a single person car on a provisional license? The idea of being insured to drive on a provisional license is so you can be taught. However there is no additional seat for another person to sit in for doing that. 

Once you pass your test and have a full license, I could see it easier - age provisos aside. 

[LightBulbFun]

34 minutes ago, SiC said:

I can't see how an insurer will cover you on a single person car on a provisional license? The idea of being insured to drive on a provisional license is so you can be taught. However there is no additional seat for another person to sit in for doing that. 

Once you pass your test and have a full license, I could see it easier - age provisos aside. 

aye, my back up plan, if I cant get myself isured for it, is to at least get it insured for my mum so its legal being parked on the road, and so at least she can use it herself while I try and sort out insurance/get a full licence for myself  

[SiC]

aye, my back up plan, if I cant get myself isured for it, is to at least get it insured for my mum so its legal being parked on the road, and so at least she can use it herself while I try and sort out insurance/get a full licence for myself  

What car are you thinking of as a car to learn in? A cheap Corsa B or something?

[LightBulbFun]

Just now, SiC said:

10 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

aye, my back up plan, if I cant get myself isured for it, is to at least get it insured for my mum so its legal being parked on the road, and so at least she can use it herself while I try and sort out insurance/get a full licence for myself  

What car are you thinking of as a car to learn in? A cheap Corsa B or something?

see Page 53  (and then when I start taking paid lessons, I guess whatever car the driving school uses)

[dozeydustman]

Useful info for you Dez

 

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q504.htm

[LightBulbFun]

Ah goody I have been looking for that page again so thanks for linking that  (I came across it in the past but could not find it again)

im really not sure how that affects the Model 70 because its worth remember a Model 70 (and most other invalid three wheelers and four wheelers) is classed as an "invalid vehicle" NOT a "Tricycle", although sadly DW was miss lead into changing TWCs body type to a Tricycle, so I cant drive TWC on public roads I dont think (unless DW changes the body type back to invalid vehicle)

but REV451R is still classed correctly as an invalid vehicle

however on that note they say

 

Quote

a provisional licence will only cover riders to ride motor tricycles if they have a physical disability.

I do have a physical disability so does that cover me regardless of the haziness behind the Model 70?

or does that just add more confusion? (what do they class a physical disability?)

[666jjp]

have you looked at the NABD site?

 

http://www.nabd.org.uk/current-laws/