Bodywork bodgery - 'fill' me in

[dollywobbler]

Now, while some of the larger bodywork dents on the BX are obviously going to need panel replacement or thumping with many hammers, there are also some minor imperfections that will need attention. One area is the roof just above the windscreen where it was bubbling up a bit. I chipped off the bubbles and rubbed the area down and wasn't surprised to find lots of small holes. I smeared rust converter over the remains and while long term, I'd like to get this properly sorted, for now I just need to make it water-tight again.

 

I've never used body fillers before, but this seems the time to learn. Bit confused about the different fillers, different grades of paper and how best to apply it all. Any input will be much appreciated! Started pricing up some of the stuff I thought I needed - quickly gets expensive!

[Captain Flimble]

Got any pictures

[Rocket88]

If you want a very quick job, I recommend a skillfully gaffer tape windscreen surround job. Lets face it, to do it properly it sounds like a screen out job.

[M'coli]

If you want watertight, I believe that ready-mixed glassfibre is the stuff, whereas ordinary filler is porous and will let water through.

[barefoot]

Have you tried spunk?

[tux]

If there are large holes, you'll need to bodge in something like Isopon P40 which is based on fibreglass resin and has strands of fibreglass in it. Then go over the top with bodyfiller.

If its just a temp job and there are only small holes then you may get away with just bodyfiller. UPOL Fantatsic seems to be the gloop of choice at the moment, but there are stacks out there to choose from, just have a skeg around eBay or your local motor factors.

Mix up with the age old golf ball size splodge of filler to a pea size amount of hardener. Mix well so its all a uniform colour with no streaks and apply to the wounded area making as smooth as possible and slightly proud of the surrounding area. It should set in about 20 minutes.

Break out the wet and dry. Initially something like 120 grit to rub the filler into shape and get it "something like." Then go down to something like 400 grit to start smoothing it out and feathering the edge down to the surrounding area. At this point it will probably have a bunch of pits in it so either bosh in more filler and go through the process again until all the pits are gone or use a stopper like Dolphin Glaze to the same effect. The stopper will probably be easier to work with, but means splashing out a few extra quid to buy.

When its all looking jubbly give the whole area a waft over with 600 grit paper to make sure its all lovely and smooth and then break out the primer and top coat.

Don't forget to post LOTS of pictures of your progress as we are all picture whores on car forums!

[Rocket88]

Whip out as much headling as you can at the affected area. Try and treat any internal grot [and there will be some] with rust converter. Make cardboard template of hole, transfer to thin steel, and then apply to the inside of the job, and attach with araldite [unless you like setting fire to your headlining with a Mig] Then fill from the outside as described above. If you don't get rid [and treat] internal grot, the filler will erupt within weeks.

On the subject, I've had two screens crack on cars where there's been rust in the windscreen surround, bonded screens especially. Glass isn't keen on flexing!

[dollywobbler]

This isn't actually the surround - it's actually a bit beyond that - though it does go down to the surround. I can't be doing with a screen out job at this stage - very likely to discover a lot more rot and I can't afford to be sorting that out at the moment. The holes are very small. I've taken some pics so will get them uploaded.

[dollywobbler]

Et voila.

 

A very extreme close-up. Hole is actually all of about 1.5mm if that.

 

Stretches back a bit, but this problem doesn't seem to be affecting any other areas of the roof.

[FredTransit]

My recent best friend for boddgery is aluminium tape. cut it to shape (having treated the rust) and push it into the holes. Push it well in, it's very flexible and very sticky. Finish with some regular filler. ~This works well with quite big holes, and avoids filling up an entire panel with filler whilst trying to bridge the hole!

[Albert Ross]

Tap the holes gently down until the area is slighlty concave. Squirt pre-mixed filler from a wee tube into the holes in a cake-icing stylee.(You can get it still in tubes can't you?) Smooth off in a general fashion. Allow to set. Smooth off with ever finer wet 'n' dry. Mask. Prime. Top-coat (lacquer too to prevent further moisture ingress.)

[John F]

Hm... it's ferked. Realistically that'll all want cutting out & some new metal letting in.

 

If you just want to tart it up for now I'd use a thin skim of P38 filler, smooth off with (wet) 800 followed by 1500 wet & dry paper (use a sanding block rather than your hand to get a properly flat finish), then a couple of rattle-can coats of primer and some top-coat paint. That'll keep the water out and give a reasonable-ish temporary finish, but the only way to get a permanent fix is to cut all of that rot out.

[dollywobbler]

Indeed John. Bodgery tips here should be useful for now. At some point hopefully I'll have the funds to rip the screen out and get all the nasty rot sorted...

[Rocket88]

If you can get to the back of it from inside of the car, I'd do it, and treat anything you find

[maxpower]

Have you tried spunk?

 

surely that's only for the balljoints

[Burnside]

My recent best friend for boddgery is aluminium tape. cut it to shape (having treated the rust) and push it into the holes. Push it well in, it's very flexible and very sticky. Finish with some regular filler. ~This works well with quite big holes, and avoids filling up an entire panel with filler whilst trying to bridge the hole!

Im with FredTransit with the aluminium tape i used some on a J reg renault 19 diesel hatch i used to own about 6 years ago to cover a large rot hole on a rear arch an just used the tape an nothing else used to last me 3/4 months then i catch it when washing the car or it peel slightly round the edges in winter with the spray on wet roads etc over time then id apply some more. Plus it would be alot easier to remove than glassfibre or filler when the time comes to sort the job out right.

[dollywobbler]

That's a decent point. Hoping to have funds to tackle major bodywork sections next year, so a very temp solution could be ideal.

[trigger]

There's some good advice on here, I'd start by getting some thin cable and pushing it behind the window rubber for starters, this will help give you a better finish and get to more rust hidden by the rubber.

 

I'd then tap in the around the main holes with a hammer, giving the P40 (U-Pol) something to stick too, apply some P40 making sure it's in the holes and wait 1/2 for it to dry and go hard, I'd then personally get the grinder out and knock down the filler so all that's left is what's in the hole (Make you cover the screen as the sparks can burn glass), failing that some 80g paper and a bit of hard graft would also work.

 

Then I'd apply a small amount of P38 filler (don't use to much hardener as it will go off to quick and can bleach through the paintwork) and cover the area, Once hard then sand of with some 120g then 240g paper finally feather out the edges with something even finer like 500g.

 

Then Mask of area, key it up with a red scotchy pad and primer with some etch primer, this will help hold of the rust for a bit longer and then prime with normal grey primer, Once dry flat down with some 800g wet and dry paper, key the area up with some grey scotchy pad, mask and paint.

[Station]

I'd be happy to to do a fibre glass isopon fillery job on that. The only problem is there may be rust on the inside of the metal. I'd chance it with filler/fg and do a good job of it.

[Cavcraft]

Shove bits of tin foil into the holes, smear with fibreglass then filler over that.

[Des]

If you could give that a bit of a sandblasting or a good wire brushing, you could make a long lasting repair with solder. If you can shield the meltable bits ok then probably easier / quicker than bodging. Some plumbers flux and a small blowtorch for some old skool lead loading, definitely tap the area to concave it a little, maybe use a drift to give you precise control - hammer a small socket on it.

[garethj]

Pretty much any of the methods will work as a temporary measure, I wouldn't get busy with a blowtorch and lead because it's a bit close to a screen rubber.

 

Can you get access from inside and treat the area for rust where you can't see from the outside? It would be nice if the bodge lasted a year, rather than until December when you've got to scrape the snow off to do it again.

[scooters]

I think you should go for the 'scheme' look - 3 or 4 strips of silver duct tape arranged in a 'picasso' esque pattern should do the trick! - I lived for 6 months with some silver duct tape on the door of my CX - all the best old SITRENZ have it don't ye know?

[Captain Flimble]

I wouldn't fanny about with a bodge on that - guaranteed any temporary repair would last you until about January - exactly when you don't want it to fail again.

 

However, just firing up the MIG isn't the only facet to this problem - that looks like a bonded windscreen. It will need taking out properly and sealing back in again once you've finished the repairs. You may feel this is a job for the professionals so you would have to weigh that cost against the value of the car.

[dollywobbler]

Thanks Flimble. I reckon a tape repair might last at least that long, and can always be re-applied. Beauty is that it can just be ripped off when I actually can afford the repair. You're quite right - the screen will have to come out, and no doubt there will be more horrors to discover once that's done. This is why I want to postpone it until I can save up the necessary funds. The screen has a big chip in the middle of it - hopefully ok for the MOT, but I'd rather have a good screen in. Saves having to worry about destroying the old screen getting it out...

[Captain Flimble]

Bodge it is, then!

 

...and maybe if you're lucky enough that crack will grow bigger so you can get the windscreen replacement done on your car insurance.

[scooters]

thanks for all the tips - I've not used filler for about 20 years when I had a Mini that was mostly made from egg cartons, chicken wire and black and white early 80's copies of The Sun.

really useful thread especially as the 306 will need some fettling