Shite Wars 2! Maestro Vs.....

[warren t claim]

A bit of a political one this.

 

In the red corner we have a car we all know and have experienced, the Austin Maestro.

 

And in the blue corner a car that maybe should of been made by BL instead. A car few of us have experienced. The Honda Quintet

 

Was Michael Edwards right to sign off Maestro production when he probably could of negotiated the licensed manufacture of the 5 door Honda?

[Father Ted]

I like the Maestro.

Predictably the only thing that really lets it down is the build quality and rustability.

Would a UK built Honda really have been so much better?

I think not.

[Guest]

Someone on RR has recently purchased a Quintet. Thread is here:

 

http://retrorides.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=readersrides&action=display&thread=106917&page=2

 

They were sold as a Rover in Australasia if my memory serves.

[dollywobbler]

I'll say yes. For all its faults, the Maestro was a pretty good car. The Honda's not really a looker either and just wouldn't have had the market impact.

 

I don't think the Maestro was as good as it could have been - it was always slightly hampered by typical quality issues and unexciting looks - but Edwardes needed to get the workers back onside after all the union chaos, and going for a home-grown product must have seemed better both for the workers and for the promotion of the newly formed Austin-Rover Group.

[dollywobbler]

I like the Maestro.

Predictably the only thing that really lets it down is the build quality and rustability.

Would a UK built Honda really have been so much better?

I think not.

 

Um, did the Triumph Acclaim bypass the North? Reliable and not really that bad for rust.

[warren t claim]

I like the Maestro.

Predictably the only thing that really lets it down is the build quality and rustability.

Would a UK built Honda really have been so much better?

I think not.

 

Like the Triumph Acclaim? Was it more reliable than an Allegro?

[Station]

Maestro sold loads, and I can't even recall ever seeing a Quintet.

[254575]

maestro was in production from 1983 to the mid 90's by rover, then up to 2001 in CKD, i think that says a lot.

 

it doesn't look as out of place as a 30 year old design should.

 

 

plus my car is exact spec as the one in the OP

[John F]

I suspect I might be on my own here, but I've never liked the Maestrocity.

 

Quality autoshite though, I'll give it that.

[ashmicro]

Much Maestro love from this callsign.Roomy, mechanically simple, easy to drive, easy to see out of. WIN

[Mash]

I like the Quintet but then I'm biassed being a freak when it comes to obscure J-tin.

 

However, I think the Maestro is the better choice, it should just have been a bit better executed. The Quintet doesn't have any styling merits and whilst it would have made a logical pairing with the Acclaim, my feeling is that BL should have been in the position by the early 80s of having a range of good home-grown designs to go with the Metro and Maestro instead of having to rely on the Japanese influence. Like it or not, the Acclaim was not a suitable replacement for the Dolomite but then the desperation of having to get rid of so many 1960s/early 70s designs all in one go must have been hard to tackle.

 

Had the evolution of BL styling been smoother through the 70s in line with cars like the Princess, then the situation by the 80s would have been better and the jump to Montego not so large. With Montego and a sharper Maestro earlier in the decade, it would have been easier for BL/ARG to compete. Having said that, patriotic sales still kept the products high in the sales charts regardless.

[pompei]

My dad bought a new Quintet when the A plate started in 1983/4. I thought at the time it was the last word in refinement and powa, but there again I was driving a Toledo.

 

I've never driven a Maestro (am I the only one here?) but I don't imagine it would have compared as well. But there again, different markets, horses for courses and all that ...

[AnthonyG]

I have a suspicion that if the average Maestro had been built to the same quality as the average Quintet, then it would have sold many more against the Escort and Astra. But I think Edwardes was right with the decision, for some of the reasons that DW mentions.

 

Remember the Maestro was originally intended to have been launched about 1979/80 when its crisper, squareish styling would have been more in vogue, similar to the Chrysler Horizon, Lancia Delta etc.

[r.welfare]

I think you're right - I'm sure the Roy Axe biography (good read by the way) states the design was frozen in 1975 or something silly like that. I know that Roy Axe's immediate response on seeing it in 1981 was to scrap it and start again! No chance of that.

 

Even if the Quintet was the better car it wouldn't have made as much money for BL due to the 'licensing costs' - the Acclaim didn't make a lot of profit (despite selling quite well) and neither did the original 200, despite selling very well indeed; in fact, hitting the Top Ten (and I think selling more than the Maestro and Montego) from 1987 onwards. Fitting the S-series engine must have helped the balance of payments, of course.

 

Of course, if the issues had been ironed out in the Maestro before launch (styling aside, which I do actually like - that early red one looks super in my view) then it would have probably sold better and certainly made more, through reduced warranty costs if nothing else.

 

As it was, the benefits (such as the proven dependability of the A-series engine and roomy body) were outweighed by the fragility of the bumpers, shonky build, tempremental autochoke etc and it really only sold to patriotic private buyers and fleet managers. The only people I knew who had them new were either elderly relatives who had been buying Austin since WW2, or company car drivers who had one foisted on them without any choice. Back then if your company fleet bought ARG, you had an ARG product; same for Ford or Vauxhall, simple as that, all the way from supermini to executive barge.

[Shep Shepherd]

If I was a company car driver in 1984, I'd have gone for the Maestro. If I was a private buyer, I'd have gone for the Quintet

[brammy777]

I had forgotten all about the Quintet, looks like a fastback version of MKII Accord. Clearly it sold nowhere near as many units as the Maestro, which actually did pretty well considering how 'dated' it was on launch. Honestly though, I think the Quintet looks a lot older, design wise anyway, a lot of chrome detailing which was seemingly a lot more 70s looking than the Maestro as a whole, ARG may not have even supplied the Maestro with a diesel lump of equal worth if they had gone down the joint development route, and that would have deleted a whole load of sales anyway.

Considering the Maestro outnumbers a fair amount of its counterparts now, it did fairly well. Probably not enough to compete with the big guns, but I think by that point, they were desperate for a new model in that sector, a decade of the Allegro and 14 years of the Maxi! Surprising they never got rid of it when the R8 was released though.

[barefoot]

That's a shite picture of a Quintet - I appreciate that this is a US spec, but the doors are shut.

 

 

I think it's a 5 door Accord isn't it?

In which case, it (and just about anything else) is/was far superior to the Maestro.

I have only driven one Maestro - a diesel van - a company vehicle.

At the time my daily was an Audi 200T (C2)

One corner between home & work that I used to take comfortably at 50 in the Audi,

and at a tyre squealing push I could do at 60

the Maestro struggled & rolly pollied at just 30.

 

I thought it the worst piece of shite I have ever driven.

That was early 90's.

 

You lot will do well to persuade me otherwise.

[254575]

comparing a executive cruiser to a 10 year old car derived van seems a bit harsh