Bus Shite

[Felly Magic]

Lothian are also well known throughout the industry not to maintain buses that are due for withdrawl, the state of the SPDs that turned up at Ensign was scary, they'd all broken their backs, and needed thousands spending on them. The SPD is a Dart too far IMHO. The Royales, well, rotten and mechanically shot to hell, Tom James was far from happy with his

 

I remember the ALX400s Arriva bought in 2000 on B7TL chassis, it was a lottery whether one would manage a round trip, and rampant aluminium corrosion appeared within a few months. Every one had to be sent back to Falkirk for extensive work. The R & S plate Royales First bought were actually popping body panels off as the adhesive failed, First fitters resorted to getting panel strapping & pop riveting them on to keep them together. Kwalitee

 

The industry as a whole is facing a very uncertain future, I have friends in all levels of the industry and they are all saying the same. What profits the PLCs are making are being creamed off for failing overseas operations, and pension deficits are sinking them, Rotala have just secured rather a lot of additional debt, and some of their operations are starting to attract the interests of the DVSA. I do think we aren't far off seeing one of the PLCs going begging to the government to bail them out, because there simply isn't a sustainable profit margin out there for most services. One by one, indies around here have either folded, or sold up, nobody wants the poison chalice that is the local arms length council op, as it is losing money and has lost the support of the council that still owns them, their petty fares war with the PLC has driven fares through the floor, there is no way in hell either operator is making any money on local services, for instance there is the 'quid zone' that is the fare for the inner town circle, which does carry quite a way out of the centre in any direction, before the 'war', this was £1.60-£1.80. Ridership has steeply declined on many routes, that double deckers have become sledgehammers to crack a nut, and single deckers are often even too big. I think everything is coming to the 'perfect storm' situation for the industry, and it is going to wipe out many more well known names

[Inspector Morose]

I like the guess in game. Okay, what's this then? (No googling)

 

[Felly Magic]

Blimey that has echos of Harrington, Yeates etc, with a Duple nose, a right old mongrel

[Noel Tidybeard]

is it a vauxhall?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Felly Magic]

It's a rare Leyland Gnu with Horsey Horseless Renault 20 ISIS body, and an Austin Maxi diesel engine, and once carried the reg D701`SWL. Did I leave out any AS legends there?

[Inspector Morose]

Okay, while you're pondering let me inflict this puzzle. Again, what is it?

(Clue - all three puzzles are linked)

 

[jon.k]

I thought the first one was easy and went to my Duple book for reference... but the side is all wrong. Ditto the Plaxton thing. Eagerly awaiting the answer.

[Felly Magic]

The D Coaches thing, it has an MCW badge on the front, hmmmmmm, it's a lightweight by the looks, I suspect Bedford VAM but could be wrong

[Inspector Morose]

They're both Bedfords, a VAL and a VAM. But the bodies? (You're almost there Felly)

[Felly Magic]

They are a bit before my time tbh, im mor of a Duple Rustbucket & Plaxton Woodworm 1970s era

[Inspector Morose]

Before RML gets it, they're all MCW coach bodies, hence the link with BMHs original post on the subject. Upper one was a Topaz as fitted to the VAL, the lower was another Metropolitan fitted to a VAM70 chassis. They were both re-fronted as windscreens for MCW coach bodies were impossible to source, even when they were fairly new. It was far easier to refront the coach when a screen went than try and find the impossible.

 

Rebuild the front using easier to source parts and you get a relatively modern coach for little money: it was this kind of lateral thinking that saw many an operator through and on to better things. Sadly gone are the days of these, sometimes weird and wonderful creations, only the imagination and supply of cheap bits seemed to stop many a bodybuilder from adapting a vehicle into something more suitable for their needs, rebuilding for further service when parts were scarce or modernising the look so the punter didn't realise you were running outdated machinery. Rebodying was another option taken by many but it's when the bodybuilder has been given carte Blanche to do as he sees fit that gets my interest. Operators large and small were up to it in the past and the creations could end up looking quite handsome or really hideous!

[Inspector Morose]

Sometimes new front ends on coaches can end up looking a little less than attractive.

 

[Inspector Morose]

Here's a nice tale of a later rebuild that actually made it into preservation.

 

Starting out as CHE297C, this leopard was rebuilt by the Yorkshire Traction workshops from 1977-1979. All new mechanicals were fitted including adding power steering, current spec(at the time) braking systems and a fresh 0.680 engine. The body was then rebuilt as new with new framing and panels. The resultant bus was in effect a new one so gained a new registration, hence the V plate on what was a 1965 bus. It also received a new chassis number - YTC3 - the previous two numbers being carried by rebuilt leopard coaches rebodied by Plaxton of Scarborough.

One of the features of the rebuild was the fitting of rear air suspension, instead of the regular leaf springs. This, however didn't end well as it shed its rear axle in Doncaster, demolishing several bollards in the process and so was dragged back and re-converted back to leaf springs once again. During his time it's front panels were modernised using mouldings and bumper from the ECW Olympian body making it into, in my opinion anyway, a rather handsome beast. It lasted in this form until the late 80s when it was withdrawn (at around the same time as its non-rebuilt cousins) and sold to a scout troup and then onto preservation.

It has now gained its original registration again (probably to help get its free RFL) and roumors have it that it is or has been rebuilt to look like it did originally. I for one hope it hasn't as the re-re-built will have erased what was quite a facinating snippet of history when operators took time and effort to extend the lives of their vehicles in the best way they could.

[rml2345]

That is quite a handsome beast and would be unique preserved in it's rebuilt form. Hope they've kept it that way.

[320touring]

Fuck, even I could see the Leopard in that.

 

I need to stop hingin aboot with you guys

[Pillock]

This is one of my favourite threads.... I know close to nothing about buses, I've got a bit of an idea about old Nottingham stuff but only because I get giddy when I recognise a local machine in preservation.

 

The information you lot have tucked away is immense. There's a life story in every post just about and it's a fascinating read about warring operators, experiments, bodged repairs, lost axles (!) and stuff.

[320touring]

This is one of my favourite threads.... I know close to nothing about buses, I've got a bit of an idea about old Nottingham stuff but only because I get giddy when I recognise a local machine in preservation.

 

The information you lot have tucked away is immense. There's a life story in every post just about and it's a fascinating read about warring operators, experiments, bodged repairs, lost axles (!) and stuff.

You really must come to a Scotoshite when FPB7 is attending:)

 

As you say much knowledge abounds from this lot

[Pillock]

Does he bring PowerPoint? Is there a test at the end?

[320touring]

Does he bring PowerPoint? Is there a test at the end?

Only if you want..

[rml2345]

Both could be arranged with minimum effort if you're keen. Dave2K may even explain Voith gearboxes if we've time.

[MorrisItalSLX]

I also know the square root of fuck all about buses, but I too love this thread!

 

These are the two that took me to school every day:

 

 

A Custom Coaches bodied Leyland Leopard, complete with a green vinyl and plastic wood interior!

 

 

Another Custom Coaches body, but this time on a Nissan Diesel chassis with a blue vinyl and plastic wood interior.

 

 

We also got this little Hino thing on occasion, it was shit. Noisey and smokey with red cloth seats that made you itchy and dusty. Plus it was the size of a postage stamp with no where near enough seats for the number of kids being transported.

 

I think only the Leyland survives now, in the hands of a local enthusiast.

 

Bus company was/is Kennedy's Bus and Coach for those who are interested.

[Pillock]

Both could be arranged with minimum effort if you're keen. Dave2K may even explain Voith gearboxes if we've time.

Do we have time? I'm 40 next year.

[busmansholiday]

Not only do I know who owns that rebuilt ex Tracky Leopard, but we hired it for a trip around YTC depots and some other operators when it was new. It certainly had some drivers looking twice as Nationals were the "new" bus then.

 

The Strathclyde rebodies were also Tracky inspired as they owned them at the time, as well as Lincolnshire. East Lancs were their 'best buddies' at that time. They had a batch of ex airport Scanias rebodied as well as coming up with the American Spartan single deck with their body. This would have been great had the exchange rate not gone tits, they even got the bloke behind the Ward chassis to sort the steering out so it went around corners.

[Felly Magic]

They also had an ex Arriva Yorkshire West Scania Vanhool Alizee  rebodied by East Lancs after it's body was destroyed by fire, I think it was M56AWW. They also had Keith Ward's last creation, the KIRN Mogul, which had been touted as a low cost bus, that had sat in chassis form at ELCB for quite some time when Frank Carter thought that would make a nice addition to the Tracky fleet. Tracky always were a very interesting company, with plenty of 'home brew' stuff, such as their wrecker fleet, which included several deckers chopped down over the years, including the new to Longstaff of Mirfield LWB AN68/Northern Counties, and even a Mk2 National tow bus. Their workshop was a source of GRP panels for Nationals including bumpers, emergency door and front dome that are now fitted to WR XUA73X. 

[busmansholiday]

They also spent / wasted a fortune rebuilding shagged Olympians. The one that twatted the bridge at Swinton was rebuilt by buying a newer ex West Yorkshire one and fitting the top deck to it when putting the WY one in service would probably have been cheaper.

 

They are sadly missed.

[Felly Magic]

They did buy a roof from one of the Barnsley yards for that, turns out it was from either a Titan or Roe body, and didn't fit, so they ended up buying another bus as a donor. Not sure whether the rumours were true about Frank Carter, but it was said that he liked to go on holiday to Skeg-Vegas, and would occasionally do the odd duty for the Road Car depot there. West Riding also were unusual for a while, and built a Lynx body at Belle Isle from an Airfix kit sent down from Workington, that bus was dead easy to spot as it had high mounted rear indicators, they also had the only dual door mk1 Lynx, which was hastily modified to single door before entering service. 

[jon.k]

Can someone explain why a few years ago the operators local to me did a kind of reverse of this by fitting crappy light clusters and blanking off the big rear lights on their paramounts? I remembered it because I also saw a few panoramas with the paramount lights retrofitted.

 

Loving the waste-not-want-not element of this thread.

[Felly Magic]

The last of the line Supremes had Paramount style rears, and I've seen quite a few Paramounts with tiny LED rear light units fitted, no doubt it boils down to cost & ease of replacement

[busmansholiday]

Just look at the rear of one of the older nasy express Caetano bodied things. A proxy small led sidelight, God knows how they got away with it.

As for Frank, have heard that before, also his initials, FAC, were on his Jag. Generally referred to by some of his employees as fat, arrogant, ....

[quicksilver]

Can someone explain why a few years ago the operators local to me did a kind of reverse of this by fitting crappy light clusters and blanking off the big rear lights on their paramounts? I remembered it because I also saw a few panoramas with the paramount lights retrofitted.

 

Loving the waste-not-want-not element of this thread.

Mostly likely because Paramount lights are unobtainum and they got broken. Such improvisation is the lifeblood of the smaller operator when it makes the difference between a vehicle being on the road earning money or sat in the yard VOR. See also all those operators who keep dead stock at the back of the yard as spares donors.