NOVA. This Govt's latest little scam

[twosmoke300]

I fucking hate all these stealth taxes . Another one that annoys me is when they put small bike / moped tax up from 15 to 16 pounds. Its only a quid but there must be millions of them in the UK. Goes towards dodgy expenses I suppose.

[Ghosty]

Mark, the Harold came from the Channel Islands didn't it?

 

Shouldn't make a difference, it's UK innit?

 

No, it's a crown dependency, so it's not in the EU, or part of the UK - it's only partially governed by us. So it doesn't need a NOVA, as that only applies to EU imports.

[wuvvum]

Another one that annoys me is when they put small bike / moped tax up from 15 to 16 pounds.

 

To be fair, moped tax had been 15 quid since the mid '90s, so an increase to 16 is still well below inflation.  I'd fully expected them to whack it right up to 20.

[Mr_Bo11ox]

I've just realised my FSO Bo11ognez is still on its Polizsh plates so is gonna need a dubious NOVA declaration made when I do summert with it.

[Lankytim]

Wasn't NOVA the robot-building bad guys in the film "Short Circuit"? They seemed total bastards in that film, so i'm not surprised they're up to no good again.

[Partridge]

Hmmm, how can we bleed people dry now? Cunts.

[nigel bickle]

Brief update to confirm that my NOVA fine has just been cancelled, as the car was re-exported without ever coming off the trailer (ahem!).

 

My initial attempt to amend the application was rejected.  My formal written Appeal was rejected. My letter to my MP seems to have altered their decision., but the whole VAT office stance is draconian.

 

However, I had to supply the ferry reference detailing its re-export, and confirm that itI will not be bringing it back in for a minimum of 6 months.

 

So, I cannot UK register my Ronda, nor could anyone else, before August, earliest..

[New POD]

Someone I work with is married to a german with a german registered LHD Mx5 insured in Germany, TUV'd in Germany and address at her parents house in German.  She has been employed in the UK for 4 plus years.  I'm guessing now that that isn't really allowed?  

[Lankytim]

I don't think that's ever been allowed.

[nigel bickle]

It needs a day trip out of the country (Calais will do)  properly documented, every 6 months.

 

If its TUV is current, presumably it pops home occasionally? That'll do -as long as it leaves the UK every 6 months

[scooters]

As there is no address to which to send the appeal I would be inclined to tell them to stick it and cc it to my MP with a copy of the letter showing there is no address to appeal to. Qwangos like the DVLA are concieted arrogant twats and hate having to answer questions from MPS especially when they have been rumbled making a total pigs arse of themselves.

 

It's a bad law - these pricks in government at the moment seem obsessed with cake and arse taxes to trip you up. Hell, if Nigel gets caught out that;s the rest of us screwed, he is the most organised of collectors, has to be given the size of his tin collection.

 

Bedroom tax, NOVA, they'll be bringing back Pitt's window tax next.

 

Of course if they really needed cash then they could always insist that companies like vodafone pay what they owe rather than what they can blag. meanwhile the small business man gets shafted. ......twunts

[nigel bickle]

Once bitten ,mate. It'll not happen( to me) again.

 

But you wait for the squeals of pain when someone buys a European import that's been languishing here, say  2 years. No tax Sir, but a £3,650 fine please.

 

And, once you've declared- you get out of it.   I had to fight like hell, supplying export details for them to cross-check (which they did!). 

 

I forecast a storm coming -when the ramifications are felt.  I think it bodes very badly for anything that's already here, unregistered. 

[Junkman]

It needs a day trip out of the country (Calais will do)  properly documented, every 6 months.

 

If its TUV is current, presumably it pops home occasionally? That'll do -as long as it leaves the UK every 6 months

 

 

Wrong.

 

Within the EU a car must be registered, where you spend the most time of the year, i.e. the 183 day rule applies.

There is no grace period either, although this is extremely difficult to get out of people's heads. If you for example leave Germany to live in England, and it is clear from day one that you will be there 183 days or more per year (a year being the next 12 months from when you entered, not the calendar year or anything), you have to register the car in the UK immediately, not after half a year or so.

So a day trip to Calais twice a year will not do anything. You will have to take 183+ day trips to Germany. If you do more than 183 day trips to Calais, you will have to register your car in France.

 

This is the law. Everything else is legend.

 

And now don't kill me, I don't make those stupid laws. I'm against them.

[Mr Lobster]

This sounds like a right racket and I can't really see how they can justify either the way it works or the ridiculous fine.

 

So, a question - I got a text from a friend earlier who has bought a German registered Twingo. He has the Nova form filled in by the previous owner but dated Sept '13. Is had better off filling a new form in with today's date or does a world of pain await?

[Pillock]

I'd fill it out as though it was all done in September. Then photocopy it. Then lose the original, and when they attempt a fine produce "proof" that it was all done last year and isn't it lucky you had a photocopy? The only thing you won't have is a proof of posting.

[nigel bickle]

If you do that- they will ask for proof of import/ export dates. Ferry tickets, references etc.

 

If you don't do that -you are lying on a legal document to the VAT man.

 

Your call

[FredTransit]

as there is free movement within the EU I cant see how the gov cant accept a Dover/Calais ticket unless leaving from Hamburg is the only passage acceptable. I would pop over and then fill out the form.

[nigel bickle]

Yes Fred- but the ticket will show that the vehicle left the UK, THAT DAY, and returned later -in a clear case of wilful avoidance. They will be able to demonstrate, to their own satisfaction that the vehicle was here all that time -and you are just, now, trying to avoid the fine for 'non compliance'.

 

You need to get the vehicle out -without recognition (ie on a covered trailer) then back under its own steam -else they'll refuse to cancel. They can/do check against the registration -so knew when mine arrived -to the hour!

 

Thankfully, I have the formal, rather snooty, letter today -confirming that the fine is cancelled. Took a load of hoops -though!

[barrett]

Guys, although this is a bugger it is nowhere near as bad as people are making out, if you imported a car before NOVA existed then you wont have to pay a fine for not declaring it, don't worry! The government are shits but not even they can fine you for not filling out a form that didn't exist when you imported the car.

 

We put through two cars a couple of weeks ago and the only problem was the thicko on the other end of the 'phone who wouldn't accept that you don't have to pay VAT or duty on historic vehicles moving within the EU. Despite both cars being here, unregistered and undeclared, for several years, the NOVA form came back and they now both have UK IDs no bother.

[Guest benno]

I am also in this boat, I got the form from the hmrc but never filled in the form because the car wasn't going on the road anytime soon because it turned out the engine needed a rebuild. You know the car Nigel

 

The car came into the country on a low loader with no plates on it. I think I can probably get away with it and just apply for another form stating that the car has only just entered the uk. I have to thank Mr. Bickle for flagging this up because I would have been in for a huge fine. 

 

My only concern is that I did call and speak to hmrc about whether there would be any tax to pay, the car was originally registered in the uk, it was exported to Belgium and reimported to the uk by me. At the time they told me there would be no tax to pay but helpfully didn't mention the 14 day rule and the potential for the massive fine. If the hmrcs record keeping is any good they may put 2 and 2 together. Time will tell...

[Mr_Bo11ox]

Anyone else got any stories about this? I think in time this will surely die a death as it seems way beyond anything that the DVLA have come up with in terms of sheer pointlessness & draconianism.

[Pillock]

Can't help thinking it's a solution to a problem that didn't really exist. I can't imagine the financial strain on the country created by importing a rusty Lada and leaving it in a field for a year while you source panels but it can't be anything worth crying about.... 

[panhard65]

It is strange that they don't say a word about it as you roll through customs. I got stopped with the Acadiane on a trailer and the customs guy didn't say a word about NOVA. It does seem very unfair to fine you for something that you were unaware of. I do hope that maybe they will crack down on foreign registered cars living here almost permanently as they don't pay any tax and can get away with speed cameras and ANPR, just playing dumb if they do get stopped.

[FredTransit]

EXACTLY panhard. If it was a case that these unregistered cars owners did anything wrong fair enought. 99% of em will be made legal in a few months anyway..

[Junkman]

It needs a day trip out of the country (Calais will do)  properly documented, every 6 months.

 

This is simply not true.

EU law says, a car must be registered in the county, where it spends more than 185 days of the year. There is also no grace period, if it is foreseeable that one resides in a country for more than six months during the upcoming twelve, it must be registered there immediately.

[cort1977]

Just had a slight brush with NOVA.   I brought a car back from Australia two years ago but have not registered it until now due to various IVA issues.   NOVA didn't exist then so just filled in form C&E 384 declaring no tax due as personal import.  

 

Finally got everything together last month and submitted the V55 only to have it sent back as car was not on the NOVA system.   Not possible to put it on the NOVA system myself as car came from outside EU but after a call to HMRC they said to send them the documents, they would enter the details to NOVA and send me a confirmation.   I was a bit dubious and worried about a possible fine but amazingly they did it all very efficiently and sent it back within a week.

 

Car is now registered with DVLA. 

 

I did have all the import documents showing it came in to the country before April 2013 so presumably that was why no mention of a fine.

[HMC]

I imported 90% of my peugeot 504 last month from Jersey (the remainder had dissolved whilst on Jersey), it seems if you are an individual, and not registered with HMRC online directly with your business (you could submit a NOVA online in that case), you still do the ce 384 form and submit that. After that has cleared they then enter it on the nova system. A bit of a hangover, from pre april 2013.

 

The 14 day grace period before informing HMRC once its landed in the uk was the main thing I was aware of having checked up what the latest legislation was prior to importation. Once back home, I lobbed the ce384 in the post the following day and within a week it was all squared up. 

 

From reading above the problems seem to stem from people trying to declare stuff that was imported prior to april 2013, or people who have landed cars since then without being aware of the latest regs. For the former group a sort of amnesty would seem to be fair where older imports can be declared now without fear of a fine, on the basis that the current legislation wasnt in force at the time of importation.