Bus Shite

[Snipes]

Yeah I thought they had those same Mercedes too, but seems not.

[quicksilver]

Fun* fact: there are Little Gems in Manchester again now as Go Goodwins revived the name and livery, and they even have original headboards from those Dodges sourced from the transport museum. One of them is some weird low-floor VW Transporter thing.

[cms206]

@83C I always found the Vario a bit of a retrograde step from the 709D but for what WG did they were absolutely a better vehicle; we did a weird mix of intensive urban and ultra rural stuff for a small outfit based in a large town.

Our two Varios were auto 29-seaters that both did 60+ and they took no time at all to get there but they rattled like bastards and unusually both had fixed bandit screens fitted which made them even less appealing; any time I had trouble on a bus it was one of these two, never had an issue even doing late turns with a 709D or a Dart. That and you could hear the square route of bugger all through the sodding things.

SF03 YXP was marginally quicker accelerating but the gearbox was near silent and the retarder used to cut out when you hit the tiniest imperfection on the road (which was a bastard when you forgot there was one raised expansion joint about 100 yards before a roundabout, on a downhill, NSL section of road on the 18, 19 and clockwise 8 like I did every time I had one on the 18, 19 and clockwise 8... ). One of the lassies crashed it through the perimiter fence at Glasgow Airport on an early morning 19 short and it was never the same after that; it was rebuilt using an older O810D, R733 EGD which was a far better bus than the one it was broken to rebuild but it was manual so against the advice of everyone it was put to death.

SF03 YXR's retarder was less fussy and it had a properly tuneful gearbox which at least made it tolerable for a 12 hour shift. It rattled a little more but judicious placement of canvas cashbags and weekly ticket holders usually sorted that out. It drove much better than it's sister and did about 67mph before the limiter woke up.

After those two we bought another two Darts new then an ex demo Cummins Solo before a pair of PS B10M MK.IVs and smattering of ex Metroline Darts. The latter four Darts were the undoing of the company and it went to the wall in summer 2013.

[Eyersey1234]

1 minute ago, cms206 said:

@83C I always found the Vario a bit of a retrograde step from the 709D but for what WG did they were absolutely a better vehicle; we did a weird mix of intensive urban and ultra rural stuff for a small outfit based in a large town.

Our two Varios were auto 29-seaters that both did 60+ and they took no time at all to get there but they rattled like bastards and unusually both had fixed bandit screens fitted which made them even less appealing; any time I had trouble on a bus it was one of these two, never had an issue even doing late turns with a 709D or a Dart. That and you could hear the square route of bugger all through the sodding things.

SF03 YXP was marginally quicker accelerating but the gearbox was near silent and the retarder used to cut out when you hit the tiniest imperfection on the road (which was a bastard when you forgot there was one raised expansion joint about 100 yards before a roundabout, on a downhill, NSL section of road on the 18, 19 and clockwise 8 like I did every time I had one on the 18, 19 and clockwise 8... ). One of the lassies crashed it through the perimiter fence at Glasgow Airport on an early morning 19 short and it was never the same after that; it was rebuilt using an older O810D, R733 EGD which was a far better bus than the one it was broken to rebuild but it was manual so against the advice of everyone it was put to death.

SF03 YXR's retarder was less fussy and it had a properly tuneful gearbox which at least made it tolerable for a 12 hour shift. It rattled a little more but judicious placement of canvas cashbags and weekly ticket holders usually sorted that out. It drove much better than it's sister and did about 67mph before the limiter woke up.

After those two we bought another two Darts new then an ex demo Cummins Solo before a pair of PS B10M MK.IVs and smattering of ex Metroline Darts. The latter four Darts were the undoing of the company and it went to the wall in summer 2013.

I didn't know you held a PSV licence CMS

[cms206]

12 minutes ago, Eyersey1234 said:

I didn't know you held a PSV licence CMS

Passed in January 2008 on a manual Javelin, was depot manager at a coach company until July this year when I fell out with the fella running it over a childcare issue when I left to go onto nights shunting; I don't have a truck licence.

 

Also: never work for your mates. It never ends well.

[Eyersey1234]

3 minutes ago, cms206 said:

Passed in January 2008 on a manual Javelin, was depot manager at a coach company until July this year when I fell out with the fella running it over a childcare issue when I left to go onto nights shunting; I don't have a truck licence.

I passed May 2007 in an automatic Volvo B10M-55. 

[cms206]

1 minute ago, Eyersey1234 said:

I passed May 2007 in an automatic Volvo B10M-55. 

I put myself through with my last big overtime payment before it was all cut... happier days working in Glasgow Airport, earning more in overtime than I was in wages!

[martc]

4 hours ago, Snipes said:

I was also reminded of the older Little Gems, but it seems they were Dodge(Ivecos?)

Dodge = Renault.

Bleak.

[Eyersey1234]

1 hour ago, cms206 said:

I put myself through with my last big overtime payment before it was all cut... happier days working in Glasgow Airport, earning more in overtime than I was in wages!

UVG body. Wightbus on the Isle of Wight had 3. I learned with EYMS. 

[cms206]

1 hour ago, Eyersey1234 said:

UVG body. Wightbus on the Isle of Wight had 3. I learned with EYMS. 

They did indeed, one of only four UVG Unistar Javelins supplied that year outwith the MOD, P81-3 VDL. The other was P100 LOW which was a demonstrator ISTR.

The one I passed in wasn't a UVG though, it was one of the last Wadham Stringer Vanguard 3s; the Unistar was a light facelift of the Vanguard 3 before they became the horrorsome UVG S320 and later still the SCC Compass.

[Eyersey1234]

Thanks I hadn't realised it was derived from a Wadham Stringer body. P81 VDL was one of my regular school buses around 2000/1, the others were H840 DDL, J142 JDL both of which were Javelins, the former was Wright bodied the latter Wadham Stringer, or sometimes we had one of the UVG bodied Darts. Southern Vectis had N810-5 PDL which AFAIK were the only 8.5m UVG Urbanstar bodied Darts built

 

Edited to add H840 DDL was so low geared the drivers would often set off in 2nd or 3rd as 1st went to maximum revs as soon as it was rolling. 

 

[cms206]

When I went through my PSV we used two Javelins; ex-Skills L31 ORC which was a Javelin GX290 with a big Cummins L10 and N188 RGD which was the one I passed in. In both the instruction was to always pull away in second, EXCEPT during the gear changing excercise (which I believe I was the last test at Bishopbriggs to feature it before it was phased out) or when the examiner stated to "pull away in the lowest available forward gear".

Javelins were happy enough in second anyway. Still one of my all time favourite buses to drive, great things.

[Eyersey1234]

16 minutes ago, cms206 said:

When I went through my PSV we used two Javelins; ex-Skills L31 ORC which was a Javelin GX290 with a big Cummins L10 and N188 RGD which was the one I passed in. In both the instruction was to always pull away in second, EXCEPT during the gear changing excercise (which I believe I was the last test at Bishopbriggs to feature it before it was phased out) or when the examiner stated to "pull away in the lowest available forward gear".

Javelins were happy enough in second anyway. Still one of my all time favourite buses to drive, great things.

J142 JDL and the P_VDLs were a bit higher geared so would happily pull away in 1st. Some of the best I have driven were the Optare Prismas, the aforementioned B10Ms and Gardner engined Leyland Olympians. We standardised on MCV bodied Volvos for the last couple of years of independence before the Go Ahead takeover last year, I drove one of the Evosetis when it was about a fortnight old and couldn't believe how atrocious the build quality was, I thought it was going to fall apart from the amount of rattles and bangs and flex in the bus. Thankfully new management have said there will be no more of them. 

[Zelandeth]

Still want to know what bloody engine that ex demonstrator Spectra I had a shot of...that thing was a bloody rocket.  Especially as hitting resume on the cruise control seemed to result in the various systems calculating the fastest possible way to get back to the set speed...normal gearchange points, rev limits etc totally out the window.

The best fun game was release handbrake, wait for bus to roll just enough the speedo picked itself off the stop, hit resume...watch other drivers react with complete befuddlement as this double decker bus catapulted itself off down the road more rapidly than seems physically possible.  Hit the rev limiter at about 55mph, but God it could accelerate.

[Mrcento]

Love these videos. Not just for the nostalgia of the buses, liveries and sounds, but for the shite spotting in between.

 

Oddly, talking of the Spectra, my local bus preservation group just got hold of Dundees old one (R2 NEG), so that's been added to their fleet.

[busmansholiday]

Spectras generally had DAF engines.

[Zelandeth]

18 hours ago, busmansholiday said:

Spectras generally had DAF engines.

That would make sense, they're engines I'm not so familiar with so would tie in with my being unable to ID it by ear...which I'm usually pretty good at.

Well, save for the last couple of years anyway when everything has wound up sounding like exactly the same tumble drier full of ball bearings.

[willswitchengage]

On 11/15/2019 at 9:50 PM, busmansholiday said:

Spectras generally had DAF engines.

I thought they all did and the Spectra was the missing link between the Metrobus and DAF's DB250. All recognisable in that the angle drive was between engine and gearbox, not gearbox and driveshaft. Some of the loudest modern buses I've found.

[Eyersey1234]

8 minutes ago, willswitchengage said:

I thought they all did and the Spectra was the missing link between the Metrobus and DAF's DB250. All recognisable in that the angle drive was between engine and gearbox, not gearbox and driveshaft. Some of the loudest modern buses I've found.

As far as I am aware the Spectra prototype was based on the Metrobus

[busmansholiday]

When MCW went tits up Optare (or Charles H Roe as I remember them in a previous life)  bought the rights to the Metrobus and Metrorider from the receivers.

Yes, the Spectra was DAF engines, but never put your house on "every one".

 

[Inspector Morose]

2 hours ago, Eyersey1234 said:

As far as I am aware the Spectra prototype was based on the Metrobus

Eeh, sort of.

Optare and DAF bought the rights to the Metrobus and Metroliner with the chassis design taken by DAF and the body design by Optare. Included in the deal was the undelivered G107FJW from the batch for West Midlands Travel (this bus was eventually sold on to Ensign and via First was exported to Sri-Lanka where it was converted to semi-auto). After it was pulled apart and rebuilt a few times, a chassis design was drawn up by DAF marrying the rear end of the Metrobus with the front end of the SB220 to come up with the DB250. The new electronically controlled 8 litre six cylinder replaced the loosely Leyland based DKL1160 in this model from the start.

The Body design, thankfully was not copied in any way (as far as I can tell) and was a clean sheet design by Optare. Knowing how MCWs can rot, thank christ for that at least.

As far as I can make out, no part of the Metroliner was used again in future construction by either party (well, not strictly true as the original double deck design was based upon the chassis design of the Hong Kong Metrobuses. The 400GT nor the partially constructed single deck designes were never used again however).

If you look under the rear end of a DB250, it is pure Metrobus, from angle drive to the H frame supporting the double reduction rear axle. That's why they sound (the early ones especially if Voith gearboxed) very much like a Metrobus - as far as driveline is concerned, they were!

[Split_Pin]

The model railway show was on in Falkirk today and there was a free bus service from Grahamston station. We use this as parking isn't great at the College and a fair walk would ensue. My dad is not very mobile at present so this is ideal.

I havent been on a Y type Leopard for years and this one made all the right noises. Unassisted steering and manual gearbox. A few times the driver came close to standy-up cab manoevering!

[Noel Tidybeard]

On 11/14/2019 at 10:59 PM, Mrcento said:

Oddly, talking of the Spectra, my local bus preservation group just got hold of Dundees old one (R2 NEG), so that's been added to their fleet.

R1 NEG is at Wythall

R1 & R2 would have been on the no 50 route- City centre to Maypole

[Pillock]

These Trippets just appeared on Facebook, apparently Loughborough based. What are they?

[cms206]

4 hours ago, Pillock said:

These Trippets just appeared on Facebook, apparently Loughborough based. What are they?

They are Optare Citypacer-bodied Volkswagen LT55s, same 2.4 6-pot diesel as the lowlier LTs and the Volvo 7/940.

Leicester took 15 as their 844-858, registered D844-854 CRY, E855/6 ENR, E857/8 GNR, all with 25 dual purpose seats. I think most passed to Derby City after Leicester.

The Citypacer was a great idea executed badly but it paved the way for proper coach built "second generation" minibuses after the Freight Rover Sherpa, Ford Transit, Bedford CF and the likes of van converted Mercedes 608Ds.

[quicksilver]

Ah, the Optare CityPacer, proper bus shite. Great looking things and the first minibuses to break away from the 'bread van' style, but pretty hopeless otherwise by all accounts. Weird high driving position (you can see the dashboard reaching more than halfway up the windscreen), gutless little non-turbo engine and some only had four-speed gearboxes with a stick that was prone to coming off in the driver's hand.

[cms206]

They weren't the best... a local operator to me were still running them into the 2000s, he swore by them.

He also swore by Renault S56s and his front line coach fleet when he closed were a Plaxton Supreme V-bodied Ford R1015 and an Elme-bodied Leyland Swift so his judgement may have been somewhat off.

[clayts450]

This should be an interesting project - bloke bought a National for peanuts and is aiming to restore it. He's set up a FB group to chart his progress

https://www.facebook.com/groups/544975109397506/

Happier times

[Eyersey1234]

On 11/25/2019 at 8:55 PM, cms206 said:

They weren't the best... a local operator to me were still running them into the 2000s, he swore by them.

He also swore by Renault S56s and his front line coach fleet when he closed were a Plaxton Supreme V-bodied Ford R1015 and an Elme-bodied Leyland Swift so his judgement may have been somewhat off.

An operator local to me was still running Plaxton Supreme bodied Fords and Duple bodied Bedfords up until 2011 when the local council lost patience and told him he had until the end of that academic year to update his fleet otherwise he could kiss goodbye to all his school runs. To be fair the maintenance was fine it was just the age of the vehicles that was the issue. 

Another local operator was also running a large number of 1st generation MCW Metrobuses up until about 5 or 6 years ago, then went moaning to the press about spending £150k upgrading their fleet, which again they had been told they had to do to keep contracts, then losing some of their school runs due to council cuts. The runs in question were not ones the council had to provide by law due to the distance from the school. 

[doug]

Good bus stuff here.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b04gvjd6/on-the-frontline-buses-on-the-frontline