Learners on Motorways

[sierraman]

It's not all blow jobs off 18 year old birds for guaranteed passes then.

[UmBongo]

I looked at being a driving instructor years ago. I think days filled with driving through the sunny countryside, a smiley 18 year old lass by my side, raking in the cash appealed. I sat down and did the maths and decided it was all bollocks. This was about the time Red started up.

 

My mum's neighbour's lad trained with and worked for Red, he jacked it in as soon as his minimum period was up. He was pretty much doing 12 hour days just to get by, thanks to Red oversaturating and putting at least three other instructors in the town, he was ending up taking 3 hours to do a 1 hour lesson after he'd gone miles out of town to get business. So suddenly he's on £4 an hour or something....

 

Years ago, my dad had to leave BSM for this very reason.

 

I was quite glad because I went from learning in an Austin Metro with a terrible gear-change to a lovely F reg Nissan Micra which was much nicer to drive.

[UmBongo]

..and remember, only a fool breaks the two second rule!

[DSdriver]

According to my girlfriend at the time, a personable young lass named Tina, the driving instructor that was giving us both lessons had "wandering hands". He never tried it with me but I didn't wear a miniskirt (and I still don't).

[Lord Sterling]

Oddly enough, I keep getting harangued by uncle to follow him into being a driving instructor. I like teaching people and have taught a couple of mates to drive and pass unofficially but it seems a right ball ache to get into what with all these tests and 100% marks or you don't pass, plus it costing something like £3k to £4k. Apparently the driving school can pick up the tab but then you are pretty much contracted to stay with them for a few years. Might consider it still as I'm fast tiring of this plater malarky.

[puddlethumper]

Judging by the number of idiots driving in the middle lane of motorways I guess there are plenty of learners using the network at the momement. Those that have not learnt to read the bloody highway code.

Driving a left hooker ( ooer ) I can easily see who is hogging the middle lane and I would say that, easy, 75% are female of any age and older men.

[puddlethumper]

I cannot see how these driving schools make money, I really can't. I saw one a few weeks back, top and bottom of it was £15 an hour, which sounds ok, but deduct fuel, cost of financing the car, advertising, insurance etc and you'd be as well working in Asda.

 

I feel for your position if you are a driving instructor as you must price yourself at a rate you find provides an acceptable return, only to find the bottom feeders arrive on the market charging a silly rate that nobody in their right mind would work for.

Crikey ! 15 squid an hour ! I've seen them advertising round me at £99 for 10 lessons. ( West Midlands ). I don't understand how they make any money at that price.

[Richard]

My view is that they can't make it compulsory because so many people don't live within reach of a motorway, so it's always going to be a voluntary extra. If you're going to voluntarily pay for lessons that don't help towards your test there's no particular advantage in doing them before you pass rather than after.

[Pillock]

The only way they'll encourage it is by offering insurance discounts, just like Pass Plus, if you've done the extra Motorway stuff.

 

But that would involve insurance being governed in some way, so scrap that. Never going to happen.

[AMC Rebel]

 

Yes motorways should probably be part of it but realistically we should really be having compulsory retests every X years. Just removing the number of idiots driving with eyesight below the required standard would be worth it.

Again, a nice idea (retests) in theory, but impractical (I saw something where someone had done the maths and it would be vastly expensive) and not really addressing all the issues -

 

- Most people (still) are reasonable drivers

 

- A lot of aggressive, inattentive and/or drunk people who crash could probably pass a retest - and then they'd carry on driving like twats.

 

- What if someone fails - do they have to stop driving until they can take a retest? Assuming they didn't fail on medical grounds you'd need to be able offer a retest quickly or they'd almost certainly lose their job in many cases -even if not driving as part of work so many people are commuters.

 

I agree about how lax we are on eyesight - it's the only explanation for some of the more random stuff we see. 

[Brodders]

Although I agree with the idea of needing learners to have a go on the motorway to get some experience, I think there needs to be a much larger focus on teaching people to drive on country roads, especially as they are statistically the most dangerous type of road. The number of people who you see thinking that doing 60 on a single track side road "because it is a national speed limit road" is acceptable really makes you think that better education is needed with an additional focus on common sense.

 

However, this would cause everyone in the cities to cry out in anger as they would never* be able to get to the countryside to do this.

[STUNO]

I am so old that when I passed my "test" we didn't have any motorways. Or traffic lights. Or a nearby hill to do a start on. There were a couple of Give way signs though, but no Stop signs.

Where I live today is just like that still, not even a parking warden.

And to add insults to todays learners there were no driving instructors. The test was done by THE local traffic cop too, because THE local Mr Plod was not remotely interested in anything to do with cars, if you drove past Mr plod at 100 in a 30 zone it was nothing to do with him, that was traffic's job.I got my licence 3 years after I started driving, because I could not get legal until I turned 15 ! 

[Guest Hooli]

The entire 'road safety' mindset is wrong to ever teach people to drive. It's all based on surviving an accident by going slower, owning a car you can't see out of but can roll 37 times without injury etc. Until it's all based on actually thinking & avoiding the accident to start with people will never learn to drive as that IS driving.

[fordperv]

I think it's a great idea as long as the person has a good standard of driving and confidence, I think it would be a decent idea to limit it to with qualified instructors though

[AMC Rebel]

The bloke from the AA foundation on the radio said some people never go on motorways due to lack of confidence and we should help them.

 

Or we could leave people in peace and not add to the traffic on motorways any more than we have to.

 

Just like people who don't want to drive at all, I am 100% in favour of letting people who don't want to drive on motorways ...er.. not drive on motorways

[captain_70s]

I didn't hit a motorway until years after passing my test, because Scotland. After years of A and B roads where locals are bombing around at anything between 40mph and 120mph, tractors dump mud everywhere and wildlife is standing on every sharp corner it was like a dream. Just get on the motorway without dying and then point your car in vaguely the right direction until you hit Glasgow.

 

Of course actually driving around in cities is another matter, I didn't have to drive around anything larger than a small town until I went to Aberdeen years after taking my test and it was a nightmare until I memorised the roads, Glasgow was oddly easier but I think it mostly because I resigned myself to going the wrong way and getting lost in advance... We don't talk about Edinburgh, fuck Edinburgh.

 

It'd probably be handy for people to experience the full range of "what you might encounter on the road network" while doing their lessons but it's not going to be practical. When I was learning some of my lessons consisted of driving 18 miles to the nearest roundabout, going round it twice and then driving home...

[Faker]

Joining a motorway via an onslip should be part of the test.

[AMC Rebel]

Joining a motorway via an onslip should be part of the test.

 

BMW/Audi version - tailgate anyone on the sliproad already, no matter how fast they are going, sitting at their rear 3/4.  As soon as hatching appears, swerve violently across it, then across the next 3/4 lanes (indicating about midway through this if you can be bothered), tailgate everyone to destination.  At destination, wait until hatching in exit slip, swerve violently from lane 3/4 to exit slip.

[Richard]

I don't think there's anything about motorway driving that can't be learned on a modern dual carriageway. Motorways are easier if anything, because they are basically dual carriageways with more lanes (sometimes) and some of the hazards removed.

[NorfolkNWeigh]

Yesterday evening I was joining the A34 dual carriageway from the A420 near Oxford. The slip road is about as long as an average motorway one, the genius in a Nissan Leaf in front of me decided to slam her brakes on just as I was committed to joining in the same gap I assumed ( I know, I know) that she was going to use.

Luckily there was room for me to accelerate around the Leaf without interfering with the traffic in the second lane and fucked off. Whether the Zafira that was too close behind me was so lucky I don't know.

You don't need to go on motorways to learn how to use a slip road.

 

You also don't need to be young and inexperienced to not be paying attention in a bit of fog, come off at the wrong junction and put 16 people in hospital.

[forddeliveryboy]

Is there much evidence to show that govt is bovvered about driver competence and ability, other than avoiding crashing? They've abandoned 'road safety' to camera enforcement, the fear of high insurance premiums if you're suspected of being within half a mile of damaging your vehicle and painting roads where they've been proved to be dangerous. And the 'speed kills' mantra has been repeated so often that many don't dare overtake anymore in case they appear in a video for everyone to see, titled "death wish driver".

 

They're just waiting now for driverless technology to fully take control out of your hands, so there can't be any more accidents. 

[rantingYoof]

Middle laners really irritate me; even moreso than those who pull out in front of you (ooerr) or use the wrong lane in a traffic queue at a junction or roundabout just to get several cars ahead and then cut someone up to get to where they want to go.

 

Commuting to and from Birmingham up the M1 and M6 for a few months has really highlighted how this idea that the middle lane is 'safe' or 'best' to use (i.e. I can see a lorry two miles in front of me in lane one so I may as well stay in lane two as I'll be overtaking them soon) has become very widespread.

 

Once, I pulled into lane two from lane one as I was approaching a junction, as I normally do to ensure those joining have a free lane, and up ahead of me I genuinely witnessed someone potter down the sliproad into an empty lane one, and then indicate and pull out into the middle lane.

 

I had to then pull into lane three to overtake them, because naturally they'd joined at 50mph and then were in the process of using 5th gear in their 1.4 petrol to accelerate up to motorway speeds.

 

I made the point of getting past them and diagonally moving from lane three back to lane one in one motion and then watched in my mirror as they disappeared behind me, simply staying in lane two.

 

It's fair to say that people who do this just need a bit of education, or at least need to be politely asked WHY THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THAT IS IN ANY WAY SAFER OR APPROPRIATE?!?!!! (although obviously not by me)...

 

I've thought about it and encapsulating motorway driving into the hazard perception part of the theory test (or even giving it its own section which requires a certain %age score to be achieved to pass) may be a good answer.

 

Or perhaps investing in traffic police and giving them the power to ticket people for DWDCAT...

[Eddie Honda]

It's a £100 FPN for being a middle lane hog. Has been since Aug 2013

 

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars/article-3792498/Just-135-fines-issued-middle-lane-hogging.html

 

Shoot the 1 in 3 and voila! Congestion slashed!

[Guest Hooli]

It's no good having the law if it isn't enforced.

[Partridge]

It's a massive double edged sword. I think it will make a difference to one half, knowing how to use Motorways properly and what to expect will probably make them safer, but there will be the other half who think it will make them infallible, and will be a menace to everyone when they're let loose.

 

A lot of new drivers (and not so new ones) seem to have a very limited grasp of what good driving involves. Remember that some seem to think because they know how to pas their driving test, "it makes them a good driver", and qualifies them to drive like twats, roaring up other people's arses, tearing round blind bends and caining it in the wet "becoz I'm skilled I'm safe".

 

Is it really a good idea to give the twattish half motorway lessons?

[Partridge]

Joining a motorway via an onslip should be part of the test.

I think they already have to join an A road on a slip road.

[Eddie Honda]

I think they already have to join an A road on a slip road.

Inverary test centre? I don't think so.

 

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/bookies-assistant-gets-driving-licence-3023064

 

(Actually a mate of mine, who isn't a bad driver, failed two tests at Inverary and only passed 4th attempt on his second go at Dumbarton)

[M'coli]

An ex-colleague (in Leeds, in the last 3 years) passed on her fourth or fifth attempt.  She said that she was meant to have a lesson beforehand, but the instructor turned up in just enough time for them to drive to the test centre, and the extra hour's fee for the pre-test lesson was wiavved, but even after I'd pointed out that this was all to take her mind off of the test itself and to make her anxious that she was going to miss it, Shannice (the ex-colleague) was adamant that it didn't help - I still think that her instructor knew she was good enough but just got freaked out by being tested, so made her late to take her mind off of it.