invacar LightBulbFun's Invacar & general ramble thread, index on page 1, survivors lists on Pages 24/134 & AdgeCutler's Invacar Mk12 Restoration from Page 186 onwards, still harping on...

[busmansholiday]

Reminds me of my first lesson back in 1973 in a Hillman Hunter ( or was it an Avenger), drove both anyway.

"Can you tell me the speed limit on this bit of road?", the instructor asked me.

"30".

"So why are we doing 40?".

Mind you, I had driven my dad's Mk III Corrina on private property before being 17, not to mention a Park Royal bodied Leyland PD2 around an old airfield at 15!!!!

[Mrs6C]

On the checking mirrors bit, not sure if you get taught these days to take a quick look round over your shoulder as well before you move onto the main carriageway from the sliproad or change lanes, so that you can chcek for cars immediately to your side and in your mirror blind spot? I think motorcyclists might refer to it as 'the Lifesaver'... certainly I would recommend it as a practice when you get your licence, if not before...

[LightBulbFun]

39 minutes ago, Mrs6C said:

On the checking mirrors bit, not sure if you get taught these days to take a quick look round over your shoulder as well before you move onto the main carriageway from the sliproad or change lanes, so that you can chcek for cars immediately to your side and in your mirror blind spot? I think motorcyclists might refer to it as 'the Lifesaver'... certainly I would recommend it as a practice when you get your licence, if not before...

cant actually recall if he has or has not brought it up, but ill keep it in mind for next time at any rate  

good bit of advice!

[ETCHY]

On ‎11‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 7:31 PM, overrun said:

Fair enough if you don't wanna share, mate.

Also, a lot (most) on here know much more about vehicles/DVLA/licencing etc than you seem to realise. Invacar stuff aside, it may be new to you, but usually isn't to the rest of us.

 

I don't know much about Invacars or the history behind Invalid carriages etc,  so I for one rather enjoy visiting this thread & reading LBF's updates 

It's funny how it's a vehicle that in my youth I might have sneered at (in my ignorance) but now I think is charming. I also admire the thinking behind the vehicles & the drive to help invalids remain mobile.

 

[Eyersey1234]

2 hours ago, ETCHY said:

 

I don't know much about Invacars or the history behind Invalid carriages etc,  so I for one rather enjoy visiting this thread & reading LBF's updates 

 

I didn't know much about Invacars or the history of invalid carriages either. Thank you LBF your thread is very interesting. 

[LightBulbFun]

4 hours ago, ETCHY said:

 

I don't know much about Invacars or the history behind Invalid carriages etc,  so I for one rather enjoy visiting this thread & reading LBF's updates 

It's funny how it's a vehicle that in my youth I might have sneered at (in my ignorance) but now I think is charming. I also admire the thinking behind the vehicles & the drive to help invalids remain mobile.

 

 

1 hour ago, Eyersey1234 said:

I didn't know much about Invacars or the history of invalid carriages either. Thank you LBF your thread is very interesting. 

happy to hear that people are continuing to find the thread enjoyable and it makes me very happy that iv been able to help educate people on the subject  

 

 

4 hours ago, ETCHY said:

I also admire the thinking behind the vehicles & the drive to help invalids remain mobile.

you know its interesting to note 

that one of my worries over time etc has been how will driving affect my back pain

as in just the physical aspects of operating pedals etc

one of the major worries is have is that over a period of time unless I can move my legs/stretch slightly and reposition them, things can get quite painful for me, which in a car with foot pedals you cant do, you cant move the foot pedals with your feet!

and if driving over a long time is gets to painful for me then thats not very good!

im still assessing just how bad that is for me, driving is currently quite painful for me, but that may also be down to the fact i still get quite tense when driving, which in itself causes me a lot of pain just on its own regardless of what my legs can and cant do, plus there's the aspect of perhaps the car im learning to drive in is just uncomfortable for my body, so the jury is still out on all that

its also one of the reasons im eager to get out on the road on some other cars, is to figure out are all regular cars this painful for me to drive or is it just this Pug 308 im learning to drive in!

 

but thankfully! I dont have that problem in REV because she has no foot pedals, shes an Invacar! my feet/legs are free to find their natural rest/most comfortable position  

id still own REV even if I was not disabled, because of the hobby/enthusiasm  (just like how I want a Routemaster even tho I dont work for London Transport!) 

but its fun to note how she is (or will be once im on the road with her!) being used for what she was built for to help a disabled person mobilise once more, in this case in less pain then what otherwise might be experienced a normal car  

it will be interesting to see how things are once im on the open road with her, but initial results from running around the FoD in her is good  (and most road surfaces will probably be smoother then the FoD!)

[Zelandeth]

18 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

cant actually recall if he has or has not brought it up, but ill keep it in mind for next time at any rate  

good bit of advice!

Good habit to get into that I can't see them penalising you for.

Especially bearing in mind how awful the mirrors on the Invacar are... you'll spend a lot of time looking backwards.

It's a common comment when learning to drive a bus that you do so many mirror checks so often in them that you spend more time looking backwards than forwards...and it really feels that way!

[LightBulbFun]

6 minutes ago, Zelandeth said:

Good habit to get into that I can't see them penalising you for.

Especially bearing in mind how awful the mirrors on the Invacar are... you'll spend a lot of time looking backwards.

It's a common comment when learning to drive a bus that you do so many mirror checks so often in them that you spend more time looking backwards than forwards...and it really feels that way!

haha yeah  (although I do have the "luxury" of 2! wing mirrors on REV  )

thats one of things im still getting used to when pulling out of junctions etc

is making sure im looking left and right and not looking forward, as I pull out etc

your brain is screaming at you to pay attention to what's ahead of you as you move towards it not whats to the left and right of you! (especially as I don't want to accidentally end up wondering left or right, or what if an obstruction pops up suddenly ahread)

ah fun days!

[LightBulbFun]

just updated the survivors list 

doing a quick check if any have become taxed/MOTed or not etc

updated OPH868R obviously since she is now taxed  and updated TWC725K since she is now SORN

and also updated WOO848S, as I noticed a few days ago that she had a keeper change on the 1st of the 7th 2019, and is now taxed  (she had previously been untaxed since 2013 or so)

sadly I dont know who she changed hands to.

(one of these days I should look into one of those apps or what have you that notify you if a vehicles Tax/MOT status changes)

[Eyersey1234]

Apologies if this has already been answered but how many Model 70s survive LBF? 

[Eyersey1234]

Just had a look on How Many Left, according to them at the end of 1994 there were 673 licenced, this fell to 50 at the end of 2003, 14 by the end of 2006 and has risen to 47 licenced plus 11 on SORN by the middle of 2019. How does this compare to your records LightBulbFun? 

[LightBulbFun]

1 hour ago, Eyersey1234 said:

Apologies if this has already been answered but how many Model 70s survive LBF? 

I personally have about 43 Model 70's documented in my survivors list (page 26 ) 

Stuart says he has about 80, although his list is somewhat out of date, since technically its the ICRs survivors list, and you know how well* the ICR have been doing...

we think between us that there are about 100 surviving Model 70's in total with about 20-15 (if you count the recent 4) yet to be discovered/made known

I update my list with a new vehicle once I have a good picture of it and some details of it

or if I dont have any details, ill take a recently taken photo as proof of survival and update my list with that

I also will only update the list once I have figured out the cars registration number/ID if not shown in said picture (hence why Q202LDV is not on the list for example even tho I know very much that one survives)

sadly out of that 80 or so, its thought only about 5-10 are actually on the road/used with any sort of regularity, most are just parked up in garages/collections and are just there as a curio...

 

1 hour ago, Eyersey1234 said:

Just had a look on How Many Left, according to them at the end of 1994 there were 673 licenced, this fell to 50 at the end of 2003, 14 by the end of 2006 and has risen to 47 licenced plus 11 on SORN by the middle of 2019. How does this compare to your records LightBulbFun? 

im curious what caused the 20 car jump between Q2 2014 and Q3 2014!

it really is a shame they dont include registration numbers!

I am surprised the number is as high as it is, as out of the 43 AC and Invacar Model 70's I have documented only 11 are licenced

keep in mind "INVACAR" will also include all the older Invacars Pre Model 70 too granted I cant imagine there are many of those still running around sadly

if you want to see a sad one, look up tippen delta, just 4 licenced IIRC...

AC (ELECTRIC) is how you find all the AC Model 70's but keep in mind you will also be getting Cobras and 3000MEs etc!

 

its also fun to note this websites theres only 14 left https://www.carlogbook.co.uk/invacar/

so yeah id take these websites with a pinch of salt!

[LightBulbFun]

 theres also the interesting line of

"survives"

and 

"exists"

for example a Lot of the field find cars are not on my list

as I know they exist, but I don't know if they will survive etc, I don't know what their future holds given how badly damaged some are

its also why KPL139P is not on that list for example

[SiC]

Had this yet?

https://carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1146777

The advert has got a VIN plate in the pictures too, for you to salivate over. 

[LightBulbFun]

25 minutes ago, SiC said:

Had this yet?

https://carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1146777

The advert has got a VIN plate in the pictures too, for you to salivate over. 

Yep its been for sale for a few months now im not so secretly hoping that someone here buys it  

the seller originally had it down as 175cc and 1962

but I got in contact with the seller, to give him more info on it, and also see if he knew any details of where he got it from etc, and also asked for a chassis plate shot/told him where it is on a Mk12

and subsequently it looks like he updated his listing with the new info I provided him with  

I appreciate the heads up tho just incase I had missed it! (much like with Q231PVL/MPH759P!)

On 8/21/2019 at 12:50 AM, LightBulbFun said:

@Datsuncog be like @egg  https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C1146777

(for a Mk12 its in fucking good shape!  ONO454D is its reg if its hard to make out)

 

 

I do hope someone here buys it, id like to see it go to a good home 

price wise for £1250 id say its OK it could be be much worse, its in very good shape for a Mk12, (i know of Mk12s in much worse shape then this for about the same price)

but its a different beast from the Model 70 much more crude and not as usable in day to day life, so keep that in mind, i got posted the link to it on my thread on the retro rides forum, currently asking if the person who sent the link is the person selling it, as id like a vin plate picture  

 

On 8/21/2019 at 10:58 AM, LightBulbFun said:

yeah I did not notice the reg plate at first, I was happily surprised when I noticed it

I sort of posted the link in a blind flail then edited the post to be better formatted later on in the night

as I was actually talking to Stuart about invacar stuff when I came across it for sale  

Stuart Thinks it may be this one http://rumcars.org/forum/index.php?topic=3800.0

sadly that forum shat all its pictures

however heres a pictures stuart sent me, do you think its the same car? I think its the same car, I mean how many 2 Tone Mk12's are there in the ROI LOL, and the "patina" looks the same between this photo and the one for sale

the most interesting bit for me is "There are several aspects of its possible history which might well be interesting. As it surfaced in the Republic, there is every chance it is one of five second-hand cars sent out via a link up between Invacar Ltd & the Southend-on-Sea Rotary Club in the late 1960s to assist disabled persons in the Republic, which of course did not have the UK Invalid Vehicle Service"

which may go some way to explaining this  https://autoshite.com/topic/32723-invacar-model-70-acquired-and-general-ramble-thread-index-on-page-1-phase-2-finding-a-suitable-driving-schoolinstructor-getting-lessons-and-a-licence/page/32/?tab=comments#comment-1764303

(how did car registrations work in the ROI back then? being its own country im guessing you would have to re-register a car imported there just like you have to re-registre a car from the US here in the UK if you import one, however the above Mk12 is on british plates, unless they stuck the ROI plates over the british ones!)

 

 

On 10/12/2019 at 10:33 AM, LightBulbFun said:

speaking of Mk12's

the seller of ONO545D got back to me  that last line is giving me some very silly/stupid/autoshite thoughts! I really do hope someone here gets it, I Just want to make sure it goes to a good home, and not someone who is going to something silly with it, or just try and make a load of profit off off it!

(as well as explaining to him what I know about ONO454D, and asking if he the old man was still around/if he could put me in contact with him, I explained that I need to get my own invacar on the road and get my driving lessons/test done before I can buy anything, but I have asked if he will be willing to extend the small discount to my close friends  )

 

 

On 10/13/2019 at 6:36 PM, LightBulbFun said:

Yay I got a chassis plate picture of the Mk12 thats for sale on C&C

and the seller said he is willing to extend his discount to yall lot  (well as I put it in my email "my close friends" )

while the chassis number lines up with what I expected it to be what I did not expect was the fact the chassis plate says its a Mk12B 

according to stuarts small book the Mk12B was only introduced in April 1966, however this Mk12B is from January 1966! 

(its chassis number is about roughly 100 behind PEV627D, which i was expecting as ONO454D is alphabetically just before Pxx-D with PEV627D being a February 1966 car and the fact it looks like ONO-D was first issued in Jan 1966))

the thing is looking at PEV627D's chassis plate im pretty sure it says Mk12A but it might be just the dirt that makes it look like so 

(ONO454Ds chassis plate defo says Mk12B theres no debate about that)

and heres some pictures of the inside that I also asked for  

 

[st185cs]

9 hours ago, LightBulbFun said:

.........its thought only about 5-10 are actually on the road/used with any sort of regularity, most are just parked up in garages/collections and are just there as a curio...

Glad to be there amongst the few which will undoubtedly increase over time. 

MHJ 22P

[LightBulbFun]

30 minutes ago, st185cs said:

Glad to be there amongst the few which will undoubtedly increase over time. 

MHJ 22P

Happy to hear that

just reminded me I should check out of the taxed ones which are insured as thats a good indication of which are being used on the road and which are just taxed because now its £0 rate

doing a quick check as I thought

only a few are showing as insured TPA621M JPA268N MHJ22P MPD553P MPH759P OPH868R and TTW906R are the ones showing as insured

so only just 7 are on the road if you go by insurance, although I know OPH is currently not on the road and same for TPA, but hopefully she will return to the road soon  

 

some of the names they are insured as is just down right worrying! MPD553P (currently VAV1L) is insured as a "KC AC" and WOO848S is insured as "OTHER BRITISH MOTHER" LOL

I shit you not!

 

TPA621M is the only one that's insured properly without any name wackiness 

as "AC (ELECTRIC) Model 70"  

 

I see quite a few end up as "AC 70" or something such because explained here

On 11/6/2019 at 10:35 PM, LightBulbFun said:

 

(next time when you renew the insurance make sure they include Model 70 not just 70   its a common thing that catches many people out because they will see a Model: (text box) and think "Model: 70" so they just type 70 in the box not realising that "Model" is also part of the Model 70's Model name!)

 

a lot of people don't realise that "Model" is part of the vehicles Model name!

and this is something you have to make clear for both the person trying to insure it, and the person on the other end of the phone doing the actual insuring!

so for example if theres a box that asks you for the vehicles model name you should type

"Model: Model 70"

but a lot of people will just type "Model: 70"

[Noel Tidybeard]

On 11/5/2019 at 9:42 PM, LightBulbFun said:

what is this?

[LightBulbFun]

2 minutes ago, Noel Tidybeard said:

what is this?

the first ever image downloaded from the human mind

it just so happened @HarmonicCheeseburger was the test subject

 

on a more serious note, a 3D rendering someone on the internet did, not a real toy! (sadly?) looks convincing tho! 

On 4/1/2019 at 12:31 PM, LightBulbFun said:

Looks like some weird hybrid between a Model 70 and a Tippen Delta   (also one for Harmonic cheeseburger)

 

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/BvtWy8yFATK/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=drfin25uo7p3&fbclid=IwAR1VHC__DFdn4ugPC_j0ldfuDlgF0spfZ42gQeDB-xWy25ewL6y1BPF_zdg

[Mrs6C]

You may have seen this already, but if not...

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-invalid-carriage-1976-online

[LightBulbFun]

14 minutes ago, Mrs6C said:

You may have seen this already, but if not...

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-invalid-carriage-1976-online

indeed I have  

but I appreciate the heads up  

somewhere there's a similar video, also featuring a Model 67 Mk14

but the person drives past either a main AC dealership or the AC headquarters or something like that, will have to see if I can find it again, its quite a cool shot  

I know its in this thread somewhere!

 

[LightBulbFun]

here we go  

I thought it was also a video but appears to be just a still image, also its a Mk15 not a Mk14!, could of also sworn it was also an SPD-F car!

 

image found here  http://hmvf.co.uk/topic/8827-invalid-carriage/

[LightBulbFun]

https://www.forces.net/news?videoId=6099152349001

I see another video of simon and his collection has appeared

I both enjoy it very much, for the invalid vehicle content

but it also frustrates me no end, just on the amount of wrong information provided and said

especially as I know stuart would not have made these mistakes!, and especially given how much effort stuart and I have put into trying to debunk and clear these myths up etc

only to see said myths and wrong information propelled by none other then the ICR themselves!

 

[egg]

Lot's of hot (broken) Mk12 action in that vid....

[LightBulbFun]

2 minutes ago, egg said:

Lot's of hot (broken) Mk12 action in that vid....

ah the soothing feeling of "see your not alone"  

but hopefully yours will actually see the road in time!

(sadly I dont think Simon has much intention of taking any of his onto the road, given what he said when I asked if he has ever taken his working tippen delta onto the road since that one is in road legal/worthy condition)

BTW I see you made your Mk12 video public recently that was a fun double take moment in my sub box! LOL

(got excited that there might of been new updates on the Mk12 then realised it was just the video from beforehand being made public)

 

[ETCHY]

18 hours ago, Mrs6C said:

You may have seen this already, but if not...

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-invalid-carriage-1976-online

That film is fascinating not just from the seeing Invacars angle but in the context of social history & the disabled.

Thank you for posting it.

[LightBulbFun]

55 minutes ago, ETCHY said:

That film is fascinating not just from the seeing Invacars angle but in the context of social history & the disabled.

Thank you for posting it.

indeed very much so  

 

there's a whole bunch of them floating around on that website and a couple others

I should round em up into 1 post then add a link to that post into the thread index at some point

there's a good number of them as Invacars where "the" subject/thing to hate on/for the media to latch onto in the 1970's peaking around 1974/1975 before fading out of the spotlight after then

its interesting to note the shift in attitude/tone from "Death to the trikes!" to "don't take our trikes away!"

from before and after they announced they would be taking them away, and the introduction of the mobility allowance etc

[LightBulbFun]

heres a small collection I was able to dig up  

 

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-probe-alf-morris-announces-the-recalling-of-the-invacar-1976-online

 

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-invalid-carriage-1976-online

 

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-year-of-the-disabled-1981-online

 

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-invalid-carriage-protest-1977-online

 

I know there is at least 1 more somewhere, featuring a YVX-L Model 70 but I cant find it for the life of me right now!

[LightBulbFun]

well I figured out who ended up with HCK972N!

could of gone to better homes like someone on here! but could of gone to worse 

swings and roundabouts as they say!

Simon said he got it to complement BKV327D his Petrol Tippen Delta

I gave simon a quick brain dump on all that I know about HCK972N and  electric Tippen Deltas in general

which he was happy to receive! 

(I did ask about the Model 70 that was behind it in the ebay listing, Simon said it had no details and sadly I dont think he got a chassis plate/number shot!, he said the seller was selling the Tippen for financial reasons)

[Mrs6C]

^^^ at least it has gone to good home where it will be conserved. Perhaps Simon could be persuaded to ask the vendor of the TD if he or she would like to provide some information on that 'Model 70 in the background' for your research? Alternatively, why not contact the vendor yourself and ask? Explain that a friend of yours has bought the TD, you have a Model 70 yourself and you are trying to compile a list of all surviving Model 70s. He or she can only say 'No' in which case you are no worse off than not asking at all!