1987 Ford Sierra Sapphire 1.8L - LIVE footage from MoT station - see page 55

[Peter C]

25 minutes ago, Popsicle said:

 AC on all the way for me.

 

Agreed!

The trouble is, my lease cars to date and my new company car, which is due to be delivered this Wednesday, are all leased based on a 10k/annum mileage allowance, which only works if I make significant use of my other cars, which I refuse to drive when the roads are wet and when it gets too hot to use them comfortably. 

[Jazoli]

1 hour ago, Peter C said:

Agreed!

The trouble is, my lease cars to date and my new company car, which is due to be delivered this Wednesday, are all leased based on a 10k/annum mileage allowance, which only works if I make significant use of my other cars, which I refuse to drive when the roads are wet and when it gets too hot to use them comfortably. 

Surely you can just open a window when it gets too hot, according to several experts on here that’s all you need to do, and that aircon is pointless and ‘I’ve never needed it m8”

[Peter C]

14 minutes ago, Jazoli said:

Surely you can just open a window when it gets too hot, according to several experts on here that’s all you need to do, and that aircon is pointless and ‘I’ve never needed it m8”

You can open all the windows you like, when you're stationary in traffic in +30deg C heat, you're getting Betty Swallocks!

 

[Wibble]

4 hours ago, Peter C said:

Imagine my surprise when I saw this on the M25 this morning!

@Wibble

What an incredible spot! So glad you managed to get a photo.

[Peter C]

I have a Ford Mustang Mach X to enjoy whilst my ID7 will be in for repairs.

Considering how lovely* the Mustang looks in shocking blue, I took the opportunity to photograph it next to its granddad. 

That's 40 years of progress, apparently. 

[Peter C]

Overdue update on the Sierra. Admittedly, I haven't done anything to it for months and I've only driven it a couple of times.

Recently, I've noticed significant brake judder. Lack of use? 

I checked on the front brakes.

Everything looked on the offside. The disc looks like new, ditto the pads. The caliper looks like it's been refurbished.

On the nearside, things weren't as good.

The disc and pads looked ok....

But the caliper was rusty and the outer pad was stuck solid to the caliper.

I hammered the pad off and cleaned up the caliper. I smeared on plenty of copper grease too.

Has this fixed the problem? Read on.

Next, I sorted out the weathered steering rack gaiters. Cable ties weren't doing the job.

My wife bought me a surprise present from Temu, a boxful of jubilee clips, all for £1. They're quality, as you expect.

Job done.

The main issue with the Sierra is a leaking engine rear crank oil seal. Oil is slowly dripping between the engine and bellhousing.

It's all dry above, so it must be the crank seal.

This is a gearbox off job. According to Google, the Type 9 gearbox weights 39kg. When I was much younger, I removed a Sierra's gearbox on my driveway, with nothing more than a mate to help out. I'm not feeling that confident now and need to think twice how to tackle this job.

Ideally, whilst the gearbox is off, I would like to replace the leaking seal, the whole clutch assembly, clean the inside of the bellhousing, clean the gearbox and replace the gearbox oil. I can see a garage charging me £300-£400 for the labour, if I can't do it myself. 

The Sierra was parked in the workshop whilst I was cutting bits of MDF and plywood, which formed part of the MGB's ICE install. Consequently, it got covered with dust and needed a good wash.

Plenty of beading confirms that the Autoglym polishes are doing their job.

Drying off.

And dry, ready for a test drive.

I went for a drive up and down the M40 and on route home tried the brakes properly. No change, I'm still getting judder. 

On the basis that a pair of new discs cost peanuts and are piss easy to change, I reckon I should do that first. Anyone got any better ideas?

For now, the Sierra is back in the garage.

As tomorrow I will be doing a few jobs on the W123.

More soon.

 

 

[Snipes]

Judder through the pedal or through the wheel?

[Peter C]

7 minutes ago, Snipes said:

Judder through the pedal or through the wheel?

Steering wheel.

[colino]

Aren't the control arm bushes the number one suspect on big Fords?

[Peter C]

4 minutes ago, colino said:

Aren't the control arm bushes the number one suspect on big Fords?

I fitted new control arms (and bushes) not long ago.

[lisbon_road]

8 minutes ago, Peter C said:

I fitted new control arms (and bushes) not long ago.

Compliance bushes in the front arms are the number one suspect on Sierras normally.  There were supposedly heavy duty replacements available - perhaps there still are - but collectively they all lasted an amazingly short time, and cost next to nothing.  Can be a bit awkard to fit.  I used to use a scissor jack on one wheel against a wall to push the arm in a bit.  It seemed to work!

[Peter C]

@lisbon_road

See page 39, post from 29th June 2024:

I replaced the TCAs.

I haven’t done many miles since, could they really need replacing again?

[danthecapriman]

Caliper piston sticking? Caliper slider pins sliding freely?

You haven’t lost a balance weight from the front wheels?

[lisbon_road]

17 minutes ago, Peter C said:

@lisbon_road

See page 39, post from 29th June 2024:

 

I replaced the TCAs.

I haven’t done many miles since, could they really need replacing again?

Give 'em a lever and see if they seem solid.  All the comments about balance weights, slide pins, all totally valid as other possibilities for sure.  

[Brigsy]

I recall my mate doing the arb bushes on the tca's on his xr4x4 a few times and them failing, we eventually learned that they needed tightening with the suspension under load. Almost 25 years ago mind, think it had similar vibration issues but ive slept a few times since then.

[Peter C]

37 minutes ago, danthecapriman said:

Caliper piston sticking? Caliper slider pins sliding freely?

You haven’t lost a balance weight from the front wheels?

Calipers work fine, pins are like new.

Surely lost balance weights would cause constant vibration, not just under braking?

[danthecapriman]

4 minutes ago, Peter C said:

Calipers work fine, pins are like new.

Surely lost balance weights would cause constant vibration, not just under braking?

Possibly. Sometimes it’s also speed influenced though. Or maybe it’s vibrating a bit all the time but when you brake it’s showing up more as you can directly feel it through the steering? Easy to tell though, as you’ll see a mark where the wheel weight(s) used to be.

It’s possible you have a warped brake disc. You need one of those dial run-out gauges to check most of the time though.

[Peter C]

The guys on the Sierra Facebook group say it’s the brakes. Or maybe the TCA bushes. Not particularly helpful.

[danthecapriman]

1 minute ago, Peter C said:

The guys on the Sierra Facebook group say it’s the brakes. Or maybe the TCA bushes. Not particularly helpful.

I’d put my money on a warped disc. Assuming the other bits of the brakes (caliper, sliders etc) are ok. 
While it could be a TCA bush, yours being recently replaced would lead me to say it’s less likely. I changed the ones on my Capri over 10 years ago and they’re still perfectly fine. Of course it’s all dependent on use and quality of the parts.

Im sure you can feel if the TCA bushes are buggered though just from driving around, not necessarily limited to braking. It’s effectively a joint with excessive play, so as you accelerate, turn or whatever there’s going to be movement in it. 
It’s a different set up on the Granada, but I remember when the TCA/stabiliser bar bush tore on my old one, the handling went instantly from poor to horrendous! Accelerating, braking, turning, bouncing the suspension was all horrible with that front wheel flapping around!

 

[Peter C]

@danthecapriman

A new pair of discs cost peanuts and are easy to replace. I’m tempted to buy a set but as suggested by @lisbon_road I will get my jemmy out tomorrow and see whether there’s any slack in the suspension.

[danthecapriman]

Also, is the brake pad actually sitting fully and squarely in its carrier? 
I’ve seen that before where the pad was a very tight fit in the carrier which stopped it moving properly. Pretty much uneven pressure against the disc. 
Sometimes filing out the dust and rust from the carrier and the thick paint off the contact points of the pad is sufficient to fix it. 

[Peter C]

18 minutes ago, danthecapriman said:

Also, is the brake pad actually sitting fully and squarely in its carrier? 
I’ve seen that before where the pad was a very tight fit in the carrier which stopped it moving properly. Pretty much uneven pressure against the disc. 
Sometimes filing out the dust and rust from the carrier and the thick paint off the contact points of the pad is sufficient to fix it. 

On the nearside, the outer pad was stuck to the caliper and needed removing with a hammer. I removed the rust and coated contact points with copper grease but the problem persists.

[sierraman]

Crank end seal? TADTS. I’d leave it until the clutch starts juddering badly. Ford seem spectacularly useless at making the seal as it’s been a problem on most Fords over the years 

[danthecapriman]

1 hour ago, sierraman said:

Crank end seal? TADTS. I’d leave it until the clutch starts juddering badly. Ford seem spectacularly useless at making the seal as it’s been a problem on most Fords over the years 

One of my old smiley Transits used to do it. It was ok for a while, then started to contaminate the clutch so pulling away needed a whole lot of flooring !😄 

I just ignored it given the effort required to repair it! Eventually sold the van and they did the same thing.

[Peter C]

@sierraman

@danthecapriman

Unfortunately, I am also experiencing clutch judder.

Back to the matter at hand.

I washed the Merc this morning and got the Sierra back in the workshop asap.

Before lifting the front end, I used a crowbar to assess the condition of the track control arm bushes.

This is with no leverage applied.

This is with leverage applied and a bit of 2x4 wedged under the crowbar, to enable me to take the photograph.

On both sides, with leverage applied, there is approx 3mm of vertical movement within the bush before the track control arm lifts up.

I guess that's bad?

I fitted new track control arms last June but they were cheap eBay, most probably made in China jobbies and chances are they were shit. 

A look on eBay revealed that polyurethane bushes are only available for Cosworth and XR models, not a lowly 1.8L. 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=sierra+track+control+arms+bushes&_sacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_odkw=sierra+track+control+arms+&_osacat=0

If I opt for rubber bushes, I can either go for complete track control arms or just replacement bushes. I guess replacing the bushes without special tools is going to be a complete nightmare? 

@Snipes asked whether I am feeling the judder through the steering wheel or the brake pedal. Am I right that I would be feeling judder via the brake pedal if the brakes were bad and through the steering wheel if there was an issue with the suspension? Or is that too obvious? 

Aside from the judder, the brakes work perfectly. They don't bind, pull or squeal and judging by appearances, the discs and pads really do look almost new. 

What do I do? Help me out here guys.

 

[lisbon_road]

I fitted PU bushes to mine and they basically lasted for ever.  I should think that you'd be able to get them from somewhere.   Not sure if they are really different in Cosworths or others, perhaps you'd be best speaking to someone who makes them.  

Normal bushes will be easy enough to fit.  The original type just tap in and the so called heavy duty ones are sort of squashed in.  

 

[Peter C]

@lisbon_road

Based on the above, would you say that mine need replacing?

[lisbon_road]

1 minute ago, Peter C said:

@lisbon_road

Based on the above, would you say that mine need replacing?

Probably.  I'd take the nut and washer off and see what they look like.  

[danthecapriman]

As @lisbon_road said. Whip the nut & washer and see if the rubber is distorted or perished. Some modern rubber is absolutely crap and does fall to bits and fail quickly.

You can get the Polyurethane bush replacements for other Fords that use that style arms (like the Capri) so as long as you find bushes with the right size hole/diameter you should be good. 
Some polyurethane bushes are meant for performance and track use though so watch out which grade you buy. The performance ones are much tighter and have much less compliance.

https://www.burtonpower.com/parts-by-category/steering-suspension/bushes-polyurethane/ford-sierra-bushes-polyurethane.html?srsltid=AfmBOooR8s2DeeCxMrWvoXB6YA3QYwn4f5_GmkFy2pelUnkDDOO2Zkoy

Says ‘all Sierra’s including Cosworth’ on that site.

[lisbon_road]

3 minutes ago, danthecapriman said:

As @lisbon_road said. Whip the nut & washer and see if the rubber is distorted or perished. Some modern rubber is absolutely crap and does fall to bits and fail quickly.

You can get the Polyurethane bush replacements for other Fords that use that style arms (like the Capri) so as long as you find bushes with the right size hole/diameter you should be good. 
Some polyurethane bushes are meant for performance and track use though so watch out which grade you buy. The performance ones are much tighter and have much less compliance.

https://www.burtonpower.com/parts-by-category/steering-suspension/bushes-polyurethane/ford-sierra-bushes-polyurethane.html?srsltid=AfmBOooR8s2DeeCxMrWvoXB6YA3QYwn4f5_GmkFy2pelUnkDDOO2Zkoy

Says ‘all Sierra’s including Cosworth’ on that site.

That's very good advice - I had the Powerflex yellow ones, but as @danthecapriman says, for road use, get the softest you can.  Normally measured by shore hardness, lower better for road use.