Classic Car Weekly

[Justin Case]

PM me your address and I will try and convince you otherwise

 I assume that you wil be sending Junkman a copy of the Automobile   It is the only magazine that I buy nowadays. The others tend to get a bit repetitive, and the regular Aston Martin DB7 v Maserati 3200 GT buying guides are a bit silly as although either of them can be bought for the price of a new Fiesta (as we are constantly reminded) but not that a new engine  for either would also probably cost more than a new Fiesta I suppose that to get new readers and advertisers the others have to include more  recent classics* but most of them are pretty uninspiring.

 

Not plugging the Automobile Barrett, but there seem to be enough pre 1960 cars and enough contributors  (rather than staff?) to provide endless variety. It's a bit like the Motor Sport of Bill Boddy days , but with the 'Sport' more VSCC trials than F1   I've just got the current editionwhich covers evrrything from a Hispano-Suiza to a Hupmobile which is the bastard child of a Cord 810. Makes anice change from yet another E type. The shorter features are worth a read too, nowhere else would something like a 19030 Singer Junior that's been in a barn for 50 years  be the main news, and what looks like aloft ladder on somebody's lawn will turn out to be the mortal remains of something like a 1904 Alldays and Onions. Definitely woth a look even if really old cars aren't your thing.

[chaseracer]

Was introduced to Peter Simpson at SF17.  What a lovely chap.

[SiC]

Guess how many of my cars I submit for inclusion. Guess WHEN they're submitted.

 

I'm somewhat amused that the RX8 appears now - when it was submitted in April with the intention of talking about how cheap they are, potential as a future classic, etc. - and after it not appearing and no feedback, I gave the car away with no further work because running a few helpful articles was about the main reason to stick with it.

 

You'll probably get to read about the Sera two months after the new owner has restored it.

 

Yes, the Twingo has had articles submitted

Not only that, it made front page! You missed a treat when you sold it. "As featured on the front of CCW!"

 

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Best classic car read? Thoroughbred and Classic Cars from the seventies and early eighties. Tony Dron, Lionel Burrell etc, very well written from an era when E Types were £1500 and the classic car boom hadn't happened.

I know Phil Bell and I do prefer Classic Cars to C&SC. I sort of vaguely know Maaartin Buckleh a bit and he's their best writer, telling it how it is. Mind you, I do worry; he mentioned in print he's looking at Ferrari Mondials now (with fresh eyes) and as you all know, they're a sorry sack of shit, a pig ugly engine donor dreamt about by the sorts who have a small house and a small pitch out front with a Boxster parked on it. I cancelled my sub a while back when Mick 'name dropper' Walsh filled his column about how he'd been invited to Jay K's (Jamiroquai) summer fucking BBQ.

 

Oh just fuck off mate. Talk about climbing the greasy pole, FFS.

 

At the end of the day, what can you say about classic cars that hasn't been said before?

 

I know, stop being cowardly and be fucking different!

 

Yes, say that a 1963 Stingray is 10 times better/cooler/more interesting than a bastard E Type. Say out loud that really, the TR6 is a hopeless piece of shit that couldn't stay with a well driven Citroen 1220 Club, that the MGC really was absolute fucking rubbish and that the original road testers didn't get it wrong, that the Mark 2 Jag was a badly made understeering pig with shit brakes. Piss off a few advertisers..............oh hang on.........

[artdjones]

Mick Walsh must have the smuggest smile in Britain.I find it almost impossible to look at without feeling a torrent of rage coursing through me.

[Shep Shepherd]

Did Phil Bell ever finish restoring his Capri GXL?

[plasticvandan]

The early-mid 80s practical classics were a good read,almost like an autoshite mag in some ways,until jalopy came along of course!

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

Mick Walsh must have the smuggest smile in Britain.I find it almost impossible to look at without feeling a torrent of rage coursing through me.

 

 

His C&SC picture reminds me of Oddjob: 

[Bear]

'80s and early '90s PC dealt with the same cars they deal with now, though. That's why Modern Classics was needed - and why the marque-specific/Japanese retro titles are great for the market, too. Otherwise classic would still mean "Farinas".

 

Classic car publications have to cater for a wide audience. The auction reports are vital for a weekly title, it's a financial barometer, and remember that for every "OKYAHIVESTMENT" person, there are 10 enthusiasts with a a (relatively) small amount of money who are justifying the tens of thousands sunk into restoring their Capri /by/ watching the values rise. People love seeing their cars in print, so events are important. The news around the classics themselves can only progress by allowing time to include more classics - the MX5 /is/ older than MGBs were when PC was writing about them in the '80s. Cars age so slowly now that we forget how old a 15 year old vehicle seemed in say, 1992. The year I started driving, my 8 year old Chevette was welcomed into classic rallies. Imagine a classic car show with a 2009 Astra?!

 

The bits I contribute I try to make adhere to the "inform, educate, entertain" mantra so I get sad if I can't put something useful in - whether that's wrapping up a product review by actually testing it on one of my cars, or a buying tip, or whatever. I don't like just doing "I drove this here". But I also, for a long time, edited the classified pages for CCW, and it was joked that this was the most important section - because you still got older, not-internet connected people sending in paper slips with handwritten adverts for their classics (that's why we edit, btw - because the errors might be in transcription, rather than idiot sellers).

 

You could tell when I'd been editing them for too long (I took it pretty seriously, so put the Mercedes model types in, grouped them) when I started putting all the MGBs in order of colour, and surrounded a dealer's "Wanted" advert with adverts for the car they wanted...

 

With no experience of Kelsey, I can't speak for CCB, but CCW is really hard work to put together. I did several Mods & Consequences articles (and at least one had an excruciating error that was my fault) and the timescale to get owners' feedback and comments was tight indeed. Remember that to test cars for sale, contributors have to travel, editors have to sort images and lay stuff out... time is a finite resource.

 

What is sadly true is this encroachment of online publishing - which has to have hideously obtrusive advertising and minimal editorial control over quality of content, originality (how many wannabe Clarksons on car blogs?) - which erodes the readership. Slowly, but it does. This is why I value producing practical content - the beauty of old Practical Classics, whether I could follow it or not - when I was 15 and dreaming of my first car, I read those reader and mag project stories with welding and joddlers and lead loading and rescued-from-near-death and imagined I could do it too. It was spelled out. I could, if the article was relevant, take it and have it next to me while following the steps.

 

Now we need to inspire a new generation. My car-nutter son's vehicle is a 13 year old red Celica. It's like he's followed in my footsteps; I had an 11 year old red Manta hatch around his age. I'd like him to pick up a car enthusiast magazine and see his Celica is valued, relevant; that his enthusiasm has a place and isn't dismissed by a load of old farts. And maybe those old farts could find time to save him a horrible experience with maintenance going wrong by explaining how to fix a common issue, or improve some aspect of it.

 

Hell, even Max Power spoke to that audience in some practical terms occasionally.

[dollywobbler]

Oh the weeklies are horrendous to put together, whichever publisher is doing it. You learn a HUGE amount very quickly working on them though. I do miss that constant buzz at times. 

 

As for classifieds, I used to proof read those just as hard as the rest of the magazine when I was on CCW, kicking out anything too modern, even modern number plates. Upset an advertiser who was placing 'Wanted' ads because I put a T in the corner. Proper sob story Wanted ads making it sound like he wasn't a trader. I got in trouble for that, annoyingly.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

I can recall buying the first ever Practical Classics in April 1980 (May issue) as a 12.5 year old, mad on old shit. I read it avidly for years, went out every weekend to the local scrapyards where the owners realised banning me was fruitless. No H&S or HiViz.

 

As Richard says, an old car was an A60 that had left production only 9 years before; ditto the Minor. Early Minis were sort of interesting but there were still loads of rusty ones about, 1100's were worthless junk. A bonefide classic was a GT6 (shudder), Minor, Mark 2 Jags were coming out of the banger please gradually (but were still 100 quid jobs in many cases).

 

The problem is that cars then were all different. Close your eyes in 1980 and you could distinguish just from the engine note a Mini from a Minor, an Escort from a Beetle, a Marina from an Avenger.

 

For the last 10-15 years there's just the uniform harsh drone of a 2 litre 4 cylinder diesel with the odd 6 cylinder BMW. There's also far, far less inclination to repair stuff yourself. Think (if you can) how busy a scrapyard was 25 years ago. Now they're empty. Cars sit in lines intact until they're crushed. 

 

I'd love one of these, but I doubt many 20 year olds would. If they inherited one, they'd swap it for an iPhone 9S;

 

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0snhODNVfs

[Bear]

Oh the weeklies are horrendous to put together, whichever publisher is doing it. You learn a HUGE amount very quickly working on them though. I do miss that constant buzz at times. 

 

As for classifieds, I used to proof read those just as hard as the rest of the magazine when I was on CCW, kicking out anything too modern, even modern number plates. Upset an advertiser who was placing 'Wanted' ads because I put a T in the corner. Proper sob story Wanted ads making it sound like he wasn't a trader. I got in trouble for that, annoyingly.

 

 

Yeah, Keith's attitude fell on your side of how it should be done. I used to trim out the all-caps trader from Hinckley, too, he got pissed off but 7 adverts in a week including a bloody Focus!

[dollywobbler]

Yeah, Keith's attitude fell on your side of how it should be done. I used to trim out the all-caps trader from Hinckley, too, he got pissed off but 7 adverts in a week including a bloody Focus!

 

I was taught by the best!

[SiC]

For the last 10-15 years there's just the uniform harsh drone of a 2 litre 4 cylinder diesel with the odd 6 cylinder BMW. There's also far, far less inclination to repair stuff yourself.

 

Which is why I think classic cars as a hobby won't disappear. Early to mid 2000 stuff is a going to be revered in the not too distant future. Still easy to fix, powerful, generally reliable and not too many electronics in the way. Also performance cars then could still be a handful. In the 2010s and later, nearly everything went diesel and the actual performance stuff is becoming too good. Ringing it out modern, modern performance stuff pretty much involves breaking the law.

 

I've said this before, and I'll say it again. We are in a golden era of internal combustion cars. You can buy a V8 Jag for less than a grand and fuel can be had for it everywhere. Want a cheap but shonky big engined e39? Yup loads about. Want cheap but great n/a fun with a big engine? Puma/Clio 172/rx8/etc had be had for a pittance. Hell you can buy proper exotica like the XKR/Maserati 3500/etc for under the price of a 3 year old family car.

 

We will be pining back to now in the not so distant future about this. Problem is, most will only see it in hindsight.

 

Incidentally I keep meaning to start buying ECU sets for cars. I reckon they're a great pension plan for the future.

 

I'd love one of these, but I doubt many 20 year olds would. If they inherited one, they'd swap it for an iPhone 9S;

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0snhODNVfs

Most 20yr old wouldn't likely be interested in one no. That's because he interested more in the other sex and socialising, etc - like 20yr olds for centuries. When that 20yr old becomes 30yr old? No still not. More disposable income and the ability to insure new modern powerful cars means he/she likely to spunk too much on that.

 

What about when that 20yr old becomes 40yrs? Probably still not as the kids are absorbing all the money. Maybe like the idea of one, but no hope.

 

20yr old becomes 50yrs? Starting to get a real interest. Once the kids have got through uni!

 

20yr old becomes 60yrs? Yes! Just settling down to retirement and as the kids have (mostly) left the home or paying rent at least, money is more available along with time.

 

I see the same thing with my other hobby, RC flying. It's been long thought it'd die out, as the average flier is quite old. Well 2 things are happening. First people living longer, so more older fliers about. Secondly, it's a hobby that people do when they get to retirement and have plenty of spare time. So most fliers tend to be older.

 

Incidentally with quadcopters (aka drones), it has brought a whole new young crowd into RC flying.

 

I see the same thing with cars and classic cars. Young people not interested in cars? Rubbish. Just look around you, wether it's on this forum (plenty of 18-35yr olds here and retro-rides), down your local Halfords who invariably is changing other people's car bulbs (which is quite a challenge on cars now!) or even cars that are "pineapples" or rat looked. You might not like the look of said things, but your forefathers probably didn't like what you did to your cars when you were younger.

 

I'm 31 and from the max-power generation. The max-power thing died out but there are still plenty of people around my age who have a love of cars. Either though they're busy getting up on a career ladder, buying their first house, getting married and/or having kids. Once some of that stuff is out of the way, you become nearly 40...

 

Plenty of people to pick up the classic cars in the future. Cars that are classics now with just become rarer due to natural decline through neglect, accidents and inactivity. Have a look at How Many Left on cars from the 70s - there isn't loads left at all. For example, the Dolomite has only around 300 left on the roads. So that's just 300 people able to have one to drive around.

 

Of course those classics are being suplimented by "modern" classics, like the 205 GTi, etc.

 

TL;DR if you're old and think classics are going to die out and fall out of favour, they're not.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

I used to buy car magazines regularly, mostly 'Classic and thoroughbred cars', but also 'Classic and sportscar' in my late teens and twenties - and before that 'Car' magazine which my late father used to buy for me. He reasoned that if I was going to read car magazines, I may as well read a well written one.

 

There was no defining moment that made me stop: I just drifted away. They became too similar, writing about the same cars over and over, recycling the same platitudes over and over. I stopped buying them  in about 2000. I did buy an issue of Classic and sportscar back in 2015 on impulse in my corner shop, because it was the 'Jaguar XJ' special issue. It irked me (though I was not surprised) that the XJ40 was only a footnote caption, but I was a little disappointed that four of the five 'facts' they wrote about it were actually incorrect. I felt I could have expected more, given the considerable number of books and articles which have been written about the XJ40 over the years. The ignorance felt almost wilful. But hey, they're not a classic. Which brings me to the point. The magazine is lost in time - reading it is like the last fifteen or twenty years have not happened. Having not read C&SC for nigh on 17 years, I was struck by just how similar it is to the magazine they were producing two decades ago. The same cars, the same 'Sunday Times colour supplement' lifestyle content. The magazine could have been from 1999 - maybe even 1989. I find that bizarre.

 

Because of this thread I have Googled 'Classic car buyer' and 'Classic car weekly'. Both look like they could be more tuned to my own interest in cars. I may buy them and see what I think. I did enjoy reading car magazines.

[sierraman]

I used to read Redline. But only for the pictures of birds with their tits out. The cars were shit.

[Jim Bell]

I used to read car magazines but dont any more. Content more suitted to my interests is widely available and free digitally. Cheaper, more convenient etc.

 

Im surprised print journalism of any kind is surviving to be honest.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

The magazine is lost in time - reading it is like the last fifteen or twenty years have not happened. Having not read C&SC for nigh on 17 years, I was struck by just how similar it is to the magazine they were producing two decades ago. The same cars, the same 'Sunday Times colour supplement' lifestyle content. The magazine could have been from 1999 - maybe even 1989. I find that bizarre.

 

 

 

 

 

You're quite right. I worked in the same Teddington office in 1994 with 'Your Classic' (note there was an excellent mag) and nothing has changed except that they are trying to compete with Octane on the 'I've got more wealthy mates than you' feel.

[Mr_Bo11ox]

I think C&SC is excellent

[chaseracer]

...I think classic cars as a hobby won't disappear. Early to mid 2000 stuff is a going to be revered in the not too distant future. Still easy to fix, powerful, generally reliable and not too many electronics in the way.

 

Which is why - quite apart from the fact that it is (objectively, at least) the best car I've ever had - I intend to keep the Blingo.  Plus the amusement/WTaF factor at classic shows in 20 years' time!

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

I think C&SC is excellent

 

 

 

It has its moments I guess.

 

When Andrew Roberts (of whom I have no knowledge therefore no dislike of) does another three car test of a 1963 Sunbeam Mediocre v 1962 Triumph Tedious v 1960 Armstrong & Hedges Blue Sapphire I just flick through. This is not What Car. You're not comparing Focus/Golf/Ashtray where the cars are basically the same anyway, you're comparing three very old cars with distinct differences. I couldn't give a fuck which of the three Roberts thinks is 'best'.

Let's see an article on that V reg 1980 Metro prototype, how it survived and the story behind it. Drive Hitler's Merc (one of them), and for bloodsport, put an MGC GT against a 240Z and see those inscrutable Nips give the best effort of BMC a fucking good shoeing.

 

Lots of old 'classics' are shit - I want to see some of these mags come out and say it. Not the same old safe shite to avoid offending anyone. A Classic Car mag in the vein of 1970's CAR where they didn't give a flying one who they offended.

[Felly Magic]

Oh the weeklies are horrendous to put together, whichever publisher is doing it. You learn a HUGE amount very quickly working on them though. I do miss that constant buzz at times. 

 

As for classifieds, I used to proof read those just as hard as the rest of the magazine when I was on CCW, kicking out anything too modern, even modern number plates. Upset an advertiser who was placing 'Wanted' ads because I put a T in the corner. Proper sob story Wanted ads making it sound like he wasn't a trader. I got in trouble for that, annoyingly.

Isn't it a legal requirement of some form in classified ads to mark trader adverts with a (T)? You did bog all wrong, and your boss should have been sent to the naughty corner

[dollywobbler]

Isn't it a legal requirement of some form in classified ads to mark trader adverts with a (T)? You did bog all wrong, and your boss should have been sent to the naughty corner

 

That was my argument. Advertiser claimed that only applied to ads where a vehicle was being sold. Management sided with him. One of many reasons I decided it'd be better to be skint and many, many miles away.

[Felly Magic]

MG so called sports cars from the 60s and 70s were shit, it needs saying in print

 

That was my argument. Advertiser claimed that only applied to ads where a vehicle was being sold. Management sided with him. One of many reasons I decided it'd be better to be skint and many, many miles away.

Should have grassed your gaffer to the ASC, that would have lit a fire under their arse, sounds like that trader was very possibly a 'mate'

 

The problem with many, many mags is contributor's faves get way too much column inches, and PC is guilty of putting the fuggin Sherpa Sports, Triumph Splitarse and Morris Moron in way too often, it becomes like a scratched 78

[dollywobbler]

To be fair, the reason you see those so often is because it provides the ad income these mags need to survive. I have a tiny budget to play with on Retro Japanese, because naturally, you don't attract the big name advertisers. There was constant pressure to feature MGBs/Minors etc in the classic rags, because it's something you have to do to make the sums work.

 

Mind you, with so many pages to fill, every single week, it left PLENTY of room to fit in other stuff. When I was a mere features writer, I was doing features on the Toyota Sera, NSU 1000, DAF 33, Chrysler Alpine and anything else that took my fancy, and that was fine, as long as we did also cover the 'boring' stuff that keeps you afloat.

 

If it was possible to make a magazine that everyone on this forum liked, it would be done. Commercially, it just isn't going to happen, which is why it hasn't been done. (or in the case of Jalopy, didn't become a long-term success, just a niche, cult one).

[Felly Magic]

Mag circulations are in freefall, that is a given, and the printed mag will come to an end very soon, very possibly within the next 10 years, their circulation isn't helped by continual features of the Sherpa coupe, I remember not that long ago, at least 6 months on the bounce in PC there was one, glad you dared to put in something different Ian, car owners clubs that charge subs are suffering falling membership, thanks to social media and google, and many so called club insurance discounts are far from it these days, so another reason not to waste money, plus car clubs can be horribly cliquey

[dollywobbler]

Again, I'd love to know here you get your 'facts' from. Circulations don't seem to be in 'freefall' at all in my experience. I've also had good club experiences with most of them, which aren't cliquey. Some are, so I've avoided those.

[SiC]

The problem with many, many mags is contributor's faves get way too much column inches, and PC is guilty of putting the fuggin Sherpa Sports, Triumph Splitarse and Morris Moron in way too often, it becomes like a scratched 78

Why do they? Well you might not like them but plenty of people do like them. There is also a lot of them still around, reasonably priced (for a classic), loads of parts, easy to fix and so easily accessible classics.

[barrett]

Mag circulations are in freefall, that is a given, and the printed mag will come to an end very soon, very possibly within the next 10 years

Thanks for the warning! Any clue as to where this hot info is coming from? Call me mad, but considering there are probably more magazines being produced today than ever before and sales in the classic motoring sector are, on the whole, steady and increasing, I would be surprised if this where the case. The days on 100,000 a month circulation are long gone but on the whole this is a golden age for periodical publishing. The big publishing houses are struggling because they haven't made their products any better in 30-odd years, and in many cases have made them worse. Just look at Classic Cars, which was always a bit shittily done, but is now printed on bog roll and has about half the pages it used to.

 

Ill give you this: any magazine that survives on ad revenue us doomed to fail, as is any mag that acquiesces to advertisers when it comes to editorial content. Nobody who deals in MGs or whatever would pay a proper advertising rate anyway, so it's totally pointless

[rovamota]

It's must be harder to find anything on an MGB or Morris Minor still worth writing about. Instead pages could be filled with interesting stuff. 

 

A few years ago we restored a car that both Practical Classics and CCW wanted to feature. CCW and PC share the same office space and it was hoped they'd both end up with a good article in each mag. CCW went to print first, PC saw the article, spat their dummy out, refused to feature it and that was the end of that.