Old barges, where do they fit in?

[Cavcraft]

I liked the 800s I had found them a decent, and quite under-rated ride. Fair play though they seem alomst impossible to get rid of.

[dieselnutjob]

^^

 

They are utter shit, one of those, with a blind tosser driving it wrote itself off hitting my Volvo 740 in the rear! It was totalled, the front door wouldnt even open! my car had a scuffed rear bumper, cracked light lense and slightly bent exhaust tail pipe!

 

They, like most cars of the age are bland, disposable shit.

 

yeah probably I should have bought one of these

 

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

I don't think they have any real prestige - no one will think you rich as they may if you own a new shape BMW '7', Jaguar XJ or Mercedes 'S' Class - or maybe even something like an Audi, but in the right condition they are admired by people in a different way; because they like them. They are very dependent on condition though; even a bit rough says "Pikey".

 

Because of this I do think they need to be a bit older too. My own car, a '93 Jaguar Sovereign, is just about emerging from a particularly messy middle age which saw it practically unwanted by all but pub landlords, banger racers and scrap metal dealers. It is in fairly good condition (very good but for the inevitable rust) and has a full service history so is completely reliable. It is far more pleasurable to drive than any other car I have driven and it feels so special to ride in I enjoy being seen in it, no matter what. It was owned by my late father before me. These Jags like all big cars suffered horrid depreciation when they were newer. I have the invoice for the Jag my dad bought before this one - one of the first XJ40s in February 1987. He paid £26,000 for it. When he sold it in 1993/4, he only got £3500 for it. It only retained 13% in 7 years!!

 

An elegant way to spend six hundred quid...

[danthecapriman]

^^

 

They are utter shit, one of those, with a blind tosser driving it wrote itself off hitting my Volvo 740 in the rear! It was totalled, the front door wouldnt even open! my car had a scuffed rear bumper, cracked light lense and slightly bent exhaust tail pipe!

 

They, like most cars of the age are bland, disposable shit.

 

yeah probably I should have bought one of these

 

 

Much better!

I like all the old pugs, particularly in oil burning flavour. Favorite is the 505 estate though, now thats a nice big barge!

[dieselnutjob]

this is my drive so I've got the best of both

 

[Cavcraft]

I don't think they have any real prestige - no one will think you rich as they may if you own a new shape BMW '7', Jaguar XJ or Mercedes 'S' Class - or maybe even something like an Audi, but in the right condition they are admired by people in a different way; because they like them. They are very dependent on condition though; even a bit rough says "Pikey".

 

Because of this I do think they need to be a bit older too. My own car, a '93 Jaguar Sovereign, is just about emerging from a particularly messy middle age which saw it practically unwanted by all but pub landlords, banger racers and scrap metal dealers. It is in fairly good condition (very good but for the inevitable rust) and has a full service history so is completely reliable. It is far more pleasurable to drive than any other car I have driven and it feels so special to ride in I enjoy being seen in it, no matter what. It was owned by my late father before me. These Jags like all big cars suffered horrid depreciation when they were newer. I have the invoice for the Jag my dad bought before this one - one of the first XJ40s in February 1987. He paid £26,000 for it. When he sold it in 1993/4, he only got £3500 for it. It only retained 13% in 7 years!!

 

An elegant way to spend six hundred quid...

 

That's lovely, still have a soft spot for them. Local reg number too, ex-Henleys by any chance?

[overheadvalve]

This thing is, to me the people who drive new barges are well off because they are driving around in a barge and it's a company car and lets face it 90% of them are it comes with the job so the fuel, insurance, rfl and servicing are all paid for by the business.

The chap that buys it at 3 or 4 years old is probably better off than average financially too.......maybe?

I was just thinking of my boss and my boss boss and my boss boss boss, you know the production manager, his boss is the factory manager who is also a director then there is the comercial director and the finance director etc etc They aren't ever going to spend £1 on anything car related because it's all paid for, that makes me think that the barges you are talking about are difficult to button hole, if they are parked in a double garage with a large detatched house in for instance Alderley Edge or South Kensington then yeah even if they are 20 years old then that makes the owner chap who will not part with his old car.

You do see a load of council types in older 5 series and mid range Merc's though who usually look like pikey's and have not looked after their car anywhere near well enough, well i see a few around here anyway.

Maybe i should move.....

So to summerise, yeah if they are well kept i would call them luxo barges to which one aspires to when reaching a certain age.

If they are rusty and dented they are shitters owned by pikeys as the bus of choice for cruising around collecting the shoplifters when they finish their shifts or selling the big fucking issue.

[Owain-328i]

These do it for me;

 

W140 (preferably S600 v12)

 

 

Or the e38 (preferably 750i v12)

 

 

Both easily bought for under 2k these days (ok maybe not good v12's, but v8's no probs)

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

I don't think they have any real prestige - no one will think you rich as they may if you own a new shape BMW '7', Jaguar XJ or Mercedes 'S' Class - or maybe even something like an Audi, but in the right condition they are admired by people in a different way; because they like them. They are very dependent on condition though; even a bit rough says "Pikey".

 

Because of this I do think they need to be a bit older too. My own car, a '93 Jaguar Sovereign, is just about emerging from a particularly messy middle age which saw it practically unwanted by all but pub landlords, banger racers and scrap metal dealers. It is in fairly good condition (very good but for the inevitable rust) and has a full service history so is completely reliable. It is far more pleasurable to drive than any other car I have driven and it feels so special to ride in I enjoy being seen in it, no matter what. It was owned by my late father before me. These Jags like all big cars suffered horrid depreciation when they were newer. I have the invoice for the Jag my dad bought before this one - one of the first XJ40s in February 1987. He paid £26,000 for it. When he sold it in 1993/4, he only got £3500 for it. It only retained 13% in 7 years!!

 

An elegant way to spend six hundred quid...

 

That's lovely, still have a soft spot for them. Local reg number too, ex-Henleys by any chance?

 

I do love my old Sov!! It was from Royles in Prestbury, but it would have had the same 'CA' reg had it been from Henleys.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

These do it for me;

 

W140 (preferably S600 v12)

 

 

My brother had one of these (an S320) in about 2000. Though impressive in many ways it was really shoddy quality and far worse than the older Mercs unfortunately. He had lots of electrical problems with it an it suffered a fair bit of rust. They fixed it under warranty, but that's not the point...

 

Refusing to give up he bought the following model - an S500 at about 12 months old. That was an abysmal abomination of a car which had rust holes in it at 5 years old and spent more time in the garage than on the road. By the time he sold it, the car was so riddled with rust it leaked like a sieve which caused the already shonkey electrics to finally give in. The S500 was so very bad he swears he will never buy a Mercedes again!! This era of Mercs doesn't seem to have the quality of the older ones sadly. This decline in quality suffered by Mercedes left him bewildered and drove him into the hands of Jaguar - all of which (4 cars) have been excellent.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

this is my drive so I've got the best of both

 

 

 

I LOVE the one on the right!! The 604 is one of my favourite cars. This is an early one too, with the delectable hubcaps and cheeky round fuel filler.

I had a multi-Peugeot childhood! It makes me think of the old man, this.

[The Reverend Bluejeans]

We live in an age where the more expensive, newer and 'prestigious' the car, the bigger the wanker at the controls.

 

Old prestige stuff - that's German and Jags and nothing French - are completely and utterly council. I've had loads and if I lived on an 'estate', I'd be the king.

 

The key to avoiding being tarred with the council brush is to avoid all the trinkets - paddy plates, chrome arches and big shiny wheels. Such appendages are the automotive equivalent of tattoos all up your arm or a fucking great satellite dish. A clean, utterly stock 15 year old lump of prestige tackle can still look nice.

 

I've not had an E38 yet, but I've had a few E32's and a black LHD W140 Benz 350TD on Kraut plates - Man, I looked like a thrusting executive in that. Only paid 600 quid for it as well back in 2003 because it had no docs. It had a battery and a set of keys though, all I needed.

[Magnificent Rustbucket]

Old prestige stuff - that's German and Jags and nothing French - are completely and utterly council.

 

I don't think so, but maybe I am deluded.

[dieselnutjob]

cheeky round fuel filler.

unfortunately a previous owner replaced the rear wing and it has a square filler. I'm guessing it got rear ended.

[overheadvalve]

We live in an age where the more expensive, newer and 'prestigious' the car, the bigger the wanker at the controls.

 

Old prestige stuff - that's German and Jags and nothing French - are completely and utterly council. I've had loads and if I lived on an 'estate', I'd be the king.

 

Agree with the first line but are you sure you don't have the german and Jags and nothing French line the wrong way around?

[Guest]

Amused by the sartorial discussion; as a small child I attended virtually the last Dame School; the locallest kids walked; we from the village rode up the hills in a '32 Vauxhaul Cadet taxi in winter, by pony cart in summer; the farming families wore tweed and cords and drove wolseleys and big morrisses; the aristocrats dressed like gypsies and lurched up in a jeep woody or, glided in an armstrong siddely typhoon on high days. The gypsies dressed like gypsies and drove jags.

my current Old Barge: W124 3litre estate, spacious, tough and, beautiful. Also waftingly comfortable, tenaciously cornerable and, thrillingly accelerative.

driving clothes; irrelevant. All down to the look in the eye.

[timmyteapot]

If it were me, buy an old Merc S class, preferably diesel and take the badges off, in silver or black, bang on a nice cheap private plate and if done properly gives you a expensive feel for beer money.

 

However:

 

No nasty pikey irish plates to hide the age (your not fooling anyone)

 

No big bling wheels, if you must fit different alloys stick to genuine ones

 

No gangster tints asides original factory ones

 

Absolutley no big exhausts, clear lenses or god forbid led side/running lamps (total chavness)

 

Old jags are great but still a bit "old man", Audi A8's are fab but noone will know its not an A4 taxi and a BMW 7 series comes complete with hidden compartment for all your "gear".

[dieselnutjob]

old thread I know, but I just refound this link, and it's a good one.

well worth a read

http://bangernomics.tripod.com/barge.htm

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

That site is seminal, but it is beyond ancient. I fear it may have been written before the internetz.

[scooters]

It would be interesting to get everyone's views on this old thread 10months later...10 months of squeezed budgets sky high premiums and silly fuel..I said back in November I wanted a s3 Daimler as a daily

As economically nowt is getting any better it will be a cavalier or a 306 as a daily and I.stead of an s3 a nice xj40 in 3.6 or 4.0 which I will ration myself to using one day a week..or a fekkin big old oil burning merc filled with old kebab shop waste...

 

What are your views on luxobarges now?

[r.welfare]

Christ - that Bangernomics site is so old there's an article I wrote ten years ago on it. And Pete-M wrote a piece for it too.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

It would be interesting to get everyone's views on this old thread 10months later...10 months of squeezed budgets sky high premiums and silly fuel..I said back in November I wanted a s3 Daimler as a daily

As economically nowt is getting any better it will be a cavalier or a 306 as a daily and I.stead of an s3 a nice xj40 in 3.6 or 4.0 which I will ration myself to using one day a week..or a fekkin big old oil burning merc filled with old kebab shop waste...

 

What are your views on luxobarges now?

 

There's always the ol' calor gas. I've also heard there are some country dwellers who have LPG heating for their houses and can mate the tank to a compressor for filling up a car. Of course, they are extremely scrupulous and always accurately report the road fuel usage to HMRC and pay the fuel duty and added VAT.

[Luxobarges_Are_Us]

As a more general observation (I do recall reading the thread from back when I was just lurking), I think that we're in a very long window of buying opportunity when it comes to barges. They're still very cheap to buy, the global economy is so fucked (and that includes China) that oil prices won't be rising anytime soon, and the dollar is as bad as the rest of the major currencies so, unless they tinker with the level of duty, fuel won't be going much further up in real terms. There is a near-perfect market in service parts, there was a lot of rationalisation within the 80s and 90s and a lot of bits shared across different models, so parts availability for 20-30 year old cars is better than it's ever been before (well, unless it was the late 60s and you owned a Morris Minor along with everyone else in the neighbourhood), and insurance is affected by so many variables that the engine/body size doesn't seem to make much of a difference anymore.

 

Things are looking great for barge ownership; unless, of course, you are unfortunate enough to lose income through the economy affecting your job/customers/tenants, in which case car ownership will probably be the last of your worries.

[Pete-M]

It would be interesting to get everyone's views on this old thread 10months later...10 months of squeezed budgets sky high premiums and silly fuel..I said back in November I wanted a s3 Daimler as a daily

As economically nowt is getting any better it will be a cavalier or a 306 as a daily and I.stead of an s3 a nice xj40 in 3.6 or 4.0 which I will ration myself to using one day a week..or a fekkin big old oil burning merc filled with old kebab shop waste...

 

What are your views on luxobarges now?

 

Same as they were then. I've still got the XJR and still love the thing to bits. Ok, it'll demolish twenty quid quicker than a coke-head on a night out but it's still cheaper to own an older XJR than to buy a four year old diesel 'sensible' saloon and pay the depreciation - provided you also have something a bit less extravagant on fuel for daily duties. Which is where the Heep comes in. LPG is the way, around town the Heep actually costs me less to fuel and run than my 1.8 petrol Mondeo.

 

I drive brand spanking new cars on a daily basis. Mainly £20k Škoda Superb 2.0 TDis, lovely cars, great on fuel, huge inside, comfy, quiet, nippy and decent handling, but getting in the Jag afterward still makes me grin. It cost over £50k new 17 years ago and the interior is about as close to perfect as you'll find. It is a nice place to be (although it is about half the size of the Škoda inside) , the engine is near silent when it's not being wellied, there are no untoward noises from anything and it'll still outperform 90% of modern cars. It'll do 25 mpg if being lightly tickled on a run, 22 mpg on a high speed motorway run or 15 mpg in town. Just about enough to be bearable as a fun thing. It's quite probably better on fuel than the 604 will be, and the Jag has more than double the power and torque of the Peugeot. It'll need somewhere between £500 and £1000 spending on it soon to get it mint, but then it'll be worth mint Jag XJR money, so I would actually turn a profit if I decided to sell.

 

As for Mr R.Welfare, I'd forgotten all about that, didn't even know that had ever been published. I had that Golf 2002-2003 so it took a long time to appear.

[Rocket88]

As a past owner of numerous "fallen from grace" old knackers, I have, on a few occasions, talked myself into buying something sensible. The experience has been distinctly underwhelming. I am just about to relace a '98 Passat 1.8t with an '84 Audi 200 Turbo, which just about sums up my attitude................

[meggersdog]

If I had a regular wage coming in and didn't have to rely on buying and selling stuff I would run this for a few months.

Bought it last week and have been running it for a few days.35 mpg on a run,200+ hp and allegedly 150 mph.It's booked in for an MOT on Monday so on sale witha year's ticket and taxed until the end of the month.

320 CLK with 87k miles and all for £995.00.

[Tayne]

Didn't Cavette want one of them?

[andrew e]

What is the panels view on 300 C's? Quite tempted to pull the trigger for my new "work" car (yes I know a 4 year old 7/8k beast is of the AS radar, but I'm asking). I'll give you lot first refusal at 150k

 

Back to the question, yep I own a barge that was very respectable/expensive when I got it many years ago, but now is in pitbull on a towrope territory. Its all down to how clean it is, freshly waxed it would still cut a dash at the golf club, filthy it looks like I'm on route to get my motability Zafira....

[Timewaster]

300C?

[dollywobbler]

Selling old barges at the moment seems very difficult. Not really had a sniff of interest in the Saab. I'm not going to lose money on it, so I'll just keep it. Even though it returned an impressive 34mpg on my 700 mile roadtrip weekend, that's still shite compared to what the 2CV/BX will do. With fuel prices the way they are, that makes a big difference and as someone who's currently skint, economy means a lot.

 

S'pose the Range Rover can be classed as a barge too. Not sure what I'm going to do with that to be honest. I do like it, but it will cost money to keep. Mind you, I reckon it'd cost me to sell it as well, so perhaps I'll keep that too.

 

But then the Mini has refused to sell as well, and that certainly isn't a barge. Povo spec, 1-litre engine and overall, pretty darned impressive condition. Not a sniff.