Volvos from China

[forddeliveryboy]

http://phys.org/news/2015-04-volvo-china-cars.html

 

Will this affect consumer image, I wonder? Will there be anything not made in China by 2050? 

[lisbon_road]

I reckon manufacture of a lot of cheap stuff will move from China to lower cost countries, especially as China starts to get more expensive.

[dave21478]

Yep, The Chinese living costs and prices are going up, which means manufacturing costs are going up too.

 

In a few year all our cheap Chinese shit will be made in Africa somewhere.

[lisbon_road]

You know those greenie tree hugging weirdos that say that perpetual growth leads to disaster and so on?

 

I just think they might be onto something...............

[Pillock]

But are Chinese production costs going up because their products are made to a higher standards, they're paying employees more and actually developing new products instead of ripping off other's intellectual property? Or have they just twigged that daft Westerners will pay loads for shiny shit with a blue LED and WiFi connectivity?

[tooSavvy]

Probably trading on 'Chinese $hite, ha! Of course..' perception turning to 'I bought [thing with bloo LED&WiFi] yay, KoolAs..eh?' (no real comment on the country of origin) 'but fcuk me.. stuff costs!!' - M8 says 'tell me about it..'

 

TS

[dave21478]

But are Chinese production costs going up because their products are made to a higher standards, they're paying employees more and actually developing new products instead of ripping off other's intellectual property? Or have they just twigged that daft Westerners will pay loads for shiny shit with a blue LED and WiFi connectivity?

 

A bit of both. There are still hundreds of tons of shonky plastic shit being churned out every day, but they are just as capable as any other country of building a good quality product from decent materials built by well trained workers.

What the Chinese are really good at is building what the market wants. People want cheap big screen TVs so they buy one from a supermarket and it breaks after 9 months and they say "cheap shit...rip off....buying quality next time...." and they look in a proper AV shop and see a telly the size they want by a "quality" brand like Bang and Olufson but its the fat end of 9 grand and uses proprietry connectors so they would need a new bluray and amp etc so they say "fuck that" and its back to Tesco where they buy a LickLongDong for 379 with 50 quid on the clubcard.

 

China is investing big-style in Africa building infrastucture because they want the resources for the future and I reckon some of the poorer African countries will soon enough be the next sweatshops churning out plastic trinkets.

[Lacquer Peel]

Aren't a lot of hidden components in new cars made in China already?

[r.welfare]

The story in the link is over a year old. That said, I don't recall seeing any noise in the US motoring press about a long wheelbase S60, only the jacked-up version which I think is Swedish-supplied.

[dave21478]

As for the OP article I reckon its a bad move for Volvo. Trying to sell cheaply made "quality" stuff often goes awry.

 

The company my father works for spent bajillions setting up a production facility in India but ended up mothballing it after a year or two as the Americans rejected its output on quality concern grounds. Now that production is back in UK they are happy to buy again.

Apparently the Indian quality was no different in real terms, the US just didnt want stuff made in India.

[egg]

China is investing big-style in Africa building infrastucture because they want the resources for the future and I reckon some of the poorer African countries will soon enough be the next sweatshops churning out plastic trinkets.

 

Yep. This is why Trump 'making America great again' is out of the question!

[For Fiats Sake]

I don't think people are really that bothered where there consumable goods come from, if they like it they will buy it.

I work for a home furnishings company and 99% of what we sell comes from China, India, Pakistan, Vietnam etc.  Most of what you buy will come from the same places.  Cars have been made in India, Korea, Poland and all have sold well here with very little negative press that I can think off apart from a few rusty dusters. (ducks and waits to be corrected).

What may well sink China's automotive ambitions is good old quotas and import duties and governments reluctance to let it's auto producers go abroad.  Quite what anyone can do when tata moves all of it's JLR production to darkest peru or nissan decides it would prefer its workers to smell of saki rather than newcastle brown ale on a monday morning.  What can be done when the bavarian motor works cuts costs even further by outsourcing even more production (isn't one Maxxi already made abroad) out of blighty who knows.

As long as people are employed here selling, servicing, financing the products does it really matter where they are made?

[andrew e]

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-autos-astonmartin-recall-idUKBREA141T420140205

 

Aston Martin had a huge recall for Chinese made parts.

[Lacquer Peel]

I don't think people are really that bothered where there consumable goods come from, if they like it they will buy it.

I work for a home furnishings company and 99% of what we sell comes from China, India, Pakistan, Vietnam etc.  Most of what you buy will come from the same places.  Cars have been made in India, Korea, Poland and all have sold well here with very little negative press that I can think off apart from a few rusty dusters. (ducks and waits to be corrected).

What may well sink China's automotive ambitions is good old quotas and import duties and governments reluctance to let it's auto producers go abroad.  Quite what anyone can do when tata moves all of it's JLR production to darkest peru or nissan decides it would prefer its workers to smell of saki rather than newcastle brown ale on a monday morning.  What can be done when the bavarian motor works cuts costs even further by outsourcing even more production (isn't one Maxxi already made abroad) out of blighty who knows.

As long as people are employed here selling, servicing, financing the products does it really matter where they are made?

 

High unemployment is linked, at least in the USA, the world's largest service economy, with a trade deficit. I don't think outsourcing manufacturing to countries with cheap labour and relying on a service economy works long term.

[For Fiats Sake]

High unemployment is linked, at least in the USA, the world's largest service economy, with a trade deficit. I don't think outsourcing manufacturing to countries with cheap labour and relying on a service economy works long term.

We're screwed then!

 

Even if you wanted to buy British you'd have a job to find stuff you wanted for a reasonable price.

 

We should throw ourselves onto Angela Merkey and ask for mercy and immediately declare ourselves as an EU area of special economic need.

[forddeliveryboy]

But are Chinese production costs going up because their products are made to a higher standards, they're paying employees more and actually developing new products instead of ripping off other's intellectual property? Or have they just twigged that daft Westerners will pay loads for shiny shit with a blue LED and WiFi connectivity?

 

Prhaps, but you've been talking about how good the Chinese brand smartphones are recently - how long before Volvos are replaced with something with a Chinese name which is a better product at 80% of the price?

 

Sure, motor cars are way more involved then electronic circuits, but the Chinese are very keen to learn...

[New POD]

http://phys.org/news/2015-04-volvo-china-cars.html

 

Everything will be made in China or India by 2017? If not made there it will be owned by companies from those countries.

 

 

 Fixed that for you

[New POD]

 

I don't think people are really that bothered where there consumable goods come from, if they like it they will buy it.

I work for a home furnishings company and 99% of what we sell comes from China, India, Pakistan, Vietnam etc.  Most of what you buy will come from the same places.  Cars have been made in India, Korea, Poland and all have sold well here with very little negative press that I can think off apart from a few rusty dusters. (ducks and waits to be corrected).

What may well sink China's automotive ambitions is good old quotas and import duties and governments reluctance to let it's auto producers go abroad.  Quite what anyone can do when tata moves all of it's JLR production to darkest peru or nissan decides it would prefer its workers to smell of saki rather than newcastle brown ale on a monday morning.  What can be done when the bavarian motor works cuts costs even further by outsourcing even more production (isn't one Maxxi already made abroad) out of blighty who knows.

As long as people are employed here selling, servicing, financing the products does it really matter where they are made?

 

 

My Astra was Built in Poland. Despite the fact that everyone thinks it was built on the Wirral.

 

By the MAXXI , do you mean the Cuntyman assembled in Austria ?

[bigstraight6]

Bad move by Volvo, Mercedes did similar production cost cutting back in the 90's with disaterous results...

[andy18s]

We're screwed then!

 

Even if you wanted to buy British you'd have a job to find stuff you wanted for a reasonable price.

 

We should throw ourselves onto Angela Merkey and ask for mercy and immediately declare ourselves as an EU area of special economic need.

Which we'll have left by then......but that's to.be "discussed " in another thread.......

[Pillock]

Prhaps, but you've been talking about how good the Chinese brand smartphones are recently - how long before Volvos are replaced with something with a Chinese name which is a better product at 80% of the price?

 

Sure, motor cars are way more involved then electronic circuits, but the Chinese are very keen to learn...

 

Well yes, those were the options - in the realms of smartphones they've moved from option B (awful tat with a blue LED) to option A (actually, really nice stuff at a great price) very recently and quite quickly. In my view the cars they've been making were also firmly in Option B - look at how Chery were just banging out shameless copies of other designs, minus most of the safety features. Look OK, perform awfully.

Now they've realised we're a huge untapped market, they've got the reason to up their game on cars too. As much as people are going to shout me down, MG are the start of this - the 3 and 6 were a hundred times better than some of the domestic cars, and yes they lacked the final finish of a BMW or Audi but were half the cost. By 2018 I think we'll be thinking differently about their cars, 2 years ago it was unthinkable that a UK phone network would stock an unknown brand phone but Huawei are selling their devices on both 3 and EE.

 

Of course, it's slightly different as the story was about Volvo building in China - where most of your favourite electronics names build stuff in the Far East anyway, or increasingly as the shipped costs from China increase, Eastern Europe. So they're building and having to match the quality standards insisted on by the customers so yes, they will knock out a massively good product. Welding is welding, wherever it happens in the world. You could argue that you'd get a better product from China, where workers will be sacked on the spot if they miss a step in production, than you would from the UK where it's all about doing the best you can but Monday is all about getting over the hangover, and Friday is all about planning the weekend in your head, and Wednesday is the day that the QA department has a half day so fuck it.

 

It's like BL vs Datsun all over again.

[dave21478]

...

Now they've realised we're a huge untapped market, they've got the reason to up their game on cars too. 

 

 

 

 

I quite fancy one of these.

 

If I was in the market for a new one I would probably give it a try. 

[Pillock]

Wasn't there a member on here ages ago who had one as a work hack, and it basically bent in the middle.

Not sure if Great Wall are old, tat Chinese products or new, good Chinese products. At least they have European dealers now.

[xtriple]

Not a fan of Chinese stuff at all. or outsourcing for that matter. My son has to deal with India a lot and the tales he tells of how it all goes horribly wrong all the time and when it does get done 'right' the quality is abysmal and it all gets rejected.

 

Had Chinese made bikes.... utter shite that wouldn't outlive the warranty, if they had one. Monkey metal fasteners that round instantly, Also, they are all blatant copies, just rip-offs of someone else's intellectual property. Seen LOTS of fake watches made in China (there are huge factories there and also, small almost mobile sweat shops so that when the authorities bother - rare- they can be back in business in a day or so) and they are so bad, they are a joke: yes, they may 'look' the part, but the inside workings and the quality of materials used is truly dire.

 

If I knew/had a choice, I would ALWAYS buy from the UK, Europe, or the US. Anything made in the far East is shit (at the moment....) except Japan (far East? geography is not my strong suite!) where they do make some decent stuff.

 

Other gross generalisations are readily available!

[Pillock]

China can make excellent quality stuff. An example: Apple Macbooks are built there. A lower failure rate than most other brands, excellent build quality, latest materials, and a very desirable product to your average consumer.

 

Cheap? Hell no, that's why they'll also sell you a $40 tablet PC which is about as desirable as genital warts.

[Felly Magic]

We already have 2 Chinese made cars here in the UK, the China State Washing Machine Company 3 & 6, and they've gone down like a lead brick

[Stanky]

I quite fancy one of these.

 

If I was in the market for a new one I would probably give it a try. 

 

Chap over the road replaced his tatty L200 (old, non jacked-up one) with one of these about 4 years ago and I have watched with a great deal of interest. I've chatted to him about it a couple of times and keep my eye on it for rust and whatnot but it seems to be holding up very well. It looks very similar to a contemporary Hilux, seems to have a well-equipped cabin and has ABS and ESP letters stuck on the back. I think its 4WD, it certainly looks 4WD, and most of all he likes it. It hasn't rusted visibly, despite us being about 2 miles from the sea, and being used in muddy places.

 

I think he does some moderate off-roading, he owns a company who deliver porta-loos to events and building sits and stuff and he really rates it. Not sure what it cost but presumably less than an equivalent machine from the usual suspects.

 

EDIT:

 

Forgot to say, I have no issue with stuff being manufactured overseas, I like to think that I have a sufficiently 'question everything' mentality to understand that things can be made cheaply, at the expense of longevity of operation and reliability; or they can be made expensively and will generally last well. Its a shame that manufacturing has been allowed to migrate elsewhere, but succesive governments are wholly to blame for the policy and cheaper overseas labour has come in to (gladly) pick the demand up.

[For Fiats Sake]

Yes Maxxi=cuntyman!

 

I reckon it will be western firms setting up out there to initially flog to the Chinese market and eventually exporting back to europe. 

 

Don't forget how the Koreans have come on in leaps and bounds in just a few years with their products!

 

[andrew e]

however the Seth Effircan  BMW plant seesm to have less of an issue,  and as others have stated Astras are multi sourced ( although i don;t think they build any in the legacy Opel plants  in former  west  germany)

The East London plant in Seth Effrica is supposedly one of Mercedes best plants for quality too. All the new RHD C Klasse bar the hybrids come from there.

[Split_Pin]

As an avid collector of model cars, nearly all of which are made in China, I can confirm that the Chinese obviously know what they are doing when it comes to quality, fit and finish together with level of detail.

 

I think it has more to do with how much YOU are prepared to pay for your product and less to do with where it is made, IMO.