invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[Andyrew]

Id rather shit in my hands and clap than deal with Adrian flux again.  Please read every single bit of info they give you. They used to be brilliant but are a right stitch up now. 

Insurance changes like the wind and I wouldn't be to worried about using the cooling off period  if you need to.

 

[dave j]

1700 quid is about 150 a month, that could go towards parts/fixing/lessons. It's not going to be on the road for at least a month, possibly a while longer so I would be tempted to cancel

[plasticvandan]

I will say in their defence,having been with Bikesure for several years now,that they are nothing like flux to deal with and have been fantastic with me and I've had to make a lot of changes due to relocation,job changes etc.they are also much more pleasant on the phone.

[LightBulbFun]

53 minutes ago, egg said:

I'm of the camp of trying to get it home to the dead end... I know that's more cost (and I know that's further from the most knowledgable Zel)....but my Invacar is just 6 miles from me - and look how hard it's been for me to break out of my daily routine and get over there regularly. I'm sure everyone has an opinion though, I think your plan for April sounds good, but I won't be able to be there myself.

as in before or after she is made road worthy?

just so there's no confusion, the current plan is once REV is road worthy she is coming home to live with me in the dead end!

I don't plan to leave her in the FoD for any longer than necessary!

51 minutes ago, Andyrew said:

Id rather shit in my hands and clap than deal with Adrian flux again.  Please read every single bit of info they give you. They used to be brilliant but are a right stitch up now. 

Insurance changes like the wind and I wouldn't be to worried about using the cooling off period  if you need to.

ahh thats always reassuring LOL!

do you know if you will be able to make for the the 4/5th?  

also related to that if you dont mind me asking is this kind offer still on offer?  (obviously the 4/5th is yet to be fully confirmed and is still a few weeks away, but i figured id get the ball rolling regarding, getting bits and bobs that I dont have in the spares stash ) 

On 8/22/2019 at 4:06 PM, Andyrew said:

Just In case you need anything through me.

Shitters trade prices 

Oc21 mahle oil filter £1.50 +vat

5110 b7hs ngk plugs £1.20 each +vat

20/50 classic Castrol 5ltr . £16+vat

20/50 normal brand £11.00+ Vat

Sae90 (ep or non ep) £10 +vat per litre Castrol classic.

im good for an oil filter, But I think I could do with some 20/50 (normal I think is fine!) and a couple liters of SAE90EP for the gearbox/diff, and a set of new spark plugs probably wont hurt to have on hand!

also wondering if you do brake line/hardware? I think the Model 70 uses 3/16th but im not sure how much it has in total, hopefully @Zelandeth can advise on what the Model 70 uses given his experience servicing the brakes on the 2 of them  

(I also think when servicing/changing brake lines you also need brake unions? Model 70 will of course be imperial, but again im not 100% sure on sizes! is your regular 7 inch girling brakes however)

[Mrs6C]

For copper brake pipes, we have Automec just up the road in Buckingham. They do the pipes and unions and are usually pretty good at dealing with obscure things. They do copper pipe by the roll also and we have a brake flare tool.
https://automec.co.uk/

[egg]

15 minutes ago, LightBulbFun said:

as in before or after she is made road worthy?

Ah, before. Just because while I don't doubt that Zel's list of what needs doing is accurate, there's bound to be some snagging along the way - it's just what old cars do isn't it?! Also, it means you can take your first drives around your local (familiar) roads...

[LightBulbFun]

8 minutes ago, Mrs6C said:

For copper brake pipes, we have Automec just up the road in Buckingham. They do the pipes and unions and are usually pretty good at dealing with obscure things. They do copper pipe by the roll also and we have a brake flare tool.
https://automec.co.uk/

ah cool thats good to know  

I also know we have some smaller premade lines in the spares stash, I think these would go from the wheels to the place where the main brake line splits off to serve each wheel separately or such?

as seen in this picture of part of the spares stash

(side note if anyone is wondering what the 3 odd looking shoes are those are the central fungal clutch shoes  hopefully I wont be needing those!) 

[Andyrew]

Brake pipe comes as a 25ft roll, done a complete full new set of lines on a range rover classic the other day that was just over a full roll.  Not expensive, around a tenner a roll for copper.  I Have proper kit to make lines.  May aswell make a set for both invacars. 

Unions/Fittings are probably fairly normal imperial, tho one in that photo looks a bit funky? 

I'll price up the h4 7" conversions we can get when I'm back at work (off this week welding the dyane). Think they are reasonable. 

New bulbs all round would be pennies aswell. 

Service items and oils not a problem, 

Got a cheap and shite friendly tyre fitter aswell if you get 3 new boots that need fitting at some point, 

[LightBulbFun]

17 minutes ago, Andyrew said:

Brake pipe comes as a 25ft roll, done a complete full new set of lines on a range rover classic the other day that was just over a full roll.  Not expensive, around a tenner a roll for copper.  I Have proper kit to make lines.  May aswell make a set for both invacars. 

Unions/Fittings are probably fairly normal imperial, tho one in that photo looks a bit funky? 

I'll price up the h4 7" conversions we can get when I'm back at work (off this week welding the dyane). Think they are reasonable. 

New bulbs all round would be pennies aswell. 

Service items and oils not a problem, 

Got a cheap and shite friendly tyre fitter aswell if you get 3 new boots that need fitting at some point, 

Awesome stuff good to know tis much appreciated  (and good to know you do H4 7 inch conversions as well, handy if I can get as much stuff from one place as possible and support a shitter while im at it!)

(yeah I did notice the fittings on the premade stuff look a bit funky, im pretty sure from @dollywobbler's videos on redoing TWC's line that it was fairly normal looking fittings he used! it could obviously be those premade lines are for something else!)

good to know on the Tyre fitting front, I fear @Slowsilver still has PTSD from when me and him tried to change a tyre on REV!, at least we dont have to install any inner tubes this time!

im not sure what the plan of attack is regarding tires, although I know as shown above they can be removed and fitted by hand on the day if need be!

for those wondering  regarding tyres im eying up these https://www.vintagetyres.com/shop/camac-bn313-145r10-68s

same ones @Zelandeth has fitted to TPA, so should be more then good enough for REV  

[LightBulbFun]

20 minutes ago, Andyrew said:

May aswell make a set for both invacars. 

and Yeah I was thinking, assuming time etc allowing

that after we get REV sorted, it would be nice bonus if we could sort some stuff on Dolly while we are it  

[Zelandeth]

Getting her transported down to London I don't reckon is a bad idea once you've figured out some security and sorted the tyres I reckon.  Pretty much everything else is doable in fits and starts and which it's an hour away from me, I'm pretty sure there are plenty of folks in or near London who are familiar with older cars and would be happy to lend an hour here and there.  As you've seen, my availability these days is all over the shop, and while I have one I don't consider myself to be an authority on all things Invacar!

I really, really wouldn't want to be one of the first proper drives she does to be from deepest darkest Bucks all the way down to central London... that's asking for disaster.  Let's not forget the Model 70 lacks hazard lights too.  We've got at least one gent on here who does vehicle transport and I think isn't based a million miles away from here so won't mess you about.

Tyre wise I took my wheels into the Vintage Tyres branch in Bicester Heritage and they fitted and balanced them for me.  Black Circles/MyTyres offer a fitting service where they can come to you, so if they do a suitable tyre for a sane price that might be worth considering too.  Not looked into it myself.

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Zelandeth said:

Tyre wise I took my wheels into the Vintage Tyres branch in Bicester Heritage and they fitted and balanced them for me.  Black Circles/MyTyres offer a fitting service where they can come to you, so if they do a suitable tyre for a sane price that might be worth considering too.  Not looked into it myself.

Looks like they do the tyre of choice, but I also have not had any experience with these tyre fitting services, does the FoD even count as a location to these guys? LOL

does the vintage tyres branch in Bicester have BN313's in stock or did ya still have to order them in from online?

I like the idea of having her brought to me, but im a bit worried about cost and also as mentioned getting her road worthy, so id at least like to have the basic-difficult stuff out the way if I do end up having her transported down!

[Zelandeth]

I booked the whole thing online, but I doubt they'd have had them on the shelf.  They're only a tiny outlet in Bicester so everything pretty much would need to be pre-booked.  They're only open a couple of days a week too so plan accordingly.
 

If you had her back in London there shouldn't be any issues getting tyres fitted there.  Just for the love of puppies don't snap any goddamn wheel studs!  The mobile fitting services do stuff all over the place though, including on farm machinery etc, so the FoD isn't likely to be a surprise for them.  Just know you've only got one full set of wheels so getting them brought to the car is likely to be easier irrespective of whether it's here or London.

Just don't break the wheel studs!

 

[Mrs6C]

The local tyre place doesn't need the whole car, just the wheels...

I suspect the simplest thing to do would be to put REV up on stands, remove the wheels, take them all off to get tyres fitted and balanced, then bring them back and refit them.

[LightBulbFun]

8 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

I booked the whole thing online, but I doubt they'd have had them on the shelf.  They're only a tiny outlet in Bicester so everything pretty much would need to be pre-booked.  They're only open a couple of days a week too so plan accordingly.
 

If you had her back in London there shouldn't be any issues getting tyres fitted there.  Just for the love of puppies don't snap any goddamn wheel studs!  The mobile fitting services do stuff all over the place though, including on farm machinery etc, so the FoD isn't likely to be a surprise for them.  Just know you've only got one full set of wheels so getting them brought to the car is likely to be easier irrespective of whether it's here or London.

Just don't break the wheel studs!

ah thats good to know, 

did just realise for some reason I thought blackcircles hada a mobile tyre fitting service, but it looks like from their website they only do it at garages so you still have to get the wheels to a garage

not sure why I thought they did mobile tyre fitting!

and yeah am too also really hoping I dont snap any wheel studs!

if anyone has any recommendations on how I should go about fitting the tyres do let me know  

I do wonder how many sets of 10 inch wheels we have lying around? if we can scrounge up 3 10 inch rims then we can just clean those up and have a garage fit tyres to them, then swap em to REV come tinkering time

and that also give's us the bonus that REV"s old wheels and tyres which still hold air AFAIK at least! can be moved onto Dolly whos tyres are currently struggling to hold air 

 

[LightBulbFun]

19 minutes ago, Mrs6C said:

The local tyre place doesn't need the whole car, just the wheels...

I suspect the simplest thing to do would be to put REV up on stands, remove the wheels, take them all off to get tyres fitted and balanced, then bring them back and refit them.

do you think this would be able to be done during the 4/5th (with the tyres already on hand/at the garage of course)

or is this something that will have to be done ahead of time? (just wondering since the 4/5th is a weekend and all that!)

[mitsisigma01]

By the magic of eBay search they show Kenda tyres at £30 each delivered, they show as trailer tyres but appear to be speed rated to 75 mph and 500kg rated, is that enough? 

[LightBulbFun]

2 minutes ago, mitsisigma01 said:

By the magic of eBay search they show Kenda tyres at £30 each delivered, they show as trailer tyres but appear to be speed rated to 75 mph and 500kg rated, is that enough? 

the availability of tyres is not an issue, its just currently figuring out how to get em fitted thats the "issue"  

tyres is very much safety critical and something i dont mind paying a bit more for to get a decent product, so I think ill go with the Camac BN313's which seem to a be good all round tyre  

plus im worried enough as it is currently about insurance Im not sure fitting trailer tyres would do anything to help that situation!

[LightBulbFun]

on an separate note while I was comparing Mk12 chassis plates to do with that SA Mk12 I noticed 

it says "thundersley Essex"

but REV/all Invacar Model 70's say "Benfleet Essex"

so this made me wonder what do later Mk12's say? so pulled up a Mk12E chassis plate and it says "Thundersley Benfleet Essex" 

I do wonder if the location name change has anything to do with the dedicated Mk12/Model 70 production building they setup, but that was pretty much on the same general estate that Invacar where based just a couple roads down

[mitsisigma01]

I was getting bored looking at the shite on telly so searched for Camac tyres.. 

https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres/camac/bn313/145-80-r10-68s-989219

They also do tyre insurance 

2 tyres from tyreleader.co.uk

2 fittings in Bicester 

2 insurance 

approx £92

doesn't show if it includes vat (unless you register) 

Is that any good?

[Andyrew]

I Wouldn't get caught up thinking about tyre fitting right now. It should be the last and easiest job to get done.

 The only hard bit is to use a place that does it for beer money and not a standard "tyre fitting fee",  that said  Ive got a couple of places and I'm sure Mr and Mrs 6cylinder have a couple of places aswell. 

 

[egg]

Deep in the wilds of Georgia in the remains of a former Soviet military base, a SMZ S-3D  (the Russian Invacar) is spotted...

12:19 in the Video

 

[LightBulbFun]

3 minutes ago, egg said:

Deep in the wilds of Georgia in the remains of a former Soviet military base, a SMZ S-3D  (the Russian Invacar) is spotted...

Neat! im hoping one of those makes it to AS some day or @dollywobbler can at least get a test drive of one, would make a fun comparison

(also hoping someday @dollywobbler will get a chance to test some other british invalid vehicles, like an Invacar Mk12 etc  again would make for a fun/interesting comparison against TWC) 

there is a green one that has been for sale on car and classic (amusingly under the Invacar section) for yonks https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1115317

 

speaking of driving had my 36th lesson today, a fairly normal lesson today, next lesson will be interesting tho, as he wants to do a mock test, so it will be interesting to see how I do there!

said next lesson is on Friday (the 13th LOL)

(will have to keep an eye on the weather, was actually somewhat warm today, so I got a bit toasty in the car LOL)

 

I also took REV's V5 and a filled out V112 with me and after the lesson I popped into the post office and got her taxed and changed to the historic vehicle taxation class 

the poor guy behind the counter was somewhat confused, im not sure he had dealt with such an application before, then got further confused because of REV's disabled tax class, meant options both came up as £0.00 so I had to tell "yep I know Its already £0 but id still like to change it please  "

so hopefully that went according to plan! I have a receipt showing that i have "paid" for tax either way! and he took and stamped my V5 with a stamp

(I also took the opportunity to update some personal details on the V5 hopefully those also go through/dont confuse the DVLA too much!)

[LightBulbFun]

and woop! she is now showing on the motor insurance database  

(amusing how they put the weight as part of the Make model info! but im glad it is noted down somewhere! so no one can pull a fast one on me, should the worst happen and I have to make a claim or such)

[mitsisigma01]

What is it with the weight, does it have to be over a certain figure to be classified as a   ......  or under to be a ...... ??

[mitsisigma01]

Good to see it is on the motor insurers database, but you or they have created a new manufacturer Invacarmodel, knowing how fickle and arseholish insurers can be you should get them to use their spacebar and lose the weight from the title, after all if you make any slight mis-declaration they can and will say fk you, not covered. 

Of all the people you would think would get it right it's the MID and the DVLC

[LightBulbFun]

45 minutes ago, mitsisigma01 said:

What is it with the weight, does it have to be over a certain figure to be classified as a   ......  or under to be a ...... ??

yeah there are a few different classes of invalid carriage depending on weight

heres an excerpt from here https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200708/cmselect/cmtran/460/460we02.htm 

and since im insured by a bike insurer, I got a bit panicky when I saw this in their generic document

https://quote.adrianflux.co.uk/documents/1198_policy.pdf

because REV is over 410Kg and Is an invalid vehicle!

so I gave em a call to double check everything was ok, because during the initial quotation, no one asked me what she weighed! (I also initially thought this was my policy document, but realised it was just some generic thing, and that my personalised one had not yet arrived by email at that point in time, although im still glad I called and got it all noted down on my revised policy along with the name correction)

it is also why im not very worried about the licencing issue that these days to drive a Tricycle like a 3 wheeler Reliant on a Car licence you have to be 21 or older, REV weighing 413Kg means she is classed as a Motorcar not a Motorcycle, like a Reliant robin or such is

although that will be a moot point relatively soonish as ill be turning 21 in September anyway!

its also worth noting that the rule of "no invalid carriages" on the motorway only applies to actual invalid carriages, under 254Kg, anything heavier is allowed on the motorway if your brave enough!

since anything above 254Kg is NOT an invalid carriage when it comes to these rules and regulations, its why you hear me say "invalid vehicle" when im generically referring to all such vehicles, rather then me say Invalid carriage, because in certain situations and regulations some of the vehicles I may be referring to are not invalid carriages!

and invalid vehicle is how the DVLA also refer to all such vehicles 

(so again one of those common misconceptions!, but no the Model 70 etc was never banned from the motorway  you can even take some of the later villiers machines like the Invacar Mk12 on the motorway if you wanted to!, they are about 305Kg, but with so little weight and with a top speed of 45Mph that might be a bit scary especially with the draft from lorries overtaking you! )

to add to the fun of it, most Model 70's have their revenue weight down on the V5 as 410Kg, but pretty much every Rollover bar Model 70's I have seen the revenue weight of, have it down as 413Kg or 414Kg

meaning for example TPA is a Motorcycle but REV is a Motorcar LOL

welcome to the fun world that is "figuring out" the invalid vehicle LOL

 

[LightBulbFun]

32 minutes ago, mitsisigma01 said:

Good to see it is on the motor insurers database, but you or they have created a new manufacturer Invacarmodel, knowing how fickle and arseholish insurers can be you should get them to use their spacebar and lose the weight from the title, after all if you make any slight mis-declaration they can and will say fk you, not covered. 

Of all the people you would think would get it right it's the MID and the DVLC

I noticed that too, but in all the documentation I have from them

it is properly spaced out as "Invacar Model 70" so I don't know why the MID is specifically getting rid of that space!

although im just glad it is down as Invacar Model 70 in some form!, because when it comes to Model 70's I have seen much worse! 

On 11/17/2019 at 9:44 PM, LightBulbFun said:

Happy to hear that

just reminded me I should check out of the taxed ones which are insured as thats a good indication of which are being used on the road and which are just taxed because now its £0 rate

doing a quick check as I thought

only a few are showing as insured TPA621M JPA268N MHJ22P MPD553P MPH759P OPH868R and TTW906R are the ones showing as insured

so only just 7 are on the road if you go by insurance, although I know OPH is currently not on the road and same for TPA, but hopefully she will return to the road soon  

 

some of the names they are insured as is just down right worrying! MPD553P (currently VAV1L) is insured as a "KC AC" and WOO848S is insured as "OTHER BRITISH MOTHER" LOL

I shit you not!

 

TPA621M is the only one that's insured properly without any name wackiness 

as "AC (ELECTRIC) Model 70"  

 

I see quite a few end up as "AC 70" or something such because explained here

 

a lot of people don't realise that "Model" is part of the vehicles Model name!

and this is something you have to make clear for both the person trying to insure it, and the person on the other end of the phone doing the actual insuring!

so for example if theres a box that asks you for the vehicles model name you should type

"Model: Model 70"

but a lot of people will just type "Model: 70"

 

[barefoot]

You fucking pendant !

[quicksilver]

10 minutes ago, barefoot said:

You fucking pendant !

* pedant (Sorry couldn't resist the obvious opportunity for further pedantry).

In other news, take a look at page 10 here: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1017/3257/files/Globe_242.pdf?v=1583827193

Not a bad potted history of the invalid carriage although the myth of the 600 engine has appeared again; I wonder where it came from as it's very prevalent despite absolutely no evidence to support it. Now we know the model Model 70 will be the Bubblecar Museum's KPK71P, which presumably is the one they measured to make it.