The Burd's MK1 Golf Rivage - The man from the ministry , he says YES!14/04/25

[big_al_granvia]

convert to throttle bodies or a modern injection system, i am not well up on veedubs but as they have a massive following there must be a cheap way to get shot of k-jet, as in plug and play and connect injector lines

[blackboilersuit]

Back in the 90's when such motors were posh and modern I had a colleague with a scirocco that was forever breaking down or not running right due to injection problems. After keeping breakers rich buying used parts and lots of swearing over a period of several months he eventually found the problem. A rotten filler neck was letting water and dirt into the tank. The rot was in a difficult to access spot right next to the filler cap and in such as a position not to leak fuel while filling or driving but it was letting spray from the wheel in. Just a thought since the fuel in the bottle looks like it came from a pothole in the road.

[big_al_granvia]

https://vwgolfmk1.org.uk/forum/index.php?page=topicview&id=big-block-injection_2%2Fk-jet-made-easy_2

might help https://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30295

[PhilA]

Could be worse. Could be Renix.

 

Does sound like all that muck is inside the metering system- all the fine particles that get through the mesh and filter that manage o collect together into little fields of dirt, particularly if the fuel has any water in it- or in the case of this if the water has any fuel in (looking at the bottle of piss you removed from the fuel system). Clean it out and it should run like new-ish again. It's a simple system, which makes it moderately reliable (reliable if it's clean, reliably unreliable if not) at the end of the day.

--Phil

[320touring]

8 minutes ago, blackboilersuit said:

Back in the 90's when such motors were posh and modern I had a colleague with a scirocco that was forever breaking down or not running right due to injection problems. After keeping breakers rich buying used parts and lots of swearing over a period of several months he eventually found the problem. A rotten filler neck was letting water and dirt into the tank. The rot was in a difficult to access spot right next to the filler cap and in such as a position not to leak fuel while filling or driving but it was letting spray from the wheel in. Just a thought since the fuel in the bottle looks like it came from a pothole in the road.

The car has had a new filter neck - and I have removed most of the guff from the tank. I have a new tank, but fitting it looks a big job, so trying everything before that.

 

Will get the shity fuel drawn out and try running it from a can as I say

6 minutes ago, big_al_granvia said:

https://vwgolfmk1.org.uk/forum/index.php?page=topicview&id=big-block-injection_2%2Fk-jet-made-easy_2

might help https://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30295

Guess what I'm reading:)

[320touring]

7 minutes ago, PhilA said:

Could be worse. Could be Renix.

 

Does sound like all that muck is inside the metering system- all the fine particles that get through the mesh and filter that manage o collect together into little fields of dirt, particularly if the fuel has any water in it- or in the case of this if the water has any fuel in (looking at the bottle of piss you removed from the fuel system). Clean it out and it should run like new-ish again. It's a simple system, which makes it moderately reliable (reliable if it's clean, reliably unreliable if not) at the end of the day.

--Phil

Any ideas where to start with cleaning it out?

I can see two screws that come out to release the metering head from the base unit, so that should let me get to the fuelling pin.

Removing the fuelling pin would be next, then I wonder if I can flush out the metering head?

[Fraz]

I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. 

 

 

 

 

Its the only way to be sure

[PhilA]

No, I have Renix, which is controlled by the equivalent of an Apple ][ computer and only works if you sacrifice a round of brie to it on a bi-weekly basis

 

I suggest ram a bratwurst down the intake and smother it with sauerkraut.

 

(Otherwise known as a VW injection specialist will be along shortly)

[320touring]

Drew another 10L of shanner fuel out this today, and noticed that the fuel pumps seemed sporadic. I wonder if the fuel pump relay is shot? A new one is £15 or so, so significantly less than a replacement metering head.

Did some initial investigation/teardown on the metering head.

I separated the fuel unit from the airbox (6x10mm bolts) as below

This revealed 2 things :

1. I can't feel any resistance from the metering pin when moving the arm

2. I have no idea how to get the unit off the metal base. I can only see 2 screws, but they seem to hold the unit together. Do I need to undo them to reach the pin? 

 

A video of the pin /arm in action

 

Any help or thoughts would be much appreciated.

[320touring]

I've even registered on the MK1 golf forum and put up a thread there..

 

First single make forum I have joined in a helluva long time

[Skizzer]

I’m hiding behind the sofa.

[320touring]

22 minutes ago, Skizzer said:

I’m hiding behind the sofa.

No need to chap, it's a 28 year old car that sat for ages. I can get parts for it, and it's already MOT'd so once it fires we're golden:)

[billy_bunter]

MK1 forum is usually pretty good. I used to ask stuff on there about my old Audi.  They have a couple of VW electrical whisperers on there as well.

Relay/ignition -  Fuse boxes on these are notoriously weak so make sure ALL connections are OK. Check for heating/burn around the plugs on the rear. Good pin connector function guides on the MK1 forum on these as well. Looking at the age of the car you should have the better* mk2 version of the fusebox.

Think you are right track at moment and good perseverance sir!

[320touring]

Thanks for the other things to check - I'm still waiting for my thread on the MK1 forum to be approved, hopefully once it is I'll get a bit further forward:)

[xtriple]

Is that the cast iron distribution block on the metering unit? If so, I had one on V8 Merc years ago that had some very odd/mysterious fuelling faults - mainly that it over-fuelled like mad and then failed it's MOT on emissions! The pin inside was well and truly stuck and I had to get a later unit which was an alloy block, then the car ran perfectly. So, I would tentatively say that it is fucked but don't take my word for it as I am a well known cock head.

[320touring]

Yesterday, I went to SVM scrapbits for to procure a part.

Unbeknownst to me, until RML2345 pointed it out, the venerable 740 uses a very similar fuel distribution system.

 

CMS had one on a known working car that was 'aff Tae the bin', so I stripped off the needed part.

The bolt in the second picture was most recalcitrant, and required the application of the "Bus Destination Pole of Justice"

Ably modelled by CMS206

That concluded Fridays efforts.

Saturday update to come.

[320touring]

So to today.

I started with high hopes

This is the Volvo unit. Despite different part numbers, it has all the ports in the right place and takes the bolts from the golf one no bother.

I got the bolts all swapped over and fitted the unit to the car

You can see how the Volvo bolts look considerably less crusty than the golf ones

With it all fitted and tightened up (including injector 4 in a test bottle) ...

 

We got...

 

Nothing.

 

There was no fuel in the test bottle, and I could only hear the pumps running intermittently.

 

Time to turn my attention to the fuel pump relay. Logic being that the metering head needs to be able to provide 75psi to the injectors to get them to open.

The lack of any fuel in the test bottle suggests we are not getting sufficient fuel pressure at the metering head. 

This could be either due to the fuel relay being intermittent, or the main pump not providing pressure.

Tucked up in the passenger footwell, the relay is easy* to reach.

Initial inspection showed signs of rusting - never good

After some gentle persuasion with a screwdriver, the relay was out

Time to order a new one then.

As a final hurrah, it also decided that it'd like to make some horrible noises when the starter tried to engage..

I think the battery may just be getting tired.

So, where are we?

I'm of the suspicion that:

1. Still have a starter/ignition switch issue

2. The metering head(s) are seeing insufficient fuel pressure to operate.

 

Next step will be seeing about a new relay (possibly even a new fuseboard) and testing that.

I'll likely pull the starter too.

 

Onwards and upwards.

[Skizzer]

Bollocks.

The intermittent ignition thing could equally be fuse board related, so if you’ve found evidence of rust there it probably makes sense to start by replacing that, then marvel at how many other things now work better. Hopefully.

[Fabergé Greggs]

Just saw the spitting image of this in NE London. Guessing it wasn’t this one @320touring

[320touring]

Correct, it's currently waiting in line whilst ai refix all the others I have already fixed:(

[cobblers]

I think thats a ce2 fuse board, they're not too bad, nothing fancy inside them just brass plates that funnel the electrons. If the relay pins are rusty then it suggests there been water in the fuse box - I would definitely investigate this further as it'll give you grief down the line. If i remember right, the CE1 type has round pins on the connectors on the back. CE2 has flat blades pins. All connectors just unplug and should* only fit back in the right place, so you can remove the fuse box from the car. I'd definitely take a handful of pictures before unplugging everything though,

I think that is a fancy relay with electronics inside it to cut the fuel pump off at a certain RPM, as a type of rev limiter. This will make it MUCH more susceptible to any dampness.

A #63 relay is a none-rev-limiter type. Less to go wrong. You can just bridge the two fat terminals out with a bit of wire or a switch for now.

 

The metering head off the volvo might fit, but it will be calibrated incorrectly for the engine. Perhaps useful to practice stripping one down and for parts.

 

[320touring]

Brilliant knowledge, cheers.

 

Sounds like I can pull the fusebox off and give it a right good clean then.

 

Can then get a new fuel relay and see how we go

[Skizzer]

Dampness is possible* in this car’s history.

This is why I will never have another soft top.

The fusebox is a much more likely candidate than the metering head or immobiliser, in my view. And much easier/cheaper to replace and therefore eliminate from enquiries, at least.

[320touring]

Aye, the fusebox/dead fuel pump relay are chief suspects.

 

Once I get to it, they'll be first priority:)

[320touring]

A mere* 10 days after the last post on this thread, some stuff happened ..

Firstly, it was time to open up the lab!

Hoachin

Then, with a little assistance from another VAG member of the fleet, up she fired.

After a bit of time to steady the idle, she trundled round onto the hardstanding, so I can start working on it.

The burd is supposed to be washing it tomorrow..

[320touring]

It's back on the original metering head now - the other one was useful in ruling out a stuck pin

[320touring]

Obviously, with Scots incarcerated, the April weather was exceeding all expectations.

I contrived to convince the burd to assist in washing and de-mingifiying the golf..

It got a "wan bucket, wan watering can" approach and came up ok.

Then it was onto the interior..

 

We also discovered the meaning of 'old money'

I had a look at the radiator in the car today, and it doesn't look a complex job to remove.

 

It looks like the new radiator is correct too.

I have a day off from work tomorrow so hoping to fit the rad...

[hairnet]

wat did ya dee wi ya nearly fair poond?

 

[320touring]

Today it was time for an epic battle - Man Vs Radiator!

First up was identifying the foes:

The temp sender

The fan connector

The top hose clamp

The bottom hose clamp

And the two top mounts

 

I worked my way methodically round these simple challenges whilst the coolant drained, and the rad was ready to come out.

Except it wasn't.. these sneaky fuckers were holding it in..

After they were removed, it was a great success!

[320touring]

Time to strip the fan shroud off so I can clean and paint it:

Found some evidence that the rad has been sleeping for a while..

 

The fan shroud was wire brushed and some primer applied

Then, once dry it was time for a couple of coats of black

 

Whilst that dried, I tapped out the shroud mounts on the new rad.

This was easily done using a mounting bolt - the plastic was fairly soft.

 

With that done and the paint dry, I reattached the fan and mounted the shroud back onto the new radiator.

I also reattached the blinds too