ModernToss (tm) testing gear

4,758 · January 10, 2017

So the FeckArse ST170 is doing the old flickery lights thing when you're at low revs.

Usually I'd buy a cheap ebay regulator and bash it on the car, and go off again into the night with stable voltage and happy motoring will ensue.

However these fords have that fancy pants Smart Charge going on don't they?

Well, I know how it's meant to work, and I know what I need to test for, however I'm lacking the kit to do it.

I've got a standard voltmeter that does ohms and all that stuff as part of my kit, so I'll check I'm getting a stable 13.8 V+ or there abouts before I start to swear at the crappy wiring and modules, and then I'll test that I've got open circuits or broken wires in lay-person terms, which would throw the check engine light anyway.

I've got a Calcium Battery (Bosch S4 Frame blue) so that's OK.

So apparently I now need to check that the wire that takes a temperature reading is working right, and that one of the wires matches the voltage of the battery output.

That's simple stuff too.

But then I need to check signals.. and for that I need to read square waves.

I'd don't have a scope in my kit, and I was thinking that surely these aren't the massive great things with a mini CRT screen that are about the size of a small dog..

Apparently, we've not managed to get these into a small hand held device yet?, at least not for a reasonable price anyway.

Unless I'm wrong, and a Â£20-40 hand held scope does indeed exist.

26,439 · January 10, 2017

Â£20 do you?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pocket-Size-Digital-Oscilloscope-DIY-Kit-2-4-TFT-200KHz-1MSa-s-SMD-Soldered/131980829392?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D2220071%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D40802%26meid%3D5d4599ded4a747969cda90c016bba6d7%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D6%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D222098522872

23,583 · January 10, 2017

There is this sort of thing.

https://ar-oscilloscope.com/

I have no experience of them, I have a "proper" oscilloscope, but I see no reason why they shouldn't be up to the simple 'scoping tasks around a car.

26,439 · January 10, 2017

Â£48 if you don't fancy building one.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DSO112A-Digital-Storage-Oscilloscope-TFT-Touch-Screen-w-MCX-clip-Cables-A4O0-/281968225025?hash=item41a69dab01:g:-3gAAOSwv9hW6NAs

40,665 · January 10, 2017

Do you actually have a starting/charging issue?

2,931 · January 10, 2017

How bad is it? I think its quite a common thing. I noticed mine doing it quite noticably on Sunday evening when I was at traffic lights with headlights/radio/air conditioning on. I'd just driven 80 miles, 20 miles the day before and 100 miles the day before that so I'm sure the battery was full.

40,665 · January 10, 2017

Do you have the heated screens on? Could well be a alternator problem. I'd have the alternator checked before I looked into it too deeply.

3,907 · January 10, 2017

Those alternators are a reasonably common failure item. New ones are about Â£300.

4,758 · January 10, 2017

It's noticeable enough to annoy me.

Screen not heated at the time it was happening.

I can hear the tell tale noisy relays clicking away in the dash too in traffic.

2,931 · January 10, 2017

Ah, I've never heard relays clicking and its not usually noticable unless I'm really looking for it.

IIRC there is a lead you can disconnect that disables the smart charge. Might be worth investigating in case that is at fault. This puts the system in to some sort of "fail safe" state where it just charges at a set voltage rather than this smart business.

40,665 · January 10, 2017

While it starts every morning and doesn't keep flattening batteries I'd ignore it.

January 10, 2017

I did that and the dash on mine (2007 2.0 TDCi) went full disco and died on the drive after coming home from work. Replacement alternator sorted a whole heap of niggles. Bit of an arse to fit though.

Sent from my Vodafone Smart ultra 6 using Tapatalk

4,758 · January 10, 2017

Ah, I've never heard relays clicking and its not usually noticable unless I'm really looking for it.

IIRC there is a lead you can disconnect that disables the smart charge. Might be worth investigating in case that is at fault. This puts the system in to some sort of "fail safe" state where it just charges at a set voltage rather than this smart business.

I think that mode also stops the dash cluster from working. I'd rather avoid doing that. Besides, it's my notShite© car and I want to make it work properly.

While it starts every morning and doesn't keep flattening batteries I'd ignore it.

I get very annoyed by things not being just so on nice cars. I've got another alternator coming that I'll recondition so it's on standby . New pulley and regulator gubbins ordered, as well as some bearings.

If it's not that, at least I'll have a spare one on the shelf

7,815 · January 10, 2017

The conventional wisdom (ex-MOOG and Bucket LPG Focus with Fartchrge fault) is remove the 3 pin smart charge connection from the alternator will disable smart charge gibbons and make it function as a conventional alternator with no damage caused to anything then drive as normal forever more with the smart charge fault light on. This assumes the non smart charge bits of the alternator works. Sometime in the distant future of warm sunshine you can fiddle with the smart charge gibbons or take it to Byfleet where the GURU hides http://www.petercoopercarrepairs.co.uk/ford_focus_alternator_smart_charging.htm and he will tell you

Remember when you remove the smart charge 3 pin plug from the back of the alternator, it reverts to a conventional alternator! If you do not have about 13.8 volts, carry out basic charging system checks and suspect the alternator, its not a smart charge fault.

17,159 · January 10, 2017

Isn't yours a bit early to have the smart charge setup?

4,758 · January 10, 2017

Isn't yours a bit early to have the smart charge setup?

Apparently the focus was the first car to get it.

The three pin plug on top of the offending alternator would certainly indicate it's there too.

21,035 · January 10, 2017

Does it have the correct calcium battery? Some people fit cheapo ones.

4,758 · January 10, 2017

Blue frame Bosch S4 so yes

17,159 · January 10, 2017

Apparently the focus was the first car to get it.

The three pin plug on top of the offending alternator would certainly indicate it's there too.

Consider me the man in orthopedic shoes...

6,497 · January 10, 2017

Lost me around the 'FeckArse' point...

What is 'SmartCharge'? What was wrong with a voltage regulator and alternator set up as was?

January 10, 2017

I think smartcharge turns the alternator off when not needed, which saves 0.000003bhp & increases emmmmpeeeegeeeggeess by about 0.0 & saves the environment.

4,758 · January 10, 2017

Its to do with optimum charge on a cold battery and when it works it's a good thing provided you have the right battery installed.

Lead acid stuff doesn't work well with it.

When it fails it can be expensive.

The pulley is over run clutched which helps with fuel and power apparently. Smart charge has nothing to do with emmisions.

FeckArse = Focus

January 11, 2017

Most of the time the smartcharge shit's itself because the wiring is broken as I think Ford borrowed Peugeots wiring experts and then gave them italian metal to make it with.

7,815 · January 11, 2017

An Engineer sticks his ore in.

Smartcharge is a modified alternator charging system to give a MASSIVE charging current if the battery is slightly low as all modern toss is ultra dependant on electronictrickery which is ultra dependant on the battery voltage. Things like the system where the engine stops and starts in standing traffic and multiple short journeys with lights, heaters, TV, sat nav, climate control, 3 tv screens, in car WIFI, drinks cooler, heated seats, electrically heated cat, put extra strain on the charging system.

3,565 · January 11, 2017

So the FeckArse ST170 is doing the old flickery lights thing when you're at low revs.

Usually I'd buy a cheap ebay regulator and bash it on the car, and go off again into the night with stable voltage and happy motoring will ensue.

However these fords have that fancy pants Smart Charge going on don't they?

Well, I know how it's meant to work, and I know what I need to test for, however I'm lacking the kit to do it.

I've got a standard voltmeter that does ohms and all that stuff as part of my kit, so I'll check I'm getting a stable 13.8 V+ or there abouts before I start to swear at the crappy wiring and modules, and then I'll test that I've got open circuits or broken wires in lay-person terms, which would throw the check engine light anyway.

I've got a Calcium Battery (Bosch S4 Frame blue) so that's OK.

So apparently I now need to check that the wire that takes a temperature reading is working right, and that one of the wires matches the voltage of the battery output.

That's simple stuff too.
But then I need to check signals.. and for that I need to read square waves.
I'd don't have a scope in my kit, and I was thinking that surely these aren't the massive great things with a mini CRT screen that are about the size of a small dog..

Apparently, we've not managed to get these into a small hand held device yet?, at least not for a reasonable price anyway.

Unless I'm wrong, and a Â£20-40 hand held scope does indeed exist.

Two things. Check the alternator live and earth feeds. ST170s for some reason seem to get through those quite often. Run a jump lead from battery -ve to engine block and see if the flickering stops.

The dashboard illumination is electroluminescent in the ST170, back the dimmer off slightly and they stop flickering. They all flicker slightly.

4,758 · January 11, 2017

Two things. Check the alternator live and earth feeds. ST170s for some reason seem to get through those quite often. Run a jump lead from battery -ve to engine block and see if the flickering stops.

The dashboard illumination is electroluminescent in the ST170, back the dimmer off slightly and they stop flickering. They all flicker slightly.

I'll check and update.

Should get the chance to do this tomorrow.

It's more than slightly and does it on all settings, it's not full on strobe effect, but I notice my headlights doing it too, which makes me think it's over-charging at times for a short burst.

20,149 · January 11, 2017

These are quite useful

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/311254669236?lpid=122&chn=ps&adgroupid=36084540643&rlsatarget=pla-271887871156&adtype=pla&poi=&googleloc=1006530&device=c&campaignid=698615505&crdt=0

4,758 · January 11, 2017

These are quite useful

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/311254669236?lpid=122&chn=ps&adgroupid=36084540643&rlsatarget=pla-271887871156&adtype=pla&poi=&googleloc=1006530&device=c&campaignid=698615505&crdt=0

I bought one of them.

Ta

Also got one of them DIY scopes en route.

4,758 · January 15, 2017

The cig lighter meter arrived yesterday and it's showing about 14v most of the time.

I popped into the local lidl yesterday which is on the same trading estate as our Halfords and popped in to get a new Chamois.

While I was in there, I had one of the oiks lend me thier Yuauza battery and charge tester and it's all apparently ok, leading me to think I need to go over the earth's and praps swap out the pulley.

A good used alternator is on standby anyway. Scope arrived but yet to be soldered together

ModernToss (tm) testing gear

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