Attempted rinsing by DVLA, any tips????

[cort16]

When did you insure it? I guess from their point of view you could have been driving around all johnny tax-free then shat it when you saw the DVLA van and taxed it once you got to work.

I'd try to appeal the fine down to something sensible unless you fancy a full on face off with the DVLA.

[HillmanImp]

When did you insure it? I guess from their point of view you could have been driving around all johnny tax-free then shat it when you saw the DVLA van and taxed it once you got to work.

I'd try to appeal the fine down to something sensible unless you fancy a full on face off with the DVLA.

 

 

If it did come to court though, he would be able to show his 't'interweb search history if he wanted to prove he had logged on to try and tax it. However, he may not want to do that depending on what he was looking at that morning.

 

08:10 pornhub/ManHammersTesticlesOntoEdwardianDeskWithDrawingPins

 

Drawing pins? Hang on I've just remembered I need to tax the Rover

 

08.17 gov.uk/vehicle-tax

08.27 Pornhub/BustyBarbarasBolloxBonanza

[barefoot]

Out of curiosity, I followed the drawing pin link.

[wuvvum]

It always used to be the case (don't know if it still is) that if the DVLA took you to court, all they could recover was the back duty - which would be nil in this instance.  I used this argument to get them to drop it when they tried to "fine" me an absurd amount of money when my (tax exempt) Reliant Regal was left parked on the road for a short period unlicensed.

[JohnK]

When did you insure it? I guess from their point of view you could have been driving around all johnny tax-free then shat it when you saw the DVLA van and taxed it once you got to work.

I'd try to appeal the fine down to something sensible unless you fancy a full on face off with the DVLA.

But regardless of that, even though Boll has taxed it at 9.30 (after seeing the van), the tax takes effect on 1st March so effectively it was retrospectively taxed from 00:01 hours and therefore became taxed at the period of being seen.

 

That would be the argument I would be playing in this situation anyway. Effectively just the same if i get caught with no tax on 26 April, if i tax it on 27th I've got to tax it from 1st April so effectively it would become retrospectively taxed for the period.

 

The DVLA made that rule and you have no choice but to tax it from the beginning of the month so I think in a court of law it would be thrown out. Don't quote me on that though, I'm not a lawyer and it's just my interpretation.

[barefoot]

I agree, I'd be happy to go to court to say all of these things above.

 

I drove my bay back from the paint shop on Saturday the first, photographed it in the street on Monday 3rd,

but because I'm not going anywhere until tomorrow the fifth, I'd not bothered taxing it until today.

If I got papped on the 28th month & didn't tax it until the 2nd of the following month, then it's a whole different thing. 

And bum raping would surely be essential.

[cort1977]

Boll, I would keep trying to push it up the ladder with them, eventually you will hopefully deal with someone reasonable.   This has worked for me with DVLA, credit cards and medical insurance companies.   Keep records of all communications with them, I agree that they won't want to take it to court for the good reasons you describe but if they do then you need to be prepared.

[Mr_Bo11ox]

I feel, if I got busted on the 2^nd, 10^th or 26^th of the month I would struggle to counter the argument that I had been deliberately bombing about without tax and I reckon I’d have to accept (at least some level of) bummage even if I quickly taxed my car after seeing their van. They could reasonably argue that if I had not seen the van, I would have continued driving about indefinitely. However, if you are taxing a previously SORN’d car, you cannot tax before the 1^st, without needlessly paying for the previous month as well. Hence you have to tax on the 1^st which I did. I think that by doing that, one can make an argument that no days elapsed where I was driving an untaxed vehicle. Tax is administered in units of days not hours or minutes, so one could make an argument that there were no gaps in the taxation of the cars I am driving.

 

I think I am gonna do what SOC and BV advocate, which is just to write back, politely reaffirming that

 

1.  I believe I can demonstrate having made reasonable efforts to pay my car tax in a timely manner, and
2.  I think a £305 penalty is disproportionate and unjustified for a case where the car tax was paid at 9.30 am on the day when it was due, and
3.  I will reluctantly attend a court appointment to demonstrate/defend my position, if this is the only option open to me as an alternative to paying £305.

[Dave_Q]

I've had a quick shufty through some of the legislation and it does make reference to additional charges, so the back tax only bit Wuvvum mentioned probably no longer applies. 

 

However it does state that you are entitled to a review and if required a subsequent appeal and tribunal as per Section 14-16 of the Finance Act 1994. The bit that refers to that is somewhere in the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994.

 

Please note: If you come across as a grade 1 pub lawyer bellend by quoting the above in a letter I cannot be held responsible.

[Adrian_pt]

Have dealt lots with DVLA in the past (albeit professionally). Can confirm that higher up the food chain they are actually quite sensible and attuned to issues of proportionality - they would struggle to defend this in a court, it seems. Your approach looks good. Best of luck. 

[KruJoe]

 

I think I am gonna do what SOC and BV advocate

 

 

After my direct experiences of matters concerning Swansea, I'd be doing exactly the same. Maybe just add two points: you are well aware of their rules that submitting false evidence may result in a fine of £3000; also that you now consider the matter closed, unless you receive your summons.

 

If they do write back, to acknowledge your letter, and to say you still owe them the £305, that is best dealt with in the IGNORE pile. Any more threatening tone is just bluster in my experience.

Chances are they'll just STFU and you can forget it.

[JohnK]

Chances are they'll just STFU and you can forget it.

This is true.

 

DVLA chased me about a tax issue in January 2015 for a failed tax DD on a white Transit Beavertail (I had sold it but forgot to send the log book off so when the DD was cancelled they wrote to me).

 

I had a fair few letters and they sold it to a debt management company who hounded me by letter and phone. I ignored them and touch wood I'm still clear.

[dave21478]

While the thought of giving them 300 sheets for literally nothing would make me want to hang myself, I would probably pay 300 quid to avoid having to take a day off work and drive to pissing Swansea (No offence to our Welsh contingent) because I frankly couldnt be fucked with all that. I know this is what they rely on - people just giving up and paying the fine to avoid hassle.....

Its easy for us to sit here and say yeah, stick it to em, write back saying "see you in court boyo" but only you can decide if the hassle is worth it. 

No harm in reasonable argument by post but if it came to an actual appearance I would sack it off, because not only that, but I would imagine the fine would mysteriously increase to a lot more than 300 if it didnt go your way.

[colnerov]

 Hi, Given that the letter you received was automatically generated from information that the camera in the van supplied, the first human involved was the person taking the letter off the machine and put in the sack for the postman.  Writing to them so someone actually has eyes on this would probably be enough.  It would be a different matter if you were stopped by the police driving an untaxed vehicle.

 

 Colin

[wuvvum]

I would probably pay 300 quid to avoid having to take a day off work and drive to pissing Swansea

Again, it's been many years since I last went to court to fight the DVLA, but it always used to be that the case would be heard at the magistrate's court closest to where the alleged offence took place.

[Station]

I've contested everything, parking fines, DVLA, and win them all. They give up because they're clerks doing a 9-5 job.

If you remember me getting clamped three times at once, I did the same and heard nothing back. Just offer dispute in court, you have done nothing wrong.

[Captain Furious]

Would rather spend £500 on travelling and legal expenses than £305 to the DVLA for being half an hour late paying their tax. Thieves

[omegod]

When I am Evil Overlord you will get bummed to death by ill tempered Gibbons for that, and then the electric chair, and then a million years in prison, and then community service cleaning the seats in a Cavcraft drunkBay purchase, and then a Paddington Hard Stare.

 

Only smokers think that dropping fag butts is OK.  People who would not drop a Mars Bar wrapper fling butts all over the place.  The punishments I mention above are the mild version, because you are on Autoshite, so you get mate's rates.

 

I had cause to challenge a penalty notice issued to me and used the following exception to the environmental protection act of 1990. A warden followed me back to work when returning from my lunch, I was followed ( targeted ) as I was smoking a fag which I duly dropped in the bucket near the door. I challenged the fine as I was the manager of the site that day and therefore consented to littler being dropped. I genuinely did empty the bucket every week. The council tried really hard to go for the jugular but their solicitor admitted I had them good and proper, I think the janitor who came to ChinaTom's defence would have fitted the bill as having control of the place. I fucking despise actual litter bugs too Breadvan.  

 

1.9 Subsections (4A), (4B) and (4C) set out exceptions to the offence. 1.10 Subsection (4A) retains the previous exception that no offence is committed if depositing litter is ‘(a) authorised by law; or ( done by or with the consent of the owner, occupier or other person having control of the place where it is deposited’. 

[Guest Breadvan72]

What is  this, Pistonheads?  People saying appeal everything, challenge everything, Republic of Me, Freeman on the Land, FUCK DA POLIZ????

 

OK, that butt in a bucket one was legit, so fair enough and SMASH THE FASCIST MACHINE YO, but what's with Station's appeal every parking ticket as a matter of course blah?

 

Estimado Signor Don Reginaldo de Testiculos, please scan and email me the letter(s) from DVLA, and I shall suggest a response.

[dave21478]

I love watching Freeman On The Land stuff on youtube. Especially the bits where they get tazed and thrown in the back of a police van.

[Guest Breadvan72]

I love that bit too.  The FOTL videos and websites are strangely compelling.  

[Guest Breadvan72]

Would rather spend £500 on travelling and legal expenses than £305 to the DVLA for being half an hour late paying their tax. Thieves

 

Er... did you miss the course on how a developed nation state does stuff? 

[Guest Breadvan72]

Again, it's been many years since I last went to court to fight the DVLA, but it always used to be that the case would be heard at the magistrate's court closest to where the alleged offence took place.

 

Shush, sensible, real world based comments may annoy the shouties!  Any fule kno that the DVLA have power to confiscate your children if you fail to tell them that your car is now rattlecan beige, and if you want to appeal you have to travel on foot to Swansea and deposit your appeal papers in fifteen notarised parchment copies in a room in a cellar with a broken lightbulb and a sign saying Beware of the Leopard.   [/stolen gag]

[Captain Furious]

Er... did you miss the course on how a developed nation state does stuff?

 

Um, don't think so, thief breaks into your house, trashes it and nicks all your stuff - gets a caution, guy is half hour late taxing his car - gets a massive fine.

 

Hurray for development

[garbaldy]

I love that bit too. The FOTL videos and websites are strangely compelling.

Yes they are entertaining but are they right ?

[tooSavvy]

Can you sell an angry photo and the story to the Daily Mail to run an anti-DVLA front page. Bonus points if the DVLA blame it on an EU regulation.

 

Should more than cover the £305

 

Tizz the IterrWebzz.... just 'linkkie' our hallowed organ to the DM 'akshunn Noozedesk'... jobbzaGoodunn M8 

 

TS

[barefoot]

Further to all this,

 

Just taxed my bay as above, here's the confirmation email;

 

Vehicle Registration Number: FMM XXX

Reference Number: XXXX XXXX 4979 9432
Application Made On: 04/04/2017 12:07:29
Vehicle Tax Period: 12 months
Vehicle Tax Amount Paid: GBP 257.25

 

It says that it's taxed for 12 months & I'll bet it doesn't expire at 12:07:29 on 04/04/2018

 

So that's confirmation that I have paid for the first couple of days in April.

[Station]

What is  this, Pistonheads?  People saying appeal everything, challenge everything, Republic of Me, Freeman on the Land, FUCK DA POLIZ????

 

OK, that butt in a bucket one was legit, so fair enough and SMASH THE FASCIST MACHINE YO, but what's with Station's appeal every parking ticket as a matter of course blah?

 

Estimado Signor Don Reginaldo de Testiculos, please scan and email me the letter(s) from DVLA, and I shall suggest a response.

 

Nobody is saying appeal everything, I've had about four parking tickets, and I'm bewildered why anyone would want to pay £35/£70 for overstaying parking for five minutes, having one wheel over a yellow line or having the nerve to park on the edge of the kerb. No doubt I'll eventually get corrected by someone for some reason.

Anyone should feel free to pay it though, it makes no difference to me.

[omegod]

I think it's the lack of proportion that's the rub and totally immoral, If you overstay in a car park you are only denying the carpark owners the revenue they would earn from that space for the time you are in it , say £3 max, how can they justify the £70 charge. Same principle applies to Doovla in my opinion. 

[wuvvum]

Of course the obvious answer to all of these issues is to never register any of your vehicles in your name.  Just send off the trader's section in the name of some spurious made-up dealer, and never have to worry about fines, VED etc. ever again.  Unless you get pulled over by an actual copper of course, in which case you'll lose your car and probably get charged with fraud as well, but everyone knows there aren't any real live traffic cops any more.