Save another Val

[Dick Cheeseburger]

Just spotted this yummy old twin steer girl on baybay. Interesting history too.

Needs saving, for sure.

 

 

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/351961795258

[mercrocker]

Yep, that needs looking at.   Hopefully not as anything 1960s film-related - just as a proper Sixties coach.    Sadly, the best I can hope to do is buy one of those seats and put it in my conservatory, get too hot, drink too much lemonade on it and feel sick for two and a half hours.    Instant nostalgia.

[sierraman]

Wasn't the original Italian Job coach scrapped in the early 1990s surely when it's value must have been recognised?

[captain_70s]

I think it ended it's days as a Scottish schoolbus so was probably well shagged and/or not recognised as the famous one.

[rml2345]

Once the filming for the Italian Job was finished the back end was sealed up again and it returned to use as a coach. Apoarently it served with a fair few companies in Scotland before being broken up, probably due to rot. Legionnaires were very rare as well so it's unlikely anyone would have taken it on at the time.

Bit like the VAL above, particularly if it's had missing glass for a while. Good source of spares for someone but restoration would be pretty difficult I'd think.

[Dick Cheeseburger]

This VAL is nothing like the Italian job VAL. It is twin steer though. It needs to be turned back into a roadworthy coach again. Love the design of them.

[Inspector Morose]

That one does have an interesting past though. It was part of the XRM project in the seventies and eighties and was written about by Colin Curtis in his book 40 years with London transport. It isn't the first Chinese six bought by London though. That was a leyland trolleybus built experimentally as part of a larger batch of ordinary six wheelers.

[sheffcortinacentre]

Often wondered why "Chinese six"?

[stephen01]

Just lovely.

[rml2345]

 

IIRC the twin steer Leyland trolleybus was built to try and alleviate the tyre scrub on three axle buses. Pity it never saw full scale production.

I think they get "Chinese six" because it's the opposite way round to a conventional six wheeled vehicle and was probably coined in the 30s so terribly un PC. On the other hand that could be shite.

[Dick Cheeseburger]

In happier times...

[sierraman]

Would make a very good coldframe for my plants.

[Faker]

That's actually heart breaking. That coach looked like it was retired and used for shows, going by Terry's pics in better times. I can't see that coach ever being restored. Cost a clean fortune to restore.

[rml2345]

Looking at the wavy panels chances are someone started an ambitious restoration before realising it needed an awful lot more work than they anticipated. There's some history on it on Flickr and apparently it spent some time as a caravan as well which would make restoration harder still.

[Asimo]

One of these was a regular ride to school, early 70s.

 

 

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4114/4799590937_3a99fe4f4e_o_d.jpg

[Inspector Morose]

The reason for the two front axles was one of pure skin flintedness. With the introduction of 36' coaches in the UK, Bedford wanted a piece of the action but found it did not have a front axle of a heavy enough capacity in its TK range. Of course any other manufacturer would just engineer a heavier axle but Bedford only used components shared with its truck range to gain as much economy of scale as possible. The answer was a simple one: by using three axles, no new axles would have to be created just for this one model. Initially twin rear axles were considered but tyre scrub was thought to be a big turn off for operators. Twin front axles were settled on using the axles from the TK with 17" wheels and the first petrol powered chassis was completed (unofficially named lash up no.1) It was bodied by Duple with an elongated vega style body and tested at Millbrook extensively to the point of destruction. The body was still good and was transferred to a production chassis later on.

The front leaf springs were individually rated to give the bestf ride possible as Bedford did have a knack of good steel suspension design. The chassis had some interesting quirks. A blow out on one of the front axles did not severely affect the steering so it could be bought to a controlled stop with ease and this feature was demonstrated on film. The chassis also had two separate handbrakes. One was a transmission brake mounted on the input of the diff and another lever operated the brakes on the rear of the two front axles.

It was the first Bedford to be fitted from the factory with power steering. When launched, as Bedford didn't produce a powerful enough Diesel engine, the Leyland 0350 was offered as the diesel option. This was different to the regular leyland unit as the head was redesigned so that inlet and exhaust was on the same side of the engine. Eventually Bedord produced the 466ci engine and the Leyland option was dropped.

Initially finding favour with operators due to the extra axle and small wheels giving the impression of grater length so a VAL was seen by the public as futuristic and modern even though the design was somewhat a compromise. After a few years the decision to use the lighter axles and small wheels was repaid by big problems with brake wear and balance and the steering geometry was fickle to eliminate high tyre wear in the faster wearing front tyres and the chassis quickly fell out of favour with operators. The brake wear problem was slightly helped with the introduction as an option of a Telma electric retarder and this was specified or retrofitted to many chassis (including this one).

The original reason for the six wheel layout was removed after a couple of years as a heavier axle was needed and indeed designed for the heavier weight TK models and so was available for bus and coach use. The Bedford VAM was designed using two axles and could be seen as the VALs replacement however the VAL carried on being sold until around 1973.

[jonathan_dyane]

The Liverpool Beatles tour until quite recently had a VAL in 'Magical Mystery Tour' guise in daily use plodding around; now sadly replaced by something modern.

[They_all_do_that_sir]

Often wondered why "Chinese six"?

Same here!

 

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[Eddie Honda]

I think they get "Chinese six" because it's the opposite way round to a conventional six wheeled vehicle and was probably coined in the 30s so terribly un PC.

 

Chinese in the late 19th century American military slang sense “inferior, clumsy, abnormal, etc.†Not very PC and fallen out of general use in the last 40 years.

 

See https://greensdictofslang.com/entry/ityinwq

 

and see usage note. http://www.dictionary.com/browse/chinese?s=t

 

[alcyonecorporation]

Same here!

 

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Bentley Continental S3s were nicknamed 'Chinese Eye' for similarly un-PC reasons.

[sheffcortinacentre]

Thanks I knew the axles where a wieght/cost thing, wasn't aware of why the use of "Chinese" six.

[Dick Cheeseburger]

The Liverpool Beatles tour until quite recently had a VAL in 'Magical Mystery Tour' guise in daily use plodding around; now sadly replaced by something modern.

[garethj]

The reason for the two front axles was one of pure skin flintedness.

 

Excellent, that's really interesting.  I've pinched it entirely and put it on my webpage.  If you tell me your real name I'll attribute it to you, rather than "Some bloke off Autoshite"

[Inspector Morose]

I prefer some bloke off Autoshite. It's got a good ring to it....

[gricer]

I thought the Italian Job one was used as a race car transporter after the film, and ended up being scrapped around 1991, which was about the time the film started being recognised as a British cinema classic.. 

[Dick Cheeseburger]

I thought the Italian Job one was used as a race car transporter after the film, and ended up being scrapped around 1991, which was about the time the film started being recognised as a British cinema classic..

 

Ive got a thread on here about the Harrington Legionnaire from TIT.

Lots of interesting reading on this Flickr thread. Apparently the photo at the top was of the coach a week before it was scrapped.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/10631124@N07/934524038

 

If you're interested in the restoration of a VAM (VA medium), as opposed to VAL (VA large) car transporter, there is a fantastic set of photos on here:

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/guru_1071/sets/72157603973265452/

 

All of this makes me want to buy some land, buy purchase an old VAL and play around with it in my spare time.

 

This '71 ex Sam Glover VAL is the ULTIMATE looker. Here's my old thread:

 

http://autoshite.com/topic/24049-save-val-71-twin-steer-coach-ex-sam-gloveredd-china/

[Inspector Morose]

If you're interested in the restoration of a VAM (VA medium), as opposed to VAL (VA large) car transporter, there is a fantastic set of photos on here

I'll dig out my reference on postwar Bedfords but VAL and VAM didn't stand for that. back soon with an answer. (Probably to say I'm wrong)

 

While I'm digging up the info I'll tidy up the facts on the above. That was off the top of my head so might be out of kilter in some places. The front axle thing was true though.

[garethj]

When I was doing the 3D model I couldn't even find out what size the wheels were!  That's a stack more information than was previously available, so thank you.

[mercrocker]

I'll dig out my reference on postwar Bedfords but VAL and VAM didn't stand for that. back soon with an answer. (Probably to say I'm wrong)

 

While I'm digging up the info I'll tidy up the facts on the above. That was off the top of my head so might be out of kilter in some places. The front axle thing was true though.

 

Short, Medium and Long?  

 

Or was that the radio?

[cms206]

I thought VAL meant "three axle shit" and VAM "two axle shit", much in the same way that YLQ/YMQ/YMP/YMT/YNT/YNV/VAS/PJK all also meant two axle shit.

 

No Bedford love here I'm afraid...

 

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