Shite in Miniature II

[Split_Pin]

10 hours ago, RoadworkUK said:

Agreed. I keep meaning to pick a C Class up at some point. I have the W168 and W169 A-Classes. I need an X-Type, too.

I say "need"... I really don't.

The X Type and S Type are 2 other great Maisto models. I also can't think of any other miniature manufacturers that have covered them. I love those cars and these model ones are perfect as they've got all the detail but don't rust!

Speaking of concept cars, the Maisto Dodge Copperhead is a cracker. I don't normally like concept cars that bear no resemblance to a production model but the paintwork and interior details are very nicely done.

I've also actually got my Corgi MGF for sale on Marketplace at the moment. It's a nice model but somewhat lacking in detail and I don't think the rubber seats work if they're trying to emulate cloth. Their MGB was a better effort.

[danthecapriman]

There are things you can get in 1:64, it’s just not quite as common as the likes of 1:76 and 1:43, the main reason being is the model railway scales, where scenery items are very popular match 1:76 (OO gauge) and 1:43 (O gauge).

But if you search for things like ‘1:64 diorama’ it does bring up results…

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p4432023.m570.l1311&_nkw=1%2F64+diorama&_sacat=0

Edit: this is a pretty handy little garage display piece,

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/167021434174?_skw=1%2F64+diorama&itmmeta=01JBAJJ3R75A1GEHG17QG2CCT1&hash=item26e340d53e:g:3U0AAOSw29Rm5Fqn&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA8HoV3kP08IDx%2BKZ9MfhVJKlv6uHglgZwpXE05eH8jUoXmJC6aMjjRMaYBf9lvpSbblez5fWbtoPI8NFfVRskSKu5KvqbVtox1N%2BHz%2Fx%2BFTgEebQu%2BX6WDI0p0HMOg4OHBnno%2B3vyiOWtBPZgMsUkGbPWLhH1%2BRZvYHuM3Rp0XhQ0ZA8Bov93D6F9mbBJryvrfbXdzMUigVI4DSDyoZm2urAITKcluG6FbNt%2FIkbsce2TKlxUi8OSrPMum%2FaJa8rbIl0w3KL69c%2FuiduYLN3AyzPwPVYDoiJRi8xrRoi8fPr2941JQNYyJm5KneEXu7M3fw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5q8yNLaZA

[Split_Pin]

8 minutes ago, danthecapriman said:

There are things you can get in 1:64, it’s just not quite as common as the likes of 1:76 and 1:43, the main reason being is the model railway scales, where scenery items are very popular match 1:76 (OO gauge) and 1:43 (O gauge).

But if you search for things like ‘1:64 diorama’ it does bring up results…

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p4432023.m570.l1311&_nkw=1%2F64+diorama&_sacat=0

Edit: this is a pretty handy little garage display piece,

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/167021434174?_skw=1%2F64+diorama&itmmeta=01JBAJJ3R75A1GEHG17QG2CCT1&hash=item26e340d53e:g:3U0AAOSw29Rm5Fqn&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA8HoV3kP08IDx%2BKZ9MfhVJKlv6uHglgZwpXE05eH8jUoXmJC6aMjjRMaYBf9lvpSbblez5fWbtoPI8NFfVRskSKu5KvqbVtox1N%2BHz%2Fx%2BFTgEebQu%2BX6WDI0p0HMOg4OHBnno%2B3vyiOWtBPZgMsUkGbPWLhH1%2BRZvYHuM3Rp0XhQ0ZA8Bov93D6F9mbBJryvrfbXdzMUigVI4DSDyoZm2urAITKcluG6FbNt%2FIkbsce2TKlxUi8OSrPMum%2FaJa8rbIl0w3KL69c%2FuiduYLN3AyzPwPVYDoiJRi8xrRoi8fPr2941JQNYyJm5KneEXu7M3fw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5q8yNLaZA

I think you'd be the very man to weather that second one into an old rust-shed!

[IronStar]

Am I right in thinking that none of the usual suspects are currently doing an original Mini in their 1:64 mainlines? I’d like to turn it into a keychain, and I’m looking for something simple with no moving parts to break. 

[Split_Pin]

Just now, IronStar said:

Am I right in thinking that none of the usual suspects are currently doing an original Mini in their mainlines?

Not that I'm aware of!  Plenty of older Hotwheels releases though. I think the earlier HW Minis used to ha e a removable bodyshell!

[bramz7]

Norev do a 1/64 original Mini. 

[bunglebus]

17 minutes ago, Split_Pin said:

Not that I'm aware of!  Plenty of older Hotwheels releases though. I think the earlier HW Minis used to have a removable bodyshell!

Indeed

 

The premium versions still have removable shells. (but no rollcage), mainline ones do not

Matchbox still crank out a Mini now and again that's closer to stock 

 

[Spottedlaurel]

9 hours ago, RoadworkUK said:

Biggest problem with 1:64 IMO is that paint seemingly cannot be applied to scale. It always looks way too thick (as shown by the A6 pictured above), to the detriment of sharp angles and accurate shut lines etc. Just means they always end up looking like toys, irrespective of how many details are carefully added.  But then again I could just be a fussy tosser.

I presume that comes down to the paint they use, needing something that goes on in one coat and dries quickly to a good shine. The Pop Race Skyline seems quite good in that regard, maybe helped by being a satin finish.

Even at 1:24 or 1:25 it's an issue, and 1:1 automotive paint as a metallic causes the added issue of flakes that are out of scale. Mica/pearl seems better in that regard however, and Tamiya TS spray cans being developed for models are also good.

On my kits I build it up in multiple thin layers and never go for a shine straight out of the can, usually having to rely on polishing through varying grades of Micromesh (3600 down to 12000). On anything that's a solid colour I try to avoid clearcoat to keep the paint looking as thin as possible. The challenge then is to not rub through the paint when polishing.......

Some people have builds which are super-shiny but look like they've been dipped in honey or something.

[danthecapriman]

2 hours ago, Spottedlaurel said:

I presume that comes down to the paint they use, needing something that goes on in one coat and dries quickly to a good shine. The Pop Race Skyline seems quite good in that regard, maybe helped by being a satin finish.

Even at 1:24 or 1:25 it's an issue, and 1:1 automotive paint as a metallic causes the added issue of flakes that are out of scale. Mica/pearl seems better in that regard however, and Tamiya TS spray cans being developed for models are also good.

On my kits I build it up in multiple thin layers and never go for a shine straight out of the can, usually having to rely on polishing through varying grades of Micromesh (3600 down to 12000). On anything that's a solid colour I try to avoid clearcoat to keep the paint looking as thin as possible. The challenge then is to not rub through the paint when polishing.......

Some people have builds which are super-shiny but look like they've been dipped in honey or something.

I must admit, I’m not a big fan of super shiny model cars. It can look out of place and too toy like. I find a more satin finish about right. Depends on the look you want I suppose, I prefer a model appearance like you’re trying to make a model of something you’d see in the street, but if you want a super shiny display piece or a polished metal vehicle…

When I had my model railway I used to use lots of the Oxford Diecast 1:76 vehicles, which tend to be quite shiny straight from the box. Usually I’d mask up the glazing etc then just give them a quick spray over with satin varnish to dull them down a touch and get rid of the shine. Looked much better on the scenic bits of the layout.

[FakeConcern]

I wish I could find spray paint that would cover without a primer on diecast cars to keep them thinnish, I've tried enamel paints, but they didn't adhere well without primer.

I am still sorting out what I do and don't really like about diecast and the main thing for me is they look like a toy or have a toy like aspect, which is why I didn't keep the really nice Models of Yesteryears Cudas and don't collect Vanguards. I've some more accurate models such as the Conrad, Inter-Cars and Yonezawaand I like them very much as the opening doors, boot and bonnet give the play aspect of toys.

[Dick Cheeseburger]

I've been thinking about paintwork for my MB R5 I'm tidying up. My initial plan was polish the metal and lacquer but I've chosen to go for painted finish as I think an actual colour would work better. 

Did MB/ Corgi use primer back in the 70s/80s? They seemed to flick just the right depth of paint over the metalwork and as mentioned above, some resprays don't really cut it as they look too thick and lose detail of the casting. My plan was etch primer, flat, top up, flat, metallic colour coat and then lacquer. I do worry it'll look too thick on the casting though. 

[MiniMinorMk3]

13 hours ago, Lord Sterling said:

Yeah, I've noticed a big jump in the quality of detail on 1/64s over the last several years. 

Not quite a fair comparison as the Audi A6 from Siku came out many years ago whereas the one below came out probably in the couple of years. But it's good to see 1/64s getting the level of detail they always deserved. Although it has to be said, even Matchbox aren't always keeping their eye on the ball regarding the front/rear lights on their cars.

What I haven't seen is any scenery models for 1/64s. For example, there is a seller on eBay who was making a block of garages for 1/76 cars, I asked him about 1/64s and he said he'd be looking to create similar if he could, when I messaged him again recently I didn't get a reply.

 

It funny how things change in the diecast world.

30 years ago Minichamps had a range called Microchamps in 1/64 and they were pretty much ignored and can be found quite cheaply. As usual with Minichamps the detail was excellent, but they only released DTM cars and F1 cars. They only lasted a few years before being dropped.

[MiniMinorMk3]

12 hours ago, IronStar said:

Am I right in thinking that none of the usual suspects are currently doing an original Mini in their 1:64 mainlines? I’d like to turn it into a keychain, and I’m looking for something simple with no moving parts to break. 

 

12 hours ago, bunglebus said:

Indeed

 

The premium versions still have removable shells. (but no rollcage), mainline ones do not

Matchbox still crank out a Mini now and again that's closer to stock 

 

Aren't the Hotwheels and Matchbox Minis 1/50th or 1/55th?

 

I modified a Tomica into a flash drive to match one of my Minis so that I could use it in the car for music.

 

For a key chain I would go for an Oxford 1/76 or one of their tiny 1/148 models. These can be found on everyones favourite auction site quite easily.

Oxford Diecast Model Mini Scale Vehicles - Oxford Diecast

[bunglebus]

On 24/10/2024 at 14:03, junkyarddog said:

Think I've got one of those in that livery!

Another NOS one just popped up on eBay 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/176650160567?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=dWv45h_2TOe&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=X5RtjeAxSP-&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

[danthecapriman]

1 hour ago, Dick Longbridge said:

I've been thinking about paintwork for my MB R5 I'm tidying up. My initial plan was polish the metal and lacquer but I've chosen to go for painted finish as I think an actual colour would work better. 

Did MB/ Corgi use primer back in the 70s/80s? They seemed to flick just the right depth of paint over the metalwork and as mentioned above, some resprays don't really cut it as they look too thick and lose detail of the casting. My plan was etch primer, flat, top up, flat, metallic colour coat and then lacquer. I do worry it'll look too thick on the casting though. 

I’m not sure if MB, Corgi etc primed or not tbh. 
When I do my custom stuff I etch prime the bare metal as thin as I can, then spray a coat of normal primer over that, wet flat, then multiple thin coats of colour. Sometimes colour is covered well enough after only a couple of coats. Lastly varnish if required.

Some paints work better than others on diecast models. I’ve found Hycote auto paint very good. Others less so as they tend to have a poor spray pattern or low pressure in the cans. Humbrol aerosol is also very good. 
It can be difficult sometimes trying to find quality paints for models in aerosol form, but if you’ve got access to an airbrush that can really help.

The other issue is scale. Obviously the bigger the model is the easier it is get the paint on without filling all the detail in with paint.

[Dick Cheeseburger]

1 minute ago, danthecapriman said:

I’m not sure if MB, Corgi etc primed or not tbh. 
When I do my custom stuff I etch prime the bare metal as thin as I can, then spray a coat of normal primer over that, wet flat, then multiple thin coats of colour. Sometimes colour is covered well enough after only a couple of coats. Lastly varnish if required.

Some paints work better than others on diecast models. I’ve found Hycote auto paint very good. Others less so as they tend to have a poor spray pattern or low pressure in the cans. Humbrol aerosol is also very good. 
It can be difficult sometimes trying to find quality paints for models in aerosol form, but if you’ve got access to an airbrush that can really help.

The other issue is scale. Obviously the bigger the model is the easier it is get the paint on without filling all the detail in with paint.

Why do you etch prime and then use normal primer on top? I suppose standard primer covers pretty well and lends itself to flatting off easily? I'm think I'm going to need to experiment a bit on a scrap shell. 

[bunglebus]

I've tried etch primer but the finish was like 80 grit. If you can find one that goes on smoothly I'd say definitely use it, it's heartbreaking when the paint falls off your freshly prepped shell - I've had this several times, usually when doing a metallic blue or silver and masking for stripes etc

 

[danthecapriman]

46 minutes ago, Dick Longbridge said:

Why do you etch prime and then use normal primer on top? I suppose standard primer covers pretty well and lends itself to flatting off easily? I'm think I'm going to need to experiment a bit on a scrap shell. 

I just use etch primer as a way to get a good bond to the metal, but found it’s not great for coverage or flatting off for the paint. The normal primer isn’t so good sticking to bare metal but does cover well and you can wet flat it down better ready for top coat. Plus, normal primer comes in more colours - so for light coloured top coats (white, yellow etc) use white primer, grey primer is fine for most other colours. Red/oxide primer is good for some colours too. Silver I tend to put a black base coat on first then silver… it’s just finding what works best for you.

Thats why when I first started doing these cars I started on some rough old Corgi, Dinky etc models. They were just for practicing on and trying things on. Better doing it on old damaged or rough ones than your best expensive models or things that are special. 
You must have a few broken cars around you could strip and use as test pieces? Maybe try one in just etch primer followed by colour. Then try another with etch primer then normal primer then colour.

Weirdly, I actually use the same etch primer - normal primer - top coat on real cars too! Probably much less important on them really because you can spray the coats on easier and thicker with no worries about filling detail etc. My theory there is simply adding more coats will give a better finish that’s harder wearing and less inclined to rust.

Another thing that’s handy is filler primer. It’s got high solids content so it sprays onto uneven surfaces then when it’s fully dry you can sand it down to leave the primer in all the low spots. You need to be very careful with it on models though as it will (obviously!) fill in detail very easily. I tried it once on a Dinky Transit and it almost completely filled in the door shut line detail in one coat! You could barely see it after.

[Spottedlaurel]

Something I do on most of my plastic kit builds is to scribe the panel lines a bit deeper. Can be a bit of a challenge on small/fiddly/curved shapes, so I sometimes miss out the fuel flap but I try to at least do the doors, bootlid and bonnet (if it's not one that opens). That helps to avoid them filling with paint, and gives a bit more definition if I want to apply a wash in the panel lines.

Of course that is rather easier to do on styrene than diecast metal.....

[sierraman]

I’ve found with regular primer you could practically scratch the paint off with your nail? Think Matchbox etc used to use some sort of enamel? They did prime some of them, the Racing Mini used to have a yellow undercoat on the orange ones. 

[danthecapriman]

2 minutes ago, sierraman said:

I’ve found with regular primer you could practically scratch the paint off with your nail? Think Matchbox etc used to use some sort of enamel? They did prime some of them, the Racing Mini used to have a yellow undercoat on the orange ones. 

That’s exactly what I found with normal primer. It’s fine, but if you scratched it or anything it’d just rub right off. Even low tack masking tape was enough to pull it off sometimes. That’s why I started using etch primer first. The etch primer never seems as good at being flatted off or taking the colour though.

[sierraman]

23 minutes ago, danthecapriman said:

That’s exactly what I found with normal primer. It’s fine, but if you scratched it or anything it’d just rub right off. Even low tack masking tape was enough to pull it off sometimes. That’s why I started using etch primer first. The etch primer never seems as good at being flatted off or taking the colour though.

Maybe enamel sprayed on is way forward but I think according to contemporary books showing manufacturing at the time they baked on the enamel afterwards? Maybe that’s what gives it the toughness? 

[Dick Cheeseburger]

Just now, sierraman said:

Maybe enamel sprayed on is way forward but I think according to contemporary books showing manufacturing at the time they baked on the enamel afterwards? Maybe that’s what gives it the toughness? 

That would make sense. The original finish was pretty damn tough. 

[sierraman]

Some seem to lose paint really easily under stripper then others seem a right twat to get off. I mean when I paint them I stick them on the shelf so I guess it suffices. 
 

Latest project is this, bought it in August from its original owner! Going back to standard which I think is right in the circumstances. 

[danthecapriman]

20 minutes ago, sierraman said:

Some seem to lose paint really easily under stripper then others seem a right twat to get off. I mean when I paint them I stick them on the shelf so I guess it suffices. 
 

Latest project is this, bought it in August from its original owner! Going back to standard which I think is right in the circumstances. 

Is that my old Lincoln behind?😄

It wouldn’t surprise me tbh if they originally baked on the paint. It seems really quite tough stuff whatever it was. Sometimes now you can repaint one and even opening the doors is enough to chip and scratch the edges. Trouble is, enamel paint tends to be quite thick so you risk filling the details in with it! 
I have found though, that if you paint the colour coat then leave the model alone for a day or two with minimal handling it seems to cure and harden off better.

[MiniMinorMk3]

22 minutes ago, danthecapriman said:

 
I have found though, that if you paint the colour coat then leave the model alone for a day or two with minimal handling it seems to cure and harden off better.

That's the best thing for paint, leave it for as long as possible to cure.

Some paints can take a week to fully cure at ambient temperature. This is also the same for primers. They may appear dry to the touch but they need to fully cure before applying further coats.

I see some have mentioned using filler primer. This is the worst for reacting after time. It still shrinks and can cause micro-blistering a few years later due to it's porosity and slow curing time.

 

I still use brush painted enamels, as seen on the Minis that I posted on here earlier in the year.

Here is the base of the car.

Before stripping

Stripped using Nitromors and wire brush

First coat applied directly to bare metal.

Second coat applied a week later

If I had used a matte white or red for the first coat I would probably have gotten a better more even coat to the red.

[sheffcortinacentre]

Was under the impression it was baked on in a sorta powder coating style.

[Volksy]

In an impulse purchase this evening I got these for a tenner. (Morrisons)

Unfortunately the lounge shelves are full. 

[Split_Pin]

15 minutes ago, Volksy said:

In an impulse purchase this evening I got these for a tenner. (Morrisons)

Unfortunately the lounge shelves are full. 

Thats an excellent buy.

[sierraman]

16 hours ago, danthecapriman said:

Is that my old Lincoln behind?😄

It wouldn’t surprise me tbh if they originally baked on the paint. It seems really quite tough stuff whatever it was. Sometimes now you can repaint one and even opening the doors is enough to chip and scratch the edges. Trouble is, enamel paint tends to be quite thick so you risk filling the details in with it! 
I have found though, that if you paint the colour coat then leave the model alone for a day or two with minimal handling it seems to cure and harden off better.

Might try leaving it in a semi cooled oven, maybe that might work?