New shitter. 1982 Citroen VISA.

[Lankytim]

I'm considering flogging this if anyone is interested? I've hit my limit mojo wise, a load of bodywork has been done but it won't quite run and also needs work on the front brake calipers. 

[Mrs6C]

31 minutes ago, Lankytim said:

I've hit my limit mojo wise

Pop it to one side for the winter months and then crack on again in the spring?

[Lankytim]

7 minutes ago, Mrs6C said:

Pop it to one side for the winter months and then crack on again in the spring?

Maybe, I just don’t seem to be getting anywhere with it though. It’s been popped on the side for most of the time I’ve owned it. 

[Tadhg Tiogar]

1 hour ago, Lankytim said:

I'm considering flogging this if anyone is interested? I've hit my limit mojo wise, a load of bodywork has been done but it won't quite run and also needs work on the front brake calipers. 

Sounds like the Visa credit is maxed out.

[Lankytim]

7 hours ago, Tadhg Tiogar said:

Sounds like the Visa credit is maxed out.

Quite possibly, now it’s out of the garage and parked behind the house I have to look at it every day and when I look at it it reminds me of how it’s never run, it’s rotten seats and it’s wanky ignition system 

[SiC]

On 3/1/2021 at 1:33 PM, Lankytim said:

Following advice I cracked open the Haynes and test meter and got stuck in to the electrics (again). 

The flywheel sensors had apparently already been tested and checked out but I decided to test them again seeing as they’ve been mentioned to me by a few people. 
 

The sensors are meant to knock out  0.5-2 volts when the peg on the flywheel isn’t directly below them and then go up to 5-7volts when the peg passes by. The output voltages on both were just under 9 volts no matter where the peg was positioned. Is it safe to say the sensors are knackered?  I hope so. 

Just going through this thread and noticed this but not seen anyone else mention it. You've connected up the meter incorrectly. That black wire in the meter should be connected to the terminal marked COM. 

[Lankytim]

3 minutes ago, SiC said:

Just going through this thread and noticed this but not seen anyone else mention it. You've connected up the meter incorrectly. That black wire in the meter should be connected to the terminal marked COM. 

Ah, is that right? An amateur mistake in that case. I'll re-test it tomorrow and see what happens. 

[SiC]

Have you tried putting spark testers between the plug and lead? Should flash away while cranking and show quickly if you've got spark. With spark then it's a timing light job to see if they're roughly at the right time. 

I know very little about these systems, so others may correct, but usually disconnecting a vac line (and plugging it engine side) on an ignition system (both electronic and mechanical dizzy) will cause the system to run effectively static timing only. Simplifies the timing measurements. 

 

[SiC]

Found this on the Visa forum in the tech docs. Maybe be useful if you've not seen it before. Screenshot from a PDF as on mobile, so hopefully enough resolution to be readable. 

[SiC]

Have you see this? Might be helpful too

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/visaforum/two-cylinder-electronic-ignition-sensor-problems-t2274.html

Re-included here:

[SiC]

Again, you probably know this but the Manuals are here:

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/visaforum/visa-workshop-manuals-and-bulletins-pdfs-t749.html

(Horrible text colours, but if you ctrl-A and select it all, it makes it easier to read)

[Lankytim]

UPDATE. Wallet bashing in progress 

[Lankytim]

I’ve got a few days off work so after finally getting my arse into gear I set about fitting this adaptor gizmo.  Stripping the front of the visa away was easy enough although large quantities of organic debris had to be cleared away with a brush and vacuum. A couple of small localised areas require some more welding but I’m pretty pleased I didn’t find any huge gaping holes. The bottom of the front fan cover has been rotted away by the sitting piles of debris but as it’s a removable panel and seemingly only there to direct air I’m not too bothered. I might just trim the corrosion away to smarten it up.

 

Fitting the adaptor was a doddle,  I was expecting to drill and tap the block casting to accept the electronic ignition module but I was happy to find that the holes were already present and threaded. After bolting on the backplate with its oil seal the adaptor itself simply slides into the end of the cam and clamps itself in when the centre nut is tightened up.  
 

It’s all ready for the electronic ignition module which I’m yet to purchase. I’ll also need to get a 2CV coil and fan as the Visa pulley will now foul the protruding electronic ignition when it’s finally fitted. 
 

Buried under the engine was this mystery animal foot, I’m thinking rabbit, does anyone have any ideas? 

[Tadhg Tiogar]

If that's a rabbit's foot, you might want to keep it for good* luck*

[Mrs6C]

2 hours ago, Tadhg Tiogar said:

If that's a rabbit's foot, you might want to keep it for good* luck*

It didn't do the rabbit much good...

[grogee]

4 hours ago, Lankytim said:

 

Buried under the engine was this mystery animal foot, I’m thinking rabbit, does anyone have any ideas? 

Don't remove that! It's the kick starter.

Ithangyouverymuchladiesngennlemen

[dollywobbler]

39 minutes ago, grogee said:

Don't remove that! It's the kick starter.

Ithangyouverymuchladiesngennlemen

Not sure about that. Could be the toe point...

[Tadhg Tiogar]

4 hours ago, Mrs6C said:

It didn't do the rabbit much good...

I imagine it probably was a rabbit of negative euphoria. 

[Lankytim]

There's signs of mice living inside the fan shrouding but I can't imagine mice dragging a rabbits foot inside there. Maybe the Visa hit a rabbit at some point in it's distant past and it's foot was amputated by the spinning fan? The plastic mesh over the lower air intake had certainly been dislodged by something.

 

Hopefully I can give the foot a proper Christian burial and "The curse of the rabbits foot" will finally be broken and this Visa will see the road once again!

[Lankytim]

I’ve removed the redundant ignition system (it was kinda redundant anyway), hopefully I’ll be able to sell the working components to another distressed 652cc Visa owner once they’ve been tested. The vacuum advance part seems to be leaking so I’m guessing is dud. It should still run with this part defective but won’t be able to switch to the advanced ignition curve. 

[Lankytim]

Something else has arrived!  Looks pretty straightforward to fit however domestic chores have interrupted the action. 
 

Does anybody know how to set the static timing on these 652cc Visa engines? 

[EyesWeldedShut]

21 minutes ago, Lankytim said:

Something else has arrived!  Looks pretty straightforward to fit however domestic chores have interrupted the action. 
 

Does anybody know how to set the static timing on these 652cc Visa engines? 

Colonel Sponsz may be your man (or woman who knows these days?) In amongst his other stuff there's some 2CV treasure

[Lankytim]

5 minutes ago, EyesWeldedShut said:

Colonel Sponsz may be your man (or woman who knows these days?) In amongst his other stuff there's some 2CV treasure

I’ve actually been looking at his page, very interesting! I can’t find a corresponding hole on the Visa block however. I can get an approximate static timing by poking my finger though the upper sensor hole and ensuring the metal peg on the flywheel is directly below. I’m not sure if that will be accurate enough though.

[EyesWeldedShut]

52 minutes ago, Lankytim said:

I’ve actually been looking at his page, very interesting! I can’t find a corresponding hole on the Visa block however. I can get an approximate static timing by poking my finger though the upper sensor hole and ensuring the metal peg on the flywheel is directly below. I’m not sure if that will be accurate enough though.

Prompts the cheeky reply "depends how fat your fingers are?"
 

Is it possible to set it roughly by the finger method, get it running and then tweak by ear (like turning a dizzy with points) or is the layout such that you cannot do this with the engine running?

[MrSteve]

If you can read french here's the instructions for finding TDC for the adapter I got for my Visa yonks ago (not a Burton one like yours).

Looks a bit of a faff hence not done it yet...

The Burton adapter is much easier to fit it seems- https://www.burton2cvparts.com/media/downloads/en_conversion_visa1.pdf

[grogee]

Oh man, I SO want this thing to fire up. I would have thought finger/notch method of TDC is good enough to get it running. Then you could use strobe to check timing? Not that I have a strobe. Not even seen one for a long time. 

[Jimblob]

Watching with much interest. Have just been for a blast in this car's identical twin. Hoping I don't ever need this ignition fix for mine but great to see how it can be done

Sent from my SM-M315F using Tapatalk

[Lankytim]

I’ve re-read the Burton instructions for finding TDC and I think I’ve got it correct. It doesn’t mention locking the flywheel via a hole in the crank case like the 2CV so maybe the Visa doesn’t have that hole. 
 

I’m still waiting for a black 2CV style coil to arrive, I’ve got a pair of brown Visa coils which were pretty hard to get hold of and I’ll be sticking on eBay. As soon as the 2cv coil turns up I’ll have a go at firing the thing up. 

Once the engine is running the timing can be altered by turning the 123 unit, in a similar way to a conventional distributor. Fine tuning needs to be done with a strobe gun, I’ll have to actually create timing marks using tippex or similar. 
 

Talking of the 123 unit, the green light is meant to illuminate as one of the magnets passes under the sensor, however this appears to be reversed with the green light only going off when the magnets pass by. 

 

[MrSteve]

Yes, the 652cc crankcases and flywheels don't have the holes for locking at TDC unlike those on A-series Citroens.

Will you be getting the special carb base block with the vacuum feed to get vacuum advance working too, or is the plan just to get the Visa running reliably for now?

[Lankytim]

3 hours ago, MrSteve said:

If you can read french here's the instructions for finding TDC for the adapter I got for my Visa yonks ago (not a Burton one like yours).

Looks a bit of a faff hence not done it yet...

The Burton adapter is much easier to fit it seems- https://www.burton2cvparts.com/media/downloads/en_conversion_visa1.pdf

Unfortunately I don't speak French but it would be interesting to see what that actually says.