Guilty until proven innocent. Thames Valley Police Not Chris and Ruffey, no Omegas.

[NorfolkNWeigh]

This morning I got a call from my brother. He'd been stopped by a Police Traffic car on the A34 near Oxford.

Apparently the Peugeot 207 he was driving was uninsured. He was adamant it was but had no proof on him. The certificate was at home and there was nobody home.

He, of course, couldn't remember who it was insured with, he'd just gone with the best quote on The Meerkat place or whatever. The Peugeot is to teach his 17 year old son to drive in so wasn't his usual company. He has other policies on other cars with cover to drive other cars not belonging etc. That was when he discovered the Pug was in his name on the logbook.

I suggested I buy it there and then and put it straight on MID , at first one copper was happy to do this to save confiscation - his mate ( apparently bad cop) said no he'd already called the recovery people.

I set off to Oxford to collect slightly peeved brawd, on getting to his lay-by, where he was surrounded by the contents of his car . He was even more peeved yet slightly relieved( no 6 pointer) His wife had got home and found the certificate, he'd phoned the company and they confirmed he was insured. It appears they'd entered the reg wrong on MID!

When told what had happened they said "Oh sorry, just let us know how much to get the car back and we'll reimburse you, that's what normally happens" !?!

 

Now he has to produce his documents at Police Station ,then go to somewhere near Kidlington , pay £170 plus £20 per day to get his own fully legal car back.

All because The computer says No.

 

The moral of this story is check Ask MID and always keep at least a photocopy of your insurance in every car.

7 day wonders still exist and there is no legal requirement to have your paperwork in the car, but it could save walking home.

[UltraWomble]

Hang on, he can prove the car was legal when confiscated - so why is he being asked to stump up?

Surely it should be the police that sort this one out.

[scaryoldcortina]

I've had that, I got a pull for no insurance/tax/mot in a sierra a couple of years ago, they were all for taking the car on the spot despite me having a motor trade policy and being able to prove it. Luckily I spotted (while in the back of the police car) that their ANPR hadn't pulled up the right ford sierra!

 

They also wanted to do me for a "bald tyre" until I made them get the gauge out and check it.

[purplebargeken]

I got pulled in Essex when I had the beige Escort. Turns out that the insurance company had a digit wrong. The copper called the company and it was all sorted there and then. Off I went with car intact. A decent copper.

[dollywobbler]

Aye, I've heard of others having the same 'computer says no' trouble. It's why I lost my rag with one insurer because it ALWAYS took them bloody ages to update MID. Always worth a check on askmid.com

[NorfolkNWeigh]

Hang on, he can prove the car was legal when confiscated - so why is he being asked to stump up?

Surely it should be the police that sort this one out.

Going on the information they had available to them it wasn't insured, I suppose.

The fault lies with the insurance company and they've put their hands up to it and say they'll cover the costs.

 

I might not feel so magnanimous towards the Police if it was me they'd called a liar and took my 100% legal car though.

[AlabamaShrimp]

In a way I've set of had the same today but the other way round. The mid says I was insured but on my last bank statement I had a payment then a refund for my insurance. Turns out it was an auto renewal that shouldn't have been taken.

 

Still drove the car as the computer said yes.

 

As for having to pay to get the car back out of the storage. That's normal, you take the bill from the garage to the police station and they will eventually give you the money back.

[forddeliveryboy]

This would make me livid. Compare and contrast with the police response when a fellow autoshiter had a wheelie bin thrown down onto his car from a motorway bridge. 

 

What sort of country is this?

[Chris2cv]

It tool a week for the 2cv tax to appear on the system last time. Wouldn't mind if only they would give you some way of proving that you had paid!  I didn't want to use it until it showed up, as it is a very visible car and I didn't need the aggro. I have been pulled for suspected drink driving twice, despite not drinking, as I suspect they were just looking for unusual cars.  

 

Does sound a pretty raw deal if you are paying for a system mistake, even if you get it back.

[EssDeeWon]

These days even out of date feckers like me have a phone with email, and every time you insure or tax a car now you should receive an email, so I would just take my phone everywhere and access my emails in front of Mr Plod and show them the emails from DVLA  or Insurance company etc..

[NorfolkNWeigh]

These days even out of date feckers like me have a phone with email, and every time you insure or tax a car now you should receive an email, so I would just take my phone everywhere and access my emails in front of Mr Plod and show them the emails from DVLA  or Insurance company etc..

You'd think.....

Guess who had recently updated his phone and deleted 5,000 emails?

Talk about a comedy of errors.

[doobietoo]

I am old enough to not trust electronics, or more to the point, the people who input the data, all my cars have copies of mot, tax and insurance in the glovebox.... there is no way a policeman who has had a bad day is going to leave me by the side of the road...

[ruffgeezer]

How is it then that the cunt I sold my picasso to is still riding around with no tax, no mot and presumable no insurance and it has been likewise since April.

[Jerzy Woking]

I have three car policies and three bike policies. I just record the policy number against the reg in the contacts of my phone. Having the policy number is far better to give to any copper that pulls you.

 

Last time I was stopped the snotty spotty wet behind the ears copper told me "your tyre is nearly illegal". I replied "so it is legal then?" Which then led him to give my car a thorough going over. I should have just said "yes".

[Jim Bell]

Isnt askmid miles out of date anyway?

What happened to a good old fashioned producer and benefit of the doubt?

 

I blame fucking Brexit.

[SiC]

Most policies require insurance already in force on a vehicle before you can drive yourself with 3rd party cover.

[forddeliveryboy]

I'm hardly enthusiastic about the compensation culture which has crossed the Atlantic from the USA, it's insidious and often brings out the worst characteristics of humanity but in situations like these, government is more likely to continue blindly towards a police state if there is no significant cost to these sorts of errors involving innocent people.

 

In December 2014, the Chief Contable of Greater Manchester warned that the UK was in danger of drifting into a police state.

[STUNO]

Why is insurance, a purely commercial transaction, anything to do with police or government ?

[Jim Bell]

Its a mandatory requirement of law.

[forddeliveryboy]

 

I'd rather they took those bullshitters cars away, because 9 times out of 10, they will be bullshitters. Just happens that this time the OP's brother was the exception.

 

This is a really interesting question for a democracy - does it assume that people are to be considered guilty until proved innocent, or innocent until proved guilty? In general, you can judge how pleasant a country is by how generously it treats its citizens at the first encounter with the law when it comes to potential minor infringements. If UK govt wants us to carry proof of insurance (which in this Wild West approach to motoring crime would make sense) then why can't we implement a system like other countries, whereby your vehicle licence is dependent on insurance being present?

 

I appreciate your feelings Nyphur and in many regards agree with them when it comes to uninsured motorists. Perhaps there should be a radical overhaul of motoring taxation and insurance, so that all drivers are insured third party, possibly paid for through fuel tax with one-off charges whenever this insurance is claimed? 

 

It's very easy to make money out of motorists, who are already taxed massively in order to pay for health and welfare services, while the police conveniently ignore crimes which could be interpreted as attempted murder, as in the case of the motorway bridge missile, which would make no money. Once your law and order works along the lines of profit and loss, you're into very dangerous territory.

[Jim Bell]

Do "producers" even exist any more?

[warren t claim]

Maybe a change to a system where the car is insured regardless of who may be driving would work?

[Junkman]

Considering what a clusterfuck legally required car insurance in the UK's total police and surveillance state is (it's legally required,

so where is just ever so for example the public insurance company?), I shall commence the habit of driving sub 200 quid chod and not give a fuck.

Paying the impound and destruction fees is still cheaper (if caught at all) than insuring a car with those private corporate fascist racketeers.

 

I have no idea why everything related to car registering and insuring has to be such a bloody good for nothing mess, even lesser I understand,

why 30 million people put up with this nonsense.

[STUNO]

Insurance not compulsory = not of interest to police.........Tick

 

Anyone who is a legal driver can drive the car...................Tick (excess may vary if you claim)

 

Don't need insurance because not compulsory..................Idiot ( idiot does the damage, idiot pays)

 

That's how it works here !

 

My experience is that the vast majority have insurance, it's reasonably cheap

and insurance co's act like they need your business.

[Jim Bell]

What happens in cases of disputed liability or failure to disclose information after an accident if a driver is uninsured over there dude?

[nigel bickle]

Similar happened to me a couple of weeks back, when I had a car on the A frame. Pulled, near home by traffic because the car was showing uninsured, untaxed etc. Nice chap- once he believed me.

 

30 secs on his machine showed an mot pass 2 days earlier, I could produce an old Insurance Cert which - once phoned through- confirmed legality, tax he wasn't bothered about( I had done it, needed my computer to prove)

 

I wondered what would have happened had I not had an old certificate, but I tend to carry one in every car - in case. I guess he'd gave just checked on what I told him.

 

So,slightly embarrassing as I'm sure a neighbour saw me, but nowt more than a minor inconvenience.

 

Anyway he knows who I am, and doubt he'd bother to stop me again, now.

 

And despite going 'Traffic', not the slightest bothered by the A frame though.

[dave21478]

Maybe a change to a system where the car is insured regardless of who may be driving would work?

 

yeah but no but yeah but no......

 

Thats how it works here. I am the named driver, but literally anyone can drive my car although the excess payment if they crash will be about 750 euros.

This makes it really easy to borrow someones car for a few hours....to lend a car to a friend for a few weeks etc.

The downside is that the entire insurance industry is an antiquated clusterfuck. I weep every time I have to deal with insurers here when I remember how comparatively easy it was in UK.

[Richard]

How about a system where you pay for your own mistakes, so you actually have some stake in ensuring you don't maim anybody?

 

How many accidents are caused by insured drivers? Better impound their cars too.

[garbaldy]

And to think that southern person's who shall remain nameless drove around in a landcruiser with mot expired in June and road tax had been out for over a year even abroad, it took a copper to pull them in Edinburgh for them to get it sorted.

[Jim Bell]

A government run, mandatory flat fee scheme would be my pick. I know the government couldnt organise a piss up in a brewery but at least a subsidised and centally managed system would have the teeth and the stomach to fight insurance fraud. Which is up again this year.