SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 Just now, Peter C said: This is my concern. I suspect that buying good quality parts and fitting them to a 54 year old distributor is not a good idea. How much is a decent cap, rotor arm, points and condenser from the DD? About the same as the Accuspark kit? Dunno off hand. As I said I bought mine from Moss as used to be local to me. Their High Quality condenser and rotor are genuine distributor doctor parts.
Peter C Posted January 30 Author Posted January 30 Just now, SiC said: Dunno off hand. As I said I bought mine from Moss as used to be local to me. Their High Quality condenser and rotor are genuine distributor doctor parts. I will investigate further. I typed Accuspark electronic ignition review into Google and found this: The reviews for the type of kit that I found confirm that it's a load of shit. Thank you for the heads up.
Peter C Posted January 30 Author Posted January 30 @SiC This is even cheaper. https://carlightbulb.com/products/vacuum-electronic-distributor-25d-45d-distributor-for-mini-mgb-austin-generic?currency=GBP&variant=43178901536930&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google Shopping&stkn=d7752ef57dbc&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiA4-y8BhC3ARIsAHmjC_HUkfov8zvHnm1_lu_av85pGzTggrwlbSrnMLRpdfpwrnCaXRqpJacaAgDLEALw_wcB Worth having a go?
Peter C Posted January 30 Author Posted January 30 I have emailed Martin at DD regarding new bits for my distributor.
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 11 minutes ago, Peter C said: @SiC This is even cheaper. https://carlightbulb.com/products/vacuum-electronic-distributor-25d-45d-distributor-for-mini-mgb-austin-generic?currency=GBP&variant=43178901536930&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Google Shopping&stkn=d7752ef57dbc&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiA4-y8BhC3ARIsAHmjC_HUkfov8zvHnm1_lu_av85pGzTggrwlbSrnMLRpdfpwrnCaXRqpJacaAgDLEALw_wcB Worth having a go? Depends if you want to drive the car or tinker with the car by the side of the road 🙃 It's all the same stuff out of China/India. Martin at DD will rebuild and test your dizzy to factory spec. Apparently great but quite expensive. About the same as a 123 ignition - I went down that route as it meant I could tweak the ignition curve in the future. I didn't and kept the 123 dizzy instead when I sold the car. Bought a good condition second hand Lucas dizzy for when I sold it. bigstraight6 and Peter C 2
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 For now just get rotor arm and condenser replaced with DD so you can use the car for a bit. Then decide next steps maybe in the future. Even a worn old dizzy will be working more than well enough to make it usable. Peter C 1
Peter C Posted January 30 Author Posted January 30 I wonder whether my coil is fucked. It’s the one thing that I haven’t replaced yet and the one that’s fitted is not original and it’s held on with cable ties. 🤔
Peter C Posted January 30 Author Posted January 30 I ask about the coil as I’ve now been through three sets of points and condensers and two sets of caps, rotor arms, leads and plugs and the same problem persists.
Dyslexic Viking Posted January 30 Posted January 30 I think the best thing you can do is put a B series diesel in it. jonathan_dyane, loserone, Peter C and 4 others 1 2 4
jonathan_dyane Posted January 30 Posted January 30 53 minutes ago, Peter C said: This is my concern. I suspect that buying good quality parts and fitting them to a 54 year old distributor is not a good idea. How much is a decent cap, rotor arm, points and condenser from the DD? About the same as the Accuspark kit? Much cheaper and better Peter C 1
Mr Pastry Posted January 30 Posted January 30 @Peter C Before condemning the condenser, re-check the points gap, and also see if there is any side play on the distributor shaft. Wear in the shaft bearings will make nonsense of your accurate setting, and can be bad enough to cause the gap to close up completely. If there is any appreciable side play, you could try setting the gap a bit wider, say .020" and see if this cures the misfire. Maybe not, but it will cost nothing to try. Yes there are poor quality parts around, but coils and condensers usually either work or they don't. Peter C 1
Zelandeth Posted January 30 Posted January 30 Coil...Held in by cable ties. Possible thought. You're not just dealing with a lack of ground path on the HT side are you? I *think* it's usually tied together internally as it's an autotransformer, but I can't remember for certain. Get it secured somewhere with the case grounded and see if anything changes. That at least should be pretty easy to test.
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 54 minutes ago, Mr Pastry said: Yes there are poor quality parts around, but coils and condensers usually either work or they don't. That's not true. Condensers breakdown especially these poor quality ones. The poor quality ones especially end up going open circuit as the end plate on the end of the stack builds up resistance from poor contact arcing between the two. Also as a condenser fails, it builds up the amount of arcing on the points causing them to fail. That's usually a giveaway the condenser is at fault. The insulation of coils breakdown if it overheats. This leads to a progressively poor quality spark. Peter C 1
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 Just fyi PeterC if you aren't aware, you shouldn't leave the ignition on for extended periods with the engine not running. The coil will continue to be powered if the engine is in a position with the points closed. This causes it to overheat and breakdown internally. garethj and Peter C 1 1
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 From memory I think you might have the coil orientated the wrong way around. On the B, the king lead terminal should be at the bottom. Another FYI, there is a positive and negative terminal on the coil. Needs to be the correct way around in the circuit to get the best spark. Zelandeth 1
Rusty_Rocket Posted January 30 Posted January 30 As SiC says, avoid the complete Accuspark dissy. I've fitted a couple at work when customers insist, but the metal is so brittle/ fragile, you can trash a new one by just doing up the retaining clamp! Hopeless. They get a bad press generally, but I've fitted loads (possibly 30 odd) of the Accuspark kits that fit into the 25/ 45D etc and have had no trouble. Yes, I agree that a NOS set of points and a proper capacitor is just as good, but unless you have a zero-miles dissy with ZERO play in the shaft, you'll never manage to set the points gap correctly. This has a noticeable affect on the running. As usual, not a problem back in the dayyyyy, because the parts were not 60 years old and completely worn out. Incidentally, setting the dwell is more useful than just setting the gap with a feeler gauge. SiC, Peter C and garethj 3
Matty Posted January 30 Posted January 30 Lucas sports coil £28.39 Distributor doctor rotor arm £6.50 Distributor Doctor condensor £7.00 One piece points for Lucas 25D £8.50 All in for 50 quid or so with known decent quality gear. Points and condensor are no less reliable than leccy ignition as long as the bits are decent. Get em bought get em on and go from there. Long as the cap, leads and plugs are right then it's sorted. Gap everything right and as @Mr Pastry said check valve clearances too. Hours work 👍 Peter C and Rustybullethole 2
Barry Cade Posted January 30 Posted January 30 Is it my dodgy specs, or is the heel of the points touching the cam? Also looks like your condenser wire may be arcing on the dizzy body. And put a new spade connector on that wire! I removed 'leccy ignition from any old car I had- electronic ignition fault= breakdown truck. Points type fault- spares in boot, 20 mins and on my way again. garethj, Peter C, Rustybullethole and 1 other 2 1 1
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 3 hours ago, Dyslexic Viking said: I think the best thing you can do is put a B series diesel in it. Nowt wrong with a b series petrol. Just these things are like 50yrs+ old now and everything else attached to it is likely just rather worn. Peter C 1
SiC Posted January 30 Posted January 30 8 minutes ago, Barry Cade said: I removed 'leccy ignition from any old car I had- electronic ignition fault= breakdown truck. Points type fault- spares in boot, 20 mins and on my way again. Spare dizzy setup on points on a mounting bracket is just as quick to swap from anything with electronic ignition in the unlikely event of it failing. Barry Cade 1
MarinaJosh Posted January 30 Posted January 30 I can also confirm the new dizzys are poor quality. A friend of mine had one which had been built 180 degrees out. The resultant backfire woke the dead! I have had the modules (also available under other brands such as SimonBBC and Powerspark) in many cars and have done thousands of miles without issue. Others haven't been as lucky. If you want to keep points/condenser then only DD parts or original NOS Lucas are worth having in my opinion. If using a module, you can always swap back to points/condenser at the roadside. SiC and Peter C 2
captain_70s Posted January 30 Posted January 30 The Dolly is currently running cheapo points and it is functional but the spark is never great and all the components have been replaced multiple times. I also had a electronic module for a while, which was great until it died. Ditto the Accuspark dizzy, perfect for a year or so and then shat itself. I need to get decent DD parts but never seem to find the time to phone... Peter C 1
Peter C Posted January 31 Author Posted January 31 12 hours ago, SiC said: From memory I think you might have the coil orientated the wrong way around. On the B, the king lead terminal should be at the bottom. Another FYI, there is a positive and negative terminal on the coil. Needs to be the correct way around in the circuit to get the best spark. Are you saying that the coil is fitted upside down? Would that make a difference? Noted about the wiring, will check.
Peter C Posted January 31 Author Posted January 31 9 hours ago, Barry Cade said: Is it my dodgy specs, or is the heel of the points touching the cam? Also looks like your condenser wire may be arcing on the dizzy body. And put a new spade connector on that wire! I removed 'leccy ignition from any old car I had- electronic ignition fault= breakdown truck. Points type fault- spares in boot, 20 mins and on my way again. Not sure what you mean by the heel of the points touching the cam. I agree that the wire in the distributor is shit. I will replace it.
plasticvandan Posted January 31 Posted January 31 I was an early user of the accuspark modules,or rather I got them from a Brit part supplier for a fiver each before Mr accuspark appeared on the scene. All made in china as you know,I wouldn't touch the complete dizzys with a barge pole,poorly made,questionable advance curves etc. The modules I had about 80% success with.some were dead out the box,and I had one fail in a reliant Rialto while in the outside lane of the M1,overtaking a lorry overtaking another lorry,just stopped working dead with no warning. Electronic does however eradicate issues with wear in the dizzy,I used to get so fed up with timing scatter due to play,and not having to adjust the points every 4 weeks because performance had dropped off as they wore. Couple of things I remember to check,the earth wire inside the dizzy needs to be good,and check the screws aren't too long and earthing out underneath or fouling the advance mechanism. Personally I had never had a coil fail on anything,they are usually pretty hardy. Condenser failure usually manifests itself as breaking down when it gets hot,so fine when you start it,five miles up the road it starts coughing and spluttering then dies. Flick the points open with the ignition on,if it's sparks wildly,or is a yellowish colour,the condenser is duff. N Dentressangle and Peter C 1 1
Barry Cade Posted January 31 Posted January 31 3 hours ago, Peter C said: Are you saying that the coil is fitted upside down? Would that make a difference? Noted about the wiring, will check. This bit
artdjones Posted January 31 Posted January 31 Do the point contacts look burned? When the ignition is on with the points closed and they are then flicked open with the end of a screwdriver is there noticeable sparking across the point contacts. That's what the condenser is for - to stop arcing across the points when the contact is made or broken. If a condenser isn't working the signs of arcing are easily seen and tested for. Even if the condenser only starts breaking down after the engine has been running for a while, the point burning will still be there. If it is the condenser, the idea above of using a modern one separately mounted seems the best idea to me. Westbay 1
artdjones Posted January 31 Posted January 31 That's what burned points look like. In the end the burning stops the points consistently making contact. It's the breaking of contact that produces the HT current in the coil, but if the contact was never made that can't happen.
Westbay Posted January 31 Posted January 31 Also check wiring to coil is correct i.e "CB" is connected to distributer and "SW" to electric supply (ignition switch)... Check for corrosion on coil body, coil bracket and earth points (bolts) as the coil is earthed through it's body ...
Rustybullethole Posted January 31 Posted January 31 16 hours ago, Matty said: Lucas sports coil £28.39 Distributor doctor rotor arm £6.50 Distributor Doctor condensor £7.00 One piece points for Lucas 25D £8.50 All in for 50 quid or so with known decent quality gear. Points and condensor are no less reliable than leccy ignition as long as the bits are decent. Get em bought get em on and go from there. Long as the cap, leads and plugs are right then it's sorted. Gap everything right and as @Mr Pastry said check valve clearances too. Hours work 👍 Or for slightly more than an hours work chuck it all in the bin and fit an mx5 lump or the like. Westbay, GeorgeB and Matty 1 2
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